Why does everyone besides Kaep seem expendable now (per fan base)?

Depth.

The priority list is clearly:
Kap
Aldon
Crabtree
...big gap...
VD
Boone
Iupati

Kap and Aldon will be here long term and it will cost a ton to keep them. Fortunatly, Justin Smith and Frank Gore will probably be done after this season and create some cap space.

We will (and should) make a serious attempt to keep Crabtree. Good receivers are hard to find. VD is a rare athlete and a key to our offense. He's also our only deep threat. I doubt the team let's him leave while he's still at the top of his game. That said, he's well compensated.

Interior OL a easy to find. s**t, we have Kilgore, Looney, Martin, and Thomas all ready to fill in. Iupati is a gonner. Boone is worth more than he's being paid.... especially since he's our top backup tackle too. That said, he isn't like to get a huge bump up in pay with 2 years left on his deal.

Originally posted by PRIMETIME21:
i didn't say kaep sucks first of all, i just simply stated he doesn't deserve to be paid top 5 QB money when his team is surrounded by so much talent, the same talent alex got far in the playoffs with. i think he more a product of the harbs system, but again not saying he is bad either, just doesn't deserve money by the likes of those 5 guys i stated.

Which system would that be? His first half season, where he was running out of the pistol a lot? The beginning of last season when they threw a lot? The middle, where they ran a lot? Maybe the end of the season where he was taking off a lot more?

I still haven't seen a cohesive system other than run-first. I think they've been developing him into a QB with whom they can actually HAVE a system.

Originally posted by Mr.Mcgibblets:

Originally posted by PRIMETIME21:

Originally posted by Mr.Mcgibblets:

Originally posted by PRIMETIME21:
i personally think kaep is overated and doesn't deserve top 5 money. he surrounded by a dominant team,

i think harbs can do this with any QB thats half decent. he is a good player yea, but

Maybe... and that's just it.. maybe. You could be right or wrong... which is why I am still in favor of waiting the year to see if he can refine his game.

i didn't say kaep sucks first of all, i just simply stated he doesn't deserve to be paid top 5 QB money when his team is surrounded by so much talent, the same talent alex got far in the playoffs with. i think he more a product of the harbs system, but again not saying he is bad either, just doesn't deserve money by the likes of those 5 guys i stated.

I am pretty certain that neither of us did suggest that.

lol

Originally posted by KegBert:

Originally posted by Jersey9er:
We realize that Kaep is most likely gonna get paid 18 Mil/yr (probably). But I haven't heard one negative comment on a new deal for him. And he's proven some things, but still has some growing to do. As is expected.

But soon, we will have Crabs, VD, Boone, and a few others that may want new deals.

Except now, go in VD's thread, Crabs, and in a few others, and they are all expendable. We are talking about how they can be replaced, or aren't playing like they used too, or they shouldn't be selfish and let Kaep's deal get done first, then the rest follow.

Just saying it's starting to seem a little more hypocritical than usual. A lot of these players have been staples in the offense, and only getting better as years go by, but now when it comes to cash, they should keep it low, or move on... That aint right.....

Has anyone else noticed this or is it just me?????

You obviously haven't been in the Kap thread at all this off season.

Also, I haven't seen any large contingent of fans saying VD is expendable, he's obviously a huge part of this offense and he is compensated appropriately, he is paid in the top 3 of TE's, doesn't seem necessary to tear up his contract and start over right now. I think Boone is deserving of a new contract and I'd like to keep Crabs but he may just want too much money.

Also, the one big upcoming free agent you didn't list is the one most likely to not be resigned by the Niners, Mike Iupati.

LOL. Actually nope not that much, but I just went in there now. And I just looked at random pages. For the most part it's almost true as I stated in the beginning. You have more that are clamoring for a new deal than those that don't want one. Now the difference is, in terms of years, and how much. Now i saw that debated constantly, but not much to the effect of not giving a new deal. I'd say just from the pages I saw it was at least 75-80% that said get er done.

And yeah i forgot about Iupati..... Really the main purpose of this thread is, I have no problem with fans debating on salary and all that, thats what we do. I just find it funny that now because of the cash now some of the players don't produce, or could be better, etc. That's all.

For example Crabs.... Ok he may want a big chunk of cash, I don't know. But when i start reading about him not producing as much, or could be replaced easily that's when I have a little issue. If someone thinks the money is too high, no problem. But then don't someone make excuses now, on lack of production or inflated numbers as being the reasoning not too maybe pay the man, know what I mean...

Originally posted by crake49:

Originally posted by PRIMETIME21:
i personally think kaep is overated and doesn't deserve top 5 money. he surrounded by a dominant team, a team alex smith took far into the playoffs. i think harbs can do this with any QB thats half decent. he is a good player yea, but would you take him over brady, eli manning , brees, peyton, rogers, i don't think so. i also think russell wilson is very overated, they both surrounded by dominant teams.

Silliest post I've seen in a long time for a couple reasons. Sure, let's compare Kaepernick to Brady, Brees, Peyton and Rogers, all locks for first ballot Hall of Fame. What nonsense. You might as well say "would you take him over Montana? I don't think so." But beyond that, Brady and Peyton are about done. At this point, it would be smarter for any GM to take Kaepernick for the future over them.

