Improved Positions?

Originally posted by lamontb:

Speaking of Devey his partner in crime Erik Pears lost tons of money investing is some sort of weed farm or something that turned out to be illegal

Makes sense... explains why he was always way too slow to react and I'm pretty sure that was Aldon Smith's farm.

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by SoCold:

Yes, I like the versatility of the line guys. The key is finding 5 guys who can stay healthy and work together. Something we haven't had in about 5 years.

True dat esp. this.

I think with the new offense it becomes most important to have a good unit that works well together. Coaching and scheme could solve a bunch of problems and will have to see how the pieces shake out.

Originally posted by ChaunceyGardner:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by SoCold:

Yes, I like the versatility of the line guys. The key is finding 5 guys who can stay healthy and work together. Something we haven't had in about 5 years.

True dat esp. this.

I think with the new offense it becomes most important to have a good unit that works well together. Coaching and scheme could solve a bunch of problems and will have to see how the pieces shake out.

Yeah, for real. Neat to see how Kyle is teaching the TE's, FB's and esp. the WR's about how THEY are part of the unit blocking too...they are learning that sometimes the backside WR, his block is the key to the play, therefore they are taking blocking as serious as their routes.

Originally posted by SoCold:

Originally posted by pasodoc9er:

What is really cool , So Cold, is that you can move Kilgore to C, Zut to either OG, Josh Garnett to either OG, Gilliam rotation at OT, Fusco OG/C(?), Beadles to other OG , Trenton has shown he can slide over to LT, and so on. You know last yr we had to START 3 talent challenged DLinemen in Martin, devey and pears...none of which showed any signs of being NFL starters. They were thru and thru not even backups ...and yet they started.

So whether we play your OL or say. Staley Garnett Zut/Kilgore Beadles Trenton , you still have a huge amount of ability to interchange the pieces, PLUS you still have Fusco, Gilliam, and Theus. Won't say much about Theus because i don't know much about him. But the others, yeah. There is so much improvement here it is off the charts. And we have legit backup/rotational guys to boot, all way better than 2/3 of our :"starters" last yr.

Maybe this is the 27th rated OL in the league, but they won't be saying that once the season starts. All the pundits are going to say, "Wow they just don't look like the same team as last yr....esp the OL"....well, no kidding Dick Tracy. They aren't. This is a great group with ability of most to play two positions, and true rotational guys as backups. Last yr was pathetic. This yr....different story.

And the really neat thing is...this turnaround is NOTHING compared to the DL...or front 7 , really. IF you like line play, then this is your yr to watch some great football. That's me...I',m a line guy.

"Build your lines first"...
Vince Lombardi.

Yes, I like the versatility of the line guys. The key is finding 5 guys who can stay healthy and work together. Something we haven't had in about 5 years.

Well, no question about our versatility nor about finding 5 guys who can stay healthy and work together. Also true, we haven't had that situation for about 5 yrs. But , the change over at trainer was a day 2 accomplishment of kyle. One look at our IR for the last 3 yrs and he KNEW there was something bad wrong somewhere up the chain, and training could sure have had a lot to do with it. Our rather proper triaining . And unquestionably we were way substandard there. We may have been at the very bottom of the league in IR dings. So it doesn't mean kyle was a good detective, it just means he was observant. Still , the fact he picked on trainer as a place to start surprised the heck out of me and danged if he wasn't spot on. Maybe it's because he has been around pro football his whole life, but still, it was a great place to start.

Next, talent level. All it took was one film of their gruesome 3some to tell there was trouble in paradise with devey to Martin to pears. All 3 didn't add up to one NFL player. Base it on injury, talent, football IQ level, strength, ability to change...ie play a 2nd position...ability to get better....man it just wasn't there. Worse, it was on our OL , and you build your lines first, at least according to Vince Lombardi.

so no question, of all the bad emanating from this stink pit, trainer was a great place to start....i would have started with talent...ie untalented people, or in other words, guys who had no business being here. When the season started last yr, and we still had those three, a tingle went down my spine, and it was followed by a bad case of sweats. We were literally useless as an OL in 2016 , after puttting up two of the worst lines in hx in 2015 . Sure some of that was blow over from the massive exodus the previous yr., but to still have those guys last yr to start? Wow, that was truly awful news.

