John Lynch - 49ers GM

Originally posted by elguapo:
It's been mentioned by Chapman, Ant and other podcasters incessantly and they sometimes stated the source (initially) but after they stated the source, they didn't have to mention it evertime. So it is what it is.

Also, even if Williams played a lot or not has absolutely no bearing on his grade. His 80+ grade definitely raises the aggregate like I said. Colton played a little better than last year (I like that he holds a bit more) but like you and many said, an upgrade at C would be tremendous.

As far as Purdy goes, pressure up the middle is devastating, but I lost count of how many sacks he got out of due to atrocious interior OL play (Brendel and Banks). Brock held it longer this year mostly bc an almost league low separation by our backup WRs, not so bc he was looking to push the ball downfield. In 2023 he was launching bombs early to Aiyuk and company. Hopefully his TTT will increase bc I'd love to see him have time in the pocket without being moved off his spot.

Brendel was 17th overall on PFF. For sure poor PBLKer.

Brock was absolutely part of the issue with pressure as well. Dude was holding onto the ball entirely too long trying to push it downfield a lot, not just because no one was open ever. Brock was 7th overall in IAY/PA (intended air yards per passing attempt aka depth of target). He absolutely wanted to push the ball downfield a lot. He's kinda the opposite of Jimmy there.

Overall that's what TTT is more relatable with. Guys not getting the ball out quickly (seeing the field well) and running around in the backfield. He's gotta improve there and for sure we can always add play makers around him.

I'll add his pressure % was 23rd in the league. So no he actually wasn't as pressure as people think. Damn near the bottom there.

Originally posted by NYniner85:

Originally posted by genus49:

Originally posted by NYniner85:

Originally posted by elguapo:
Incorrect. That may be the general rating however, Brendel cost us 2-3 games by himself with his 33rd rated self!!!! Williams and Puni bring the group ranking WAY UP.

having average players is much better than 2 great players and 2-3 horrendous ones

I'm no fan of Brendel, but where did you get the 33rd rate from?

Williams barely played this year. Colton was actually decent and will probably play his way out of SF in a yr the way guys are getting paid.

honestly upgrading the center position would vastly improve the OL overall. Brock himself needs to play better and get rid the of ball quicker, his TT was near the top of the league and he was consistently looking to push the ball downfield. Time and a place for all that, but this OL isn't built to be a heavy straight drop back OL.

PFF has him as the 36th overall ranked Center based on pass pro.

Overall he's 20th.

I'm not seeing that?

Don't know what to tell you on how they get their calculations

But this is straight from their own site



Brendel is 20th overall. You can adjust for % of snaps played but that just further skews the info since only so many guys play 50%/80% of snaps. The screenshot above is 20% of snaps played which eliminates the single game, couple of snap type outliers.

Originally posted by genus49:

Originally posted by NYniner85:

Originally posted by genus49:

Originally posted by NYniner85:

Originally posted by elguapo:
Incorrect. That may be the general rating however, Brendel cost us 2-3 games by himself with his 33rd rated self!!!! Williams and Puni bring the group ranking WAY UP.

having average players is much better than 2 great players and 2-3 horrendous ones

I'm no fan of Brendel, but where did you get the 33rd rate from?

Williams barely played this year. Colton was actually decent and will probably play his way out of SF in a yr the way guys are getting paid.

honestly upgrading the center position would vastly improve the OL overall. Brock himself needs to play better and get rid the of ball quicker, his TT was near the top of the league and he was consistently looking to push the ball downfield. Time and a place for all that, but this OL isn't built to be a heavy straight drop back OL.

PFF has him as the 36th overall ranked Center based on pass pro.

Overall he's 20th.

I'm not seeing that?

Don't know what to tell you on how they get their calculations

But this is straight from their own site



Brendel is 20th overall. You can adjust for % of snaps played but that just further skews the info since only so many guys play 50%/80% of snaps. The screenshot above is 20% of snaps played which eliminates the single game, couple of snap type outliers.

