What is Kaeps worth....?

Who is this man, and what has he done with the real Jason La Candouche?

Originally posted by Young2Rice:

Originally posted by 16to87:
http://mweb.cbssports.com/nfl/writer/jason-la-canfora/24469225/kaepernick-will-get-his-20m-per-deal-whether-niners-pay-up-now-or-later

Nice post. Here are some eye poppin facts from the article:

"Kaepernick currently stands third in postseason history in yards per pass attempt (among anyone with 100 playoff pass attempts), at a gaudy 8.48.

His average of 9.9 yards per scrimmage touch, in the NFL playoffs, is the best in league history for any quarterback.

Kaepernick is second all-time among quarterbacks with 507 scrimmage yards in the postseason, behind only Hall of Famer Steve Young (and Young amassed that yardage on 96 carries, while Kaepernick has only 51 playoff rushing attempts). Oh, and those 51 playoff rushes are already 10th in NFL history for any quarterback, yet Kaepernick has played only six postseason games (4-2). John Elway, by comparison, had 94 rushes for 484 yards all-time in the playoffs."


Good thing we have a stacked team which allows for Kap to keep setting these milestones in the post season...

Curious what that stat looks like for this post season only?

YPA 7.02 Good for 9th place.

He also had the 2nd worse QBR out of all the QBs in the post season.

Originally posted by Jakemall:

Originally posted by Young2Rice:

Originally posted by 16to87:
http://mweb.cbssports.com/nfl/writer/jason-la-canfora/24469225/kaepernick-will-get-his-20m-per-deal-whether-niners-pay-up-now-or-later

Nice post. Here are some eye poppin facts from the article:

"Kaepernick currently stands third in postseason history in yards per pass attempt (among anyone with 100 playoff pass attempts), at a gaudy 8.48.

His average of 9.9 yards per scrimmage touch, in the NFL playoffs, is the best in league history for any quarterback.

Kaepernick is second all-time among quarterbacks with 507 scrimmage yards in the postseason, behind only Hall of Famer Steve Young (and Young amassed that yardage on 96 carries, while Kaepernick has only 51 playoff rushing attempts). Oh, and those 51 playoff rushes are already 10th in NFL history for any quarterback, yet Kaepernick has played only six postseason games (4-2). John Elway, by comparison, had 94 rushes for 484 yards all-time in the playoffs."


Good thing we have a stacked team which allows for Kap to keep setting these milestones in the post season...

Curious what that stat looks like for this post season only?

YPA 7.02 Good for 9th place.

He also had the 2nd worse QBR out of all the QBs in the post season.

That tends to happen when playing three straight road games, of which two are against the #1 and #2 defenses in the league, on the road. Especially at SEA where no one has success as a QB.

He did have the third most passing yards which is awesome.

That's why its better to include last season to balance things out. Either way, those numbers are stellar. Considering its a guy playing in 1.5 seasons, its miraculous.

Originally posted by Young2Rice:

Originally posted by Jakemall:

Originally posted by Young2Rice:

Originally posted by 16to87:
http://mweb.cbssports.com/nfl/writer/jason-la-canfora/24469225/kaepernick-will-get-his-20m-per-deal-whether-niners-pay-up-now-or-later

Nice post. Here are some eye poppin facts from the article:

"Kaepernick currently stands third in postseason history in yards per pass attempt (among anyone with 100 playoff pass attempts), at a gaudy 8.48.

His average of 9.9 yards per scrimmage touch, in the NFL playoffs, is the best in league history for any quarterback.

Kaepernick is second all-time among quarterbacks with 507 scrimmage yards in the postseason, behind only Hall of Famer Steve Young (and Young amassed that yardage on 96 carries, while Kaepernick has only 51 playoff rushing attempts). Oh, and those 51 playoff rushes are already 10th in NFL history for any quarterback, yet Kaepernick has played only six postseason games (4-2). John Elway, by comparison, had 94 rushes for 484 yards all-time in the playoffs."


