49ers Finale 2016 - Thoughts on the season and the team going forward...

This was one of your finest posts!!

Thanks for all your input all season long.

Well, starting with Marvin's list above, we have 10 guys , almost enough to field either an entire D or O...but not both.

Six guys on D, and Four guys on O. The better news is that O also has Staley, Beadle(at OC), so we have a true really nice OL to start out with. Yes, we need starter backups, but right now we have Staley/ Garnett/ Beadles/ Tiller/ Trenton, and even tho all are not the 10 guys Marvin has named, they all count FINALLY on that OL. Our OL is what we start with this coming season. It actually works but we need a couple starter type subs..maybe Theus, but still early to tell for me.'


Moving over to D, Marvin has 6 guys , all guys he is watching as starters. LBs we got wiped out on. Wiped out. And Bow coming back after a second major lower limb surgery....not likely he will be the old Bow. However: we do have 4 high picks coming, and one of those is going to be an NT unless we snag one in FA (I hope). But we will have two terrific DEs, and with a FA or draftee NT, will have our DL set. Blair is nice from the outside, also. But we are likely to get a superb passrusher in draft, keeping in mind we pick in the top 98 4times. #2, #34, #66, #98. Most likely that will only be 3 picks because I feel a move up coming. Still we are in position for 3 starting impact players. Add those to our D and it will be close to decent. Certainly one high and one low is going for QB unless we go Garopp. If so, then we get one QB lower down, maybe another late. But we are close to having a DL, maybe half or 3/4 of our DBs, Blair, and a new top flite passusher, making us weak still at LB. Maybe we get lucky and find some in FA, IDK. But we are a lot closer to where we want to be than just 10 starters, overall.

Sure the big IF is QB. And we got a situation where Trubisky if there would be our first pick but he is truly BPA somewhere further down the list. Maybe we take him, but hard to imagine we let Garrett(unless gone) or Allen (Ala DE) go by. We get one of those guys for sure. All of a sudden, we look like a decent D team, but no LBs. FA and draft will have to build that.

On O we lack a #1 WR, another RB starter, but besides the big MISSING piece, QB, we are very close to where we want to be. It is just that the impact players we are missing, are all key. A Garrett immediately fixes a lot of that, Allen would be interesting. Trubisky....pretty thin piece of work there. But then again, maybe Cleve takes its 4th QB as the #1 pick in the draft, setting a new NFL record for picking #1 QBs. That would make our pick a lot easier.

Point is, we are better than just 10 starters to keep our eyes on. We can fill out most of a D and O, just missing 4 key impact players, 2 on D, 2 on O. But they are all the 4 impact players that you never get more than 1 at a time per yr. Occasionally you might get 2. Only other way is to blow a wad in FA, paying up to double to bring in an impact NT, and an impact ILB. Do that and we could get 3, even 4 impact players. Somehow, I don't think we get our QB fixed this yr...at least not in the top 4 QBs. If we got lucky it would be from #75-125 in draft and would have to be a Dak clone...of which there are none. So I see us getting most of our needs this yr, but not scoring at QB.

In retrospect, this season was doomed before it started. The defense had a young flailing DC brought in to teach a highly complex scheme to a bunch of youngsters. The LBs were being asked to make post snap reads of what the down linemen were doing, then react accordingly. Ian Williams, the most consistent D starter from last season IR'ed, Dorsey the vet of the DL out half the season, Lynch suspended 4 games, AA busted shoulder. The defensive backfield was asked to learn pattern matching to add to the complexity. Multiple fronts, lots of personnel packages, coverages that were a healthy mix off man, zone, and pattern matching. Lose Ray Ray, lose Bow. Tank and Eli show no signs of generating pressure.

On offense Chip loves his 11 personnel (3WRs) but that was the big weak spot of the offensive roster - WR. So now the weakest area of the offense is asked to field 3 players on every down. Down goes Ellington and Rogers (CFL guy) who were both considered possible contributors, especially Ellington. Gabbert showed improvement in 2015 from his JAC days. Reverts back to looking like a jaguar. Interior run blocking was subpar. Guards have trouble nailing their second level blocks. Kilgore gets no push run blocking.

Bright spots were DeFo, Hyde, Kerley, Kap reestablishing himself as a competent NFL QB, Rashard Robinson, TBrown, Vance. Too many disappointments but Gabbert, Harold, Tank, Tartt, and Lynch are my notables. Young guys we needed to improve. Gabbert being a letdown is my own fault. I thought he could improve upon 2015, but 2015 was his peak and that was barely passable by NFL standards.

