MD was right

Originally posted by AmpLee:
While MD was certainly right about JJ Watt being a force, he was wrong on his assessment of Smith. But what I'm most excited about was how wrong he was about Kaep. This guy looks to have the tools to be a dominant force at the QB position for years to come. He's got elite size, speed, arm strength. Coupled with intelligence, accuracy, leadership, and humbleness, this guy could be the steal of the draft. I'm really surprised since RGIII and Cam Newton garnered the exact same superlatives, and that we were fortunate enough to land Kaep in the second round. What a home-run. Looks like Baalke knew what he was doing after all.

Originally posted by LieutKaffee:
You're grasping, dude. I know the whole Watt vs. Aldon thing is ingrained in the premise of this thread, but it's time to let go of the notion that Watt's success in the NFL diminishes Aldon's success. They are both superstars, plain and simple.

As for DPOY, I agree 100% with MD, and your rebuttals are weak. You say it shouldn't be based just on Watt's stats but rather on "other things" like "value to a team's defense overall." Well, the body of stats MD has pointed out show, definitively, that Watt has added the most value to a team's defense overall in the entire NFL. There's no doubt in my mind that he's asked to do more things than Smith and is a more dynamic all-around player (don't take this as a commentary on whom we should have drafted, simply an evaluation of their current seasons).

Here's how I see it. If Aldon is the only one to break 22.5, he will win DPOY over Watt because of the prestige that record carries. If Watt beats Aldon in sacks, Watt will win DPOY. If they both fall short of 22.5, Watt will win DPOY even if Aldon edges him for the sack title. The wild-card is what happens if Aldon beats Watt, but they both break the record (of course, this wouldn't be considered a "record" for Watt in this scenario, but imagine 23.0 for Watt and 23.5 for Aldon). Even though Aldon's name would go in the record books, I could see the voters using Watt's number as justification to give him DPOY. It all comes down to sacks at this point.

Whatever happens, keep in mind Aldon is about to follow this year with another dozen or so opportunities to break the sack record and collect DPOY awards.

Originally posted by MadDog49er:
Nobody could have expected that a 3-4 DE could lead the NFL in sacks, and make a run at 22.5, nor be number one in QB hits by a wide margin (Watt at 39, Wake second at 28, Smith tied for third at 26), tackles for a DL by a wide margin (Watt at 74, J. Smith second with 66) number one in the NFL in tackles for loss by a wide margin (Watt at 33, Miller second at 25, Lavonte David third at 18, A. Smith tied for fourth at 17), lead the NFL in passes defensed by a non-secondary player (Watt has 15, the next DL has 7; the top LB has 9), lead the NFL by a wide margin of negative plays with 81 (sacks, tackles for loss or no gain, deflections), nor blow everyone away defensively in what Advanced NFL Stats grades as their WPA, which determines the impact a player has in a game.

To me, this is not about being right or wrong anymore for the year 2012. This is about the stuff of legends. We are witnessing the greatest performance by a DL since Bruce Smith. For me, it is simply the joy of watching a player dominate the game.

Stats courtesy of Advanced NFL Stats

Originally posted by SofaKing:
Oh pleeeease....

Look, J.J. Watt is a phenomenal player. He looks like a shoe in for the HOF. But based on the personnel that we had going into that draft, picking Aldon was the right call. We have J. Smith and McDonald. Where would Watt fit? Should we have let McDonald go in FA instead? In that scenario we are left without an elite pass-rusher, something that prevented this defense from being a top unit for years.

Aldon is putting up some eye-popping numbers too you know. He has a shot at breaking Reggie White's record as the fastest defender to reach 20 sacks. Reggie-freakin'-White. I think we're doing just fine with Aldon.

Originally posted by LieutKaffee:
You're grasping, dude. I know the whole Watt vs. Aldon thing is ingrained in the premise of this thread, but it's time to let go of the notion that Watt's success in the NFL diminishes Aldon's success. They are both superstars, plain and simple.

