49ers Head Coach Kyle Shanahan Thread

Can't say Baalke ruined the team and assembled a talentless roster, then turn around and wonder why it's been two offseasons and the team isn't contending yet. The roster has been overhauled, two completely different schemes put in place on offense and defense. It's a complete franchise rebuild.

Originally posted by Joecool:
That's because we didn't turn over our entire roster.

What? How many players from 2016 are still on the team? Like 10?

Staley, Celek, Ward, AA, Eli, Blair, Tartt, Burnbridge uhhh

Originally posted by qnnhan7:
Protect your 137mil FQB and improve the run game to help take pressures off him in 1 pick— McG. How does that not make mores sense than any other option

We have cap space. Free Agency is an option we didn't use wisely. We signed another undersized RB and a C but let go of our RT. Imagine drafting McG for RG, keeping Brown, and having our FA Center. Our OL would be set.

Personally, I think we would have been better off with signing Alfred Morris much earlier in the year and pairing him with Brieda and then drafting a more workhorse type of RB in the 2018 draft.

With Malcolm Smith and all of our WRs, we didn't necessarily need Fred Warner and Pettis. Could have moved up in the draft to get an edge rusher.

edit: mtmt

Originally posted by Joecool:

Originally posted by mojave45:

Originally posted by Joecool:

Originally posted by mojave45:

Originally posted by Joecool:

Originally posted by Bluesbro:

Originally posted by Joecool:

We have been hoping for this for years now. I'll believe it when I see it starting to happen. As of now, it appears nobody knows what to do and how to do it.

Perspective is everything in life. While your posts are concentrating on the positions that still need upgrading, or are question marks, I choose to focus on just STARTING the 2nd year of what was expected to be a lengthy rebuild. From my pov we are so far ahead of where I expected to be this time last year that I can't help but feel great. I get that you were probably just stirring the pot a bit for debates sake, and that is cool (joecool). But a good dose of perspective will make things look very good right about now imo.

I would agree with you if this were 25 or so years ago. In this era, a rebuild can happen in 2 years. If it takes 4 years, then we have problems because our players from 4 years ago will be too old or near the end of their contract and we must decide to reup them on a team where they have not helped get into the playoffs.

Not every rebuild is equal though. And there are different strategies involved as well. Because it CAN happen in two years doesn't mean it will always happen in two years. I always ask everyone that pints that out to bane lbs team that has had to turn over their entire roster in two years and that went anywhere the second year. I am still waiting for a response to that. From anyone.

A surprise rebuild in this era is a one year turnaround because at least one team does that every year. A reasonable complete rebuild is 2 years and at the most 3 years.

Any longer than 3 years in this era is not a good sign because just when you think your drafted players are ready, your veterans or the players you drafted 3 years ago only have one more year on their contract. Now you are looking at going into the 4th year trying to decide who you want to keep while making the playoffs for the first time the previous year. This is a fail.

With free agency and picking high 3 straight years, this roster does not look very promising in the offensive skill positions and in the fronts.

We have what seems to be our QB, but we do not have any freak talent besides Foster and DeFo. That's not a good sign.

Once again I see a post dancing around the question. Which team has ever turned over their entire roster and has been successful in year two? No one ever answers that. Because it's never been done. We were not a typical rebuild. Most of those teams had way more talent than we did.

I have maintained since the hiring of Lynch and Shanahan that we would not see the real 49'ers come out of the ashes until 2019.

And instead of focusing on freak talent look at the entire roster, the drafting and instead of worrying about guts we drafted in year one being gone in four years, look at the model they are setting for future success. Do you think they will quit drafting talent going forward and coaching up rookies?

This isn't a one time, one shot philosophy I am seeing play out, unlike the Rams.

That's because we didn't turn over our entire roster.

That is a ridiculous nit pick. Out of players starting on the 2016 team how many are still projected as starters? On the entire team how many are projected on the 53?

So once again, dance around the fact it is a new team. We were basically an expansion team last year.

Not to mention an entirely new offensive and defensive philosophy as well as the coaching change over. Add into that they had a late start on the FA and draft prep and were hiring what was left on the shelf for assistants.

We will a better team this year, but I believe we really see what the vision is, and the proof of concept staring next year.

Originally posted by thl408:

Originally posted by Joecool:

That's because we didn't turn over our entire roster.

What? How many players from 2016 are still on the team? Like 10?

Staley, Celek, Ward, AA, Eli, Blair, Tartt, Burnbridge uhhh

Right?

Originally posted by cciowa:

i think alot of fans here are underestimating the rams. i do not think they are in the mindset that they are going all in this year and then just bow to the niners for the next five years.

