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Originally posted by NYniner85:
Originally posted by elguapo:
No. The extensions they gave to Goff and Gurley which put them in such a bad position. Horrible contracts just like AA

Regarding AA & the structure of his contract, its really isn't bad…compared to Gurley/Goff.

$6M last yr, $12M this yr…really it's one yr of high end pay in 2022, then he can be moved off if they want. Post June-1st helps even more. He's also got a 6yr that can strictly be used for lowering cap charges. Dude does a lot of dirty work and should be thrown inside more on passing downs.

I fault them staff for not really upgrading the Edge spot.

Agree on that.

Is Ingram still available?
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Originally posted by LasVegasWally:
Originally posted by NYniner85:
Originally posted by elguapo:
No. The extensions they gave to Goff and Gurley which put them in such a bad position. Horrible contracts just like AA

Regarding AA & the structure of his contract, its really isn't bad…compared to Gurley/Goff.

$6M last yr, $12M this yr…really it's one yr of high end pay in 2022, then he can be moved off if they want. Post June-1st helps even more. He's also got a 6yr that can strictly be used for lowering cap charges. Dude does a lot of dirty work and should be thrown inside more on passing downs.

I fault them staff for not really upgrading the Edge spot.

Agree on that.

Is Ingram still available?

Ingram and Houston are. However it's clear that Samson is their guy on the edge so that's that. Same way it's clear that Moesley is the guy outside
Originally posted by elguapo:
Ingram and Houston are. However it's clear that Samson is their guy on the edge so that's that. Same way it's clear that Moesley is the guy outside

I don't think it's clear with Samson, he's not a true DE and has little film/snaps to make anyone really feel safe about him as a starter.

Moesley has been a starter here for a while. He's not awful, mid level starter that can play outside/inside. Defense is built around the DL and IMO they need a legit guy across from Bosa that can get 400+ snaps a year because we ain't seeing that from Ford. Ingram would be perfect for that role, he shouldn't be getting 800+ snaps a year at this point anyway. We need a stud rotation at DE and overall what we have is meh IMO.
Great honest and objective breakdown of TH, it's long but gives you an idea of what he is imo.

Originally posted by NYniner85:
Originally posted by elguapo:
Ingram and Houston are. However it's clear that Samson is their guy on the edge so that's that. Same way it's clear that Moesley is the guy outside

I don't think it's clear with Samson, he's not a true DE and has little film/snaps to make anyone really feel safe about him as a starter.

Moesley has been a starter here for a while. He's not awful, mid level starter that can play outside/inside. Defense is built around the DL and IMO they need a legit guy across from Bosa that can get 400+ snaps a year because we ain't seeing that from Ford. Ingram would be perfect for that role, he shouldn't be getting 800+ snaps a year at this point anyway. We need a stud rotation at DE and overall what we have is meh IMO.

Disagree. The contract says so. Unless you want to ignore that and the fact that we haven't signed anyone else, even bargains like Kerrigan. AA and Samson are going to be on the other side of Bosa.

As for Moesley, he's an average starter that gets absolutely roasted far too many times. Way more than Sherman has and we aren't signing another cb as of yet.

I wish we signed Ingram to Samson's contract bc I have a feeling he would of signed for what we offered Samson. This could come back to hurt us. Verrett is among the most injured players in the NFL and he missed 3 games last year. Imagine Moesley as our #1 cb? We are dead if that's the case

As far as Hufanga goes there are a lot of honest breakdowns that show him anywhere from a slow player that has potential to a playmaker that might start next year
[ Edited by elguapo on Jul 9, 2021 at 6:27 PM ]
Originally posted by elguapo:
Disagree. The contract says so. Unless you want to ignore that and the fact that we haven't signed anyone else, even bargains like Kerrigan. AA and Samson are going to be on the other side of Bosa.

As for Moesley, he's an average starter that gets absolutely roasted far too many times. Way more than Sherman has and we aren't signing another cb as of yet.

I wish we signed Ingram to Samson's contract bc I have a feeling he would of signed for what we offered Samson. This could come back to hurt us. Verrett is among the most injured players in the NFL and he missed 3 games last year. Imagine Moesley as our #1 cb? We are dead if that's the case

As far as Hufanga goes there are a lot of honest breakdowns that show him anywhere from a slow player that has potential to a playmaker that might start next year

The contract? He basically got a 1 yr $5M deal. I wouldn't call that commitment.

Kerrigan said he wanted to play in the NFCE…not every player wants to play in SF.

