congrats Charles haley

Originally posted by ElephantHaley:
Charles in CHARGE!! Dumb ass Seifert shoulda never ever trevor traded Haley to the Cowgirls. Imagine if 49ers kept him, no way do the Cowgirls win it in 92'93. Those coulda and shoulda been #6 & 7 or 5 and 6 or 7 8??

YES sir!!

Worst move by a Niner HC ever!

Bozo the Siefert - like letting Adam Walker, wearing a cast to receive kickoff or punt [I forget which] then he fumbled and the Packers scored

Like calling Roger Craig run against Giants instead of giving it to Rathman then the Giants scored a FG and won

I know hindsight is 20-20 - BUT ....

In the future we should NEVER allow any player to walk w/out getting something and NEVER to a direct competitor.

Originally posted by 49erFan816:

Originally posted by cciowa:

oh, cc forgot to say,, that he had no confidence , at the time, that steve young would have been able to win a super bowl.. he did not think young was ready for that type of game and would have pissed it down his leg,,,, in cc's opinion

Are you talking about 1990 (SB 25)?

This has always been an age old question of mine. If they would have won the 90 conf title game coukd they have won SB 25.

I looked up some numbers. From '87-'90, steve started 10 games. His numbers where the following:

Comp - 124
Att - 213
% - 58.2%
Yds - 1692
Td - 12
Int - 3
Rate - 97.0

So as you can see steve did a tremendous job when called upon. My feeling is it would have been a tough ask, but I think with how the defense played in '90 it would have been possible. Well we will never know, but we were extremely lucky to have a backup qb of his quality.

Crazy S.O.B. deserves it!!!

Originally posted by Niners816:
This has always been an age old question of mine. If they would have won the 90 conf title game coukd they have won SB 25.

I looked up some numbers. From '87-'90, steve started 10 games. His numbers where the following:

Comp - 124
Att - 213
% - 58.2%
Yds - 1692
Td - 12
Int - 3
Rate - 97.0

So as you can see steve did a tremendous job when called upon. My feeling is it would have been a tough ask, but I think with how the defense played in '90 it would have been possible. Well we will never know, but we were extremely lucky to have a backup qb of his quality.

Walsh always thought that Young could have taken the WC offense to the next level with his skill set and athleticism. In 89 he threw over 1000 yards as a backup which is pretty unheard of even by todays standards. In his first year there in 87 he threw 10 TDs and 0 INTs as a backup. 88 was really the only year that was a mess for him but Walsh was being like Landry with Morton and Staubach from 71 that year. Still the 71 Cowboys and 88 49ers won the SB once they got it straighten out.

Even though 90 was a bad year for Craig you could have put him situation to be a decoy of some kind due to his reputation. Like a pass catcher at times in the game. Talking about playing the bills in SB 25 of course.

Originally posted by LasVegasWally:

Originally posted by ElephantHaley:

Charles in CHARGE!! Dumb ass Seifert shoulda never ever trevor traded Haley to the Cowgirls. Imagine if 49ers kept him, no way do the Cowgirls win it in 92'93. Those coulda and shoulda been #6 & 7 or 5 and 6 or 7 8??

YES sir!!

Worst move by a Niner HC ever!

Bozo the Siefert - like letting Adam Walker, wearing a cast to receive kickoff or punt [I forget which] then he fumbled and the Packers scored

Like calling Roger Craig run against Giants instead of giving it to Rathman then the Giants scored a FG and won

I know hindsight is 20-20 - BUT ....

In the future we should NEVER allow any player to walk w/out getting something and NEVER to a direct competitor.

I hate when people bash Seifert. It's ridiculous. He won 2 Super Bowl's, and put up a better overall record than Walsh did.

People always argue that Walsh set him up, but a mediocre coach can spoil even the most talented teams. Seifert was a great coach, which is why he led the 49ers to 8 more years of success after Walsh.

Walsh teams choked too. 1987? They put up crap seasons a couple times as well.

Seifert never gets his due, and its sad.

Originally posted by 49erFan816:

Walsh always thought that Young could have taken the WC offense to the next level with his skill set and athleticism. In 89 he threw over 1000 yards as a backup which is pretty unheard of even by todays standards. In his first year there in 87 he threw 10 TDs and 0 INTs as a backup. 88 was really the only year that was a mess for him but Walsh was being like Landry with Morton and Staubach from 71 that year. Still the 71 Cowboys and 88 49ers won the SB once they got it straighten out.

It basically took joe playing at his 1989 level to keep steve on the bench.

What was crazy about 1990, was how poor the run game was until the final month of the season. In the 5 games played in December of 1990 they averaged 150.6 ypg. However that didn't translate into the playoffs. They rushed for 46 vs washington and 39 yards vs the Giants.