No one underestimates them. No one ever said they would lay down, you dreamed that up. And you seem to ignore that teams that buy championships instead of drafting them pay the price eventually.

Originally posted by Joecool:
A surprise rebuild in this era is a one year turnaround because at least one team does that every year. A reasonable complete rebuild is 2 years and at the most 3 years.

Any longer than 3 years in this era is not a good sign because just when you think your drafted players are ready, your veterans or the players you drafted 3 years ago only have one more year on their contract. Now you are looking at going into the 4th year trying to decide who you want to keep while making the playoffs for the first time the previous year. This is a fail.

With free agency and picking high 3 straight years, this roster does not look very promising in the offensive skill positions and in the fronts.

We have what seems to be our QB, but we do not have any freak talent besides Foster and DeFo. That's not a good sign.

Would you give examples of this? The niners Harbaugh joined in 2011 were: drafted Willis, Gore, Bowman, Staley, Smith, A Davis, Iupati, Goldson. These core players were picked between 2005-2010, a six year period. They also signed free agents to augment. In 2015 they started to break down and that core was gone but for Staley and Bowman.

So I see it as waves of elite players and fill ins that is constantly refreshed...in different ways. NE tends to keep a few core elite players but then fills in with very good roll players. GB does a revamp every few years with major turn over. They dip and doodle along. The common factor is a FQB. The niners have that now and if they keep putting players around him, consistently, they will remain in the upper echelon of teams.

Originally posted by mojave45:

Originally posted by Joecool:

Originally posted by mojave45:

Originally posted by Joecool:

Originally posted by mojave45:

Originally posted by Joecool:

Originally posted by Bluesbro:

Originally posted by Joecool:
We have been hoping for this for years now. I'll believe it when I see it starting to happen. As of now, it appears nobody knows what to do and how to do it.

Perspective is everything in life. While your posts are concentrating on the positions that still need upgrading, or are question marks, I choose to focus on just STARTING the 2nd year of what was expected to be a lengthy rebuild. From my pov we are so far ahead of where I expected to be this time last year that I can't help but feel great. I get that you were probably just stirring the pot a bit for debates sake, and that is cool (joecool). But a good dose of perspective will make things look very good right about now imo.

I would agree with you if this were 25 or so years ago. In this era, a rebuild can happen in 2 years. If it takes 4 years, then we have problems because our players from 4 years ago will be too old or near the end of their contract and we must decide to reup them on a team where they have not helped get into the playoffs.

Not every rebuild is equal though. And there are different strategies involved as well. Because it CAN happen in two years doesn't mean it will always happen in two years. I always ask everyone that pints that out to bane lbs team that has had to turn over their entire roster in two years and that went anywhere the second year. I am still waiting for a response to that. From anyone.

A surprise rebuild in this era is a one year turnaround because at least one team does that every year. A reasonable complete rebuild is 2 years and at the most 3 years.

Any longer than 3 years in this era is not a good sign because just when you think your drafted players are ready, your veterans or the players you drafted 3 years ago only have one more year on their contract. Now you are looking at going into the 4th year trying to decide who you want to keep while making the playoffs for the first time the previous year. This is a fail.

With free agency and picking high 3 straight years, this roster does not look very promising in the offensive skill positions and in the fronts.

We have what seems to be our QB, but we do not have any freak talent besides Foster and DeFo. That's not a good sign.

Once again I see a post dancing around the question. Which team has ever turned over their entire roster and has been successful in year two? No one ever answers that. Because it's never been done. We were not a typical rebuild. Most of those teams had way more talent than we did.

I have maintained since the hiring of Lynch and Shanahan that we would not see the real 49'ers come out of the ashes until 2019.

And instead of focusing on freak talent look at the entire roster, the drafting and instead of worrying about guts we drafted in year one being gone in four years, look at the model they are setting for future success. Do you think they will quit drafting talent going forward and coaching up rookies?

This isn't a one time, one shot philosophy I am seeing play out, unlike the Rams.

That's because we didn't turn over our entire roster.

That is a ridiculous nit pick. Out of players starting on the 2016 team how many are still projected as starters? On the entire team how many are projected on the 53?

So once again, dance around the fact it is a new team. We were basically an expansion team last year.

Not to mention an entirely new offensive and defensive philosophy as well as the coaching change over. Add into that they had a late start on the FA and draft prep and were hiring what was left on the shelf for assistants.

We will a better team this year, but I believe we really see what the vision is, and the proof of concept staring next year.

From 2017 to 2018, we "reloaded" at positions we were already loaded on. We draft a RT but let go of a top pass blocking RT which the Pats are using very well as a stretch blocker. We draft a coverage LB when we already have a coverage LB in M. Smith. We draft a WR when we are loaded at that spot.