Mosley is fine, not a top end CB, but again it's about the DL. you get to the QB consistently you don't need crazy lockdown DBs…. It's hard to have shutdown CBs the way the NFL has spread out the field. The game is different now. Crocker talked about this today on locked on 49ers. He himself a DB said he would take a top end edge rusher over a top end DB.

as far as TH go watch that breakdown, it's with Cocky, and formed NFL safety, and a writer for USC….fair honest/objective breakdowns.
Not sure if this has been discussed, and to lazy to look. Is it possible he makes the 53 and takes a LB spot in a hybrid role? If Ryans is looking at using some of this then I think Hufanga is the type of player he would utilize. It would mean Hufanga could also be a safety backup without using a spot. That could be why Gerry was let go?
[ Edited by Bluesbro on Jul 9, 2021 at 9:07 PM ]
Originally posted by NYniner85:
Originally posted by elguapo:
Disagree. The contract says so. Unless you want to ignore that and the fact that we haven't signed anyone else, even bargains like Kerrigan. AA and Samson are going to be on the other side of Bosa.

As for Moesley, he's an average starter that gets absolutely roasted far too many times. Way more than Sherman has and we aren't signing another cb as of yet.

I wish we signed Ingram to Samson's contract bc I have a feeling he would of signed for what we offered Samson. This could come back to hurt us. Verrett is among the most injured players in the NFL and he missed 3 games last year. Imagine Moesley as our #1 cb? We are dead if that's the case

As far as Hufanga goes there are a lot of honest breakdowns that show him anywhere from a slow player that has potential to a playmaker that might start next year

The contract? He basically got a 1 yr $5M deal. I wouldn't call that commitment.

Kerrigan said he wanted to play in the NFCE…not every player wants to play in SF.

Mosley is fine, not a top end CB, but again it's about the DL. you get to the QB consistently you don't need crazy lockdown DBs…. It's hard to have shutdown CBs the way the NFL has spread out the field. The game is different now. Crocker talked about this today on locked on 49ers. He himself a DB said he would take a top end edge rusher over a top end DB.

as far as TH go watch that breakdown, it's with Cocky, and formed NFL safety, and a writer for USC….fair honest/objective breakdowns.

It is a commitment. For a backup/rotational player that is a big deal. Paying him like that? When we could've got a more proven pass rusher for that cash. You've even stated that yourself. Hyder was pretty awesome last year and is durable and got less. Don't you think?

If you think Moseley is fine that's your opinion, but getting benched for Witherspoon and even giving up some playing time to Donte "are you kidding me" Johnson says that's a very very questionable one. He was atrocious and downright embarrassing at times. My standard for cb play is definitely not that at all. He would be much better suited to be a backup not a starter. Also, would you feel comfortable with Moesley being our #1 cb if/when Verrett goes down? I'm sure you've watched how badly Moesley gets beat when he faces some good wrs. Like I said, utterly embarrassing

Also, who says we need shutdown cbs. I'm talking maybe 2 top 30-50 cbs would suffice. I wouldn't make excuses for Moesley by saying he is fine. Do you think Sherman is better than him currently? I'm sure Sherman wouldn't give up 14 catches for 150 yards not to mention all those other horrible games he had. Just food for thought.

I watched the breakdown of TH and it's a fair one. I hope he plays awesome on ST and next year as either a SS or the Harris LB role
[ Edited by elguapo on Jul 10, 2021 at 12:37 AM ]
Originally posted by elguapo:
It is a commitment. For a backup/rotational player that is a big deal. Paying him like that? When we could've got a more proven pass rusher for that cash. You've even stated that yourself. Hyder was pretty awesome last year and is durable and got less. Don't you think?

If you think Moseley is fine that's your opinion, but getting benched for Witherspoon and even giving up some playing time to Donte "are you kidding me" Johnson says that's a very very questionable one. He was atrocious and downright embarrassing at times. My standard for cb play is definitely not that at all. He would be much better suited to be a backup not a starter. Also, would you feel comfortable with Moesley being our #1 cb if/when Verrett goes down? I'm sure you've watched how badly Moesley gets beat when he faces some good wrs. Like I said, utterly embarrassing

Also, who says we need shutdown cbs. I'm talking maybe 2 top 30-50 cbs would suffice. I wouldn't make excuses for Moesley by saying he is fine. Do you think Sherman is better than him currently? I'm sure Sherman wouldn't give up 14 catches for 150 yards not to mention all those other horrible games he had. Just food for thought.

I watched the breakdown of TH and it's a fair one. I hope he plays awesome on ST and next year as either a SS or the Harris LB role

What you're saying about Mosley and money given to him should also apply to Samson and the money they gave him, no? It's the same thing lol.

