*Strongside Pass Rush

Originally posted by LoneWolf:

Honestly no one is writing these guys off, we havent even seen them play yet, but we have seen the players on our defense and it doesn't need to be said but it has been satisfactory and successful (other then the obvious flaws in the secondary). In Aldon's rookie year he was a situational down LB, which is pretty much what Tank will be doing this year. You are right about Aldons rookie year atowards the end of the season he may have seen more playing time for multiple reason biggest one being we were the best run defense in the league that year and teams had to use an alternative offense against us by passing the ball, giving Aldon more reps. The reference to Harbaugh telling Lattimore take his time and not Tank is really unneccesary due to the fact Tank tore his ACL, Lattimore had one of the most gruesome knee injuries in College sports the comparison is irrelevant.

What I was referring to was you saying that tank will start late. I thought he ran a 4.7 40 post injury? does he still need more time to recover? I was saying that harbaugh hasn't said anything to suggest he won't be ready. I totally agree that are front 7 and our pass rush was more than sufficient buy that doesn't mean they can't play better. I believe the strongside can be much more productive. The one reason I don't think lemonier will start is because you can't have that much of a turnover on defense in one year. When you have probably the best defense you don't change out that many players in one year. NT FS LE LOLB and possibly corner if nhamdi proves his worth. I can see tank taking over for mcdonald though still. He was once considered a top 15 pick and has so much talent.

Originally posted by dtg_9er:

Was wondering what the argument is regarding McDonald and Brooks? Did the niners draft someone who will take their places? What's the likelihood of them being cut? Does it sound reasonable that Harbaugh would cut too valuable players and replace them with rookies? Any examples of this from the past two years?

Seems to me that this is not the year to consider whether the two mentioned above are good enough, but to hope they are and wish the team well.

Noone was implying they were going to get cut this year and mcdonald's cap figure isn't that much so I doubt he will get cut next year either. I think brooks will get cut if lemonier pans out and is close to as good or better than brooks. Brooks and Rogers are scheduled to make alot of dough so I can see them being cut next year or later, but def not this year. The argument was about brooks and mac's production and ability to get after the qb from the strongside. I do think they are good players but still think we can find better talent.

Originally posted by JimDrinkAMiller:
Noone was implying they were going to get cut this year and mcdonald's cap figure isn't that much so I doubt he will get cut next year either. I think brooks will get cut if lemonier pans out and is close to as good or better than brooks. Brooks and Rogers are scheduled to make alot of dough so I can see them being cut next year or later, but def not this year. The argument was about brooks and mac's production and ability to get after the qb from the strongside. I do think they are good players but still think we can find better talent.

Thanks for the response. Just trying to clarify as they seem to be very important cogs in the machine and may continue to be going forward. I'm not as interested in individual stats as team stats and the D did well last two years.

Originally posted by dtg_9er:
Thanks for the response. Just trying to clarify as they seem to be very important cogs in the machine and may continue to be going forward. I'm not as interested in individual stats as team stats and the D did well last two years.

That's your opinion. But does that mean you would want carlos rogers to stick around for another couple years?

Originally posted by JimDrinkAMiller:
That's your opinion. But does that mean you would want carlos rogers to stick around for another couple years?

If he is the best CB on the team, or the second best, or the third best...sure. Can't tell that until camp proves or disproves the order. Would you want to cut him if he returns to being the best CB on the team? Works both ways. Luckily, we don't have to rely on your or my opinion!

I think any dlineman who plays with this much intensity and fearlessness is worth keeping around, Tank is more then likely Cowboys successor anyways....

Originally posted by JimDrinkAMiller:
What I was referring to was you saying that tank will start late. I thought he ran a 4.7 40 post injury? does he still need more time to recover? I was saying that harbaugh hasn't said anything to suggest he won't be ready. I totally agree that are front 7 and our pass rush was more than sufficient buy that doesn't mean they can't play better. I believe the strongside can be much more productive. The one reason I don't think lemonier will start is because you can't have that much of a turnover on defense in one year. When you have probably the best defense you don't change out that many players in one year. NT FS LE LOLB and possibly corner if nhamdi proves his worth. I can see tank taking over for mcdonald though still. He was once considered a top 15 pick and has so much talent.

IIRC he still hasnt started in training or OTA's yet because he is still rehabbing his acl injury, thats what I was talking about when I was saying he is starting late, and I think him not being able to participate in football school and OTA's (so far) would be considered a statement from Harbaugh. And like I said above Tank isnt taking over for RayMac, Justin is the one who has been talking about retiring and personally I would like his successor (more then likely Tank) to train and develop under his wing.

Originally posted by JimDrinkAMiller:
That's your opinion. But does that mean you would want carlos rogers to stick around for another couple years?