So, our first 3 2018 picks were of positions we already had starters at. THIS is why we still have so many holes. Instead of filling up 6 spots, we "reloaded" on 3 spots we didn't need to at this time while leaving the original holes.

Let's not even talk about Free Agency and our cap space.

Originally posted by dtg_9er:

Originally posted by Joecool:
A surprise rebuild in this era is a one year turnaround because at least one team does that every year. A reasonable complete rebuild is 2 years and at the most 3 years.

Any longer than 3 years in this era is not a good sign because just when you think your drafted players are ready, your veterans or the players you drafted 3 years ago only have one more year on their contract. Now you are looking at going into the 4th year trying to decide who you want to keep while making the playoffs for the first time the previous year. This is a fail.

With free agency and picking high 3 straight years, this roster does not look very promising in the offensive skill positions and in the fronts.

We have what seems to be our QB, but we do not have any freak talent besides Foster and DeFo. That's not a good sign.

Would you give examples of this? The niners Harbaugh joined in 2011 were: drafted Willis, Gore, Bowman, Staley, Smith, A Davis, Iupati, Goldson. These core players were picked between 2005-2010, a six year period. They also signed free agents to augment. In 2015 they started to break down and that core was gone but for Staley and Bowman.

So I see it as waves of elite players and fill ins that is constantly refreshed...in different ways. NE tends to keep a few core elite players but then fills in with very good roll players. GB does a revamp every few years with major turn over. They dip and doodle along. The common factor is a FQB. The niners have that now and if they keep putting players around him, consistently, they will remain in the upper echelon of teams.

See my post 11327. Our first three 2018 picks were not needed. We could have filled a lot of holes with those picks such as RG, Edge Rusher, and a 4 down RB.

Originally posted by Joecool:
From 2017 to 2018, we "reloaded" at positions we were already loaded on. We draft a RT but let go of a top pass blocking RT which the Pats are using very well as a stretch blocker. We draft a coverage LB when we already have a coverage LB in M. Smith. We draft a WR when we are loaded at that spot.

So, our first 3 2018 picks were of positions we already had starters at. THIS is why we still have so many holes. Instead of filling up 6 spots, we "reloaded" on 3 spots we didn't need to at this time while leaving the original holes.

Let's not even talk about Free Agency and our cap space.

I get it. You want the team to have more of a, 'go for it now' attitude in 2018. That's not the approach the front office is taking. They are looking longer term. Had they drafted for immediate needs, then maybe they do aggressively draft/sign an edge player. Garcon, Trent Brown, and Malcolm Smith are not long term answers at their positions. That's why the team went for Pettis, McG, and Warner.

Kyle and Lynch are using their 6 year contracts to their advantage. I'm positive they understand their needs, but they won't do anything haphazard to fill them that could hurt the team down the road when it comes to mortgaging draft capital or cap space. They are playing the long game.

Originally posted by mojave45:

Originally posted by Joecool:

Originally posted by mojave45:

Originally posted by Joecool:

Originally posted by Bluesbro:

Originally posted by Joecool:

We have been hoping for this for years now. I'll believe it when I see it starting to happen. As of now, it appears nobody knows what to do and how to do it.

Perspective is everything in life. While your posts are concentrating on the positions that still need upgrading, or are question marks, I choose to focus on just STARTING the 2nd year of what was expected to be a lengthy rebuild. From my pov we are so far ahead of where I expected to be this time last year that I can't help but feel great. I get that you were probably just stirring the pot a bit for debates sake, and that is cool (joecool). But a good dose of perspective will make things look very good right about now imo.

I would agree with you if this were 25 or so years ago. In this era, a rebuild can happen in 2 years. If it takes 4 years, then we have problems because our players from 4 years ago will be too old or near the end of their contract and we must decide to reup them on a team where they have not helped get into the playoffs.

Not every rebuild is equal though. And there are different strategies involved as well. Because it CAN happen in two years doesn't mean it will always happen in two years. I always ask everyone that pints that out to bane lbs team that has had to turn over their entire roster in two years and that went anywhere the second year. I am still waiting for a response to that. From anyone.

A surprise rebuild in this era is a one year turnaround because at least one team does that every year. A reasonable complete rebuild is 2 years and at the most 3 years.

Any longer than 3 years in this era is not a good sign because just when you think your drafted players are ready, your veterans or the players you drafted 3 years ago only have one more year on their contract. Now you are looking at going into the 4th year trying to decide who you want to keep while making the playoffs for the first time the previous year. This is a fail.

With free agency and picking high 3 straight years, this roster does not look very promising in the offensive skill positions and in the fronts.

