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Injuries - 9-Year Analysis

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Originally posted by KeepRabbitsOut:
Originally posted by NCommand:
Random keeps this thread alive.

I just post the annual data and their respective rankings compared to all other teams within Adjust Games Lost which takes into account the quality and quantity of those injuries. The aggregate average rank over the past 9 years gives us a better idea how we've fared over time compared to all other teams. I expanded to show the strong correlation of high/low AGL to the odds of making the playoffs.

It's really not that complicated if he spent 30 seconds reading the OP and clicked on the annual link. LOL

As to the bold, you'll never get that from him because that data doesn't exist; and he's literally the last and only one dying on that hill alone.

His issues are clearly personal in here. That's beyond obvious (hence why he's blocked).

This thread was so quiet for the lead up to the post season that it was really nice to just enjoy the victories and relative health of the team. I think even the FO must have been holding their breath........but how do you have 4 QB's go down in 1 year? WOWSERS

It was terrific, wasn't it!?!

Then the Football God's said, "OK, enough of that...let's take out the entire QB room at once for fun when it matters most!"

Thanks guys!
  • Giedi
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 32,565
Originally posted by NCommand:
Originally posted by KeepRabbitsOut:
Originally posted by NCommand:
Random keeps this thread alive.

I just post the annual data and their respective rankings compared to all other teams within Adjust Games Lost which takes into account the quality and quantity of those injuries. The aggregate average rank over the past 9 years gives us a better idea how we've fared over time compared to all other teams. I expanded to show the strong correlation of high/low AGL to the odds of making the playoffs.

It's really not that complicated if he spent 30 seconds reading the OP and clicked on the annual link. LOL

As to the bold, you'll never get that from him because that data doesn't exist; and he's literally the last and only one dying on that hill alone.

His issues are clearly personal in here. That's beyond obvious (hence why he's blocked).

This thread was so quiet for the lead up to the post season that it was really nice to just enjoy the victories and relative health of the team. I think even the FO must have been holding their breath........but how do you have 4 QB's go down in 1 year? WOWSERS

It was terrific, wasn't it!?!

Then the Football God's said, "OK, enough of that...let's take out the entire QB room at once for fun when it matters most!"

Thanks guys!

Think positive NC! , without all the injuries to the QB room - we wouldn't have discovered Brock Purdy. I say use the injuries to ShanaLynch's advantage. Use it to discover and acquire more talent. (Another example: Jimmy got hurt, we got Bosa) not saying intentionally tank, but build that depth as best as you can and once the injuries hit, you get to discover hidden depth and talent. Still agree with you on not spending high value draft picks on talented players that have injury issues (Example: Kinlaw) in fact I agree with pasodoc9er who said more like 5th through 7th for those guys.

I think ShanaLynch is doing better at getting more durable players. As you, or someone said, there was a stretch last year where we didn't have serious injuries for multiple weeks. Deebo escaped serious knee injuries (he was injured on grass) last year. I think 49ers have to really watch for those astro-turf games, that's where they have gotten a lot of very serious injuries. (Usually its against Seattle). LA Rams stadium is also another astro-turf field. Availability is also ability.
Originally posted by Giedi:
Originally posted by NCommand:
Originally posted by KeepRabbitsOut:
Originally posted by NCommand:
Random keeps this thread alive.

I just post the annual data and their respective rankings compared to all other teams within Adjust Games Lost which takes into account the quality and quantity of those injuries. The aggregate average rank over the past 9 years gives us a better idea how we've fared over time compared to all other teams. I expanded to show the strong correlation of high/low AGL to the odds of making the playoffs.

It's really not that complicated if he spent 30 seconds reading the OP and clicked on the annual link. LOL

As to the bold, you'll never get that from him because that data doesn't exist; and he's literally the last and only one dying on that hill alone.

His issues are clearly personal in here. That's beyond obvious (hence why he's blocked).

This thread was so quiet for the lead up to the post season that it was really nice to just enjoy the victories and relative health of the team. I think even the FO must have been holding their breath........but how do you have 4 QB's go down in 1 year? WOWSERS

It was terrific, wasn't it!?!

Then the Football God's said, "OK, enough of that...let's take out the entire QB room at once for fun when it matters most!"

