O line will not give Smith time

Originally posted by English:

Originally posted by SJniner7:
I just don't want to hear excuses if he stinks it up. This is his year and his team now. If he sucks, then we don't need to start blaming on everyone but him...

Let me see now. Pashos out, guards playing like sh1te, camp and preseason spent as 2nd string, yeah no reason to blame anyone but himself.

He will probably get killed this week. But I think he will pull it together during the season, gradually.

It's a team sport, I understand that, but for everyone who has been drinking the koolaid since 05', and has always spouted off every excuse known to man for this guy not to succeed, he really has no reason now... not to succeed that is... I would not be suprised to see such a double standard, for all those who blamed Hill's failures solely on Hill, yet blame AS's failures (hopefully not!!!) on everyone else...

I will admit, I had a sip of the koolaid, but I am not fully convinced he has completely turned it around and become the QB we all want him to be... in my book, he is 0-0 right now, since he seems like a new QB...

Originally posted by SJniner7:

Originally posted by English:

Originally posted by SJniner7:
I just don't want to hear excuses if he stinks it up. This is his year and his team now. If he sucks, then we don't need to start blaming on everyone but him...

Let me see now. Pashos out, guards playing like sh1te, camp and preseason spent as 2nd string, yeah no reason to blame anyone but himself.

He will probably get killed this week. But I think he will pull it together during the season, gradually.

It's a team sport, I understand that, but for everyone who has been drinking the koolaid since 05', and has always spouted off every excuse known to man for this guy not to succeed, he really has no reason now... not to succeed that is... I would not be suprised to see such a double standard, for all those who blamed Hill's failures solely on Hill, yet blame AS's failures (hopefully not!!!) on everyone else...

I will admit, I had a sip of the koolaid, but I am not fully convinced he has completely turned it around and become the QB we all want him to be... in my book, he is 0-0 right now, since he seems like a new QB...

The double standards started when Hill began struggling and people started using what were stupidly called "Alexcuses" by some of the more ignorant posters. When the oline sucked, the receivers dropped balls...etc, it was the QB's fault, then when Hill couldn't get it done it was everything except the FACT that Hill couldn't get it done. I guess that argument was rendered moot last Sunday.

Originally posted by Bobbi9698:

Originally posted by Luca:
I think that our O line will come around.

Based on what????

Originally posted by SanDiego49er:

Originally posted by Super5:

Originally posted by drama:
obvisouly our o line is not that good i honestly think staley is overrated alex can be a good qb in this leage but he will need time and thats something our line hasnt done since young was with us. What we need to do is open up our check books and get some solid players so that alex can get the ball downfield. 2 first rounders next year, with our first pick in 2010 darft we will get a legit o lineman

Why do YOU think Staley is overrated?

Staley isn't overrated. LOL. He's the best linemen we have by far. He's just on such a crap line the overall line looks bad, which in turn makes him look bad sometimes. But he holds his own against the best rushers in the league. I'm worried about the other 4.

yeah he is the best lineman we have but he gets pushed around hes not a premiere left tackle at best hes a good rt tackle. Watch him against freeny and mathis this weekend. Smith is gonna be running for his life and its gonna be same ol song

Originally posted by drama:
obvisouly our o line is not that good i honestly think staley is overrated alex can be a good qb in this leage but he will need time and thats something our line hasnt done since young was with us. What we need to do is open up our check books and get some solid players so that alex can get the ball downfield. 2 first rounders next year, with our first pick in 2010 darft we will get a legit o lineman

"our check books". That's funny.

LB

Originally posted by Giant9er:

Originally posted by Bobbi9698:

Originally posted by Luca:
I think that our O line will come around.

Based on what????

Someone reads drudge.

LB

I remember reading that Smith had even less time to throw than Hill and he still made plays.

Hopefully, he can continue that trend!

