49ers Offensive Line

Originally posted by frenchmov:

Just start trading for guys and signing guys! Sign as many as it takes until you find 9 quality starters: 5 to start and 4 off the bench, all pro bowlers. But no, our front office is a piece of s**t and won't do this! I'm really disappointed

I wouldn't say POS but the idea is spot on. I mean that's literally what we've done with the DL over the past 6 years.

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by PopeyeJonesing:

1) Who is the available center you're suggesting?

2) Remember back when Baalke said they filled out the draft card for AJ Jenkins the night before the draft?

Garland has been playing offensive line in the NFL since then. Calling him a converted d-lineman at this point is just a cheap way to get your finger on the scale.

3) I'm as disappointed in Rich as you are, but as of now he's scheduled to be back for week 1 and even if it doesn't work you can't argue that they haven't substantially invested in the position. Even if one existed bringing in a starting quality center with what they have invested in him simply isn't in the cards.

4) I said I can't think of one. Given the dearth of talent at O-line if there was a team with stockpiled talent I assume I'd have heard about it.

It's not like the Texans traded two firsts and a second for a so-far good but not great tackle because there's a lot of tackles out there.

Is there a team with great depth at O-line that you're thinking of and I'm missing?

Remember, this is over 3 full off seasons. In those 3 years, 1 FA, 1 high draft pick, 2 trades for serviceable players. And the FA has not panned out yet. It isn't that they haven't tried, it's that they stopped adding talent and never drafted young talent to develop to date.

They KNEW Richburg was a massive ? mark and knew he'd be out almost all camp and that's with a best case scenario. They knew their pass protection was suspect even when the 5 are on the field together. They knew this OL barely survived as a unit last year (Staley, McGlinchey and Person battled through ankle and foot injuries, Richburg was playing on one leg and Tomlinson was lost to an MCL).

This is life as a zone blocking OL in Kyle's system. It exposes you. Yet despite knowing ALL of this and JG coming back from an ACL, their solution was to do absolutely nothing, carry 8 OL over 10 and their depth for injury is Garland, Skule and Brunskill. Just say those 3 names out loud in front of a mirror and watch your face.

I hear what you're saying, but the five starters are in place.

At tackle their backup plan got knocked out for the year, and they're left with their backup plan to their backup plan (Skule), because they believed more in their backup plan to their backup plan than they did in their backup plan to their backup plan to their backup plan (Young).

I'm as concerned about Skule as you are, but again, who is the guy after week 1 of the preseason when Coleman was IRd who was gonna solve this problem?

Originally posted by genus49:

You know I love even with your Pettis obsession ;) but come on...

We've done this song and dance so much I feel like we should be engaged by now lol. This team was ass cheeks of the rare variety when Kyle and John took over. In order to get them to a place where all the units are properly upgraded and the depth on the OL isn't something to be worried about would require pretty much a miracle to happen. It would require us to hit on absolutely EVERY pick we made, every FA addition we made and to suffer no injuries in the process.

Basically an absurdly unrealistic ask.

The team replaced 4 out of the 5 starters. I think we can safely admit all of them were an upgrade or at least equal. We can argue about Trent Brown vs McGlinchey and at the time I hated the move. My actual response in the "What pick would you hate to see us make in the first round" was "Any OT" lol. The reason for that was I still thought Brown would be on the roster and I figured we'd extend him.

Kyle didn't vibe with Trent and saw a guy who wasn't worth investing top T money to and figured McGlinchey was a guy they can build around. So far, so good.

We've made a ton of moves on the OL but obviously not all of them worked out. We all want the same thing - a dominant OL which can punish people in the running game while clearing out massive holes for our backs and don't let anyone close enough to Jimmy to even look at him funny when pass rushing. Outside of SteveYoung I don't think anyone was crazy enough to think our OL was good. It's not and I hope we find ways to improve it.

But once again you don't have the luxury to pick who you want and there are times when drafting or in free agency when you have to prioritize one position over another or one player over another.

We're on the same page with Risner, I would've loved to have him. Every mock draft I did where Bradbury, Lindstrom or Risner were available in the 2nd I went with them.

Kyle clearly loved what he saw in Samuel(personally I was more higher on Brown/Metcalf/Butler) but I've always said until proven otherwise I will trust Kyle in his evaluations on offense. I think it's highly likely Samuel was the top WR on his board since only Brown and Harry went before Deebo. So taking the top WR with a clear need at the position over Risner is a move I am ok with. We'll monitor the careers of both to see whether the move will haunt us or make a ton of sense.