Chip was dealt a tough hand, but outside of a few two RB backfields and a slower tempo, I didn't see much change from his days in PHI. There was little evolving from Chip. Good coaches scout the opposing defense and adjust. Chip tries to do what he likes better. Pretty much 11 and 12 personnel (1rb/2te/2wr) all game. Baalke out is a fitting ending. Liked his philosophy of acquiring as many draft darts as possible, but it's useless if he can't hit the dartboard. At least he didn't destroy the cap space situation for the next guy. At least there's a GM/HC search to entertain us this offseason as well as our consolation prize, the 2nd overall.

Originally posted by thl408:

In retrospect, this season was doomed before it started. The defense had a young flailing DC brought in to teach a highly complex scheme to a bunch of youngsters. The LBs were being asked to make post snap reads of what the down linemen were doing, then react accordingly. Ian Williams, the most consistent D starter from last season IR'ed, Dorsey the vet of the DL out half the season, Lynch suspended 4 games, AA busted shoulder. The defensive backfield was asked to learn pattern matching to add to the complexity. Multiple fronts, lots of personnel packages, coverages that were a healthy mix off man, zone, and pattern matching. Lose Ray Ray, lose Bow. Tank and Eli show no signs of generating pressure.

On offense Chip loves his 11 personnel (3WRs) but that was the big weak spot of the offensive roster - WR. So now the weakest area of the offense is asked to field 3 players on every down. Down goes Ellington and Rogers (CFL guy) who were both considered possible contributors, especially Ellington. Gabbert showed improvement in 2015 from his JAC days. Reverts back to looking like a jaguar. Interior run blocking was subpar. Guards have trouble nailing their second level blocks. Kilgore gets no push run blocking.

Bright spots were DeFo, Hyde, Kerley, Kap reestablishing himself as a competent NFL QB, Rashard Robinson, TBrown, Vance. Too many disappointments but Gabbert, Harold, Tank, Tartt, and Lynch are my notables. Young guys we needed to improve. Gabbert being a letdown is my own fault. I thought he could improve upon 2015, but 2015 was his peak and that was barely passable by NFL standards.

Chip was dealt a tough hand, but outside of a few two RB backfields and a slower tempo, I didn't see much change from his days in PHI. There was little evolving from Chip. Good coaches scout the opposing defense and adjust. Chip tries to do what he likes better. Pretty much 11 and 12 personnel (1rb/2te/2wr) all game. Baalke out is a fitting ending. Liked his philosophy of acquiring as many draft darts as possible, but it's useless if he can't hit the dartboard. At least he didn't destroy the cap space situation for the next guy. At least there's a GM/HC search to entertain us this offseason as well as our consolation prize, the 2nd overall.

2016...that's a wrap. Well said.

I normally would agree w/Marvin.. but if believes that GORE will help this team especially in the locker room, the I fully believe that our problem is bigger than what it is..

Gore's done, he can no longer help this team and I don't care what some tv host or announcers may say... It's time for the young guys to step up, even if this means we get rid of Bowman, Staley, I say the next guy has to step up..

what I would like to see is for the team to sign FS (Eric Berry)... He will bring balance to this team.. leadership.. smart play.. he could be that DWIGHT HICKS of 1981.. and the TIM MCDONALD of the 90s.. .. and last but not the least.. JUSTIN SMITH of the past 10 years..

Originally posted by thl408:
In retrospect, this season was doomed before it started. The defense had a young flailing DC brought in to teach a highly complex scheme to a bunch of youngsters. The LBs were being asked to make post snap reads of what the down linemen were doing, then react accordingly. Ian Williams, the most consistent D starter from last season IR'ed, Dorsey the vet of the DL out half the season, Lynch suspended 4 games, AA busted shoulder. The defensive backfield was asked to learn pattern matching to add to the complexity. Multiple fronts, lots of personnel packages, coverages that were a healthy mix off man, zone, and pattern matching. Lose Ray Ray, lose Bow. Tank and Eli show no signs of generating pressure.

On offense Chip loves his 11 personnel (3WRs) but that was the big weak spot of the offensive roster - WR. So now the weakest area of the offense is asked to field 3 players on every down. Down goes Ellington and Rogers (CFL guy) who were both considered possible contributors, especially Ellington. Gabbert showed improvement in 2015 from his JAC days. Reverts back to looking like a jaguar. Interior run blocking was subpar. Guards have trouble nailing their second level blocks. Kilgore gets no push run blocking.

Bright spots were DeFo, Hyde, Kerley, Kap reestablishing himself as a competent NFL QB, Rashard Robinson, TBrown, Vance. Too many disappointments but Gabbert, Harold, Tank, Tartt, and Lynch are my notables. Young guys we needed to improve. Gabbert being a letdown is my own fault. I thought he could improve upon 2015, but 2015 was his peak and that was barely passable by NFL standards.