Originally posted by English:

Originally posted by hondakillerzx:
i think smiths ability to stretch the feild and actually use the young speedy WR's we have will hide some of the lines inadequacies. the line looked like s**t in the first half against houston and in the second they looked a lot better because of smiths pocket presence, mobility and quick reads. we definitely need help on the line but they will look a lot better without 8 or 9 men in the box like teams did when Hill was back there. in the draft we must address the o-line for once and for all. not in the 1st rounds though with all the play-making talent coming out, good linemen will get pushed further back. i hope we get the best OLB available if Eric Berry isnt still on the board, then a guy like CJ Spiller or Jahvid Best with the second 1st rounder to give us a great return man, RB, WR, all purpose playmaker. round two go DT and 3rd and beyond go O-line and whatever other need they see fit to address

I would prefer to address the problem. Taking a kick returner in the first round is not addressing the problem. Taking an OT in the first round (2nd pick) and a guard in the second, with other later picks on the O line as well is addressing the problem.

this draft is full of legit O-lineman, in order to take advantage of a deep draft the harder to find positions first and get the quality guys later in the plentiful position. Heitman was a 7th rounder and he's played better than every lineman we've had that was drafted above him. many teams will be going for the firepower guys this year, i think you will see less tackles and gaurds chosen in the 1st and 2nd rounds this year than usual. i hope they sign a GOOD FA OT, a starting O-Line with 3 very young, very raw players is not a good idea. sign a Tackle, no marvel smith, jonas jennings, barry sims garbage, a legit lineman to start. look at guys like harvin, hester, chris johnson, sproles... these guys break games open in one play. just last week, battles muffed fair catch was the mistake that killed us, we gave them the ball on the 10 i believe and they scored shortly after. and Frank Gore is great but he is hurt every year and needs a change of pace back who can probably replace him if he wears out. Coffee is good, and he will get better but a guy like Spiller or Best can be put anywhere on the field and make defenses have to account for them as RB's, WR's, PR, KR. if they solidify the RT position in FA and we get a guy like this, teams will be s**tting bricks trying to cover Crabtree, VD, Morgan, Gore and Spiller/Best (or anyone like them) at any given time. thats a lot of speed.

Originally posted by ninertico:
I remember reading that Smith had even less time to throw than Hill and he still made plays.

Hopefully, he can continue that trend!

that wouldn't surprise me. Smith was being decisive with his passes. he was getting the ball out to the receivers pretty fast, on target and in stride most of the time.

Originally posted by hondakillerzx:

Originally posted by English:

Originally posted by hondakillerzx:
i think smiths ability to stretch the feild and actually use the young speedy WR's we have will hide some of the lines inadequacies. the line looked like s**t in the first half against houston and in the second they looked a lot better because of smiths pocket presence, mobility and quick reads. we definitely need help on the line but they will look a lot better without 8 or 9 men in the box like teams did when Hill was back there. in the draft we must address the o-line for once and for all. not in the 1st rounds though with all the play-making talent coming out, good linemen will get pushed further back. i hope we get the best OLB available if Eric Berry isnt still on the board, then a guy like CJ Spiller or Jahvid Best with the second 1st rounder to give us a great return man, RB, WR, all purpose playmaker. round two go DT and 3rd and beyond go O-line and whatever other need they see fit to address

I would prefer to address the problem. Taking a kick returner in the first round is not addressing the problem. Taking an OT in the first round (2nd pick) and a guard in the second, with other later picks on the O line as well is addressing the problem.