Sure we got DeFo and Garnett last yr, but in the 4 mos kyle and johh have been here, we turned over 50% ok a krapt lineup. Baalke had been going down for the last 2-3 yrs but to get one guy to buck up the OL and stil have pears, devey and Martin? Wow, that was a major league screw up on baalke's part. Here's a question: Did he even KNOW it? I've thot about it and have come to the conclusion that he didn't know how bad we were, hence his time here was overdone.

So when So Cold mentioned 5 guys playing together (and by inference, staying together), one would have to say we have hit the jackpot with our current OL. :

Joe S, Garnett. Zut/ kilgore. Beadles Trenton PLus we have fusco and kilgore who could both start. Gilliam can play either OT, and Trenton can cover LT. Beadles can switch to eihter OG, and C, Zut play OG, kilgore play OG, Garnett can play either OG. So having guys who not jsut start but can stay together and stay healthy, if we can't do it with this OL group i will be absolutley astounded.


And since looking at improved positions, same goes for a DL that was #32 last yr against the run. How bad was it? It was the worst DL ever in red and gold. So lookey here:

AA, DeFo , Buck, DJ, Dooms, Pita, Mitchell, Dial and for LB , Bow, Foster, Navarro, Lynch, and then a riot squad of 4 or 5 guys that all could make it, but i have no idea who does. All are talented, and once again, no injuries while going thru OTAs. Sounds minimal but it wasn't . Guys were hopefully stretched out right so no pulls, no hammie's, no pecs, no knees...i know that won't hold, but I am assuming the training part of our squad is now in good hands. The fact that was Kyle's #1 fix tells you something. What we had had...obviously was NOT working. So put down in Improved positions both OL and DL.

It should be said that getting rid of the old was half the battle. Turning over half the squad was way way overdue. And kyle and john started with the lines first....ahead of QB and his backup. In fact that slot was pushed back til next yr, as there was no one kyle liked except CJ...and everyone else didn't match up. So if the most important player just wasn't there in FA or draft , build your lines. And that is exactly what Shalyn did. Actually they rebuilt the OL and then rebuilt the FRONT 7, not just the the DL. And first off kyle got a journeyman QB and his backup, both of whom know WCO.

Lastly, cutting away the dead wood which had lingered so long, was key. And we had 4-5 WRs that were hangers on, and had no business being here. Bang, they went'. Their replacements, none of them household names, are still way and away better athletes and WRs than what we had had for the last 3 yrs. Admittedly, that is a low bar

Plus 1...obviously the Juice....as we had no FB last yr and we desperately needed one. Improved positions means we had to have somebody better to make these decisions and there we hit a home run....kyle and john. They were the ones making the changes noted above, and they in effect were the biggest stars we got. HC, GM, OL , DL , FB, new WRs, a good rotational #2 RB plus 2 others in contention, and 2 new TEs one of which is a RZ TE...how would you rate a team that did better or great at all these positions? Seriously, how?

I just don't see antoher team out there that got that much better everywhere except WR (#1) and QB? How many teams did all that? My guess is NONE.
And to reiterate, the key move, or decison? Was to put a hold on QB (because there was no #1 for kyle) and put a hold on #1 WR. Sure we could have gotten one, but then we would have had to sacrifice a good bit fo the improvement noted above. #! WRs come expensive in regards to talent drafting. Kyle and john did the right thing ...they passed on those two tricky slots. Helluva job. Truly helluva job.

Paso!.. Sheesh im intimated to even start reading your reply lol.

Originally posted by SmokeCrabtrees:

Paso!.. Sheesh im intimated to even start reading your reply lol.

Shucks, Smokes, and i had been doing so good on limiting posts to a paragraph or two. Yup, i backslid. Doesnt' change how much we improved team-wide at positions, however. Singularly, the biggest 1 season improvement of any 32 teams out there. The rest just backs up that premise.

I'll work on it. Smokes.

Historically awful last season. We improved everywhere.

A+ off-season.

When you get so low that you look up and see a snake's belly...you know you are in trouble. And last 2 yrs...that was us. What's amazing was that even with De Fo and Josh, we still just stunk. Part of it was the devey to Martin to Pears gruesome 3some, but it was the same everywhere. And for every guy we had who did't play well we had an equal amount not playing well PLUS they were on IR. That's when you look up nad see snake's bellies. Baalke had a bad last 4 yrs, but his last two? They were pistoleros. REALLY bad.

