Colin Kaepernick Thread

Originally posted by awp8912:

Originally posted by qnnhan7:
Kaep has the propensity to run with the ball and gash defenses with his running, especially early in his career. Defenses had limited that. If Gabbert decided to run with the ball with more frequency, defenses have to be aware of that too, because at 4.62 that's very good foot speed for a qb to make them pay if they don't look for it.

Right now Gabbert isn't known for a running qb, because he doesn't depend on running with the ball as much as other reputable running qb. Make no mistake, he has wheels.

And wait until he gets hit the first time trying to be cute. Sorry if you think it's that easy to be a mobile QB than watch out. Dude will get lit up. And I doubt dude even has the cardio to go that hard on the ground and man a fast chip kelly offensive attack. Again Kap is perfect for this offense. Kap is the "I dont get tired" QB.

Sounds like you like Kaep a lot. It's cool. It's a Kaep thread after all.

No one is equal to Kaep in a Kaep thread

Originally posted by mojave45:
I think you are incorrect about this... Having Kap back there with a quickly collapsing pocket due to not having extra blockers is a recipe for disaster. He won't have "extra time to throw the ball" lol. He will have less. Seriously less than he used to have, and he will have that on every play. Defenses will be able to penetrate, but if they aren't careful that opens up Kelly's passing lanes, abd again having a quick decision about who is the open guy, us much more important to keep the chains moving than a one read and do I run, situation. Having a great straight ahead run 4 or 5 times a season isn't what we need. We need a QB with quick accurate strikes that is mobile enough to get some yards when he has to. Not the other way around.

Yeah cause that worked out for Bradford or Foles. Try again and this time come with facts and not hyperbole and opinions.

Originally posted by qnnhan7:
Sounds like you like Kaep a lot. It's cool. It's a Kaep thread after all.

No one is equal to Kaep in a Kaep thread

Nothing I said was wrong. It seems people thing being a running QB is as simple as running a 40 yard dash. You have to be tough, first and foremost and you have to learn how to dodge missiles while still making positive plays and still not get out of breath so much that you lose arm strength on the very next play.

If you think these nuances are something any QB can just pick up with zero experience than I don't know what to tell you.

Originally posted by BleedsRedNGold:
Kap needs to be able to take advantage of the tight ends. This is the key to beating teams like Seattle whose weakness is covering tight ends.

The real game that put Gabbert on my radar was the Seattle game. We never saw a QB in a Niners uniform do that against that team.

Yes, it was amazing to watch for a change. To have it happen on a fast 2 minute drill in that stadium was impressive.

I'll say a few things about both QBs:

a) Gabbert's athleticism underrated - a 44 yard TD run by a QB against any NFL defense is impressive.
b) Kap's athleticism will benefit him in Kelly's offense more so than it did before - Trust me when I say this that Russell Wilson's mobility is fully maximized in the Seahawks game plan. The Hawks never stopped using it, and that's a big part of the reason why their offense is still pretty good.
c) Both QBs in my opinion are better than they are given credit for - we've seen Kap do big things, and the best from Gabbert mixes in a bit of what we liked from Alex and Kap. You put either of these guys on the Cards or Bengals and they are not going to be held back, IMHO.

Originally posted by awp8912:

Originally posted by 49ers81:
Defenses have already proven they can take away his running game, they've done it for the past two years. They don't HAVE to plan for his "mobility" because it has already been demonstrated that he doesn't really have any. He is a straight line runner with good speed, he is not, as I said, particularly shifty or mobile the way someone like Russell Wilson is, who is still driving defenses nuts with his scrambling ability. That is something you can't really defend against.

There was a play against the Falcons I think last year where Gabbert had to scramble out of the pocket and he sort of weaved his way through all of these defenders and got the ball down to the 1 yard line. Every time I watch that play I think,Kaepernick could never have done that because his stride is too long. Someone posted somewhere earlier that while Kaepernick had a better time in the 40 Gabbert was better in all of the agility drills which I think is an important distinction to make. If they don't plan for Gabbert that will be fine with me because it means he will have more opportunities to beat them, like he did in Chicago.