I think Mosley is a top 50 CB in the NFL. You don't which is fine. The DL will make the backend better. I have no idea if Sherm is better than him at this pt, sherm can't stay on the field, so it doesn't really matter anyway. I'm sure Sherm wants more than 2 yrs $6M.
Originally posted by NYniner85:
Originally posted by elguapo:
It is a commitment. For a backup/rotational player that is a big deal. Paying him like that? When we could've got a more proven pass rusher for that cash. You've even stated that yourself. Hyder was pretty awesome last year and is durable and got less. Don't you think?

If you think Moseley is fine that's your opinion, but getting benched for Witherspoon and even giving up some playing time to Donte "are you kidding me" Johnson says that's a very very questionable one. He was atrocious and downright embarrassing at times. My standard for cb play is definitely not that at all. He would be much better suited to be a backup not a starter. Also, would you feel comfortable with Moesley being our #1 cb if/when Verrett goes down? I'm sure you've watched how badly Moesley gets beat when he faces some good wrs. Like I said, utterly embarrassing

Also, who says we need shutdown cbs. I'm talking maybe 2 top 30-50 cbs would suffice. I wouldn't make excuses for Moesley by saying he is fine. Do you think Sherman is better than him currently? I'm sure Sherman wouldn't give up 14 catches for 150 yards not to mention all those other horrible games he had. Just food for thought.

I watched the breakdown of TH and it's a fair one. I hope he plays awesome on ST and next year as either a SS or the Harris LB role

What you're saying about Mosley and money given to him should also apply to Samson and the money they gave him, no? It's the same thing lol.

I think Mosley is a top 50 CB in the NFL. You don't which is fine. The DL will make the backend better. I have no idea if Sherm is better than him at this pt, sherm can't stay on the field, so it doesn't really matter anyway. I'm sure Sherm wants more than 2 yrs $6M.

Lol I did say the same thing about Moseley and I think it's a mistake to depend on him and Samson. So you aren't worried that if Verrett goes down Moesley will be our number one? We are going to get destroyed and you even admit that our edge depth is thin and at the same time saying our DL will help out our corner seems contradictory at best.

We need a better line in order to make Moesley even look like a capable corner. But we all saw what happened last year. That doesn't scare you? Him getting benched for Witherspoon, even Dante Johnson got some playing time instead. When you say you think he is a top 50 corner are you disregarding last year's play? Maybe two years ago bc we had a ridiculously good pass rush but last year he played barely like a top 100 corner. That's like putting perfume on a pig.
[ Edited by elguapo on Jul 10, 2021 at 12:38 PM ]
Originally posted by elguapo:
Lol I did say the same thing about Moseley and I think it's a mistake to depend on him and Samson. So you aren't worried that if Verrett goes down Moesley will be our number one? We are going to get destroyed and you even admit that our edge depth is thin and at the same time saying our DL will help out our corner seems contradictory at best.

We need a better line in order to make Moesley even look like a capable corner. But we all saw what happened last year. That doesn't scare you? Him getting benched for Witherspoon, even Dante Johnson got some playing time instead. When you say you think he is a top 50 corner are you disregarding last year's play? Maybe two years ago bc we had a ridiculously good pass rush but last year he played barely like a top 100 corner. That's like putting perfume on a pig.

So if Bosa goes down you cool with Samson being our top pass rusher? At least they spent some draft capital on DB (3 picks).

#1 CB doesn't mean much at this point in the NFL. They will lineup whomever on to whomever now. s**t Is so spread out now that you're #1CB doesn't follow your top WR anymore, we don't do that here for the most part anyway.

as much as you hate Ward you can lineup him up across from just about any WR and we won't be s**t out of luck either. We have a decent secondary and have for a couple years.

does it not scare you that this WHOLE defense is base around our DL (our GM as said this) and the only viable EDGE we have, is coming off a massive ACL injury?

as far as him getting benched, I could care less what we did at the end of last season when we weren't making the playoffs…for all we know it was to see if Spoon was worth resigning…also how about this, you told me you have faith in this FO, they resigned Mosley, so you should have faith in him, no?
Originally posted by NYniner85:
Originally posted by elguapo:
Lol I did say the same thing about Moseley and I think it's a mistake to depend on him and Samson. So you aren't worried that if Verrett goes down Moesley will be our number one? We are going to get destroyed and you even admit that our edge depth is thin and at the same time saying our DL will help out our corner seems contradictory at best.

We need a better line in order to make Moesley even look like a capable corner. But we all saw what happened last year. That doesn't scare you? Him getting benched for Witherspoon, even Dante Johnson got some playing time instead. When you say you think he is a top 50 corner are you disregarding last year's play? Maybe two years ago bc we had a ridiculously good pass rush but last year he played barely like a top 100 corner. That's like putting perfume on a pig.