But then to bring Eli Manning into the equation. WTF? Kaepernick already has much better numbers than Eli. He's even got a higher completion percentage. He's got a higher rating. And memo to Einstein here: Eli Manning threw 27 interceptions last season against 18 TD's. Eli Manning has got to be the luckiest QB in the league. Both of his SB wins were absolute flukes. I would take Kaepernick over Eli any day of the week. Talk about over-rated.

Giants are one of two teams to win two SBs in the last ten years. Underdogs both times. Eli lead clutch late game winning drives both times. And you call that an absolute fluke and luck?...... Now that's silly.

Originally posted by SanDiego49er:
Always believe in Kaep. Never question Kaep. Just fall in line and chant "Kaep is great, Kaep is great."

Never question Kap (all Niner fans should know by now it isn't Kaep /Kaeps - if you don't even know your franchise QB nickname well....)???????????????????

You have questioned everything he does. I'm trying to find one positive comment from you about OUR QB .... Nope I can't find one.


Many don't want to pay him the big bucks. But, no one follows up and says he isn't worth Cutler, Rome, Stafford or Ryan money. So are we mad at non-elite QBs getting such huge contracts or Kaepernick specifically? What is Alex Smith worth?

Most teams liked to reward the QB for bringing home a SB ring. Apparently that has changed. Now it appears if he might be able to bring you a ring, you pay the man.

And this Miami thing is on Kap. Forget the action itself. Niner FO has hands tied until this is totally resolved, meanwhile Hawks are getting there SB contract rewards, it appears Kap will get rewarded too, which is making many players think about themselves this offseason and being rewarded prior to SB.

Originally posted by goodthings19:
So much talent to resign but only so little cap space to work with. The fan base doesn't want any of these guys to go. Here is my prediction for who gets extensions and who we let walk

Walks
-Mike Iupati
-Alex Boone
-Michael Crabtree

Extensions
-Aldon Smith
-Collin Kaepernick
-Vernon Davis

The 49ers o-lineman will be easier to replace. Letting go of Crabtree hurts but his asking price will be WAY above his actual value to our team. Aldon Smith WILL cost us an absolute fortune but letting a once in a generation talent like him just walk seems like a terrible idea. Nothing needs to be said about Kaepernick besides that he's our franchise QB. I believe that Vernon's new contract will be a marginal increase in pay but the new deal will extend through 2018 or something like that.

I think we can sign Boone. Unless he's going to be too hurt over having to wait a year, we should be fine. He's a versatile player but will not command top dollar. I think once we get the big fish out of the way, serious talks will begin wtih him and we'll see where his head is at. Michael Crabtree is a wildcard. Everyone assumes he's headed to Dallas, but with what money? No way they could afford Dez Bryant and Crabtree. I think if Crabtree is cool with 8-10 million a year, he stays. I also don't anticipate us having to pay a receiver big money for awhile.

Originally posted by Mr.Mcgibblets:

Originally posted by PRIMETIME21:

Originally posted by Mr.Mcgibblets:

Originally posted by PRIMETIME21:

i personally think kaep is overated and doesn't deserve top 5 money. he surrounded by a dominant team,

i think harbs can do this with any QB thats half decent. he is a good player yea, but

Maybe... and that's just it.. maybe. You could be right or wrong... which is why I am still in favor of waiting the year to see if he can refine his game.

i didn't say kaep sucks first of all, i just simply stated he doesn't deserve to be paid top 5 QB money when his team is surrounded by so much talent, the same talent alex got far in the playoffs with. i think he more a product of the harbs system, but again not saying he is bad either, just doesn't deserve money by the likes of those 5 guys i stated.

I am pretty certain that neither of us did suggest that.

Well, the 49er brain trust has made it clear that extending Kaepernick's contract is a priority.

Time shapes the notion of top money. What is considered top money today, may well not be top money in two or three years.
Over time, maybe for the next three to five years, the cap figures are going to increase and those projected increases are also going to impact the contract extension.

The front office has been very astute in its dealing with contract extensions, so I am inclined to think that they will do a good job with Kaepernick's extension.

I anxiously await the extension of Kaepernick's contract, but I await the coming year even more.

Originally posted by aTx49er:
Giants are one of two teams to win two SBs in the last ten years. Underdogs both times. Eli lead clutch late game winning drives both times. And you call that an absolute fluke and luck?...... Now that's silly.

I guess we'll have to disagree, because both games I saw featured last minute unbelievable catches, especially the Patriots game, by receivers who pretty much haven't really done anything like that before or since. The pass to Manningham was a good pass, but an even better catch. The pass in the Patriots game was just throwing up a prayer and the catch against the helmet is an interception or an incompletion 9 out of 10 times. I think Eli Manning is and has been one of the most over-rated QB's of the modern era and last season, when he didn't have the benefit of a good defense helping him, I think he started to show that.