As for DPOY, I agree 100% with MD, and your rebuttals are weak. You say it shouldn't be based just on Watt's stats but rather on "other things" like "value to a team's defense overall." Well, the body of stats MD has pointed out show, definitively, that Watt has added the most value to a team's defense overall in the entire NFL. There's no doubt in my mind that he's asked to do more things than Smith and is a more dynamic all-around player (don't take this as a commentary on whom we should have drafted, simply an evaluation of their current seasons).

Here's how I see it. If Aldon is the only one to break 22.5, he will win DPOY over Watt because of the prestige that record carries. If Watt beats Aldon in sacks, Watt will win DPOY. If they both fall short of 22.5, Watt will win DPOY even if Aldon edges him for the sack title. The wild-card is what happens if Aldon beats Watt, but they both break the record (of course, this wouldn't be considered a "record" for Watt in this scenario, but imagine 23.0 for Watt and 23.5 for Aldon). Even though Aldon's name would go in the record books, I could see the voters using Watt's number as justification to give him DPOY. It all comes down to sacks at this point.

Whatever happens, keep in mind Aldon is about to follow this year with another dozen or so opportunities to break the sack record and collect DPOY awards.

Originally posted by oldninerdude:

Originally posted by LieutKaffee:
You're grasping, dude. I know the whole Watt vs. Aldon thing is ingrained in the premise of this thread, but it's time to let go of the notion that Watt's success in the NFL diminishes Aldon's success. They are both superstars, plain and simple.

As for DPOY, I agree 100% with MD, and your rebuttals are weak. You say it shouldn't be based just on Watt's stats but rather on "other things" like "value to a team's defense overall." Well, the body of stats MD has pointed out show, definitively, that Watt has added the most value to a team's defense overall in the entire NFL. There's no doubt in my mind that he's asked to do more things than Smith and is a more dynamic all-around player (don't take this as a commentary on whom we should have drafted, simply an evaluation of their current seasons).

Here's how I see it. If Aldon is the only one to break 22.5, he will win DPOY over Watt because of the prestige that record carries. If Watt beats Aldon in sacks, Watt will win DPOY. If they both fall short of 22.5, Watt will win DPOY even if Aldon edges him for the sack title. The wild-card is what happens if Aldon beats Watt, but they both break the record (of course, this wouldn't be considered a "record" for Watt in this scenario, but imagine 23.0 for Watt and 23.5 for Aldon). Even though Aldon's name would go in the record books, I could see the voters using Watt's number as justification to give him DPOY. It all comes down to sacks at this point.

Whatever happens, keep in mind Aldon is about to follow this year with another dozen or so opportunities to break the sack record and collect DPOY awards.

Hmm. If I'm "grasping" then you must be reaching, cuz we're pretty much saying the same thing.

One of my questions is, who decides on the DPOY award? Is it coaches, players, fans, media? And is it based strictly on stats?

If its fans and/or media and based solely on stats, Watt should win it.

If its coachs and players, then they make take into account other, intangible factors, and others will likely be in consideration as well.

Thats all I'm saying.

Originally posted by 4evrfan:
I'd say Watt should win it no matter who's voting, unless of course, Aldon ends up with the sack title and breaks Strahan's record. I just think there's no more dominant defensive player right now that J J Watt.

Originally posted by oldninerdude:
I hear ya. Watt has put up some terrific individual stats, no doubt. It would probably take a record breaking sack record to beat him out of the award.

Originally posted by ChazBoner:
this is like fighting over who's hotter. Jessica Alba or Mila Kunis. I'm just happy we got one of them and not another Kentwan Balmer.

Originally posted by oldninerdude:
It appears pretty clear to me that Jessica Alba wins that one.

She's got way better . . . uh . . . stats.

Originally posted by AmpLee:
While MD was certainly right about JJ Watt being a force, he was wrong on his assessment of Smith. But what I'm most excited about was how wrong he was about Kaep. This guy looks to have the tools to be a dominant force at the QB position for years to come. He's got elite size, speed, arm strength. Coupled with intelligence, accuracy, leadership, and humbleness, this guy could be the steal of the draft. I'm really surprised since RGIII and Cam Newton garnered the exact same superlatives, and that we were fortunate enough to land Kaep in the second round. What a home-run. Looks like Baalke knew what he was doing after all.