You're adding guys with less than 300 snaps to the equation. Why would you do that?

this is what it looks like on their page right now when you don't mess around with the snap mins

Originally posted by NYniner85:

Originally posted by genus49:

Originally posted by NYniner85:

Originally posted by genus49:

Originally posted by NYniner85:

Originally posted by elguapo:
Incorrect. That may be the general rating however, Brendel cost us 2-3 games by himself with his 33rd rated self!!!! Williams and Puni bring the group ranking WAY UP.

having average players is much better than 2 great players and 2-3 horrendous ones

I'm no fan of Brendel, but where did you get the 33rd rate from?

Williams barely played this year. Colton was actually decent and will probably play his way out of SF in a yr the way guys are getting paid.

honestly upgrading the center position would vastly improve the OL overall. Brock himself needs to play better and get rid the of ball quicker, his TT was near the top of the league and he was consistently looking to push the ball downfield. Time and a place for all that, but this OL isn't built to be a heavy straight drop back OL.

PFF has him as the 36th overall ranked Center based on pass pro.

Overall he's 20th.

I'm not seeing that?

Don't know what to tell you on how they get their calculations

But this is straight from their own site



Brendel is 20th overall. You can adjust for % of snaps played but that just further skews the info since only so many guys play 50%/80% of snaps. The screenshot above is 20% of snaps played which eliminates the single game, couple of snap type outliers.

You're adding guys with less than 300 snaps to the equation. Why would you do that?

this is what it looks like on their page right now when you don't mess around with the snap mins

Part of the problem NY is you seem like you are trying to push the narrative that our center wasn't totally atrocious or awful and putting more blame on Brock Purdy. I can see that but the facts remain…. Brock Purdy escaped so many sacks and so much pressure, especially up the middle that he deserves a damn medal, not so much criticism.

Putting a lot on him, especially when our receivers got no separation whatsoever and our major weapons were out like Williams BA and McCaffrey is disingenuous. Our center is bottom of the barrel in NFL. Rankings differ by which site or source you use but we all could see how absolutely awful he was by watching every play of every game which we did.

"Game over man, game over!!!"

Let's just hope Hennessy is the starter this year bc that will help out Brock and the offense out so much. We can all agree that we need a huge upgrade at C.

*******We were in the BOTTOM 2 in third and 2 or less in the NFL. That is a huge stat showing how poor Brendel and Banks were all year.

Originally posted by elguapo:
Part of the problem NY is you seem like you are trying to push the narrative that our center wasn't totally atrocious or awful and putting more blame on Brock Purdy. I can see that but the facts remain…. Brock Purdy escaped so many sacks and so much pressure, especially up the middle that he deserves a damn medal, not so much criticism.

Putting a lot on him, especially when our receivers got no separation whatsoever and our major weapons were out like Williams BA and McCaffrey is disingenuous. Our center is bottom of the barrel in NFL. Rankings differ by which site or source you use but we all could see how absolutely awful he was by watching every play of every game which we did.

"Game over man, game over!!!"

Let's just hope Hennessy is the starter this year bc that will help out Brock and the offense out so much. We can all agree that we need a huge upgrade at C.

*******We were in the BOTTOM 2 in third and 2 or less in the NFL. That is a huge stat showing how poor Brendel and Banks were all year.

No he didn't man. Post proof that he escaped so many sacks or else it's just hearsay.

There are so many reasons why we dropped in scoring PPG and 3rd downs but the main reasons were:

- Injuries. We were without Trent, Banks and CMC for half the year and Aiuyk for the whole year. Pearsall got shot. Mason missed time. Guerrendo missed time. Hell we had to play with a 4th string RB at times.

- Kittle had to stay in and block because we didn't have a blocking TE

- Deebo regressed to a shell of his former self.

Putting all the blame on one position player and ignoring all those points is just flat out absurd and makes you look foolish.

Sure we could use an upgrade on center but good luck finding one. There are also half a dozen more pressing needs where we need an upgrade.

Originally posted by genus49:

Originally posted by Cisco0623:

Originally posted by genus49:
A tale as old as time. Fans overreacting to pre-draft talking points from the GM/HC.

