Joe Montana Legacy Secured

Originally posted by jbeale49:
I've avoided this conversation until now but if Brady plays half as long as he plans to, this question will seem silly. he has extended his prime in unprecedented fashion and isn't showing signs of coming back to the pack.

For now, the debate can go back and forth but time will settle it.

IMO debate is over. brady is the GOAT. doesn't matter if he retires tomorrow or retires 10 years later.

Anyone know how many qbs over thirty are on league rosters today?

Originally posted by genus49:
You didn't answer the question.

I'd be very happy with either QB but the situations aren't exactly the same. Montana's 89 SB is what really set him apart but that team was beyond stacked and not just on offense.

If Joe's talent didn't stay together due to salary cap reasons we have no idea how successful he would've been or if he would've even gotten to those SBs.

Though what Brady was able to accomplish in the comeback this year was amazing.

If Brady is the clear GOAT why not pick Brady?

to many what ifs, we can't compare everything else accurately so why bother ? who knows which coach was better, which teams, which drugs, which surgery etc etc etc

If you got to the Superbowl who's your QB?

Originally posted by natediaz:
playoffs are important too because without winning the playoffs, you don't get to the SB. and brady has won more playoff games then montana and young combined. and he's still going strong.

Playoffs are sort of important but why was Montana always considered better than Elway or Kelly ?

Originally posted by babarvaart:

Playoffs are sort of important but why was Montana always considered better than Elway or Kelly ?

Waaaaaaaaay better decision-maker.

Originally posted by brodiebluebanaszak:

Originally posted by babarvaart:
Playoffs are sort of important but why was Montana always considered better than Elway or Kelly ?

Waaaaaaaaay better decision-maker.

Because he won championships and they didn't...

So why should Montana be considered better than Brady when Brady won more?

Originally posted by genus49:
Because he won championships and they didn't...

So why should Montana be considered better than Brady when Brady won more?

because he always delivered in the biggest stage.

Originally posted by babarvaart:
If Brady is the clear GOAT why not pick Brady?

to many what ifs, we can't compare everything else accurately so why bother ? who knows which coach was better, which teams, which drugs, which surgery etc etc etc

If you got to the Superbowl who's your QB?

I'm a 49ers fan and I'm not going to deny how great Joe has played in superbowls but I'm also a football fan who understands stats don't always tell the whole story and it's not so black or white all the time.

If we're evening up the field then yes I will take Brady. I will take Brady because he has had to adapt to different schemes and offensive personnel nearly every season and has had success. He's won more and what he showed in the SB this year was what I thought was impossible. Now I'm well aware it wasn't all him, his defense made key plays but when he had to be, Brady was perfect and his teammates and his defense fed off of him and didn't fall apart because they knew they had him backing them up.

I'm sure your choice will be Montana and that's fine but don't say throw out everything else when you're basing that on the fact that Joe was undefeated in SBs and i'm sure you'll throw in the fact that he never threw a pick in the SB but you can't just say that and pretend coaching and supporting cast doesn't play a part in that.

So you chose to value what you value but I'm going with the guy who has won more SBs, gotten to more SBs and has played with all sorts of teams and dealt with constant turnover on his roster because IF we are throwing all those things out the window then to me Brady has shown he can handle more curveballs thrown at him than Joe.

Originally posted by babarvaart:
because he always delivered in the biggest stage.

No, it's because he won more championships.

What do you define as the biggest stage? Superbowls? This brings me back to another topic. Is Brad Johnson better than Tom Brady? Is Eli Manning better than Tom Brady? Is Terry Bradshaw better than Tom Brady? I mean they're perfect in SBs too, surely they must be better right?

Is a do or die playoff game not a big enough stage? In your book it's ok to lose earlier in the playoffs because the stage isn't big enough right? But if you get to the SB more but lose there then bye bye legacy.

Originally posted by genus49:
No, it's because he won more championships.

What do you define as the biggest stage? Superbowls? This brings me back to another topic. Is Brad Johnson better than Tom Brady? Is Eli Manning better than Tom Brady? Is Terry Bradshaw better than Tom Brady? I mean they're perfect in SBs too, surely they must be better right?

Is a do or die playoff game not a big enough stage? In your book it's ok to lose earlier in the playoffs because the stage isn't big enough right? But if you get to the SB more but lose there then bye bye legacy.