Good thing we have a stacked team which allows for Kap to keep setting these milestones in the post season...

Curious what that stat looks like for this post season only?

YPA 7.02 Good for 9th place.

He also had the 2nd worse QBR out of all the QBs in the post season.

That tends to happen when playing three straight road games, of which two are against the #1 and #2 defenses in the league, on the road.

Especially at SEA where no one has success as a QB.

That's why its better to include last season to balance things out. Either way, those numbers are stellar. Considering its a guy playing in 1.5 seasons, its miraculous.

It also tends to happen when teams have film on the QB instead of him being a fairly talented surprise.

Originally posted by Jakemall:

Originally posted by Young2Rice:

Originally posted by Jakemall:

Originally posted by Young2Rice:

Originally posted by 16to87:
http://mweb.cbssports.com/nfl/writer/jason-la-canfora/24469225/kaepernick-will-get-his-20m-per-deal-whether-niners-pay-up-now-or-later

Nice post. Here are some eye poppin facts from the article:

"Kaepernick currently stands third in postseason history in yards per pass attempt (among anyone with 100 playoff pass attempts), at a gaudy 8.48.

His average of 9.9 yards per scrimmage touch, in the NFL playoffs, is the best in league history for any quarterback.

Kaepernick is second all-time among quarterbacks with 507 scrimmage yards in the postseason, behind only Hall of Famer Steve Young (and Young amassed that yardage on 96 carries, while Kaepernick has only 51 playoff rushing attempts). Oh, and those 51 playoff rushes are already 10th in NFL history for any quarterback, yet Kaepernick has played only six postseason games (4-2). John Elway, by comparison, had 94 rushes for 484 yards all-time in the playoffs."


Good thing we have a stacked team which allows for Kap to keep setting these milestones in the post season...

Curious what that stat looks like for this post season only?

YPA 7.02 Good for 9th place.

He also had the 2nd worse QBR out of all the QBs in the post season.

That tends to happen when playing three straight road games, of which two are against the #1 and #2 defenses in the league, on the road.

Especially at SEA where no one has success as a QB.

That's why its better to include last season to balance things out. Either way, those numbers are stellar. Considering its a guy playing in 1.5 seasons, its miraculous.

It also tends to happen when teams have film on the QB instead of him being a fairly talented surprise.

I'd attribute it more to facing top tier defenses. I don't think Manning sucked that bad against SEA on a neutral field because Manning is no longer a talented surprise. SEA just has a good defense, especially that secondary. Carolina is a bad ass defense as well. Both games were on the road and very tough to pull through.

Yet Kap had them reeling.

Is La Canfora Kap's publicist or something? Holy crap.

Man I'm not normally a LaConwhateverhisnameis fan but that article is dead the hell on. As fans (especially on the zone, and yes I do it 2 sometimes) we focus on the flaws in a player way too closely and don't really look at the player vs. his true peer group accurately. Niner fans often compare there QBs to Montana/Young (remember everyone hating Young when he first took over because he just wasn't Joe?)

Broken down the way it is in this article to me, nobody can really deny how good the kid already is, that fact along with his young age and freakish athletic ability/arm strength and this kid is the LeBron James of quarterbacks. I truly think he can and probably will continue to evolve and become the best player in the NFL one day, and it won't be that long until it happens.

I hate the $20M/year talk for any player, that's a lot of cap space for one player even if it is the QB but the overall message of this article is right, he's going to get paid sooner or later, the longer the franchise waits, the more expensive it will become, Kaep will get paid.

The only part of the article not fact driven though is the proclamation that he will demand the talks start at $20M no matter what and will pull a Flacco if he isn't given that much. Kaep said he wants a fair deal in line w/his peers that also gives the franchise flexibility to keep talent around him. Let's just pray that he really meant that & the cap keeps going up.

