Do you believe the 49er will sign a true #1 WR AND a high draft pick as #2 WR?

Originally posted by pasodoc9er:
My guess all along has been that we bundle craps up with maybe a 2nd pick for a much higher pick in the draft. Another thot has been to package craps AND Kap for a run at the #2 or #3 pick in draft, Blackmon. I know there is a lot of sentiment for Kap, but i think Tolzien has #2 nailed down...tight. Hence, offer both for a blackmon.
What i don't see is getting a real bona fide #1 WR in FA and Baalke/Harbaugh keeping a #4 or #5 WR who is making #1 WR money. I guess they could offer craps less money for a #4 WR, but don't see that going over well. Also, drafting high will mean giving up something, and craps did have a run of circus catches at midseason before disappearing. Maybe he would be of interest along with another of our picks or as noted above bundled with Kap for a shot at Blackmon. I am curious how many think we keep craps and his #1 salary if we FA a #1 WR and move up for a high #2 WR pick.

Let's just break this down:

1) Michael Crabtree is a "crap" #2 WR.
2) Kaepernick is a #3 quarterback, who will obviously get beat out by an UFA next year.

So here's the plan...

We trade a #3 quarterback, and a #2 wide receiver to obtain a top five pick. This is a fantastic idea.

But why stop there? Let's trade ALL of our backups and get EVERY top ten pick this year. 10 top 10 picks would bring us an infusion of talent really fast. This is great stuff, why didn't we think of this before?

Originally posted by BrianGO:

Originally posted by pasodoc9er:
My guess all along has been that we bundle craps up with maybe a 2nd pick for a much higher pick in the draft. Another thot has been to package craps AND Kap for a run at the #2 or #3 pick in draft, Blackmon. I know there is a lot of sentiment for Kap, but i think Tolzien has #2 nailed down...tight. Hence, offer both for a blackmon.
What i don't see is getting a real bona fide #1 WR in FA and Baalke/Harbaugh keeping a #4 or #5 WR who is making #1 WR money. I guess they could offer craps less money for a #4 WR, but don't see that going over well. Also, drafting high will mean giving up something, and craps did have a run of circus catches at midseason before disappearing. Maybe he would be of interest along with another of our picks or as noted above bundled with Kap for a shot at Blackmon. I am curious how many think we keep craps and his #1 salary if we FA a #1 WR and move up for a high #2 WR pick.

Let's just break this down:

1) Michael Crabtree is a "crap" #2 WR.
2) Kaepernick is a #3 quarterback, who will obviously get beat out by an UFA next year.

So here's the plan...

We trade a #3 quarterback, and a #2 wide receiver to obtain a top five pick. This is a fantastic idea.

But why stop there? Let's trade ALL of our backups and get EVERY top ten pick this year. 10 top 10 picks would bring us an infusion of talent really fast. This is great stuff, why didn't we think of this before?

lol here comes brian's condescending tone because someone dare suggest Kaepernick should be anything but a starting QB and that Crabtree is not a world beater of a WR.

For the record the trade is obviously unrealistic, no team would be stupid enough to make that deal and Crab isn't getting dealt, he should have a good year next year after another offseason in the system and being healthy this time. He's not a bad player. But that doesn't stop us from getting a guy opposite him to take some of the pressure off him, and add another element to the offense.

For the record, I misunderstood craps salary, mistakenly under the impression that he was near the $9mil/yr range...instead of essentially half that, or maybe slightly less. Going back and looking up his salary, i feel a lot better about him, because we should be able to come up with a pair of guys better than he is or close, so he could be a #2 or maybe #3 if we get really lucky in FA and draft. i thot he was eating up way more cap $$ than that. I can live all day with him playing 3rd fiddle, maybe if he improves greatly, 2nd fiddle. If he were our #1 guy after FA and draft, I would have been bummed. This looks fine, his holdout actually helped us $$wise, doofy agent, and i am now looking forward to our two new hands guys. If Fleener is better than any other WR when we pick, i bet we take him, and we still will end up with a handful of WRs in camp , UDFAs, probably most known to Coach H. I'm a happy camper, and can live with craps ~4mil per/yr.