It wasn't that long ago that we were raging about this regime not caring about edge rushers because they were content with Cassius Marsh.

They're not going to show their hand and they're going to prop up the guys they have now until they can find replacements. As a reminder to some they talked about Marsh like he was Reggie White in his prime and then once they were able to add legit edge rushers they cut his ass.

I am bookmarking this comment. I know this is BS day and season, but they have largely ignored the o line their entire tenure. I wont be holding my breath.

You can bookmark it and I'm not predicting they will have the equivalent of adding Dee Ford and Nick Bosa on the OL since the draft isn't strong on the OL at our biggest spots to improve on.

However your claim that they've ignored the OL is not accurate. I've done a deep dive on this before but don't feel like it again so will just go off memory and address the big moves.

McGlinchey with a top 10 pick - if you recall most people felt we didn't have a need at OT cuz we had Trent Brown
Weston Richburg - big $ in FA
Trent Williams trade - huge move with Staley retiring
Traded for Laken Tomlinson
Added key cheap vets in FA who have been major contributors on the OL - Mike Person, Brandon Fusco, Ben Garland, Daniel Brunskill
Signed Alex Mack
Drafted Aaron Banks in the 2nd round
Drafted Puni in the 3rd round
Jaylon Moore, Burford, Zakelj, Mckivitz drafted to develop.

I think if anything we've simply been unlucky in some of our bigger FA moves. RIchburg was playing great football before the career ending injury.

The biggest issue is the moves haven't been homeruns save hopefully Puni and Trent Williams. It doesn't help that you have an OL coach who believes he can coach guys up and it doesn't help that Kyle is very particular in who he looks for in OL and it hasn't fallen for us where BPA was OL earlier in the drafts.

The proof is how cyclical this topic is every year. The line is not good, and you guys are all throwing numbers at me to defend it. We get it, the line overachieves based on many metrics, except come championship time.

Do you really expect different results rolling out this offensive line next season? We will be having this same exact conversation again, and you will probably still try to justify it.

They have had way more focus on dline and lets be honest, their record here has been abysmal aside Bosa. They have not drafted well with the trenches and the ones who were good, were not retained.

Originally posted by NYniner85:
Not really. They traded for the best LT this decade. Spend top 5 money on a center. Drafted a RT top 10. Drafted a OG top 50 etc etc.

I don't expect them to go OL high. Listening to Kyle just talk….There's gonna be a heavy dose of young defensive linemen added via the draft. Toss LBer in there.

start doing your homework on late day 2 day 3 OL. Cause they're not looking at that based off everything they've all said (and this isn't the draft to go that direction early anyway).

I know you're probably right, but I actually think this is why they should go oline early and then fill out the defense mid to late rounds. Again, if they roll the line out as it is today, I don't expect anything other than being back here again next year with this same topic. TW could retire tomorrow, McK is a FA after this year. Not taking a tackle at 11 if one is there would be stupid unless a blue chip fell.

Anyone defending Brendel is nuts, that guy is garbage and he is a ball and chain to the entire team. I know they can work with/around Mckivitz, but not him + Brendel. We will have a 50million dollar QB hurt or damaged regardless.

Originally posted by Cisco0623:
The proof is how cyclical this topic is every year. The line is not good, and you guys are all throwing numbers at me to defend it. We get it, the line overachieves based on many metrics, except come championship time.

Do you really expect different results rolling out this offensive line next season? We will be having this same exact conversation again, and you will probably still try to justify it.

They have had way more focus on dline and lets be honest, their record here has been abysmal aside Bosa. They have not drafted well with the trenches and the ones who were good, were not retained.

I know you're probably right, but I actually think this is why they should go oline early and then fill out the defense mid to late rounds. Again, if they roll the line out as it is today, I don't expect anything other than being back here again next year with this same topic. TW could retire tomorrow, McK is a FA after this year. Not taking a tackle at 11 if one is there would be stupid unless a blue chip fell.

Anyone defending Brendel is nuts, that guy is garbage and he is a ball and chain to the entire team. I know they can work with/around Mckivitz, but not him + Brendel. We will have a 50million dollar QB hurt or damaged regardless.