I am too lazy to dig it up right now cuz i have to go to my brother in law's bday party soon but I remember similar conversations in the edge rusher thread. Don't think it was with you but people were furious we didn't address pass rushers last offseason and were calling for John's head for the "you don't just replace a Cassius Marsh" comments. I said at the time that they used their FA/draft capital to address the positions they felt were the best bang for their buck and were based on who was available they felt fit best as well as what they can invest in the following offseason. I said it then that if we didn't address edge rushers this offseason that I would join the lynch mob in...well lynching Lynch. I will say it again. If we don't go heavy on OL next offseason I'll join you in the "damnit these guys don't care about Jimmy's life" parade

I think we are looking ahead and see a draft and free agency class that's heavy on OL talent. We will invest at that point. Until then let's buckle up and hope our starters remain healthy.

Haha. Awesome. I'm sure you'd make a fantastic partner.

Let's dance. I think 90% of the fans were on the same page this year to make OL a priority one way or another. I was clamoring to do more last year and the year before even more. Essentially, treat the OL like they did the DL. Exactly like that. And that plan expedited the second we got a FQB and exasperated after he tore his ACL.

I think they eff'd up big time here. And the odds are we're going to see that inactivity and poor priority and planning reer it's ugly head this year.

I'm with you though. Buckle up and say some prayers. It's too late now so it is what it is. This was what they chose to ride/die with. Faithful.

Originally posted by genus49:

You know I love even with your Pettis obsession ;) but come on...

We've done this song and dance so much I feel like we should be engaged by now lol. This team was ass cheeks of the rare variety when Kyle and John took over. In order to get them to a place where all the units are properly upgraded and the depth on the OL isn't something to be worried about would require pretty much a miracle to happen. It would require us to hit on absolutely EVERY pick we made, every FA addition we made and to suffer no injuries in the process.

Basically an absurdly unrealistic ask.

The team replaced 4 out of the 5 starters. I think we can safely admit all of them were an upgrade or at least equal. We can argue about Trent Brown vs McGlinchey and at the time I hated the move. My actual response in the "What pick would you hate to see us make in the first round" was "Any OT" lol. The reason for that was I still thought Brown would be on the roster and I figured we'd extend him.

Kyle didn't vibe with Trent and saw a guy who wasn't worth investing top T money to and figured McGlinchey was a guy they can build around. So far, so good.

We've made a ton of moves on the OL but obviously not all of them worked out. We all want the same thing - a dominant OL which can punish people in the running game while clearing out massive holes for our backs and don't let anyone close enough to Jimmy to even look at him funny when pass rushing. Outside of SteveYoung I don't think anyone was crazy enough to think our OL was good. It's not and I hope we find ways to improve it.

But once again you don't have the luxury to pick who you want and there are times when drafting or in free agency when you have to prioritize one position over another or one player over another.

We're on the same page with Risner, I would've loved to have him. Every mock draft I did where Bradbury, Lindstrom or Risner were available in the 2nd I went with them.

Kyle clearly loved what he saw in Samuel(personally I was more higher on Brown/Metcalf/Butler) but I've always said until proven otherwise I will trust Kyle in his evaluations on offense. I think it's highly likely Samuel was the top WR on his board since only Brown and Harry went before Deebo. So taking the top WR with a clear need at the position over Risner is a move I am ok with. We'll monitor the careers of both to see whether the move will haunt us or make a ton of sense.

I am too lazy to dig it up right now cuz i have to go to my brother in law's bday party soon but I remember similar conversations in the edge rusher thread. Don't think it was with you but people were furious we didn't address pass rushers last offseason and were calling for John's head for the "you don't just replace a Cassius Marsh" comments. I said at the time that they used their FA/draft capital to address the positions they felt were the best bang for their buck and were based on who was available they felt fit best as well as what they can invest in the following offseason. I said it then that if we didn't address edge rushers this offseason that I would join the lynch mob in...well lynching Lynch. I will say it again. If we don't go heavy on OL next offseason I'll join you in the "damnit these guys don't care about Jimmy's life" parade

I think we are looking ahead and see a draft and free agency class that's heavy on OL talent. We will invest at that point. Until then let's buckle up and hope our starters remain healthy.

This.

Even if they took Risner in the second we're still complaining about the disaster of having Skule as the swing tackle, and instead of complaining about interior Oline depth we're complaining about how they still haven't addressed the lack of talent at WR.

We can't have it both ways.

One alternative would have been to keep Trent Brown for at least another year and draft McGlinchey (who would play guard) . Shanahan would have had to brace himself for a player who didn't fully meet his requirements, but he'd have an improved OL to protect his qbs.

Originally posted by PopeyeJonesing:

I hear what you're saying, but the five starters are in place.

At tackle their backup plan got knocked out for the year, and they're left with their backup plan to their backup plan (Skule), because they believed more in their backup plan to their backup plan than they did in their backup plan to their backup plan to their backup plan (Young).

I'm as concerned about Skule as you are, but again, who is the guy after week 1 of the preseason when Coleman was IRd who was gonna solve this problem?