Thanks guys!

Think positive NC! , without all the injuries to the QB room - we wouldn't have discovered Brock Purdy. I say use the injuries to ShanaLynch's advantage. Use it to discover and acquire more talent. (Another example: Jimmy got hurt, we got Bosa) not saying intentionally tank, but build that depth as best as you can and once the injuries hit, you get to discover hidden depth and talent. Still agree with you on not spending high value draft picks on talented players that have injury issues (Example: Kinlaw) in fact I agree with pasodoc9er who said more like 5th through 7th for those guys.

I think ShanaLynch is doing better at getting more durable players. As you, or someone said, there was a stretch last year where we didn't have serious injuries for multiple weeks. Deebo escaped serious knee injuries (he was injured on grass) last year. I think 49ers have to really watch for those astro-turf games, that's where they have gotten a lot of very serious injuries. (Usually its against Seattle). LA Rams stadium is also another astro-turf field. Availability is also ability.

You've got the right mindset. If not for all the injuries over the years, this team never would have become the deepest roster in the NFL...by a country mile. And to your other point, it may have lead to finding a FQB! And like you said, maybe the FO is learning not to 'count' on those oft-injured players (e.g. Ward and Moseley leaving) and build out better contingency plans.
Originally posted by NCommand:
Originally posted by Giedi:
Originally posted by NCommand:
Originally posted by KeepRabbitsOut:
Originally posted by NCommand:
Random keeps this thread alive.

I just post the annual data and their respective rankings compared to all other teams within Adjust Games Lost which takes into account the quality and quantity of those injuries. The aggregate average rank over the past 9 years gives us a better idea how we've fared over time compared to all other teams. I expanded to show the strong correlation of high/low AGL to the odds of making the playoffs.

It's really not that complicated if he spent 30 seconds reading the OP and clicked on the annual link. LOL

As to the bold, you'll never get that from him because that data doesn't exist; and he's literally the last and only one dying on that hill alone.

His issues are clearly personal in here. That's beyond obvious (hence why he's blocked).

This thread was so quiet for the lead up to the post season that it was really nice to just enjoy the victories and relative health of the team. I think even the FO must have been holding their breath........but how do you have 4 QB's go down in 1 year? WOWSERS

It was terrific, wasn't it!?!

Then the Football God's said, "OK, enough of that...let's take out the entire QB room at once for fun when it matters most!"

Thanks guys!

Think positive NC! , without all the injuries to the QB room - we wouldn't have discovered Brock Purdy. I say use the injuries to ShanaLynch's advantage. Use it to discover and acquire more talent. (Another example: Jimmy got hurt, we got Bosa) not saying intentionally tank, but build that depth as best as you can and once the injuries hit, you get to discover hidden depth and talent. Still agree with you on not spending high value draft picks on talented players that have injury issues (Example: Kinlaw) in fact I agree with pasodoc9er who said more like 5th through 7th for those guys.

I think ShanaLynch is doing better at getting more durable players. As you, or someone said, there was a stretch last year where we didn't have serious injuries for multiple weeks. Deebo escaped serious knee injuries (he was injured on grass) last year. I think 49ers have to really watch for those astro-turf games, that's where they have gotten a lot of very serious injuries. (Usually its against Seattle). LA Rams stadium is also another astro-turf field. Availability is also ability.

You've got the right mindset. If not for all the injuries over the years, this team never would have become the deepest roster in the NFL...by a country mile. And to your other point, it may have lead to finding a FQB! And like you said, maybe the FO is learning not to 'count' on those oft-injured players (e.g. Ward and Moseley leaving) and build out better contingency plans.

i purposely kept my mouth shut an didnt post in here when we went on that 6-8 week run of minimal injuries. at the end. i didnt wanna jinx it. i was all for being superstitious, whatever works. i wanted to let the team put this thread to its grave an prove it wrong. then.........the reality of the 49ers woke up an got revenge when it would hurt us the most.

all one possesion after another:
warner injured
bosa injured
brock injured
bosa injured on the sideline even
then josh johnson, our last hope, our 4th QB THAT SEASON, OUR LAST f**kING RESORT.........CONCUSSION!