Originally posted by matt49er:
Man I'm not normally a LaConwhateverhisnameis fan but that article is dead the hell on. As fans (especially on the zone, and yes I do it 2 sometimes) we focus on the flaws in a player way too closely and don't really look at the player vs. his true peer group accurately. Niner fans often compare there QBs to Montana/Young (remember everyone hating Young when he first took over because he just wasn't Joe?)

Broken down the way it is in this article to me, nobody can really deny how good the kid already is, that fact along with his young age and freakish athletic ability/arm strength and this kid is the LeBron James of quarterbacks. I truly think he can and probably will continue to evolve and become the best player in the NFL one day, and it won't be that long until it happens.

I hate the $20M/year talk for any player, that's a lot of cap space for one player even if it is the QB but the overall message of this article is right, he's going to get paid sooner or later, the longer the franchise waits, the more expensive it will become, Kaep will get paid.

The only part of the article not fact driven though is the proclamation that he will demand the talks start at $20M no matter what and will pull a Flacco if he isn't given that much. Kaep said he wants a fair deal in line w/his peers that also gives the franchise flexibility to keep talent around him. Let's just pray that he really meant that & the cap keeps going up.

No sports agent in the world is going to go into a business negotiation and say, "Yeah, um, so... Kap wants to be real nice and make less money, so let's start from there."

Agents play hard ball. I don't care what has been said by anyone up to this point. Agents will always paint a picture to maximize their clients salary, that is their job for goodness sake.

20 million wouldn't surprise me though. The people sitting around the business table all know very well Kap's ability. They certainly know he can "read defenses" etc. The facts demonstrate he is top ten, that alone is almost worth 20 million per. Digging deeper into the stats, especially playoff numbers, combined with future projections, he looks more like top five. The serious business people are well aware of this stuff.

In five years, 20 million will STILL seem like a bargain. That's how inflation works.

Originally posted by BrianGO:
No sports agent in the world is going to go into a business negotiation and say, "Yeah, um, so... Kap wants to be real nice and make less money, so let's start from there."

Agents play hard ball. I don't care what has been said by anyone up to this point. Agents will always paint a picture to maximize their clients salary, that is their job for goodness sake.

20 million wouldn't surprise me though. The people sitting around the business table all know very well Kap's ability. They certainly know he can "read defenses" etc. The facts demonstrate he is top ten, that alone is almost worth 20 million per. Digging deeper into the stats, especially playoff numbers, combined with future projections, he looks more like top five. The serious business people are well aware of this stuff.

In five years, 20 million will STILL seem like a bargain. That's how inflation works.

I agree. That is why we should sign Colin for $25 Million right now because that's how much some team might pay him later.

$20M quarterbacks don't need half field game plans. They get production from all roster spots. They can improvise in the pocket. They play fake to the correct side 100% of the time. They don't take undue risk in game crucial situations.

What we sign Kap for doesn't really matter as long as we continue to scout, evaluate and work with developing qb talent. We shouldn't stop all activites there just because we have CK. All teams are one hit away from losing their starter.

Originally posted by brodiebluebanaszak:

$20M quarterbacks don't need half field game plans. They get production from all roster spots. They can improvise in the pocket. They play fake to the correct side 100% of the time. They don't take undue risk in game crucial situations.

What we sign Kap for doesn't really matter as long as we continue to scout, evaluate and work with developing qb talent. We shouldn't stop all activites there just because we have CK. All teams are one hit away from losing their starter.

But $20 million QBs should win playoff games! I don't care how he does it so long as he wins! I still say no QB is worth more than 10% of a teams payroll but this is the going rate these days like it or not. Kap and Wilson have won more playoff games than any two QBs in the NFL the last two season! This is a fact that is hard to overlook. $15 million annually to me is HOF type money but in this market it is just average to good wildcard round maybe QB money. Folk here don't have to like it but it is what it is. IMO paying QBs exorbitantly can greatly hinder the teams ability to supplement the QB with enough talent to win it all. This is a big reason why Kap and Wilson have won more games over the last two seasons and why Peyton just got creamed in the Super Bowl