There isn't one rookie that will come in and improve on what we have. It just won't happen.

It makes ZERO sense to draft a tackle with a premium pick just because Trent Williams might retire in two years.

Deal with it when it happens or have a top 15 pick play out of position at a less than impactful position or sit on the bench.

It makes no sense when we literally have NO STARTERS at either DT position, one starting DE, one starting LB and two starting corners.

Originally posted by Sask49erFan:

Originally posted by Cisco0623:
The proof is how cyclical this topic is every year. The line is not good, and you guys are all throwing numbers at me to defend it. We get it, the line overachieves based on many metrics, except come championship time.

Do you really expect different results rolling out this offensive line next season? We will be having this same exact conversation again, and you will probably still try to justify it.

They have had way more focus on dline and lets be honest, their record here has been abysmal aside Bosa. They have not drafted well with the trenches and the ones who were good, were not retained.

I know you're probably right, but I actually think this is why they should go oline early and then fill out the defense mid to late rounds. Again, if they roll the line out as it is today, I don't expect anything other than being back here again next year with this same topic. TW could retire tomorrow, McK is a FA after this year. Not taking a tackle at 11 if one is there would be stupid unless a blue chip fell.

Anyone defending Brendel is nuts, that guy is garbage and he is a ball and chain to the entire team. I know they can work with/around Mckivitz, but not him + Brendel. We will have a 50million dollar QB hurt or damaged regardless.

There isn't one rookie that will come in and improve on what we have. It just won't happen.

It makes ZERO sense to draft a tackle with a premium pick just because Trent Williams might retire in two years.

Deal with it when it happens or have a top 15 pick play out of position at a less than impactful position or sit on the bench.

It makes no sense when we literally have NO STARTERS at either DT position, one starting DE, one starting LB and two starting corners.

How do you know we cannot improve the offensive line? That's ridiculous. If we have a draft that is deep along the defensive line and thinner at the offensive line, then using a higher pick on the o line makes sense. Using your logic how can we say any rookie could improve the d line either?

Originally posted by elguapo:
Part of the problem NY is you seem like you are trying to push the narrative that our center wasn't totally atrocious or awful and putting more blame on Brock Purdy. I can see that but the facts remain…. Brock Purdy escaped so many sacks and so much pressure, especially up the middle that he deserves a damn medal, not so much criticism.

Putting a lot on him, especially when our receivers got no separation whatsoever and our major weapons were out like Williams BA and McCaffrey is disingenuous. Our center is bottom of the barrel in NFL. Rankings differ by which site or source you use but we all could see how absolutely awful he was by watching every play of every game which we did.

"Game over man, game over!!!"

Let's just hope Hennessy is the starter this year bc that will help out Brock and the offense out so much. We can all agree that we need a huge upgrade at C.

*******We were in the BOTTOM 2 in third and 2 or less in the NFL. That is a huge stat showing how poor Brendel and Banks were all year.

Listen, I'm not a Brendel fan. Not sure how many times I've had to say that. He's without question the weak link to the OL. I'm pointing out he was bad as a PBLK (see PFF) he was actually pretty good as a RBLK. He's not the worst starting center like everyone claims. Does he need to be upgraded? Absolutely!

folks need to accept that if a lineman can't run block, they aren't getting on the field here. Period

you could be one of the best pass-blockers in the league (Trent brown says hi), but if you can't run block you're out.

Our offense is not built to be a true drop back pass heavy scheme. Just not. The foundation is running the ball and playing off that. Play action and moving the QB around behind the LOS. Distribute the ball and let the play makers do their thing.

Brock was not pressured as much as everyone wants to complain about this yr. The stats are there. He was pressured less this yr vs 2023. He forced downfield passes this yr, hence the TTT.

I mean there's a reason we have these huge debates about Brock. You act like the only way he can be successful is if we have a ton of stud separators. We've talked about his lack of arm strength and being able to throw those tight window throws. Well that adds up to him needing more space to make completions…. Shows BA's worth as well (while everyone wants to trade him for a bag of chips because they're all up in their feelings over contract stuff). If he's healthy it's a massive upgrade.