Doesn't matter what you say or what your opinion is. Defenses will ALWAYS plan for Kap's mobility because his mobility is ALWAYS there at any given moment. Geez are you really going to pretend that defenses don't plan for that, because he was shut down 2 weeks ago?

Agility drills? Go read any Defensive leader/coordinate talk about defending Kap and then ask them the same questions about Gabbert. Again forget your opinion, defenses will ALWAYS account for the playoff single game rushing leader stat holder over the guy that ran 40 yards against CHI.

Okay, got it what I say is opinion and what you say is absolute fact. Little did I know that I was in the presence of such a genius. Defenses have effectively taken away his running game for the last two years which means they know how to game plan for it just as they would game plan for anything else. I seriously doubt that there is a defensive coordinator in the league who is sitting around nights sweating out what Colin Kaepernick is going to do. Remember there wasn't a team in the league who thought he was worth more than a fourth round pick when the Niners let him pursue offers earlier in the year because they know that is a one dimensional player and if defenses take away the run he's probably not going to beat them through the air. Sure if you let your guard down he's capable of torching you with his legs and occasionally with his arm but that's true of almost any QB in this league. Gabbert demonstrated that he could beat people with his arm and legs as well, so honestly I don't see what your point is in all this. Oh, wait I forgot, you're a genius so you see things that we mere mortals don't.

Originally posted by awp8912:

Originally posted by mojave45:

I think you are incorrect about this... Having Kap back there with a quickly collapsing pocket due to not having extra blockers is a recipe for disaster. He won't have "extra time to throw the ball" lol. He will have less. Seriously less than he used to have, and he will have that on every play. Defenses will be able to penetrate, but if they aren't careful that opens up Kelly's passing lanes, abd again having a quick decision about who is the open guy, us much more important to keep the chains moving than a one read and do I run, situation. Having a great straight ahead run 4 or 5 times a season isn't what we need. We need a QB with quick accurate strikes that is mobile enough to get some yards when he has to. Not the other way around.

Yeah cause that worked out for Bradford or Foles. Try again and this time come with facts and not hyperbole and opinions.

Neither one if those guts are very good. Come back yourself with your snark and show me facts about how great Kap is under pressure making consistent good reads and decisions while delivering accurate short and medium range passes consistently. I was being polite. Kap has sucked donkey balls doing the type of work that will be required under Kelly. The rest is a freaking pipe dream out of an opium den. Kap can run great in a straight line. Yay. When he is pressured we see 2015. Get a grip.

Originally posted by JTsBiggestFan:
Yes, it was amazing to watch for a change. To have it happen on a fast 2 minute drill in that stadium was impressive.

I'll say a few things about both QBs:

a) Gabbert's athleticism underrated - a 44 yard TD run by a QB against any NFL defense is impressive.
b) Kap's athleticism will benefit him in Kelly's offense more so than it did before - Trust me when I say this that Russell Wilson's mobility is fully maximized in the Seahawks game plan. The Hawks never stopped using it, and that's a big part of the reason why their offense is still pretty good.
c) Both QBs in my opinion are better than they are given credit for - we've seen Kap do big things, and the best from Gabbert mixes in a bit of what we liked from Alex and Kap. You put either of these guys on the Cards or Bengals and they are not going to be held back, IMHO.

Athleticism and mobility aren't the same thing. That is why Wilson has continued to be effective while Kaepernick has not. Wilson's ability to feel pressure and move laterally while still looking downfield is what makes him so dangerous. Once you take the edge away from Kaepernick and prevent him from turning the corner his long stride and straight line speed don't help him.

Originally posted by 49ers81:
Okay, got it what I say is opinion and what you say is absolute fact. Little did I know that I was in the presence of such a genius. Defenses have effectively taken away his running game for the last two years which means they know how to game plan for it just as they would game plan for anything else. I seriously doubt that there is a defensive coordinator in the league who is sitting around nights sweating out what Colin Kaepernick is going to do. Remember there wasn't a team in the league who thought he was worth more than a fourth round pick when the Niners let him pursue offers earlier in the year because they know that is a one dimensional player and if defenses take away the run he's probably not going to beat them through the air. Sure if you let your guard down he's capable of torching you with his legs and occasionally with his arm but that's true of almost any QB in this league. Gabbert demonstrated that he could beat people with his arm and legs as well, so honestly I don't see what your point is in all this. Oh, wait I forgot, you're a genius so you see things that we mere mortals don't.