I don't know crap about NFL player contracts and how they work, but on the surface it seems like it wouldn't be necessary to pay $20 million a year for 5 years to Kap (I am a big fan of Kap's, so this isn't a put down on him). Suppose they don't come to an agreement this year and pay Kap his contracted ~ $1 million. That is $19 million less than $20 million. The next year the team franchises him - let's say that is $20 million (which doesn't seem to be a low estimate) - that's the same as they would have paid him with a $20 million/year contract anyway and the team is still ahead by the $19 million they didn't pay that first year. Then the team franchises him again the next year and suppose that costs $22 million. That's $2 million more than a $20 million/year contract, so the team is now ahead $17 million overall. The next year they can't franchise him (I don't think - contract gurus can correct me on that), so they have to negotiate a contract to keep him. They could pay him $28 million a year for two years and still not have paid more than the $20 million/year for 5 years. Plus, they would not incur as much downside if he got injured or he doesn't develop like it seems he is likely to.

I only put those numbers out there because that is at least superficially the way it looks. There's probably more to it than I realize, though, so I imagine someone will show the mistake(s) in what I said above. Other than the numbers, though, the potential cost of harm to the team's chemistry by dealing with Kap that way may make it worth paying him the bigger contract now.

I'm not saying this to get down on Kap. He's frustrating to watch sometimes, but overall I am a big fan of his and I hope he and the team can work out a deal where he gets the pay he deserves without hurting the team's long term prospects. It's just that people legitimately have been pointing out that it is the market that determines a players worth in salary. Yep, that's the way the NFL and the player's union set up the rules. They also set up the rules so that teams can take advantage of franchising a player. If it's only about $ and each side using the rules to their favor then maybe it isn't foolish for the team to go the franchise route - though once again I admit that my "analysis" may be off a lot which could make this whole thing a quick "never mind".


Edit: I think I was too low on the second year franchise number compared to the first year - but I think the first year number I put up is high so maybe it comes close to the same amount of $ over the two years even if I was off on the second year. And they could franchise him a third year, but the cost would be way too high.

Originally posted by brodiebluebanaszak:
$20M quarterbacks don't need half field game plans. They get production from all roster spots. They can improvise in the pocket. They play fake to the correct side 100% of the time. They don't take undue risk in game crucial situations.

What we sign Kap for doesn't really matter as long as we continue to scout, evaluate and work with developing qb talent. We shouldn't stop all activites there just because we have CK. All teams are one hit away from losing their starter.

Hey! You make an important point there! The Niners shouldn't stop all activities there just because we have CK! Quick, somebody get the Niners front office on the line. They need to know this, STAT! Because sources say that if they sign Kaepernick, everyone was just going to take off and have a long vacation.

Originally posted by crake49:

Originally posted by brodiebluebanaszak:
$20M quarterbacks don't need half field game plans. They get production from all roster spots. They can improvise in the pocket. They play fake to the correct side 100% of the time. They don't take undue risk in game crucial situations.

What we sign Kap for doesn't really matter as long as we continue to scout, evaluate and work with developing qb talent. We shouldn't stop all activites there just because we have CK. All teams are one hit away from losing their starter.

Hey! You make an important point there! The Niners shouldn't stop all activities there just because we have CK! Quick, somebody get the Niners front office on the line. They need to know this, STAT! Because sources say that if they sign Kaepernick, everyone was just going to take off and have a long vacation.

problem for brodie is the 17 and 18 million dollar qbs do some of the things he listed 20 million dollar qbs dont do.

Originally posted by brodiebluebanaszak:
$20M quarterbacks don't need half field game plans. They get production from all roster spots. They can improvise in the pocket. They play fake to the correct side 100% of the time. They don't take undue risk in game crucial situations.

What we sign Kap for doesn't really matter as long as we continue to scout, evaluate and work with developing qb talent. We shouldn't stop all activites there just because we have CK. All teams are one hit away from losing their starter.

You make good points.