this draft is full of legit O-lineman, in order to take advantage of a deep draft the harder to find positions first and get the quality guys later in the plentiful position. Heitman was a 7th rounder and he's played better than every lineman we've had that was drafted above him. many teams will be going for the firepower guys this year, i think you will see less tackles and gaurds chosen in the 1st and 2nd rounds this year than usual. i hope they sign a GOOD FA OT, a starting O-Line with 3 very young, very raw players is not a good idea. sign a Tackle, no marvel smith, jonas jennings, barry sims garbage, a legit lineman to start. look at guys like harvin, hester, chris johnson, sproles... these guys break games open in one play. just last week, battles muffed fair catch was the mistake that killed us, we gave them the ball on the 10 i believe and they scored shortly after. and Frank Gore is great but he is hurt every year and needs a change of pace back who can probably replace him if he wears out. Coffee is good, and he will get better but a guy like Spiller or Best can be put anywhere on the field and make defenses have to account for them as RB's, WR's, PR, KR. if they solidify the RT position in FA and we get a guy like this, teams will be s**tting bricks trying to cover Crabtree, VD, Morgan, Gore and Spiller/Best (or anyone like them) at any given time. thats a lot of speed.

Only problem with that is top flight OT's rarely become free agents these days. they just get franchised. Not to mention if there isn't a new CBa a lot of guys are gonna be off the free agency list. hopefully it plays out like you layed it out.

Originally posted by Dajanksta:

Originally posted by BrianGO:
If your team doesn't have a good quarterback, fans do two things:

1) Blame the o-line for poor quarterbacking.
2) Praise the o-line of teams with good quarterbacks.

Does Eli Manning's o-line deserve praise for almost getting him sacked in the Super Bowl when he broke free of Richard Seymour?

Does Ben Roethlisberger's o-line deserve praise for all the tackles he had to break in the Super Bowl, where he single handedly won the game for them despite guys in his face?

This teams whole concept on offense has been screwed up since Nolan arrived, the quarterbacking has been poor, but the o-line is the one that gets the blame for it.

Smith has plenty of weapons, and he will have plenty of time and opportunities to make a play, just like he has had in the past.

Dude I just know our O-line is garbage. Our Rt situation is bad. baas isn't playing at a high level. Rachal is fckn declining the more the plays. I swear I see it like two or three times a game he gets out of his stance and the dt or whatever is already passed him and he is falling his ass over.
grrrrr

The only thing that changed, in the second half of the Texans game, is that we passed the ball most of the time.

Perhaps there were more receivers, but that is less relevant.

We PASSED the ball more, the line blocked fine, Smith had time and got into a rhythm.

Some coaches don't seem to understand what quarterback rhythm is, or how important it is.

Even when our running game was successful a few years back, we didn't have an amazing offense.

Passing is what offense is all about. Running is complimentary.

Originally posted by lamontb:

Originally posted by hondakillerzx:

Originally posted by English:

Originally posted by hondakillerzx:
i think smiths ability to stretch the feild and actually use the young speedy WR's we have will hide some of the lines inadequacies. the line looked like s**t in the first half against houston and in the second they looked a lot better because of smiths pocket presence, mobility and quick reads. we definitely need help on the line but they will look a lot better without 8 or 9 men in the box like teams did when Hill was back there. in the draft we must address the o-line for once and for all. not in the 1st rounds though with all the play-making talent coming out, good linemen will get pushed further back. i hope we get the best OLB available if Eric Berry isnt still on the board, then a guy like CJ Spiller or Jahvid Best with the second 1st rounder to give us a great return man, RB, WR, all purpose playmaker. round two go DT and 3rd and beyond go O-line and whatever other need they see fit to address

I would prefer to address the problem. Taking a kick returner in the first round is not addressing the problem. Taking an OT in the first round (2nd pick) and a guard in the second, with other later picks on the O line as well is addressing the problem.

this draft is full of legit O-lineman, in order to take advantage of a deep draft the harder to find positions first and get the quality guys later in the plentiful position. Heitman was a 7th rounder and he's played better than every lineman we've had that was drafted above him. many teams will be going for the firepower guys this year, i think you will see less tackles and gaurds chosen in the 1st and 2nd rounds this year than usual. i hope they sign a GOOD FA OT, a starting O-Line with 3 very young, very raw players is not a good idea. sign a Tackle, no marvel smith, jonas jennings, barry sims garbage, a legit lineman to start. look at guys like harvin, hester, chris johnson, sproles... these guys break games open in one play. just last week, battles muffed fair catch was the mistake that killed us, we gave them the ball on the 10 i believe and they scored shortly after. and Frank Gore is great but he is hurt every year and needs a change of pace back who can probably replace him if he wears out. Coffee is good, and he will get better but a guy like Spiller or Best can be put anywhere on the field and make defenses have to account for them as RB's, WR's, PR, KR. if they solidify the RT position in FA and we get a guy like this, teams will be s**tting bricks trying to cover Crabtree, VD, Morgan, Gore and Spiller/Best (or anyone like them) at any given time. thats a lot of speed.