Smh. Can you read? Please stop typing with emotions and try and comprehend what my points were before you type paragraphs back to me.

for example my whole point was that defenses ARE planning for Kap's mobility and NOT planning for Gabberts. Jeez louise.

Originally posted by mojave45:
Neither one if those guts are very good. Come back yourself with your snark and show me facts about how great Kap is under pressure making consistent good reads and decisions while delivering accurate short and medium range passes consistently. I was being polite. Kap has sucked donkey balls doing the type of work that will be required under Kelly. The rest is a freaking pipe dream out of an opium den. Kap can run great in a straight line. Yay. When he is pressured we see 2015. Get a grip.

Really? Bradford doesn't know how to go through his progressions or make quick decisions? LMAO Bradford is 10 times the QB that Gabbert is. Go take a poll right now and see. And please pretend that Bradford didn't go to a mess of a team when he was drafted by the worst team that year and yet has done more in this league than Gabbert x10.

Originally posted by 49ers81:
Athleticism and mobility aren't the same thing. That is why Wilson has continued to be effective while Kaepernick has not. Wilson's ability to feel pressure and move laterally while still looking downfield is what makes him so dangerous. Once you take the edge away from Kaepernick and prevent him from turning the corner his long stride and straight line speed don't help him

If a defense focuses on doing the bolded above, then don't you think that gives him an advantage in Chip Kelly's system, more so than it did in Geep's System?

Originally posted by awp8912:

Originally posted by mojave45:

Neither one if those guts are very good. Come back yourself with your snark and show me facts about how great Kap is under pressure making consistent good reads and decisions while delivering accurate short and medium range passes consistently. I was being polite. Kap has sucked donkey balls doing the type of work that will be required under Kelly. The rest is a freaking pipe dream out of an opium den. Kap can run great in a straight line. Yay. When he is pressured we see 2015. Get a grip.

Really? Bradford doesn't know how to go through his progressions or make quick decisions? LMAO Bradford is 10 times the QB that Gabbert island Go take a poll right now and see. And please pretend that Bradford didn't go to a mess of a team when he was drafted by the worst team that year and yet has done more in this league than Gabbert x10.

I wasn't talking about Gabbert as usual any time anyone critiques your hero you guys default to parrot mode. Squad, Gabbert! Squak Alex! Talk about Kaepernick if you have the ability, which I am now doubting that any of you do. Quit deflecting with crap about other QB rejects, and show me how great Kap is under pressure making correct reads and repetitive accurate throws. I will wait. But won't hold my breath because those stats dont exist do they? if they did you guys would use them, but no let's talk about somebody else.

Originally posted by awp8912:

Originally posted by 49ers81:
Okay, got it what I say is opinion and what you say is absolute fact. Little did I know that I was in the presence of such a genius. Defenses have effectively taken away his running game for the last two years which means they know how to game plan for it just as they would game plan for anything else. I seriously doubt that there is a defensive coordinator in the league who is sitting around nights sweating out what Colin Kaepernick is going to do. Remember there wasn't a team in the league who thought he was worth more than a fourth round pick when the Niners let him pursue offers earlier in the year because they know that is a one dimensional player and if defenses take away the run he's probably not going to beat them through the air. Sure if you let your guard down he's capable of torching you with his legs and occasionally with his arm but that's true of almost any QB in this league. Gabbert demonstrated that he could beat people with his arm and legs as well, so honestly I don't see what your point is in all this. Oh, wait I forgot, you're a genius so you see things that we mere mortals don't.

Smh. Can you read? Please stop typing with emotions and try and comprehend what my points were before you type paragraphs back to me.

for example my whole point was that defenses ARE planning for Kap's mobility and NOT planning for Gabberts. Jeez louise.

I can read and I know what your point is. Defenses have learned how to defend against Kapernicks running, surround him with bodies and don't let him get around the edge, so that's what they do, they nullify the threat and make him essentially useless. How is that different from any other sort of game planning that you would do against any other offense or against any other team. The fact that it is Kaepernick some how makes it "special" I guess.