I'll add we lost one WR from 2023 to 2024. He still had kittle, Deebo and JJ.

Banks just got paid $77M, clearly the league thought he was better…it shows how bad the NFL is overall at OL. Same s**t with McG, everyone was crying about him for years. Now he's part of one of the best OLs in the league.

Originally posted by NYniner85:

Originally posted by elguapo:
Part of the problem NY is you seem like you are trying to push the narrative that our center wasn't totally atrocious or awful and putting more blame on Brock Purdy. I can see that but the facts remain…. Brock Purdy escaped so many sacks and so much pressure, especially up the middle that he deserves a damn medal, not so much criticism.

Putting a lot on him, especially when our receivers got no separation whatsoever and our major weapons were out like Williams BA and McCaffrey is disingenuous. Our center is bottom of the barrel in NFL. Rankings differ by which site or source you use but we all could see how absolutely awful he was by watching every play of every game which we did.

"Game over man, game over!!!"

Let's just hope Hennessy is the starter this year bc that will help out Brock and the offense out so much. We can all agree that we need a huge upgrade at C.

*******We were in the BOTTOM 2 in third and 2 or less in the NFL. That is a huge stat showing how poor Brendel and Banks were all year.

Listen, I'm not a Brendel fan. Not sure how many times I've had to say that. He's without question the weak link to the OL. I'm pointing out he was bad as a PBLK (see PFF) he was actually pretty good as a RBLK. He's not the worst starting center like everyone claims. Does he need to be upgraded? Absolutely!

folks need to accept that if a lineman can't run block, they aren't getting on the field here. Period

you could be one of the best pass-blockers in the league (Trent brown says hi), but if you can't run block you're out.

Our offense is not built to be a true drop back pass heavy scheme. Just not. The foundation is running the ball and playing off that. Play action and moving the QB around behind the LOS. Distribute the ball and let the play makers do their thing.

Brock was not pressured as much as everyone wants to complain about this yr. The stats are there. He was pressured less this yr vs 2023. He forced downfield passes this yr, hence the TTT.

I mean there's a reason we have these huge debates about Brock. You act like the only way he can be successful is if we have a ton of stud separators. We've talked about his lack of arm strength and being able to throw those tight window throws. Well that adds up to him needing more space to make completions…. Shows BA's worth as well (while everyone wants to trade him for a bag of chips because they're all up in their feelings over contract stuff). If he's healthy it's a massive upgrade.

I'll add we lost one WR from 2023 to 2024. He still had kittle, Deebo and JJ.

Banks just got paid $77M, clearly the league thought he was better…it shows how bad the NFL is overall at OL. Same s**t with McG, everyone was crying about him for years. Now he's part of one of the best OLs in the league.

I think we agree more than disagree and based on what you said then i think Kyles offense is half assed as he has a down the field pocket passer, but not the o-line to compliment his play style etc.

Simply put our trenches are weak and need to be improved. I have more faith in them improving the defense line, than offensive line at this point.

Originally posted by Cisco0623:

Originally posted by NYniner85:

Originally posted by elguapo:
Part of the problem NY is you seem like you are trying to push the narrative that our center wasn't totally atrocious or awful and putting more blame on Brock Purdy. I can see that but the facts remain…. Brock Purdy escaped so many sacks and so much pressure, especially up the middle that he deserves a damn medal, not so much criticism.

Putting a lot on him, especially when our receivers got no separation whatsoever and our major weapons were out like Williams BA and McCaffrey is disingenuous. Our center is bottom of the barrel in NFL. Rankings differ by which site or source you use but we all could see how absolutely awful he was by watching every play of every game which we did.

"Game over man, game over!!!"

Let's just hope Hennessy is the starter this year bc that will help out Brock and the offense out so much. We can all agree that we need a huge upgrade at C.

*******We were in the BOTTOM 2 in third and 2 or less in the NFL. That is a huge stat showing how poor Brendel and Banks were all year.