Only problem with that is top flight OT's rarely become free agents these days. they just get franchised. Not to mention if there isn't a new CBa a lot of guys are gonna be off the free agency list. hopefully it plays out like you layed it out.

there are good OL available every year. we shouldnt even be in this mess, they let smiley go for no reason, he was a guard but he was one of the best. orlando pace became a free agent and he still looks good, there are always guys out there. i just think with our set of playmakers being as young as they are, we can round out the skill positions so our nucleus is young and a few simple tweaks to the oline should have us running like a top 10 offense or higher. ofcourse this is speculation but i think it can very easily happen

I posted this in another thread:

Quote:
A good QB can help overcome an Olines deficiencies.

First, it is a QB's responsibility to identify the blitz and either audible out of the play, hit the hot read, or get the ball out quickly. Also, a mobile QB can take off and run if there is pressure and nobody is open.

Second, an effective passing game will help the running game because defenses will have to scheme against the pass. Teams can't bring up a 8th man in the box or they open themselves up to a big play. The offense can also spread the defense out wide which opens up running lanes in the middle of the field.

Third, offense is all about rhythm and timing. As the offense gets into a rhythm, players gain confidence. Long drives also wear opposing defenses out making the it easier on offense. Ultimately, an offense can't get into a rhythm if they keep having 3-and-outs.

Fourth, balanced offenses keep defenses guessing. When players don't know if the play is a run or pass, they tend to play with a little hesitation. This in turn gives the offense a slight advantage.

Our OLine is in a funk right now. The players are better than they are currently playing. In my opinion the fundamental issue is a lack of chemistry. I think our Oline still can build chemistry this season. Hopefully, a change at QB will help them get it together.

Originally posted by hondakillerzx:

Originally posted by English:

Originally posted by hondakillerzx:
i think smiths ability to stretch the feild and actually use the young speedy WR's we have will hide some of the lines inadequacies. the line looked like s**t in the first half against houston and in the second they looked a lot better because of smiths pocket presence, mobility and quick reads. we definitely need help on the line but they will look a lot better without 8 or 9 men in the box like teams did when Hill was back there. in the draft we must address the o-line for once and for all. not in the 1st rounds though with all the play-making talent coming out, good linemen will get pushed further back. i hope we get the best OLB available if Eric Berry isnt still on the board, then a guy like CJ Spiller or Jahvid Best with the second 1st rounder to give us a great return man, RB, WR, all purpose playmaker. round two go DT and 3rd and beyond go O-line and whatever other need they see fit to address

I would prefer to address the problem. Taking a kick returner in the first round is not addressing the problem. Taking an OT in the first round (2nd pick) and a guard in the second, with other later picks on the O line as well is addressing the problem.

this draft is full of legit O-lineman, in order to take advantage of a deep draft the harder to find positions first and get the quality guys later in the plentiful position. Heitman was a 7th rounder and he's played better than every lineman we've had that was drafted above him. many teams will be going for the firepower guys this year, i think you will see less tackles and gaurds chosen in the 1st and 2nd rounds this year than usual. i hope they sign a GOOD FA OT, a starting O-Line with 3 very young, very raw players is not a good idea. sign a Tackle, no marvel smith, jonas jennings, barry sims garbage, a legit lineman to start. look at guys like harvin, hester, chris johnson, sproles... these guys break games open in one play. just last week, battles muffed fair catch was the mistake that killed us, we gave them the ball on the 10 i believe and they scored shortly after. and Frank Gore is great but he is hurt every year and needs a change of pace back who can probably replace him if he wears out. Coffee is good, and he will get better but a guy like Spiller or Best can be put anywhere on the field and make defenses have to account for them as RB's, WR's, PR, KR. if they solidify the RT position in FA and we get a guy like this, teams will be s**tting bricks trying to cover Crabtree, VD, Morgan, Gore and Spiller/Best (or anyone like them) at any given time. thats a lot of speed.