Chip was dealt a tough hand, but outside of a few two RB backfields and a slower tempo, I didn't see much change from his days in PHI. There was little evolving from Chip. Good coaches scout the opposing defense and adjust. Chip tries to do what he likes better. Pretty much 11 and 12 personnel (1rb/2te/2wr) all game. Baalke out is a fitting ending. Liked his philosophy of acquiring as many draft darts as possible, but it's useless if he can't hit the dartboard. At least he didn't destroy the cap space situation for the next guy. At least there's a GM/HC search to entertain us this offseason as well as our consolation prize, the 2nd overall.

I though tartt was good this year. I like the way he plays. Harold was ok. lynch was a huge disappointment. he needs some body to coach him up. I pray we don't draft trubisky in the 4th round. garrett, allen or Barnett is a must.

Another wasted year...two straight "evaluation" years where nothing gets accomplished and we are headed for a third evaluation" year.
I don't have a lot of confidence in those building the future but I am going to try to be hopeful.

Marvin 49
I like all your points
Don't want to write took much but heres a thought....The last time we were 2-14 Bill Walsh was hired and a qb was selected in the 3rd round...3 yrs later'SUPERBOWL'

Originally posted by Marvin49:
So my job situation kinda sucks right now because we dunno whats gonna happen (company was purchased)...but this was pretty cool.

I got invited to watch the game from the company suite on Sunday. I saw Levis from a different angle and I have to say...I don't care what people say, I love that place.

Anyway...


1) Kap: I don't hate Kap and I don't love Kap. I just don't think he's a part of the future. I mean the guy finished the season with a 4 to 1 TD to INT ratio and his best QB rating since 2013.

I just think he needs to go and the team needs to start fresh with another young QB.



2) Baalke: It was time. The more I hear the more I'm convinced he should have gone earlier. I defended the guy for several years so I'm not going to pretend I didn't, but I flipped around midseason this year. If what I've been hearing lately tho is true and he was the reason they didn't hire Gase (although I'm not really sold on him yet) and the reason they didn't hire Hue Jackson (per Michael Silver), then the firing came far too late. Problem is tho...how much of that is true and how much of that is Jed spinning.

Dunno.



3) Kelly: I've been saying that I wouldn't mind him coming back and I'm actually still on that page. I don't hate Chip and there were aspects of his offense I really like. Here's the rub tho...once you decide that Trent is done, what do you do next? If you force a coach on a GM then you limit who is willing to take that job. You can't give the job to Chip as he's proven he can't do both jobs.

Essentially...once the decision was made to fire Baalke, they HAD to fire Chip.



4) Jed: I've seen from ALOT of people that they didn't like Jeds "I own the team" line. I couldn't disagree more. I LOVED it. It was the closest I've ever seen him to acting like Eddie. He was cordial about it, but it was effectively an FU to Lowell Cohn and precisely the answer I'd want from an owner.

Jed wasn't cut out to be in front of the camera and many would say he wasn't cut out to hold the job he has. That wouldn't be entirely unfair either. THAT response tho to me was perfect. Loved it.



5) Reset: Jed has been trying to hang on desperately thinking that they could somehow recreate some of that Harbaugh magic. I think he finally woke up here. It was an expensive lesson (more on that later). The 49ers haven't completely reset since 2005. They came close in 2011 but Trent was essentially just promoted.

Bringing in all new blood is precisely what the team needs. All that talent from 2011-2013 is gone now. Bill Walsh, George Seifert, or Jim Harbaugh aren't walking in the door anytime soon.

Start over. Start fresh. There are some you pieces to build around but get the right guys in place to move this team into the future.

As far as the expense....can we PLEASE stop with the "Yorks are cheap" mantra? It hasn't been the case since Jed took over and it isn't the case now. They are dropping 30 mil or so for coaches who won't be coaching the team...and thats just the HCs. Yes...they didn't use the cap space, but guess what? It rolls over and they HAVE to spend it or not comply with league rules. It'll get spent and NOW that cap space is a huge plus to perspective GMs and Coaches.



6) "Who would want to coach there?": Everybody. Seriously. 80 to 100 mil in cap space. 2nd pick of the draft. An owner who wants to win so desperately he'll be dropping 30 mil on coaches not coaching the team. A brand new stadium with revenue streams galore. A historic NFL franchise. When the Niners are good, they OWN this town. They can be good again.

Don't let people convince you that the 49er job isn't desirable. Thats BS...in particular because Baalke isn't there anymore.