But the 5 starters are not in place. We have no idea when Richburg will be NFL ready let alone productive to the level we paid for him. And the first 3 games are critical to this season because of the tough schedule. As to your injury point about Coleman, totally unfortunate. But the rash of injuries they've dealt with over 3 years to the OL is exactly WHY you continue adding real talent to it...so you don't have to rely on scrubs like Toran, Brunskill, Garnett, Skule, Garland, etc. This is the bed they made and now they have to sleep in it. Appreciate this discussion!

Originally posted by PopeyeJonesing:

This.

Even if they took Risner in the second we're still complaining about the disaster of having Skule as the swing tackle, and instead of complaining about interior Oline depth we're complaining about how they still haven't addressed the lack of talent at WR.

We can't have it both ways.

Fair. You'd still need to find a quality T after Coleman went down. That was just unfortunate. Find an older veteran with some talent/experience in the system. Or have drafted a mid level T (over the past 3 years) who's been developed for a few years and is ready to step in.

Originally posted by PopeyeJonesing:

Even if they took Risner in the second we're still complaining about the disaster of having Skule as the swing tackle, and instead of complaining about interior Oline depth we're complaining about how they still haven't addressed the lack of talent at WR.

We can't have it both ways.

Risner could play tackle as well as guard. Without Deebo, the team would still have added Matthews and Hurd. But instead of Risner, they added Skule.

Or the team could have picked an OLineman instead of Hurd or Wishnowsky. He may not have been a starter, but likely would be more talented and ready than Skule as a backup.

Originally posted by Paul_Hofer:

One alternative would have been to keep Trent Brown for at least another year and draft McGlinchey (who would play guard) . Shanahan would have had to brace himself for a player who didn't fully meet his requirements, but he'd have an improved OL to protect his qbs.

Yeah, there are nearly endless ways to build up a position group once it's prioritized. We've seen that here with DL/ER, LB and ST.

Originally posted by Paul_Hofer:

One alternative would have been to keep Trent Brown for at least another year and draft McGlinchey (who would play guard) . Shanahan would have had to brace himself for a player who didn't fully meet his requirements, but he'd have an improved OL to protect his qbs.

Sure but you're then screwing over the development of McGlinchey and we're getting a comp pick at best for Brown this year. So now it's one year later and we have a RT with one year less of playing the position in the NFL and a hole at RG regardless.

Plus not every OT can move to guard and have success. Mike didn't exactly Light it up when forced to move there after injuries to Person and Garnett vs Vikings last year.

Originally posted by Paul_Hofer:

Originally posted by PopeyeJonesing:

Even if they took Risner in the second we're still complaining about the disaster of having Skule as the swing tackle, and instead of complaining about interior Oline depth we're complaining about how they still haven't addressed the lack of talent at WR.

We can't have it both ways.

Risner could play tackle as well as guard. Without Deebo, the team would still have added Matthews and Hurd. But instead of Risner, they added Skule.

Or the team could have picked an OLineman instead of Hurd or Wishnowsky. He may not have been a starter, but likely would be more talented and ready than Skule as a backup.

Which guy do you pick over Hurd or Wish?

Originally posted by genus49:

Originally posted by Paul_Hofer:

One alternative would have been to keep Trent Brown for at least another year and draft McGlinchey (who would play guard) . Shanahan would have had to brace himself for a player who didn't fully meet his requirements, but he'd have an improved OL to protect his qbs.

Sure but you're then screwing over the development of McGlinchey and we're getting a comp pick at best for Brown this year. So now it's one year later and we have a RT with one year less of playing the position in the NFL and a hole at RG regardless.

Plus not every OT can move to guard and have success. Mike didn't exactly Light it up when forced to move there after injuries to Person and Garnett vs Vikings last year.

Yeah. Not all 6'9" T's can convert to G. That said, McGlinchey is an elite talent so if anyone could it would be him with training over a full off season. I think that's why you and I wanted Risner because he was a player you'd feel talent wise, could do either and was in a position where he'd have a full off season to dual train with the rest of the OL (versatility is huge for Kyle on the OL).

I just think they should have spent a few more draft picks on oline prospects, instead of picking more late round dlineman, TEs and Wrs. Think of all the capital we've spent on the Dline, even in late rounds. Why not spread the love? They do protect the most important player on the team.

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by Paul_Hofer:

One alternative would have been to keep Trent Brown for at least another year and draft McGlinchey (who would play guard) . Shanahan would have had to brace himself for a player who didn't fully meet his requirements, but he'd have an improved OL to protect his qbs.

Yeah, there are nearly endless ways to build up a position group once it's prioritized. We've seen that here with DL/ER, LB and ST.

Hello wifey.

You bring up ER there but we didn't touch it for two seasons because the guys worth it weren't available. When the situation finally presented itself we doubled down on it and now(hopefully) it's a strength.

The only time OL draft class was full of OL talent worth having was last year and we took McGlinchey 9 overall.

So it begins...



Damn Cardinals will be claiming o-line and CBs like crazy