No draft is full of legit O linemen. And whilst I acknowledge Heitmann as a legitimate late round star, how many O linemen are taken late who DONT make it?

I have had enough compromise and make-do on the O line. You may think starters will be common in the next draft, I just don't see it. The only position which remotely relates in need terms is pass rush.

Lets get the line sorted

Originally posted by English:

Originally posted by hondakillerzx:

Originally posted by English:

Originally posted by hondakillerzx:
i think smiths ability to stretch the feild and actually use the young speedy WR's we have will hide some of the lines inadequacies. the line looked like s**t in the first half against houston and in the second they looked a lot better because of smiths pocket presence, mobility and quick reads. we definitely need help on the line but they will look a lot better without 8 or 9 men in the box like teams did when Hill was back there. in the draft we must address the o-line for once and for all. not in the 1st rounds though with all the play-making talent coming out, good linemen will get pushed further back. i hope we get the best OLB available if Eric Berry isnt still on the board, then a guy like CJ Spiller or Jahvid Best with the second 1st rounder to give us a great return man, RB, WR, all purpose playmaker. round two go DT and 3rd and beyond go O-line and whatever other need they see fit to address

I would prefer to address the problem. Taking a kick returner in the first round is not addressing the problem. Taking an OT in the first round (2nd pick) and a guard in the second, with other later picks on the O line as well is addressing the problem.

this draft is full of legit O-lineman, in order to take advantage of a deep draft the harder to find positions first and get the quality guys later in the plentiful position. Heitman was a 7th rounder and he's played better than every lineman we've had that was drafted above him. many teams will be going for the firepower guys this year, i think you will see less tackles and gaurds chosen in the 1st and 2nd rounds this year than usual. i hope they sign a GOOD FA OT, a starting O-Line with 3 very young, very raw players is not a good idea. sign a Tackle, no marvel smith, jonas jennings, barry sims garbage, a legit lineman to start. look at guys like harvin, hester, chris johnson, sproles... these guys break games open in one play. just last week, battles muffed fair catch was the mistake that killed us, we gave them the ball on the 10 i believe and they scored shortly after. and Frank Gore is great but he is hurt every year and needs a change of pace back who can probably replace him if he wears out. Coffee is good, and he will get better but a guy like Spiller or Best can be put anywhere on the field and make defenses have to account for them as RB's, WR's, PR, KR. if they solidify the RT position in FA and we get a guy like this, teams will be s**tting bricks trying to cover Crabtree, VD, Morgan, Gore and Spiller/Best (or anyone like them) at any given time. thats a lot of speed.

No draft is full of legit O linemen. And whilst I acknowledge Heitmann as a legitimate late round star, how many O linemen are taken late who DONT make it?

I have had enough compromise and make-do on the O line. You may think starters will be common in the next draft, I just don't see it. The only position which remotely relates in need terms is pass rush.

Lets get the line sorted

how many early draft pick o-linemen have failed? kwame, gallery, baas has been a disapointment, chilo is still young and i think he will improve. good players are everywhere, the hard part is picking them. i do know this, someone posted up before the draft all the starting safeties in the league, the majority were 1st and 2nd round picks and a few 3rd rounders, after that nothing, no one of note anyway. i hope they go FA for the RT, we cant afford to waste our talent waiting for someone who may never develop. our offense has been hindered for a few years because of the weak o-line