you cant make this s**t up. NO other team has had to play in this condition. im lookin forward to picking up more durability!
Originally posted by BobSacamano69:
i purposely kept my mouth shut an didnt post in here when we went on that 6-8 week run of minimal injuries. at the end. i didnt wanna jinx it. i was all for being superstitious, whatever works. i wanted to let the team put this thread to its grave an prove it wrong. then.........the reality of the 49ers woke up an got revenge when it would hurt us the most.

all one possesion after another:
warner injured
bosa injured
brock injured
bosa injured on the sideline even
then josh johnson, our last hope, our 4th QB THAT SEASON, OUR LAST f**kING RESORT.........CONCUSSION!

you cant make this s**t up. NO other team has had to play in this condition. im lookin forward to picking up more durability!

another good post and I enjoy your contributions in here

on the QB injury; there were 68 QBs that started games in 2022 an NFL record.. a part of this is 17 game regular seasons, and more teams wanting to throw the football, more often, also teams wanting to run their QBs.

I feel as you go down the chart guys are more likely to get injured at QB; they are just less used to playing heavy snaps, taking hits, reading pre and post snap, etc.
Originally posted by NCommand:
And like you said, maybe the FO is learning [insert my/our better expertise than the front office has right here]


Always a joy. We missed you NC!!
[ Edited by random49er on Mar 21, 2023 at 11:32 AM ]
Originally posted by 49erFaithful6:
Originally posted by BobSacamano69:
i purposely kept my mouth shut an didnt post in here when we went on that 6-8 week run of minimal injuries. at the end. i didnt wanna jinx it. i was all for being superstitious, whatever works. i wanted to let the team put this thread to its grave an prove it wrong. then.........the reality of the 49ers woke up an got revenge when it would hurt us the most.

all one possesion after another:
warner injured
bosa injured
brock injured
bosa injured on the sideline even
then josh johnson, our last hope, our 4th QB THAT SEASON, OUR LAST f**kING RESORT.........CONCUSSION!

you cant make this s**t up. NO other team has had to play in this condition. im lookin forward to picking up more durability!

another good post and I enjoy your contributions in here

on the QB injury; there were 68 QBs that started games in 2022 an NFL record.. a part of this is 17 game regular seasons, and more teams wanting to throw the football, more often, also teams wanting to run their QBs.

I feel as you go down the chart guys are more likely to get injured at QB; they are just less used to playing heavy snaps, taking hits, reading pre and post snap, etc.

ya i know the media def highlighted how more QBs were used this year than ever before. thats crazy. i just cant believe out all of the time in the entire season, we had to go down to our 4th QB at the very end when it mattered most. when our season was on the line. why couldnt that happen week 3? or the week before our bye? or a week or two before the playoffs? because were the 49ers thats why.
Originally posted by BobSacamano69:
ya i know the media def highlighted how more QBs were used this year than ever before. thats crazy. i just cant believe out all of the time in the entire season, we had to go down to our 4th QB at the very end when it mattered most. when our season was on the line. why couldnt that happen week 3? or the week before our bye? or a week or two before the playoffs? because were the 49ers thats why.

49ers may be ahead of the game here, as we saw they added a 3rd QB aggressively in day 1 FA. Now they will push for the rule change and the league has every incentive to change the rule. Player safety, competitive balance, ratings and watchable TV for viewership, you name it. It benefits the league to go back to a 3rd QB and it doesn't take away a roster spot. NFC Champ game and the 68 QBs starting will be used as evidence in the push for this rule change. Then we can dress all three.
  • Giedi
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 32,565
Originally posted by NCommand:
Originally posted by Giedi:
Originally posted by NCommand:
Originally posted by KeepRabbitsOut:
Originally posted by NCommand:
Random keeps this thread alive.

I just post the annual data and their respective rankings compared to all other teams within Adjust Games Lost which takes into account the quality and quantity of those injuries. The aggregate average rank over the past 9 years gives us a better idea how we've fared over time compared to all other teams. I expanded to show the strong correlation of high/low AGL to the odds of making the playoffs.

It's really not that complicated if he spent 30 seconds reading the OP and clicked on the annual link. LOL

As to the bold, you'll never get that from him because that data doesn't exist; and he's literally the last and only one dying on that hill alone.