1990 still stings like a b***h. It's just ridiculous that the '90 title was Ronnie, Roger and essentially joe last game with the niners. Very unfitting way to go out.

Originally posted by Niners99:
I hate when people bash Seifert. It's ridiculous. He won 2 Super Bowl's, and put up a better overall record than Walsh did.

People always argue that Walsh set him up, but a mediocre coach can spoil even the most talented teams. Seifert was a great coach, which is why he led the 49ers to 8 more years of success after Walsh.

Walsh teams choked too. 1987? They put up crap seasons a couple times as well.

Seifert never gets his due, and its sad.

He was a DC of some kind during the Walsh days up until his promotion to HC in 89. So it's not like he didn't know what Haley was.

Originally posted by Niners816:
It basically took joe playing at his 1989 level to keep steve on the bench.

What was crazy about 1990, was how poor the run game was until the final month of the season. In the 5 games played in December of 1990 they averaged 150.6 ypg. However that didn't translate into the playoffs. They rushed for 46 vs washington and 39 yards vs the Giants.

1990 still stings like a b***h. It's just ridiculous that the '90 title was Ronnie, Roger and essentially joe last game with the niners. Very unfitting way to go out.

Whats crazy is that the Giants are undefeated in NFC title games. 2 of which were won on the Niners home field in 90 and 2011.

Originally posted by Niners99:

I hate when people bash Seifert. It's ridiculous. He won 2 Super Bowl's, and put up a better overall record than Walsh did.

People always argue that Walsh set him up, but a mediocre coach can spoil even the most talented teams. Seifert was a great coach, which is why he led the 49ers to 8 more years of success after Walsh.

Walsh teams choked too. 1987? They put up crap seasons a couple times as well.

Seifert never gets his due, and its sad.

I always thought the best way to appreciate George was to just look at his years, they are staggering:

1989 14-2 (SB title)
1990 14-2 (conf title appearance)
1991 10-6
1992 14-2 (conf title appearance)
1993 10-6 (conf title appearance)
1994 13-3 (SB title)
1995 11-5
1996 12-4

2 titles and 5 conference title game appearances is crazy in 8 years. I've ways appreciated what George did.

Originally posted by Niners816:
I always thought the best way to appreciate George was to just look at his years, they are staggering:

1989 14-2 (SB title)
1990 14-2 (conf title appearance)
1991 10-6
1992 14-2 (conf title appearance)
1993 10-6 (conf title appearance)
1994 13-3 (SB title)
1995 11-5
1996 12-4

2 titles and 5 conference title game appearances is crazy in 8 years. I've ways appreciated what George did.

George just tried his best to not screw up the system that was in place.

Originally posted by 49erFan816:

Whats crazy is that the Giants are undefeated in NFC title games. 2 of which were won on the Niners home field in 90 and 2011.

The only sort of pay back we got was in the 1993 divisional game vs NyG. Simms and LT. ended their careers with a 44-3 loss in watters 5 td game.

Originally posted by 49erFan816:

George just tried his best to not screw up the system that was in place.

He did make a fundamental shift to the defense in 1994 going to a 4 man front. If memory serves me 1994 was ranked 6th and 95 & 96 were top 2-3. I give him credit for that, because he had so much success with a 3-4 thru the 80s and early 90s.

Offensively he was fortunate to have Holmgren and shanahan. I always thought he would have been better served to make trestman get away from the 60/40 pass/run split that's his MO. In the end, that's what cost george his job.

Originally posted by Niners816:
He did make a fundamental shift to the defense in 1994 going to a 4 man front. If memory serves me 1994 was ranked 6th and 95 & 96 were top 2-3. I give him credit for that, because he had so much success with a 3-4 thru the 80s and early 90s.

Offensively he was fortunate to have Holmgren and shanahan. I always thought he would have been better served to make trestman get away from the 60/40 pass/run split that's his MO. In the end, that's what cost george his job.

He was the HC of 2 of the greatest teams to win the SB in 89 and 94 and 2 of the greatest teams not to win the SB in 90 and 92.

I believe the 94 squad was the highest scoring team of the 5 super bowl winners and scored in the 500 point column which was rare at that time.

Originally posted by 49erFan816:

He was the HC of 2 of the greatest teams to win the SB in 89 and 94 and 2 of the greatest teams not to win the SB in 90 and 92.

I believe the 94 squad was the highest scoring team of the 5 super bowl winners and scored in the 500 point column which was rare at that time.

1994 was the the highest of all of our titke teams. 505 in the regular season and 636 total including post season.

1996 was pretty much the only team of his era I really didn't think could win a title. They just didn't match up well with both GB and Car. I think 1991 would have rolled thru he playoffs if it would have got in. After starting 4-6, they were stomping playoff teams down the stretch.