So if Bosa goes down you cool with Samson being our top pass rusher? At least they spent some draft capital on DB (3 picks).

#1 CB doesn't mean much at this point in the NFL. They will lineup whomever on to whomever now. s**t Is so spread out now that you're #1CB doesn't follow your top WR anymore, we don't do that here for the most part anyway.

as much as you hate Ward you can lineup him up across from just about any WR and we won't be s**t out of luck either. We have a decent secondary and have for a couple years.

does it not scare you that this WHOLE defense is base around our DL (our GM as said this) and the only viable EDGE we have, is coming off a massive ACL injury?

as far as him getting benched, I could care less what we did at the end of last season when we weren't making the playoffs…for all we know it was to see if Spoon was worth resigning…also how about this, you told me you have faith in this FO, they resigned Mosley, so you should have faith in him, no?

Huh? I think you may have read my post wrong. I am not cool with Samson being a guy that steps in if Bosa goes down the same way I was not cool with Moesley being our best cb if Verrett goes down. Not that hard to understand. My point is we need to upgrade at the corner spot and the edge spot. I think you may have misinterpreted that completely. Also it's pretty bad to say you don't care what happened to Mosley last year when he was a burn victim often and was playing horribly yet at the same time you think he's a good corner. That is far from the truth but that's your opinion. Like I said you still need good corners and you can't really cop out by claiming that Moesley lost playing time to Witherspoon to see if he was worth resigning. Was that the case with Donte Johnson too??? Nope

And I think you're taking things to extremes and speaking in hyperbole like you sometimes do. I am confident in the front office with MOST of their decisions not all. Just like I said I was not supportive of their decision to extend Armstead for that amount of money so that contradicts what you claimed I said. I guess you must've not considered that or forgot before you made that statement which was false.

Also you really got to stop putting words in my mouth bro. You do it to a lot of people on here and it's just getting old. I never said I hated Ward so don't say that. You always call people out when they say you hate Jimmy Garoppolo when you never said that so don't pull that with me. The double standards are real man! Not cool Also if you do think Ward is very good and how you were so inclined to tell people to listen to Crockers podcast, you must've missed the part where he said Harris stepped up and got turnovers when he got the opportunity unlike ward did. So what do you have to say there? I am saying in no way shape or form Harris is better but Crocker stated that at least Harris took better angles and was more instinctive than ward. For somebody who apologizes how ward can't get a turnover for the life of him obviously blaming things like the scheme or a system that is also incorrect. You point out that he is so good and dismiss the fact he misses these opportunities and making plays on the ball while others may not and all you say is show me the film. Well there's a lot of it out there.

It does scare me that we do not have another good edge, I really hope Ford can play a little bit and Armstead can rotate at the other end of Bosa with Samson. Hopefully Bosa comes back strong. It's a good thing our first couple of games are easy until we get to Green Bay so that might give him a couple extra weeks with less reps
[ Edited by elguapo on Jul 11, 2021 at 7:19 PM ]
Originally posted by elguapo:
Huh? I think you may have read my post wrong. I am not cool with Samson being a guy that steps in if Bosa goes down the same way I was not cool with Moesley being our best cb if Verrett goes down. Not that hard to understand. My point is we need to upgrade at the corner spot and the edge spot. I think you may have misinterpreted that completely. Also it's pretty bad to say you don't care what happened to Mosley last year when he was a burn victim often and was playing horribly yet at the same time you think he's a good corner. That is far from the truth but that's your opinion. Like I said you still need good corners and you can't really cop out by claiming that Moesley lost playing time to Witherspoon to see if he was worth resigning. Was that the case with Donte Johnson too??? Nope

And I think you're taking things to extremes and speaking in hyperbole like you sometimes do. I am confident in the front office with MOST of their decisions not all. Just like I said I was not supportive of their decision to extend Armstead for that amount of money so that contradicts what you claimed I said. I guess you must've not considered that or forgot before you made that statement which was false.

Also you really got to stop putting words in my mouth bro. You do it to a lot of people on here and it's just getting old. I never said I hated Ward so don't say that. You always call people out when they say you hate Jimmy Garoppolo when you never said that so don't pull that with me. The double standards are real man! Not cool Also if you do think Ward is very good and how you were so inclined to tell people to listen to Crockers podcast, you must've missed the part where he said Harris stepped up and got turnovers when he got the opportunity unlike ward did. So what do you have to say there? I am saying in no way shape or form Harris is better but Crocker stated that at least Harris took better angles and was more instinctive than ward. For somebody who apologizes how ward can't get a turnover for the life of him obviously blaming things like the scheme or a system that is also incorrect. You point out that he is so good and dismiss the fact he misses these opportunities and making plays on the ball while others may not and all you say is show me the film. Well there's a lot of it out there.