Originally posted by mojave45:

Originally posted by awp8912:

Originally posted by mojave45:
Neither one if those guts are very good. Come back yourself with your snark and show me facts about how great Kap is under pressure making consistent good reads and decisions while delivering accurate short and medium range passes consistently. I was being polite. Kap has sucked donkey balls doing the type of work that will be required under Kelly. The rest is a freaking pipe dream out of an opium den. Kap can run great in a straight line. Yay. When he is pressured we see 2015. Get a grip.

Really? Bradford doesn't know how to go through his progressions or make quick decisions? LMAO Bradford is 10 times the QB that Gabbert island Go take a poll right now and see. And please pretend that Bradford didn't go to a mess of a team when he was drafted by the worst team that year and yet has done more in this league than Gabbert x10.

I wasn't talking about Gabbert as usual any time anyone critiques your hero you guys default to parrot mode. Squad, Gabbert! Squak Alex! Talk about Kaepernick if you have the ability, which I am now doubting that any of you do. Quit deflecting with crap about other QB rejects, and show me how great Kap is under pressure making correct reads and repetitive accurate throws. I will wait. But won't hold my breath because those stats dont exist do they? if they did you guys would use them, but no let's talk about somebody else.

Seriously dude, what is your problem? You interject while I am speaking about the competition between Kap vs Gabbert, you make some hyperbole laced jabs at Kap, I come back with a retort that disputes your hyperbole and now you pull the, "why bring Gabbert into this convo..." mess? Ahhh duh, because I was speaking about Gabbert when you decided to quote me, *&*?!!

If you don't want to speak about what other posters are arguing about then leave or don't quote any of us.

If you get this angry and surly then please go do something less stressful to your health.

Originally posted by awp8912:

Originally posted by mojave45:

Originally posted by awp8912:

Originally posted by mojave45:

Neither one if those guts are very good. Come back yourself with your snark and show me facts about how great Kap is under pressure making consistent good reads and decisions while delivering accurate short and medium range passes consistently. I was being polite. Kap has sucked donkey balls doing the type of work that will be required under Kelly. The rest is a freaking pipe dream out of an opium den. Kap can run great in a straight line. Yay. When he is pressured we see 2015. Get a grip.

Really? Bradford doesn't know how to go through his progressions or make quick decisions? LMAO Bradford is 10 times the QB that Gabbert island Go take a poll right now and see. And please pretend that Bradford didn't go to a mess of a team when he was drafted by the worst team that year and yet has done more in this league than Gabbert x10.

I wasn't talking about Gabbert as usual any time anyone critiques your hero you guys default to parrot mode. Squad, Gabbert! Squak Alex! Talk about Kaepernick if you have the ability, which I am now doubting that any of you do. Quit deflecting with crap about other QB rejects, and show me how great Kap is under pressure making correct reads and repetitive accurate throws. I will wait. But won't hold my breath because those stats dont exist do they? if they did you guys would use them, but no let's talk about somebody else.

Seriously dude, what is your problem? You interject while I am speaking about the competition between Kap vs Gabbert, you make some hyperbole laced jabs at Kap, I come back with a retort that disputes your hyperbole and now you pull the, "why bring Gabbert into this convo..." mess? Ahhh duh, because I was speaking about Gabbert when you decided to quote me, *&*?!!

If you don't want to speak about what other posters are arguing about then leave or don't quote any of us.

If you get this angry and surly then please go do something less stressful to your health.

Stop. Both. Thanks.

Originally posted by awp8912:

Originally posted by 49ers81:
Athleticism and mobility aren't the same thing. That is why Wilson has continued to be effective while Kaepernick has not. Wilson's ability to feel pressure and move laterally while still looking downfield is what makes him so dangerous. Once you take the edge away from Kaepernick and prevent him from turning the corner his long stride and straight line speed don't help him

If a defense focuses on doing the bolded above, then don't you think that gives him an advantage in Chip Kelly's system, more so than it did in Geep's System?

No, because Kaepernick hasn't demonstrated that he can process reads and get rid of the ball quick enough and with enough accuracy to make him a threat in the passing game. He's a long ball hitter. He strikes out a lot but every once in awhile he'll hit one out of the park and it will look spectacular. Sort of feast or famine. Personally I want a guy who keeps getting on base and moving the other runners along