Funny...both Asomugha and Rogers were Pro Bowl CBs a few years ago so wouldn't it be great if they both played up to that level this year...or we can cut them now because they were disappointing last year. Seems a bit rash.

Originally posted by dtg_9er:
Funny...both Asomugha and Rogers were Pro Bowl CBs a few years ago so wouldn't it be great if they both played up to that level this year...or we can cut them now because they were disappointing last year. Seems a bit rash.

Hey man I have always been a supporter of nnamdi. They had an offensive line coach coaching the defense. I never said to cut either of these guys this year, so where did you get that from? Rogers will be cut next year though. I never considered rogers a pro-bowl caliber cornerback. Yes he made the pro bowl in 11 but did you see him get torched by victor cruz in the nfc championship game? Oh it was raining so that's why he got torched? I've seen rogers get torched more than any other corner on the team. Say what you want about culliver but dude is a stud who is young and has a huge upside. Brown to me has been the most underrated person on the team, and nnamdi CAN flourish in our defense.

Originally posted by LoneWolf:
IIRC he still hasnt started in training or OTA's yet because he is still rehabbing his acl injury, thats what I was talking about when I was saying he is starting late, and I think him not being able to participate in football school and OTA's (so far) would be considered a statement from Harbaugh. And like I said above Tank isnt taking over for RayMac, Justin is the one who has been talking about retiring and personally I would like his successor (more then likely Tank) to train and develop under his wing.

Yeah that does make it a bit more unlikely. I just figured since he put up that great of a 40 that he was on track to be ready for preseason. Still though this will give him a chance to put on some weight and focus on his upper body strength. If he is healthy and gets strong enough to take on nfl lineman, than why not line him up across from Justin? He has a lot to learn no doubt but like you said he is learning from the best 3-4 d-end in the league and one of the best d line coaches if not the best. You never know how fast a player can pick up a defense. He can continue to develop and still play. On top of all that he can still be Justin Smith's replacement.

Like you said we haven't seen either of them play yet so how can we automatically say, no they won't do it. Or there is a close to impossible chance that lemonier starts over brooks? It could happen this season, or it could happen in the next season or 2. But both the guys that we drafted are very atheletic.. Lemonier ran a 4.6 and did 30 reps of 225. Carradine ran a 4.7 when he was hurt and was rumored to run upwards of 4.6, def needs a lil bit more weight to fit in our system though.

The fact still remains that above all else rogers and brooks are getting paid more than they are worth. To me they are getting paid a lot more than even other teams would be willing to pay them at this point. But the fact that we have so many all-star caliber players that their value to our team is even less. Who's more important Brooks and rogers? Or Kaep and Aldon Smith? Or Crabtree and Iupati? We can't keep all these guys.

Originally posted by LoneWolf:


I think any dlineman who plays with this much intensity and fearlessness is worth keeping around, Tank is more then likely Cowboys successor anyways....

Badass play, still not on steve young's level though.

What is a player supposed to do though? Oh my helmet flew of so I'm going to stand still? fall down and play dead? or run off to the sidelines?

Originally posted by JimDrinkAMiller:

The fact still remains that above all else rogers and brooks are getting paid more than they are worth.

But the fact that we have so many all-star caliber players that their value to our team is even less.

Your are entitled to your own opinion, but I think that you are getting facts and your opinions confused.

I gotta ask you, why are you advocating so hard that RayMac and Brooks deserve to be replaced? And how do you figure Brooks is getting overpayed, I understand Rogers getting overpayed, but Brooks really? I understand that we have alot of all star quality players but we also have an all star quality front office that has been managing salarys, drafting etc etc, better then most teams fo's in the NFL. We also have alot of unselfish players that have been taking reductions on there salaries to keep the team together, It takes some seriously smart front office workers, and seriously willing team mates to be able to lower salaries to the point we can sign all the players we need to and keep everyone happy. Although I doubt we can sign Iupati, Kaep, Crabtree (most likely to be gone IMO), and Aldon one will most likely no longer be a Niner, but s**t like that happens in the NFL. You cant keep them all together forever.

Originally posted by JimDrinkAMiller:

Originally posted by LoneWolf:


I think any dlineman who plays with this much intensity and fearlessness is worth keeping around, Tank is more then likely Cowboys successor anyways....

Badass play, still not on steve young's level though.

What is a player supposed to do though? Oh my helmet flew of so I'm going to stand still? fall down and play dead? or run off to the sidelines?

What is it about some fans who can look at a play like that and still think of something snide to say about it? Pretty sad, IMO.

Originally posted by GNielsen:
What is it about some fans who can look at a play like that and still think of something snide to say about it? Pretty sad, IMO.

I agree alot of players that lose there helmets think a little more about there own safety and turn there aggression down a little. All RayMac cared about was hitting Brady.