NY Giants coaches film analysis

Originally posted by TheRickestRick:

Originally posted by LastPost:
Hi all. I'm a long time (maybe six years?) lurker here, but thought I would finally sign up to say my peace. This dumpster fire of a thread seems like as good a place as any to finally post.

This forum is the single most awful place on the internet that I regularly view. You'd be hard pressed to find a more belligerent group of know-nothings than you regularly find in the 49erswebzone forums. Every fan base has a layer of truly awful fans, but I've been amazed that seemingly all of the 49ers worst fans all end up here. It's like a bilge pump at a sewage treatment plant broke, and all these terrible trolls just backed up into this place.

What's most shocking is how long some of these chumps have been here. Just firing off angry posts for literally years! I always assume that the only people that ever leave this forum, is when they get caught punching a dude in the bathrooms at the stadium, and suddenly lose their internet rights in prison. Seriously, it's so strange to see people with tens of thousands of posts, but are still barely literate. You'd think that at some point, after writing about how much you hate the team we all root for, you'd learn some basic grammar. But, alas, you don't.

Anyway, the reason I decided to show up was to give some props to THL and JonnyDel for the truly awesome posts that they regularly post. I really love these threads, with the exception of having to dig through the comments from most of the rest of you apes. I'm worried that the tone of this thread will make these two guys stop doing this really great work, or else they will bail to another site, and I wouldn't know where they went, and wouldn't be able to continue reading what are really entertaining posts. I hope that doesn't happen. This is really good stuff in here, every week. I'm sorry that there is a group of morons kinda ruining this (the way they ruin everything else).

Have fun, guys. I'm sure I'll be perma-banned soon.

Translation = Seahawks fan that used Johnny and THL's post to learn about football since most in the northwest keep getting it confused with soccer or a half priced McDonald's deal.

lol

It's okay if Jonnydel is a Kap basher. It's ok that others like myself are HaRoman bashers. They're all opinions and if anyone wants to give more weight to one or the other opinion that's up to them. I still appreciate seeing and reading the analysis whether I agree with it or not.

Also I think it's good for Kap to hear the negative comments and hear from the non-believers. It really fuels him. I don't think people like me who thinks he's an all-star really do anything to motivate the guy. So I'm all for people bashing Kap. I'm surprised there isn't more bashing in the media. I see an incredibly competitive spirit in Kap... anyways... I'm carrying on.

Well I just wasted an hour reading through all this and just noted there was only one cut up in 122 posts. What Jonnydel & thl do they do for free. I may not agree with what they say, but to criticizing that they don't do it right, or should look at this or need to analyze that is like biting the hand that feeds you. I'll take what I can get and be happy about. As should all of you.

Also one other thing. Football is hard to do at a professional level. Whether you are a coach or a player. Yes they screw up, and yes we all live and die with every single one. But taking it out in an anonymous format against two great individuals who are doing a lot of us a great service is just plain wrong.

I really hope the mods step in a bit. If any thread deserves to remain true to its original intentions it is this one.

And Jonny and Thl if you do leave, which I wouldn't blame you, please let us know where. I'd almost follow you to a Seahawks site... almost.

There's a reason jonnydel and I do this every week. It's not so we can show off our mspaint skills, it's not so we can show off what we know about football, it's not so we can push an agenda onto other forum members. I don't respond to the positive feedback posts that say "thanks". I appreciate it, but I don't want to clutter the thread with 'you're welcome'. That's not why we do this.

It's so we, as 49er fans, have a better understanding of what our team is doing - at low level detail. That's it. Nothing more. How many members would think the 49ers ran a one read passing attack, were a zone dominant defense, that Kap is a one read QB? Those are all myths that have been stated by various members of the media. We do this so Zone members understand our team. Its strengths and its weaknesses. When the family sleeps, I cut plays up so we have items to discuss that is below the level of "our offense sucks", and "our defense kicks ass". That's all the "Whats". But Why? How?

When it was stated that I had a bias and an agenda by a fellow poster, that hit a nerve because I'd like to think I have no pro-coach, pro-player, anti-coach, or anti-player bias. The only bias I have is pro-49ers. The main reason I don't point out the coaches as much as the players is because it's easier to see when the players fail to execute their assignment. That's plain to see on film. So why do the players continue to fail in certain areas? That's where you, as an independent thinker, can point to the proper coach.