His issues are clearly personal in here. That's beyond obvious (hence why he's blocked).

This thread was so quiet for the lead up to the post season that it was really nice to just enjoy the victories and relative health of the team. I think even the FO must have been holding their breath........but how do you have 4 QB's go down in 1 year? WOWSERS

It was terrific, wasn't it!?!

Then the Football God's said, "OK, enough of that...let's take out the entire QB room at once for fun when it matters most!"

Thanks guys!

Think positive NC! , without all the injuries to the QB room - we wouldn't have discovered Brock Purdy. I say use the injuries to ShanaLynch's advantage. Use it to discover and acquire more talent. (Another example: Jimmy got hurt, we got Bosa) not saying intentionally tank, but build that depth as best as you can and once the injuries hit, you get to discover hidden depth and talent. Still agree with you on not spending high value draft picks on talented players that have injury issues (Example: Kinlaw) in fact I agree with pasodoc9er who said more like 5th through 7th for those guys.

I think ShanaLynch is doing better at getting more durable players. As you, or someone said, there was a stretch last year where we didn't have serious injuries for multiple weeks. Deebo escaped serious knee injuries (he was injured on grass) last year. I think 49ers have to really watch for those astro-turf games, that's where they have gotten a lot of very serious injuries. (Usually its against Seattle). LA Rams stadium is also another astro-turf field. Availability is also ability.

You've got the right mindset. If not for all the injuries over the years, this team never would have become the deepest roster in the NFL...by a country mile. And to your other point, it may have lead to finding a FQB! And like you said, maybe the FO is learning not to 'count' on those oft-injured players (e.g. Ward and Moseley leaving) and build out better contingency plans.

Great point about letting Ward and Moseley go due to durability issues. I hadn't thought of that. I hope the Brock injury in the NFCCG focuses ShanaLynch on more QB protections (OLine upgrade and development) and also making sure that the QB corps is deep. I.e. more competition for that third string QB in addition to Darnold. Looking forward to the draft now that most of free agency is over now.
  • Giedi
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 32,565
Originally posted by 49erFaithful6:
Originally posted by BobSacamano69:
ya i know the media def highlighted how more QBs were used this year than ever before. thats crazy. i just cant believe out all of the time in the entire season, we had to go down to our 4th QB at the very end when it mattered most. when our season was on the line. why couldnt that happen week 3? or the week before our bye? or a week or two before the playoffs? because were the 49ers thats why.

49ers may be ahead of the game here, as we saw they added a 3rd QB aggressively in day 1 FA. Now they will push for the rule change and the league has every incentive to change the rule. Player safety, competitive balance, ratings and watchable TV for viewership, you name it. It benefits the league to go back to a 3rd QB and it doesn't take away a roster spot. NFC Champ game and the 68 QBs starting will be used as evidence in the push for this rule change. Then we can dress all three.

One of the less durable players last year was Jimmy G. Now that his durability issues are gone, I hope Darnold, Purdy and Lance are more durable than Jimmy has been - comparatively speaking. QB durability issues have cost us a lot of important game losses in the playoffs. Joe and Steve were pretty durable - comparatively speaking - to Jimmy over their whole careers.

Originally posted by BobSacamano69:
Originally posted by 49erFaithful6:
Originally posted by BobSacamano69:
i purposely kept my mouth shut an didnt post in here when we went on that 6-8 week run of minimal injuries. at the end. i didnt wanna jinx it. i was all for being superstitious, whatever works. i wanted to let the team put this thread to its grave an prove it wrong. then.........the reality of the 49ers woke up an got revenge when it would hurt us the most.

all one possesion after another:
warner injured
bosa injured
brock injured
bosa injured on the sideline even
then josh johnson, our last hope, our 4th QB THAT SEASON, OUR LAST f**kING RESORT.........CONCUSSION!

you cant make this s**t up. NO other team has had to play in this condition. im lookin forward to picking up more durability!

another good post and I enjoy your contributions in here

on the QB injury; there were 68 QBs that started games in 2022 an NFL record.. a part of this is 17 game regular seasons, and more teams wanting to throw the football, more often, also teams wanting to run their QBs.