Originally posted by pasodoc9er:
For the record, I misunderstood craps salary, mistakenly under the impression that he was near the $9mil/yr range...instead of essentially half that, or maybe slightly less. Going back and looking up his salary, i feel a lot better about him, because we should be able to come up with a pair of guys better than he is or close, so he could be a #2 or maybe #3 if we get really lucky in FA and draft. i thot he was eating up way more cap $$ than that. I can live all day with him playing 3rd fiddle, maybe if he improves greatly, 2nd fiddle. If he were our #1 guy after FA and draft, I would have been bummed. This looks fine, his holdout actually helped us $$wise, doofy agent, and i am now looking forward to our two new hands guys. If Fleener is better than any other WR when we pick, i bet we take him, and we still will end up with a handful of WRs in camp , UDFAs, probably most known to Coach H. I'm a happy camper, and can live with craps ~4mil per/yr.

Yeah I think he is a good #2 or slot reciever. He doesn't have a whole lot of top end speed(not slow but not Randy Moss either), but he is pretty shifty. We need someone to get him matched up on lesser corners or in the slot where the CB doesn't have the boundary line helping them out as another defender. Crabs is more of a posession reciever and he's a lot better in open space than up and down the field.

Call me crazy, but I still think Crabs has the potential to be a #1. He'll never be a Randy Moss type deep threat, but his skill set is elite. He needs work in the offense the same as everyone else. The WCO is very difficult for every position (ie Vernon Davis) so it is understandable that all of the skill positions took a hit in production.

That said, I hope we draft a WR or two in the top three rounds. I'd also like to see a RG or center taken, and a safety or corner (depending on whether we sign Rogers or Goldson). If we do all of that, and re-sign Josh Morgan, we'll have a lot to work with on offense.

Would sign top 5 fa wr. Draft te At number 1, play double te formation. With gore as the sole back.

we need a # 1 WR---however we get one---we don't have a true # 1 WR on the team---haven't really since TO left.

Originally posted by sfninerfanMax:
we need a # 1 WR---however we get one---we don't have a true # 1 WR on the team---haven't really since TO left.

We had that antonio bryant dude, he was good while he kept his head straight.


But yeah, gut our WR core.

Trade crabs, cut swain, let williams battle for a TC spot, resign morgan, put ginn on perma ST and no more WR fail attempts.

Give Mike Wallace a big deal....steelers can't match...we get a real #1 wr! 4.3 40 $peed oh yeah and no need for kyle/ginn he can be a returner too

just a point of clarification. Did craps $32mil (plus another 8 with incentives) end up being 9 mil the first yr and then $4 mil and change /yr after that for the next 5 yrs.? Somehow i got screwed up on his salary structure. Is that the way it went down?

Originally posted by Furlow:
Call me crazy, but I still think Crabs has the potential to be a #1. He'll never be a Randy Moss type deep threat, but his skill set is elite. He needs work in the offense the same as everyone else. The WCO is very difficult for every position (ie Vernon Davis) so it is understandable that all of the skill positions took a hit in production.

That said, I hope we draft a WR or two in the top three rounds. I'd also like to see a RG or center taken, and a safety or corner (depending on whether we sign Rogers or Goldson). If we do all of that, and re-sign Josh Morgan, we'll have a lot to work with on offense.

I agree with this! Crabtree is a very different type receiver than most. He moves in a shifty way and is almost like a basketball player on the field...good with high balls and dodging after the catch to get a few more yards. He is certainly never going to be Rice or Taylor but he can be a valuable receiver.

mike wallace

i would give a first for him without hesitating

deep threat who has great hands and not afraid to go down the middle
he will strech the field allowing VD and crabs to work the middle of the field as well

dtg, one of the things noticeably missing is the simple art of learning how to fake, and then actually using it. One thing craps did not do this yr was fake, juke, make crisp cuts. All those things are tiny but in the big picture, they have to do with getting open or not. I think it interesting that Coach let only 1 asst walk and he was....our WRs coach. Things like fakes, crisp routes are to a WR, as learning how to pick up blitzes is to OLs, learning how to read blitzes is to Qbs, and learning how to block with proper footwork and upper body moves are for OLs. If craps can learn the essentials of running perfect routes, his catches and yrds go up...way up. He apparently has the talent, but it seemingly comes and goes. Is there a mental part of this? I don't know but it is peculiar that he can make circus catches, snag balls out of the air way over his head, and then come up dry near end of season and then in the postseason. His most obvious deficiency is not getting open. He should either read the Jerry Rice book on "how to" or get some actual hands on from Jerry. I have wondered how it was that he never asked for help in the area that keeps him from getting open...fakes and crisp routes, sometimes comebackers if Qb in trouble.