7) Frank Gore: I was listening to the radio this morning and Ted Robinson said they should get Frank Gore back just to have in the locker room. I couldn't agree more. I'd LOVE to have Frank back. He still has a year left on his deal in Indy and I don't know their situation, but I really hope they go get him if the Colts cut him loose.

He just has the personality you want in your locker room to show younger players. Oh yeah, and he can STILL play.



8) Who do I like?: My hope for the first 2 picks are Myles Garrett in round 1 and Deshaun Watson in round 2. Now that I've said that I can all but guarantee those will NOT be the picks.



9) Damnit Cleveland: Seriously? A fumble on the 3 years line? Really? Sigh.



10) FINALLY over: At least now we can finally begin the process of looking to next year. I've been looking forward to this for months. :)

I know people bashed York but I though that line was perfect. really owned that cohnhead on that one. he seemed kind of nervous up there though. if we draft garrett and Watson that would be absolutely perfect.

Marvin, Nice wrap up. Thanks for all your work all season long. I hope your job situation works out for you. Must be about as tough as watching Cleveland blow a game.

I hope we are all wrong on Kaepernick leaving. We need a solid bridge to whoever is next and if he can play at the same level he did in the last 6 games, he could be that guy. He isn't the long-term solution but I just don't see us getting any one else short of a deal-with-the-devil for Garappolo. The FA QB market is pathetic. Love him or hate him, he is our best option next season. We will know before the draft.

I think you may have a point worth considering on Jed York - he is manning up and really going to make the right move this time. I just don't believe he has it in him. I strongly dislike narcissism and that is how he got his CEO hat. He will have a long hard time convincing me he is worthy.

Like you and others, I look forward to next year. When healthy, we have some very good defensive talent and a pretty good young OL. I especially look forward to seeing Buckner. I watched him a lot the past few games. The kid is a stud. One play Sunday had me cheering. It was late in the game and he took on a double team and held them while Blair got a hard hit on Wilson. It was the same stuff that we loved when Cowboy and Aldon were operating.

Finally, I agree that the GM/HC positions are very desirable. Yes, Jed has messed the bed but if he truly is willing to fully re-set, this has all the makings of a good beginning.

Originally posted by Marvin49:
I guess my mood can be summed up this way....

I'm not old enough to remember the building of Walshs Niners. I watched them win all 5 SBs but I wasn't old enough to know what I was watching in '81 and '84.

I then watched them suck for many years and watched them build a new powerhouse in 2011, 2012, and 2013. Those teams weren't as good as Walshs Niners but I enjoyed watching them SOOO much more because I watched it get built and it came after years of suckage.

Thats what excites me now. Its not about the final product. Its about being there for the journey. :D

After reading your post, I now realize why I have hope. I was a young football fan in the early 70s and watched the horrible teams of the pre-walsh era as a pre-pubescent teen when forming your football love is so important. I don't know if many people realize how much it sucked to be a Niner fan in the mid to late 70s, it gives me hope that good things can happen during the darkest Niner times. Thanks for helping me realize that.

I kind of agree with you on Jed's comment. The guy is exactly my age... and I think I only graduated from being a complete idiot 3 or 4 years ago. (I'm only a partial idiot now).

You do a lot of growing up in your early to mid 30's and honesty is a decent sign of it. Here's hoping he's genuine about the desire for change and listening to the right people.

I can see us Keeping Kaeperknick for one more year , but if the opportunity to improve the QB position surfaces , we'll definitely have to explore those options, if it's a veteran then so be it, but if we land a Trubisky, Watson or Kizer, we're going to need that veteran stop gap QB

Hyde is a top 10 RB, keeping him healthy is a priority ,so I'd like to see a couple new RB's on the roster next year, Draughn has no upside left ,he is a serviceable RB at best, but I'd like to see a younger RB with skills to help improve the running game, Harris fumbles too damn much IMO, I don't see him back next year, so maybe an addition of youth and a veteran RB to help pick up the slack is in order, I'd love to see Gore come home for a year and retire, he still runs hard, his leadership would be a huge asset. and if we could land an young explosive RB in the draft, that would be a real score, if a RB like Kareem Hunt or Donta Foreman were available lets say in the 3rd, we better pounce on that

our offensive line isn't too shabby, Staley should be able to play at a high level again next year ,Garnett has experience now and should be ready to roll, Trent Brown has shown he can play in this league , but we need someone to take that RG spot and play at a high level, Tiller hasn't exactly taken ownership of the position, so do we need to sign a free agent for RG or draft one and groom for the future, and let Tiller and Beadles fight for the spot? ..I know everyone wants to stay loyal to Kilgore , but it would be nice to acquire a bigger, younger and more athletic center to anchor the line for seasons to come, Theus will be given a shot to make the team