Originally posted by crake49:

Originally posted by aTx49er:
Giants are one of two teams to win two SBs in the last ten years. Underdogs both times. Eli lead clutch late game winning drives both times. And you call that an absolute fluke and luck?...... Now that's silly.

I guess we'll have to disagree, because both games I saw featured last minute unbelievable catches, especially the Patriots game, by receivers who pretty much haven't really done anything like that before or since. The pass to Manningham was a good pass, but an even better catch. The pass in the Patriots game was just throwing up a prayer and the catch against the helmet is an interception or an incompletion 9 out of 10 times. I think Eli Manning is and has been one of the most over-rated QB's of the modern era and last season, when he didn't have the benefit of a good defense helping him, I think he started to show that.

i actually like eli a little bit, he is overrated by being a manning and in new york, throw in the hard ware and it is a jizz fest on occasion. but his problems i see is his o-line. around their 1st title in 07 and for a couple of years after they were considered one of the best units in the game. couple guys get hurt, another retires or maybe moves on and things change a little bit.

Originally posted by Rizvi49er:
Kaepernick is THE difference maker. The other team has to account for his legs so that opens stuff up especially in the playoffs when they tend to run him more.

You can blame him for not getting is reads down and going through progressions but that hopefully will come together this offseason. This is his 4th year in the system and 2nd year as the full time starter so this is when he's supposed to make his big jump.

They're on the cusp of a championship...and this is the year they'll get it.

And if u think Kaep isn't good enough...would you rather have Kaep or Alex Smith, Troy Smith, Shaun Hill, J.T. O'Sullivan, Trent Dilfer, Chris Weinke, Tim Rattay, Ken Dorsey or Cody Pickett? Cause that's what we had to suffer thru the last 10 years...i'm taking Kaepernick every time.

Alex Smith was 2 fumbled punts away from leading us to the Superbowl. Kap is a great athlete but has not demonstrated the abiltiy to be a great QB who can read defenses and find the open receiver yet. He has great potential. He might have developed faster had he not started last year with 1 legit WR. Patton was hurt early and Crabtree was out before opening day. That tends to make your reads 1 dimensional. Hopefully he will spread the ball around a lot more this season. he wants to be great and works hard to be great and has the potential to be great so the possibilities for the future seem to be pretty darn good but only time will tell for sure.

Originally posted by crabman82:
i actually like eli a little bit, he is overrated by being a manning and in new york, throw in the hard ware and it is a jizz fest on occasion. but his problems i see is his o-line. around their 1st title in 07 and for a couple of years after they were considered one of the best units in the game. couple guys get hurt, another retires or maybe moves on and things change a little bit.

I like him a little bit, too. I just think he's been very lucky. That helmet catch. OMG. And, you're right. His supporting cast has dropped off considerably. But look what happened when it did and his luck ran out - 28 interceptions against 18 TD's.

Originally posted by SanDiego49er:

Originally posted by PRIMETIME21:

i personally think kaep is overated and doesn't deserve top 5 money. he surrounded by a dominant team, a team alex smith took far into the playoffs. i think harbs can do this with any QB thats half decent. he is a good player yea, but would you take him over brady, eli manning , brees, peyton, rogers, i don't think so. i also think russell wilson is very overated, they both surrounded by dominant teams.

Always believe in Kaep. Never question Kaep. Just fall in line and chant "Kaep is great, Kaep is great."

We all know you dont like Kap as the Niners QB. I mean, its understandable, considering hes just a 26 year old kid with 4 playoff wins, Super Bowl experience, a cannon arm, gazelle-like speed, a great work ethic, and the ability to lead.

Besides all that crap, he hasnt won a Super Bowl for us before his 30th career start, so its obviously time to move on and draft a new QB who will probably be better, and more likely to deserve a big contract. That is how great franchises operate. They throw away young, budding mega-talents over money and lack of being a finished product right away.

I think the OP dramatizes a bit. I think most know VD is irreplaceable, if a bit irritated at his dissatisfaction. Want Crabtree to stay. Are resigned to Iupati likely leaving. Think Boones play for more unlikely to materialize into anything disruptive.

Most our fans on this board realize that in the modern era of the NFL you must have an ever flowing stream of talent on and off your team to properly balance the cap and said talent. Some people may have different ideas on how that should affect the talent on our team, of which there is plenty, which is why it seems you are seeing wide spread dissatisfaction. There are of lot of members on the zone, a lot of opinions.

GM, if something went sideways in Miami, whether with merit or not, and we didn't have kap's services for awhile, ever thot about just exactly what kind of team we could put on the field? Everyone tosses this off as done and gone, but what if? Obviously we all want this gone, but if that happened, what would you expect as a team out there? I thot about that initially when gabbert was signed, and prayed we had a better answer than that. Josh...could he perform well enough to keep us competitive for 4 games ...or 6 .....or 8? Do I think this is going to happen? NO, I don't. But my question is what if? Any thots? My hope would be that we win enough without kap to make a run when he returned. It would sure make some of the earlier games which look like locks look pretty iffy. So, would Josh be enough to keep us in it, or not? I didn't ask about gabbert because I think he is just way too far away from being a decent backup.