It does scare me that we do not have another good edge, I really hope Ford can play a little bit and Armstead can rotate at the other end of Bosa with Samson. Hopefully Bosa comes back strong. It's a good thing our first couple of games are easy until we get to Green Bay so that might give him a couple extra weeks with less reps

I don't really care what happened end of the season all that much when we we're done playing for anything....Spoon was in a contract yr and they wanted to see what he had at that point. Look I don't think he's some stud, I don't think he sucks either as long as the DL does it's job, then he's fine back there.

Also If they didn't have confidence in Mosely they wouldn't have signed him, same as Samson which is what I'm saying. You're talking about contracts and they signed damn near the same thing (GTD cash).

Dude you've talked s**t about Ward multiple times...how else am I suppose to interpret how you feel about him? Yes maybe I shouldn't have used the word hate, but you most certainly aren't a fan by the way you talk about replacing him. Yeah I don't hate Jimmy, I do think he's very avg same as you do with Ward... that's it you don't have to make it about me all the time

Harris doesn't play the same role as Ward, show me all the snaps of him lining up in man down on the LOS. His TO are fumbles not INTs...people are actually targeting him as well. I'm also a bigger Harris fan then most...also what better angles? How was he most instinctive, explain please? Ward doesn't miss tackles or give up yards...that's the definition of taking good angles and being instinctive, he wasn't out of place or blowing plays. He did his job and what has been asked of him...there's a reason why Kyle said if he could wear any 49er's jersey it would be Ward.

All I'm saying is if it comes to upgrading secondary or EDGE I'm going edge all day.
[ Edited by NYniner85 on Jul 12, 2021 at 7:23 AM ]
Originally posted by NYniner85:
I don't really care what happened end of the season all that much when we we're done playing for anything....Spoon was in a contract yr and they wanted to see what he had at that point. Look I don't think he's some stud, I don't think he sucks either as long as the DL does it's job, then he's fine back there.

Also If they didn't have confidence in Mosely they wouldn't have signed him, same as Samson which is what I'm saying. You're talking about contracts and they signed damn near the same thing (GTD cash).

Dude you've talked s**t about Ward multiple times...how else am I suppose to interpret how you feel about him? Yes maybe I shouldn't have used the word hate, but you most certainly aren't a fan by the way you talk about replacing him. Yeah I don't hate Jimmy, I do think he's very avg same as you do with Ward... that's it you don't have to make it about me all the time

Harris doesn't play the same role as Ward, show me all the snaps of him lining up in man down on the LOS. His TO are fumbles not INTs...people are actually targeting him as well. I'm also a bigger Harris fan then most...also what better angles? How was he most instinctive, explain please? Ward doesn't miss tackles or give up yards...that's the definition of taking good angles and being instinctive, he wasn't out of place or blowing plays. He did his job and what has been asked of him...there's a reason why Kyle said if he could wear any 49er's jersey it would be Ward.

All I'm saying is if it comes to upgrading secondary or EDGE I'm going edge all day.

I get where you're coming from I just wish we had a better fs same as qb or rg/lg. It's hard not to come at you specifically when you're the one putting false claims or words in my mouth. That's all I'm saying don't assume I hate the guy. I can be critical of his play/lack of plays just as you are towards Jimmy so you should understand the frustration of all people. Agreed? It's not a big deal, I just know it wouldn't be hard at all to replace those positions through the draft (a high pick) or a fa that may be less or even a few million more with a greater impact besides being a great tackler and solid coverage. I will choose edge over secondary as well but here's a troubling trend. Did you notice that the referees didn't call holding much last year when compared to past years. I believe at the beginning of the year weren't the referees told to not be as strict on the holding calls? So that kind of the lessens the impact of edge defenders and gives more importance to the secondary.

Besides we have not had a great corner besides Sherman/Verrett (hopefully if he stays somewhat healthy) since we won the last Super Bowl in 95. It would be nice having a playmaker that is also a solid defender/tackler. You can have both you know. A LOT of teams have way better corners and or safeties than we do. I'm actually tired of getting exposed against a great quarterback and or passing offense/wrs if our pass rush doesn't get there.
[ Edited by elguapo on Jul 12, 2021 at 3:44 PM ]
Isn't this thread supposed to be about Talanoa Hufanga? Can't wait to see this kid suit up. Whether at safety, OLB or on special teams, I think this kid could be a great addition to this team. I see a future team captain in this kid. What say you..........
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