Receiver needs a BIG talent infusion, that's for sure , this is where the new GM has his work cut out for him , Smith needs to have a big season and come back strong, and finding a couple play makers would be huge, taking a swing at a free agent WR should be an option, finding talent in the draft will be crucial to future success , McDonald is a legit starting TE, but he needs to get on that Juggs machine and improve those hands ,Bell and Celek are decent TE's, but it wouldn't hurt to look for talent at TE either

the defensive line could take a giant step towards improving if we can find a stout NT like Poe , that would free up Armstead and Buckner to make plays, Ronald Blair is a keeper, I'm thinking he comes back bigger next year to compete for more snaps , Dial should be solid if he stays healthy, I'd like to see Dorsey come back as a reserve , his run stopping ability was strong at the end of the season , Jones and TJE might have to fight hard for a roster spot, Purcell is a goner IMO

Inside linebacker needs talent in a big way, this is the position I want to see addressed early , if we could land a top ILB in the draft, that would be sweet, Zach Cunningham, Rueben Foster, ILB's of that caliber would help our run defense in a big way , Ray Ray is a good LB, but I'd like to see him in a reserve role, because we need that talent at ILB, a stud LB to run with Bowman would be bad ass
OLB obviously needs addressed , if we do acquire Myles Garrett, we would have an explosive athlete to build around , Lynch has a shot to start at the other OLB spot, but we need to find depth also, drafting another edge rusher in the middle rounds would be smart, or add talent through free agency. I have a feeling Brooks will be let go?

the secondary could be a strength, Robinson is a legit CB , so is Ward , and Redmond will be given an opportunity to seize a spot on the roster, Reaser, DJ and Cromartie have a fight on their hands , because we will be adding another CB, or 2 more in the draft, and I'm not sure what the plan is for Brock?
Tartt might be our starting SS next year, I have a feeling Bethea is a goner , Reid is a mainstay at FS, but depth will be needed at both safety positions

things could be much better next year if obvious needs are addressed

Marvin, just want to thank you for your posts throughout the year. I haven't always agreed with you but have always enjoyed reading your perspective. I don't know how you manage to re-watch and comment on some games. After those debacles it's like a drama critic having to comment on a manuscript typed randomly by monkeys. I always appreciate your optimism, although I don't usually share it. I doubt that I will live long enough to see the 9ers in another SB. Good luck with your job situation. Smart optimistic guys with good judgment like you usually float to the top.

Originally posted by Marvin49:

4) Jed: I've seen from ALOT of people that they didn't like Jeds "I own the team" line. I couldn't disagree more. I LOVED it. It was the closest I've ever seen him to acting like Eddie. He was cordial about it, but it was effectively an FU to Lowell Cohn and precisely the answer I'd want from an owner.

Jed wasn't cut out to be in front of the camera and many would say he wasn't cut out to hold the job he has. That wouldn't be entirely unfair either. THAT response tho to me was perfect. Loved it.

I didn't mind it either, he owned it. I wish he would've been more stern to Lowell Cohn. We have a pompous and clueless owner who makes poor football hires. He definitely wasn't cut out to be in front of the camera and his presser was unimpressive as usual. I felt that his speech was status quo for the past two years. The only thing I loved was that he fired Baalke and Kelly.

His culture rhetoric was total b.s. He got lucky and had a winning culture with Harbaugh but he effed that culture up. He missed his chance to gain some respect from anti Jed fans if he came out and said that, "yeah, I screwed up royally, fired the wrong guy. I've learned from this and we'll be better for it..." Nope, instead he dismissed the questions and said the past is history. He contradicts himself by bringing up the past and saying that we've had the winning formula and went to three straight NFC Champs.

He screws up again by saying that he's going to respect the anonymity of his counsel but then during Ann Killion's immediate follow up question, bonehead Jed reveals his counsel (Brent Jones, Montana, Young, Barton, Lott....) Ann Killion later contradicts Jed's statement on knbr and reported that they, along with Uncle Eddie, stopped talking to him because Jed does not take their advice and are estranged from the organization because of Jed.

Nothing's going to change. He's horrible at making football decisions and got lucky with Harbaugh. I have zero confidence in Jed and Marathe. Jed is going to pick a coach and GM that worships him and will tow the line like yes man Jimmy T. In stark contrast, he will never hire someone with Cable's strong personality. I truly hope Jed gets lucky again and hires the perfect GM/Coach combo. Its hard watching him ruin our team.