We have what seems to be our QB, but we do not have any freak talent besides Foster and DeFo. That's not a good sign.

Once again I see a post dancing around the question. Which team has ever turned over their entire roster and has been successful in year two? No one ever answers that. Because it's never been done. We were not a typical rebuild. Most of those teams had way more talent than we did.

I have maintained since the hiring of Lynch and Shanahan that we would not see the real 49'ers come out of the ashes until 2019.

And instead of focusing on freak talent look at the entire roster, the drafting and instead of worrying about guts we drafted in year one being gone in four years, look at the model they are setting for future success. Do you think they will quit drafting talent going forward and coaching up rookies?

This isn't a one time, one shot philosophy I am seeing play out, unlike the Rams.

Mojave, i had hoped not and had pinned my hopes on winning it all this yr. But the further we go, the more it looks like you are going to be right. It is just not rational to turn over an entire 53 man team and be a legit competior for the SB. Sad to say. I keep hoping, but we need another yr it looks like

Originally posted by thl408:

Originally posted by Joecool:

From 2017 to 2018, we "reloaded" at positions we were already loaded on. We draft a RT but let go of a top pass blocking RT which the Pats are using very well as a stretch blocker. We draft a coverage LB when we already have a coverage LB in M. Smith. We draft a WR when we are loaded at that spot.

So, our first 3 2018 picks were of positions we already had starters at. THIS is why we still have so many holes. Instead of filling up 6 spots, we "reloaded" on 3 spots we didn't need to at this time while leaving the original holes.

Let's not even talk about Free Agency and our cap space.

I get it. You want the team to have more of a, 'go for it now' attitude in 2018. That's not the approach the front office is taking. They are looking longer term. Had they drafted for immediate needs, then maybe they do aggressively draft/sign an edge player. Garcon, Trent Brown, and Malcolm Smith are not long term answers at their positions. That's why the team went for Pettis, McG, and Warner.

Kyle and Lynch are using their 6 year contracts to their advantage. I'm positive they understand their needs, but they won't do anything haphazard to fill them that could hurt the team down the road when it comes to mortgaging draft capital or cap space. They are playing the long game.

I agree. That philosophy builds on long term success too. Quick, reactive fixes that would soon become the norm are not what these guys are doing. If they end up with more hits than misses in their drafts it will be more a New England model of long term sustained relevance.

Originally posted by Joecool:
So, our first 3 2018 picks were of positions we already had starters at. THIS is why we still have so many holes. Instead of filling up 6 spots, we "reloaded" on 3 spots we didn't need to at this time while leaving the original holes.

Let's not even talk about Free Agency and our cap space.

So many holes? Aside from Edge rush and right guard.. what else is there?

And starter doesnt equal quality starters. Brown couldnt run block at all and was unwilling to get to a weight where he could move in space. That shuts down the entire right side on run plays for the offense... the scheme is based on mobile pulling lineman so when one cant move the rest now have a road block to get to their assignments.

Drafting Pettis was controversial, I did like Landry allot but they just paid the franchise so it makes sense to get another versatile weapon. Taylor cant go outside, Bourne still needs to prove consistency, if Goodwin or Garcon go down... the outside WR group becomes an area of need... remember Louis Murphy? Then Warner is a stud at a position of need who will be filling in for and starting next to Foster.

Pass rush is gonna suck this year but at least on paper that is one of the last holes to fill on this roster. This FO is going into year two of rebuilding one of the least talented rosters in football. Getting the glaring weaknesses down to two areas is pretty damn good.

Originally posted by TheRickestRick:

Originally posted by Joecool:

So, our first 3 2018 picks were of positions we already had starters at. THIS is why we still have so many holes. Instead of filling up 6 spots, we "reloaded" on 3 spots we didn't need to at this time while leaving the original holes.

Let's not even talk about Free Agency and our cap space.

So many holes? Aside from Edge rush and right guard.. what else is there?

And starter doesnt equal quality starters. Brown couldnt run block at all and was unwilling to get to a weight where he could move in space. That shuts down the entire right side on run plays for the offense... the scheme is based on mobile pulling lineman so when one cant move the rest now have a road block to get to their assignments.

Drafting Pettis was controversial, I did like Landry allot but they just paid the franchise so it makes sense to get another versatile weapon. Taylor cant go outside, Bourne still needs to prove consistency, if Goodwin or Garcon go down... the outside WR group becomes an area of need... remember Louis Murphy? Then Warner is a stud at a position of need who will be filling in for and starting next to Foster.

Pass rush is gonna suck this year but at least on paper that is one of the last holes to fill on this roster. This FO is going into year two of rebuilding one of the least talented rosters in football. Getting the glaring weaknesses down to two areas is pretty damn good.