I feel as you go down the chart guys are more likely to get injured at QB; they are just less used to playing heavy snaps, taking hits, reading pre and post snap, etc.

ya i know the media def highlighted how more QBs were used this year than ever before. thats crazy. i just cant believe out all of the time in the entire season, we had to go down to our 4th QB at the very end when it mattered most. when our season was on the line. why couldnt that happen week 3? or the week before our bye? or a week or two before the playoffs? because were the 49ers thats why.

Agreed. It was a rough year on QB's across the league but of course we have to trump all of them. LOL
Originally posted by Giedi:
Originally posted by NCommand:
Originally posted by Giedi:
Originally posted by NCommand:
Originally posted by KeepRabbitsOut:
Originally posted by NCommand:
Random keeps this thread alive.

I just post the annual data and their respective rankings compared to all other teams within Adjust Games Lost which takes into account the quality and quantity of those injuries. The aggregate average rank over the past 9 years gives us a better idea how we've fared over time compared to all other teams. I expanded to show the strong correlation of high/low AGL to the odds of making the playoffs.

It's really not that complicated if he spent 30 seconds reading the OP and clicked on the annual link. LOL

As to the bold, you'll never get that from him because that data doesn't exist; and he's literally the last and only one dying on that hill alone.

His issues are clearly personal in here. That's beyond obvious (hence why he's blocked).

This thread was so quiet for the lead up to the post season that it was really nice to just enjoy the victories and relative health of the team. I think even the FO must have been holding their breath........but how do you have 4 QB's go down in 1 year? WOWSERS

It was terrific, wasn't it!?!

Then the Football God's said, "OK, enough of that...let's take out the entire QB room at once for fun when it matters most!"

Thanks guys!

Think positive NC! , without all the injuries to the QB room - we wouldn't have discovered Brock Purdy. I say use the injuries to ShanaLynch's advantage. Use it to discover and acquire more talent. (Another example: Jimmy got hurt, we got Bosa) not saying intentionally tank, but build that depth as best as you can and once the injuries hit, you get to discover hidden depth and talent. Still agree with you on not spending high value draft picks on talented players that have injury issues (Example: Kinlaw) in fact I agree with pasodoc9er who said more like 5th through 7th for those guys.

I think ShanaLynch is doing better at getting more durable players. As you, or someone said, there was a stretch last year where we didn't have serious injuries for multiple weeks. Deebo escaped serious knee injuries (he was injured on grass) last year. I think 49ers have to really watch for those astro-turf games, that's where they have gotten a lot of very serious injuries. (Usually its against Seattle). LA Rams stadium is also another astro-turf field. Availability is also ability.

You've got the right mindset. If not for all the injuries over the years, this team never would have become the deepest roster in the NFL...by a country mile. And to your other point, it may have lead to finding a FQB! And like you said, maybe the FO is learning not to 'count' on those oft-injured players (e.g. Ward and Moseley leaving) and build out better contingency plans.

Great point about letting Ward and Moseley go due to durability issues. I hadn't thought of that. I hope the Brock injury in the NFCCG focuses ShanaLynch on more QB protections (OLine upgrade and development) and also making sure that the QB corps is deep. I.e. more competition for that third string QB in addition to Darnold. Looking forward to the draft now that most of free agency is over now.

No doubt, adding Darnold so quickly is a great sign. I'm sure they'll bring in another too via the draft and UDFA.

Very true about unit PP (don't expect Tyler Kroft back anytime soon), scheme (more outlets, less naked PA and bootleg risks) and having the best safety blanket of all in CMC made a huge difference for both Jimmy and Brock.
  • Giedi
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 32,565
I posted this in the wrong thread.

Hi NC, I read an interesting post in another teams bulletin board, I think its the Patriots board. I tried looking for it again to link here, but can't find it. Anyway... here is the idea:

One of the reasons Kyle Shanahan's QBs get injured is because he doesn't run a true West coast short passing game (a la Bill Walsh) duh! 😋 what Kyle runs is actually more of an air Coryell *heavy play action* run dominant passing game. The explosive plays that Kyle always talks about is more akin to the air Coryell long ball plays based off play acrion runs which requires the QB to hold the ball longer for those long developing plays to occur. Hence the injuries to the QB - because he has to hold the ball longer and will get hit harder on those long developing plays.