Listen, I'm not a Brendel fan. Not sure how many times I've had to say that. He's without question the weak link to the OL. I'm pointing out he was bad as a PBLK (see PFF) he was actually pretty good as a RBLK. He's not the worst starting center like everyone claims. Does he need to be upgraded? Absolutely!

folks need to accept that if a lineman can't run block, they aren't getting on the field here. Period

you could be one of the best pass-blockers in the league (Trent brown says hi), but if you can't run block you're out.

Our offense is not built to be a true drop back pass heavy scheme. Just not. The foundation is running the ball and playing off that. Play action and moving the QB around behind the LOS. Distribute the ball and let the play makers do their thing.

Brock was not pressured as much as everyone wants to complain about this yr. The stats are there. He was pressured less this yr vs 2023. He forced downfield passes this yr, hence the TTT.

I mean there's a reason we have these huge debates about Brock. You act like the only way he can be successful is if we have a ton of stud separators. We've talked about his lack of arm strength and being able to throw those tight window throws. Well that adds up to him needing more space to make completions…. Shows BA's worth as well (while everyone wants to trade him for a bag of chips because they're all up in their feelings over contract stuff). If he's healthy it's a massive upgrade.

I'll add we lost one WR from 2023 to 2024. He still had kittle, Deebo and JJ.

Banks just got paid $77M, clearly the league thought he was better…it shows how bad the NFL is overall at OL. Same s**t with McG, everyone was crying about him for years. Now he's part of one of the best OLs in the league.

I think we agree more than disagree and based on what you said then i think Kyles offense is half assed as he has a down the field pocket passer, but not the o-line to compliment his play style etc.

Simply put our trenches are weak and need to be improved. I have more faith in them improving the defense line, than offensive line at this point.

For sure, and if we put resources into the offensive line, we would probably have one or two Super Bowls. It's just amazing that they don't know that by now or don't want to change philosophies.

Originally posted by Sask49erFan:
No he didn't man. Post proof that he escaped so many sacks or else it's just hearsay.

There are so many reasons why we dropped in scoring PPG and 3rd downs but the main reasons were:

- Injuries. We were without Trent, Banks and CMC for half the year and Aiuyk for the whole year. Pearsall got shot. Mason missed time. Guerrendo missed time. Hell we had to play with a 4th string RB at times.

- Kittle had to stay in and block because we didn't have a blocking TE

- Deebo regressed to a shell of his former self.

Putting all the blame on one position player and ignoring all those points is just flat out absurd and makes you look foolish.

Sure we could use an upgrade on center but good luck finding one. There are also half a dozen more pressing needs where we need an upgrade.

You're asking to post proof? Did you not watch any of the 49ers games last year? He avoided so much pressure and so many sacks. It was unbelievable. I actually felt sorry for him running around that much. Maybe you missed every game but that's OK. There are other factors as to why we lost but having a better offensive line, especially Center was a major factor (did you not catch how many times Brendel would get blown up, couldn't hold his blocks or just watched somebody hit our quarterback and all he did was stand there and look? It was incredibly pathetic and did cost us a few games).

A upgrade at C would've helped us so much in the red zone as well as third and short, which again, we were second to last in the NFL, which is disturbing even with the injuries we had.

Originally posted by Cisco0623:
I think we agree more than disagree and based on what you said then i think Kyles offense is half assed as he has a down the field pocket passer, but not the o-line to compliment his play style etc.

Simply put our trenches are weak and need to be improved. I have more faith in them improving the defense line, than offensive line at this point.

The offenses biggest issue was RZ TDs last yr. That has to do with a lack of talent in those close quarters situations, QB play, and Kyle needing to be more creative down there.

Originally posted by elguapo:
For sure, and if we put resources into the offensive line, we would probably have one or two Super Bowls. It's just amazing that they don't know that by now or don't want to change philosophies.

They would have won two super bowls if we didn't have Dre get injured and Jimmy could make a downfield throw all the same.

I agree you can always improve the OL. IMO this draft isn't setup to do that unfortunately.

we will put points up if we can get healthy on the offensive side…also based off Kyle's presser today, I'm expecting more targets for Kittle in 2025.