who knows, maybe Coach H is going to hire a guy who CAN teach those things to not just craps but other WRs as well. The one thing on the field i hate to see is a WR just running a deep route, hoping he can run faster than the DB or CB. That doesn't work. As anxious as i am to see who we FA and draft at WR, I am equally interested in our WR coach. Also, i will be amazed if Coach H doesn't oversee this aspect of WRs, at least initially. He knows how to coach perfect, crisp routes with fakes.

Lastly, as we both have noted, some of this is on Roman for not calling quick slants and outs. Instead of calling those plays routinely, he calls them infrequently. His one bugaboo has been NOT calling slants and outs when the D is standing there and just overtly giving them to us...and Roman responds with a deep fly route or a 24 dive. That aspect of his playcalling HAS to improve this yr.

I am going with FA receiver, Coby Fleener, and a WR in round 2-4.

Originally posted by pasodoc9er:
dtg, one of the things noticeably missing is the simple art of learning how to fake, and then actually using it. One thing craps did not do this yr was fake, juke, make crisp cuts. All those things are tiny but in the big picture, they have to do with getting open or not. I think it interesting that Coach let only 1 asst walk and he was....our WRs coach. Things like fakes, crisp routes are to a WR, as learning how to pick up blitzes is to OLs, learning how to read blitzes is to Qbs, and learning how to block with proper footwork and upper body moves are for OLs. If craps can learn the essentials of running perfect routes, his catches and yrds go up...way up. He apparently has the talent, but it seemingly comes and goes. Is there a mental part of this? I don't know but it is peculiar that he can make circus catches, snag balls out of the air way over his head, and then come up dry near end of season and then in the postseason. His most obvious deficiency is not getting open. He should either read the Jerry Rice book on "how to" or get some actual hands on from Jerry. I have wondered how it was that he never asked for help in the area that keeps him from getting open...fakes and crisp routes, sometimes comebackers if Qb in trouble.

who knows, maybe Coach H is going to hire a guy who CAN teach those things to not just craps but other WRs as well. The one thing on the field i hate to see is a WR just running a deep route, hoping he can run faster than the DB or CB. That doesn't work. As anxious as i am to see who we FA and draft at WR, I am equally interested in our WR coach. Also, i will be amazed if Coach H doesn't oversee this aspect of WRs, at least initially. He knows how to coach perfect, crisp routes with fakes.

Lastly, as we both have noted, some of this is on Roman for not calling quick slants and outs. Instead of calling those plays routinely, he calls them infrequently. His one bugaboo has been NOT calling slants and outs when the D is standing there and just overtly giving them to us...and Roman responds with a deep fly route or a 24 dive. That aspect of his playcalling HAS to improve this yr.

Great post and I agree with all of it. Crabtree has to work on his route running, and the detailed nuances are critical. It's not just breaking on the right foot and being crisp, it's knowing when and how to change his footwork just enough to give him an edge. The problem is that requires him to know what EVERYONE on the field is doing. That takes a lot of time. Once the offense is working together, once they all know what the other is doing, it will be much easier to make adjustments during the play. What we basically saw all season was a series of practice sessions. It was simply unprecedented for a team with a first year coach and brand new system to have that much success. I am very excited to see what Crabtree and every other skill position player is capable of next year and the years that follow.

One thing is for sure, Crabtree is a BEAST when the ball is at it's high point. He is excellent at plucking the ball and being able to time his jump perfectly. Those are not coachable skills. Once he's able to blend that talent with knowledge of the system and chemistry with Alex (or whoever the QB is), he will be a force.