The conclusion I came away with was that, Joe and Steve were relatively healthy in their careers because they didn't hold the ball too long. Basically they ran a 3 and 5 step drop patterns typical of Walsh. Whereas Kyle's QBs are required to hold the ball longer. (Example, Those TE and WR crossing patterns after a play pass boot) So the answer to the QB injury problems might be Brock himself, if Kyle can go to a more short passing game and have Purdy get rid of the ball quicker - that might preserve his health better. (As well as getting some quality OLinemen etc...)

I still remember a Scangarello quote where he said in Kyles system, he likes QBs that can stand in there and take the hit after a pass. That definitely doesn't sound like a Bill Walsh concept because Walsh wanted the QB to get rid of the ball quickly. The nice thing about Kyle's system is that he can easily switch to a much shorter passing game and easily have Purdy take shorter drops. Key here is Purdy's ability to pass. That is why I think there was a stretch of weeks last year where the 49ers didn't get any serious injuries. (1) both Jimmy and Brock took shorter drops, or were able to get rid of the ball quicker, because of CMC (2) Brock being able to escape the hit due to his elusiveness.

Patrick Mahomes has been relatively healthy and durable, and I think one reason is Reid has stayed true to the Walsh - get rid of the ball quickly - offense. Anyway looking forward to the criticisms of this idea.
Originally posted by Giedi:
I posted this in the wrong thread.

Hi NC, I read an interesting post in another teams bulletin board, I think its the Patriots board. I tried looking for it again to link here, but can't find it. Anyway... here is the idea:

One of the reasons Kyle Shanahan's QBs get injured is because he doesn't run a true West coast short passing game (a la Bill Walsh) duh! 😋 what Kyle runs is actually more of an air Coryell *heavy play action* run dominant passing game. The explosive plays that Kyle always talks about is more akin to the air Coryell long ball plays based off play acrion runs which requires the QB to hold the ball longer for those long developing plays to occur. Hence the injuries to the QB - because he has to hold the ball longer and will get hit harder on those long developing plays.

The conclusion I came away with was that, Joe and Steve were relatively healthy in their careers because they didn't hold the ball too long. Basically they ran a 3 and 5 step drop patterns typical of Walsh. Whereas Kyle's QBs are required to hold the ball longer. (Example, Those TE and WR crossing patterns after a play pass boot) So the answer to the QB injury problems might be Brock himself, if Kyle can go to a more short passing game and have Purdy get rid of the ball quicker - that might preserve his health better. (As well as getting some quality OLinemen etc...)

I still remember a Scangarello quote where he said in Kyles system, he likes QBs that can stand in there and take the hit after a pass. That definitely doesn't sound like a Bill Walsh concept because Walsh wanted the QB to get rid of the ball quickly. The nice thing about Kyle's system is that he can easily switch to a much shorter passing game and easily have Purdy take shorter drops. Key here is Purdy's ability to pass. That is why I think there was a stretch of weeks last year where the 49ers didn't get any serious injuries. (1) both Jimmy and Brock took shorter drops, or were able to get rid of the ball quicker, because of CMC (2) Brock being able to escape the hit due to his elusiveness.

Patrick Mahomes has been relatively healthy and durable, and I think one reason is Reid has stayed true to the Walsh - get rid of the ball quickly - offense. Anyway looking forward to the criticisms of this idea.

Sorry, there's a lot to unpack here.

I see what you mean about the scheme...the long developing pass plays that put strain on the unit pass protection. I believe that's what you meant. I've always called Kyle's system to flip side of the WCO. Same terminology but philosophically, it's run to set up the pass. It's still pretty conservative...usually ball control, TOP control and just a couple shot plays dialed up. Heavy focus on 3rd downs via the short game and keeping the chains moving. Old 9er teams also had top 5 defenses.

Agreed about PM. He only rushes for a few hundred yards a year so WHEN he does, it's like Steve Young...back breaker for defenses. QB friendly system, Reid exploits every defensive weakness, heavy focus on the OL and pass protection, etc.
Heavy focus on the pass protection when they aren't getting his ankle almost broken.
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