But Otto Graham won even more so what about him ?

to be fair Brady has only won with BB so there is that as well.

but yeah it's all totally pointless and we can all make our own minds up.

And yes I'd rather lose in the playoffs than the SB. Losing the SB felt worse than going 2-14.

The old timers with no tape are excluded. that's why we can't really be talking about GOAT. It's only post Rozelle GOAT.

Originally posted by genus49:

Originally posted by brodiebluebanaszak:

Originally posted by babarvaart:
Playoffs are sort of important but why was Montana always considered better than Elway or Kelly ?

Waaaaaaaaay better decision-maker.

Because he won championships and they didn't...

So why should Montana be considered better than Brady when Brady won more?

No -- play by play by play by play -- Joe made the better decisions for the offense, getting the first downs moving the sticks.That's why.

Originally posted by genus49:

Originally posted by babarvaart:
If Brady is the clear GOAT why not pick Brady?

to many what ifs, we can't compare everything else accurately so why bother ? who knows which coach was better, which teams, which drugs, which surgery etc etc etc

If you got to the Superbowl who's your QB?

I'm a 49ers fan and I'm not going to deny how great Joe has played in superbowls but I'm also a football fan who understands stats don't always tell the whole story and it's not so black or white all the time.

If we're evening up the field then yes I will take Brady. I will take Brady because he has had to adapt to different schemes and offensive personnel nearly every season and has had success. He's won more and what he showed in the SB this year was what I thought was impossible. Now I'm well aware it wasn't all him, his defense made key plays but when he had to be, Brady was perfect and his teammates and his defense fed off of him and didn't fall apart because they knew they had him backing them up.

I'm sure your choice will be Montana and that's fine but don't say throw out everything else when you're basing that on the fact that Joe was undefeated in SBs and i'm sure you'll throw in the fact that he never threw a pick in the SB but you can't just say that and pretend coaching and supporting cast doesn't play a part in that.

So you chose to value what you value but I'm going with the guy who has won more SBs, gotten to more SBs and has played with all sorts of teams and dealt with constant turnover on his roster because IF we are throwing all those things out the window then to me Brady has shown he can handle more curveballs thrown at him than Joe.

but but but..Brady also has proven he will lose in the SB. So you would still go with him? I'd still prefer a guy who hasn't lost than a guy who has.

Originally posted by dwy621:

but but but..Brady also has proven he will lose in the SB. So you would still go with him? I'd still prefer a guy who hasn't lost than a guy who has.

I'm going with Johnny Manziel. He's never lost a Super Bowl either.

Originally posted by dwy621:

Originally posted by genus49:

Originally posted by babarvaart:
If Brady is the clear GOAT why not pick Brady?

to many what ifs, we can't compare everything else accurately so why bother ? who knows which coach was better, which teams, which drugs, which surgery etc etc etc

If you got to the Superbowl who's your QB?

I'm a 49ers fan and I'm not going to deny how great Joe has played in superbowls but I'm also a football fan who understands stats don't always tell the whole story and it's not so black or white all the time.

If we're evening up the field then yes I will take Brady. I will take Brady because he has had to adapt to different schemes and offensive personnel nearly every season and has had success. He's won more and what he showed in the SB this year was what I thought was impossible. Now I'm well aware it wasn't all him, his defense made key plays but when he had to be, Brady was perfect and his teammates and his defense fed off of him and didn't fall apart because they knew they had him backing them up.

I'm sure your choice will be Montana and that's fine but don't say throw out everything else when you're basing that on the fact that Joe was undefeated in SBs and i'm sure you'll throw in the fact that he never threw a pick in the SB but you can't just say that and pretend coaching and supporting cast doesn't play a part in that.

So you chose to value what you value but I'm going with the guy who has won more SBs, gotten to more SBs and has played with all sorts of teams and dealt with constant turnover on his roster because IF we are throwing all those things out the window then to me Brady has shown he can handle more curveballs thrown at him than Joe.

but but but..Brady also has proven he will lose in the SB. So you would still go with him? I'd still prefer a guy who hasn't lost than a guy who has.

Yep. Lets take Joe Flacco, Trent Dilfer, or Brad Johnson over Tom Brady, Roger Staubach, Aaron Rodgers, or Dan Marino. I mean, why would anyone want a HOF QB that lost a SB instead of guys who never lost a SB?