Originally posted by dtg_9er:
Which positions do you expect to play better this year?

I expect the passing game to flash some sophistication. In recent times, it felt like the receiver had to be really fast, big, or open to catch the ball.

Originally posted by zonkers:

Originally posted by dtg_9er:

Which positions do you expect to play better this year?

I expect the passing game to flash some sophistication. In recent times, it felt like the receiver had to be really fast, big, or open to catch the ball.

Across the board, dtg...and that is why I ,cautiously , like us better at:

DL..,we got the BIG 3 which are awesome, plus Dooms,Mitchell, DJ, PITA, et al, our strongest position on team..Plus all seem healthy

LBs Bow and Reuben...then lynch et al. Front 7 is best we have had in yrs

CBs. If they hit, look out. If not...then our D will just be good, not great
S. Ditto as above

On O:

QB and backup...way better ALREADY...and this is our weak spot

RBs...now have TWO guys who can put up yardage..an d good backups in the wings

FB/ OW...even if we had one, this was a huge leap forward

OL..C is still,the weak link, but with Kilgore, Zut, and Beadles, we are in great shape...once hurt last yr, with Kilgore, we were in trouble. OG we got two good starters and two good backups. It is our strongest position if you count backups. Then there is Joe and Trenton, one all pro, the other looking like following in his mentors footsteps...and we got way better backup with Gilliam...best yet, we no longer have Devey, Martin, nor Pears

TEs...McD had a better yr, but now have some nice talent in the wings

WRs...still got our ace from last yr, Kerley, but now have sure handed Garçon, plus 2 or 3 nice talent at # 3,4, and 5

And then the capper...best OC/HC WE've had since 17 yrs ago...and same goes for GM...match that with ownership turning back the clock to the glory days with Yorks finally agreeing maybe Eddie D had it right. Be proud of our heritage..and turn football over to the pros

In sum...only positions I am iffy about, are DBs...and I am willing to change my mind if they produce...and somehow with Lynch out there, I got a feeling some of them hit

That is a massively positive overhaul for just one FA and one draft. In a down QB yr, we wisely immediately put off FR QB(there were none) and #1 WR. And even there we finally got a developmental QB, Cousins as a distinct possibility, plus are in good shape to make a run at FR QB in draft

No other team came even close to,improving as much as we did...of course we were virtually worst in league in O, D, OC/ HC, GM,, AND ownership...all changed and for the good.

Originally posted by pasodoc9er:

AA, DeFo , Buck, DJ, Dooms, Pita, Mitchell, Dial and for LB , Bow, Foster, Navarro, Lynch, and then a riot squad of 4 or 5 guys that all could make it, but i have no idea who does. All are talented, and once again, no injuries while going thru OTAs. Sounds minimal but it wasn't . Guys were hopefully stretched out right so no pulls, no hammie's, no pecs, no knees...i know that won't hold, but I am assuming the training part of our squad is now in good hands. The fact that was Kyle's #1 fix tells you something. What we had had...obviously was NOT working. So put down in Improved positions both OL and DL.
.

Looks like John and Kyle are going to make Bowman twice the player he used to be.

Originally posted by Andra:

Looks like John and Kyle are going to make Bowman twice the player he used to be.

Yup, i liked him so well he got mentioned twice. Thanks for the note. I'll just leave it and we can laugh .

Originally posted by pasodoc9er:

Yup, i liked him so well he got mentioned twice. Thanks for the note. I'll just leave it and we can laugh .

It seems like they improved everywhere. Athletes, coaches, front office. Hopefully the synergy of the three will lead to something good. I think that it will.

But of course, we will see. First training camp. We will see what players emerge as the best. Then they have to play the games. Predictions are just opinions. The team has to get it done.

It should be fun!

Of all the yrs to have a change in cut format...who could that possibly help most but the suckiest team in the NFL in 2016, who needed the biggest complete overhaul...than us?

This just gives John and Kyle a nice bit of longer time with the guys they most want to keep. In a sense, they get extended time to be sure they are truly taking the 53 best. Also, if we take more than one cut from elsewhere, I will be surprised. My guess is none. Maybe a corner...if anything.