I have never ever stated that the sole reason for offensive failure is all on the players. I have repeatedly stated that there are always various reasons for failure on different plays. This includes players and coaches. I'm sure I also speak for jonnydel when I say that we welcome content from anyone that would like to share. This isn't his thread. This isn't my thread. This is a 49er fan's thread and anyone with a computer can post pictures to share their thoughts on the team. As always, if anyone has a certain play they'd like to see, feel free to mention it.

TLDR version: My only "agenda" is to discuss football in low level detail. On with the film breakdowns.

The 49ers were 6-14 on 3rd down conversions in the game, which led to much of our frustrations with the offense. Here are the 3rd down failures that led to a punt or FG attempt. I can go into the 1st and 2nd downs later. For now, here are the 3rd downs - the 'money' down, where players and coaches earn their money.

3rd Down Failure #1

1st Down: Kap -7 run
2nd Down: Hyde run +4

49ers: To Kap's left looks like a basic clear out by Lloyd to earn room for Boldin's out route. To Kaps right, VD's route looks to occupy the strongside hook/curl defender (orange), while Gore brings the Curl/Flat defender (blue) out wide. This should earn a passing lane to Crabs.
NYG: cover3


Kap completes his dropback and looks left. This is the quicker developing route combination.


The throw leads Boldin too much. Incomplete.


A passing lane can be seen opening up for Crabs on the other side of the field, although the CB on Crabs played it well and would have been in good position to drive into the throw had Crabs been targeted. This was the 49ers second failed attempt at the red zone as they were 0 for 2 on the day. The first attempt ended on Gore/Kap's fumble.

e/Kap's fumble.

I'm ok with this decision by Kap that crab throw would have had to been kinda perfect.. he can make that throw but im ok he didn't on this one. he needs to make a way better throw to boldin if he wants boldin to have any chance at making the catch and turning up field.

Originally posted by LastPost:
Hi all. I'm a long time (maybe six years?) lurker here, but thought I would finally sign up to say my peace. This dumpster fire of a thread seems like as good a place as any to finally post.

This forum is the single most awful place on the internet that I regularly view. You'd be hard pressed to find a more belligerent group of know-nothings than you regularly find in the 49erswebzone forums. Every fan base has a layer of truly awful fans, but I've been amazed that seemingly all of the 49ers worst fans all end up here. It's like a bilge pump at a sewage treatment plant broke, and all these terrible trolls just backed up into this place.

What's most shocking is how long some of these chumps have been here. Just firing off angry posts for literally years! I always assume that the only people that ever leave this forum, is when they get caught punching a dude in the bathrooms at the stadium, and suddenly lose their internet rights in prison. Seriously, it's so strange to see people with tens of thousands of posts, but are still barely literate. You'd think that at some point, after writing about how much you hate the team we all root for, you'd learn some basic grammar. But, alas, you don't.

Anyway, the reason I decided to show up was to give some props to THL and JonnyDel for the truly awesome posts that they regularly post. I really love these threads, with the exception of having to dig through the comments from most of the rest of you apes. I'm worried that the tone of this thread will make these two guys stop doing this really great work, or else they will bail to another site, and I wouldn't know where they went, and wouldn't be able to continue reading what are really entertaining posts. I hope that doesn't happen. This is really good stuff in here, every week. I'm sorry that there is a group of morons kinda ruining this (the way they ruin everything else).

Have fun, guys. I'm sure I'll be perma-banned soon.

Barely literate? I'll have you know my parents were married in that church right over there!

3rd Down Failure #2

1st Down: Gore for -1
2nd Down: Incomplete pass

49ers: Not sure what's going on to Kap's left. Looks rather vanilla. To Kap's right is a clear out by SJ for VD's out route. The whole play looks rather basic, but it got someone open.
NYG: cover 4


Kap drops back and looks to his left. With the CB over Lloyd playing with a large cushion, there's nothing to be had there. Boldin's Curls gets defeated as well. The two DL across from Boone and ADavis just stunted.


Kap looks to his right for a split second before the stunting DT loops around ADavis and has a clear path to Kap.


Kap sees the rusher coming at him and checks down to Hyde over the middle. VD was open along the sidelines, but the pressure didn't allow Kap to see him.







jonnydel alluded to this play earlier in this thread: "To me, when I see a QB miss a read against cover 4 when the defense showed, pre-snap, a 4 shell look and stayed in that look post snap and the QB never looks to the side of the play to beat a cover 4 and has an open TE - it's not a system issue." Read more at http://www.49erswebzone.com/forum/niners/180298-giants-coaches-film-analysis/page5/#6DmL6gWlfU5hVYdk.99

Originally posted by jonesadrian:
I'm ok with this decision by Kap that crab throw would have had to been kinda perfect.. he can make that throw but im ok he didn't on this one. he needs to make a way better throw to boldin if he wants boldin to have any chance at making the catch and turning up field.

I disagree. I think it's time he needs to be attempting that throw. I wouldnt be surprised if he's not even cleared to make that throw, I'm sure Boldin was the only "real" target here.

Originally posted by thl408:

The 49ers were 6-14 on 3rd down conversions in the game, which led to much of our frustrations with the offense. Here are the 3rd down failures that led to a punt or FG attempt. I can go into the 1st and 2nd downs later. For now, here are the 3rd downs - the 'money' down, where players and coaches earn their money.

3rd Down Failure #1

1st Down: Kap -7 run
2nd Down: Hyde run +4

49ers: To Kap's left looks like a basic clear out by Lloyd to earn room for Boldin's out route. To Kaps right, VD's route looks to occupy the strongside hook/curl defender (orange), while Gore brings the Curl/Flat defender (blue) out wide. This should earn a passing lane to Crabs.
NYG: cover3


Kap completes his dropback and looks left. This is the quicker developing route combination.


The throw leads Boldin too much. Incomplete.


A passing lane can be seen opening up for Crabs on the other side of the field, although the CB on Crabs played it well and would have been in good position to drive into the throw had Crabs been targeted. This was the 49ers second failed attempt at the red zone as they were 0 for 2 on the day. The first attempt ended on Gore/Kap's fumble.

Imo, you need a little more room for that mills concept that crabs and VD were running. The outside corner is allowed to aggressively defend that post because he has the endZone acting as an extra defender. Pehaps if there was a little more fears of a vertical stretch between the dig and post that window would have been even more pronounced and a more viable option.

3rd Down Failure #3

1st Down: Gore for +3
2nd Down: Incomplete pass deep to VD

49ers: Looks like mirroring Curl-Flat concepts on both sides. When running this concept (zone buster) versus man coverage, there is a small window to hit the curl just as it is breaking, provided the CB plays off coverage. Notice the two WRs running the Curls (Lloyd, Crabs) and which CB is pressing and which is playing off coverage. When a CB presses on a Curl route (Lloyd), it's nearly extremely risky to complete.
NYG: cover 1 robber


Kap drops back and looks to VD. He is covered.


Kap then looks to Crabs, who has favorable leverage on his CB as Crabs is about to break inwards on his Curl.


Kap is mid windup.


Kap airmails the throw incomplete.

Originally posted by thl408:
3rd Down Failure #2

1st Down: Gore for -1
2nd Down: Incomplete pass

49ers: Not sure what's going on to Kap's left. Looks rather vanilla. To Kap's right is a clear out by SJ for VD's out route. The whole play looks rather basic, but it got someone open.
NYG: cover 4


Kap drops back and looks to his left. With the CB over Lloyd playing with a large cushion, there's nothing to be had there. Boldin's Curls gets defeated as well. The two DL across from Boone and ADavis just stunted.


Kap looks to his right for a split second before the stunting DT loops around ADavis and has a clear path to Kap.


Kap sees the rusher coming at him and checks down to Hyde over the middle. VD was open along the sidelines, but the pressure didn't allow Kap to see him.







jonnydel alluded to this play earlier in this thread: "To me, when I see a QB miss a read against cover 4 when the defense showed, pre-snap, a 4 shell look and stayed in that look post snap and the QB never looks to the side of the play to beat a cover 4 and has an open TE - it's not a system issue." Read more at http://www.49erswebzone.com/forum/niners/180298-giants-coaches-film-analysis/page5/#6DmL6gWlfU5hVYdk.99

Jonny i saw nothing wrong with this play...please explain

Originally posted by sanjo49er:

Jonny i saw nothing wrong with this play...please explain

He wanted kaep to hold it a little longer and throw it to stone hands, great decision by kaep, saw pressure..got rid of it

Originally posted by awp8912:

Originally posted by jonesadrian:
I'm ok with this decision by Kap that crab throw would have had to been kinda perfect.. he can make that throw but im ok he didn't on this one. he needs to make a way better throw to boldin if he wants boldin to have any chance at making the catch and turning up field.

I disagree. I think it's time he needs to be attempting that throw. I wouldnt be surprised if he's not even cleared to make that throw, I'm sure Boldin was the only "real" target here.

disagree completely. kap has shown that if he has time he'll go through the reads and make the throws. he'll also throw it to whoever is open. there is no such thing as only looking to someone specific.. at different points over the past season and a half you could insert 3 different names into your "only real target here" sentence.

he has to make a better throw to boldin on that pass.