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Move David Baas to center

I want the entire offensive line replaced other than staley

and staley can go too if he doesn't step it up next season
The zone has a rager for Heitmann
it's been true since he broke his leg
it wasn't a coincedence that every time he comes off the field because of injury our run game improves. It's not the guards, it's the center!

I've said it many times, and got into many arguments about this subject. Of course if we get better guards Heitmann will look better, but we would still suck running behind the center. It's funny how people bash on Baas' speed yet he always seems to get in front during his pulls on running plane
Originally posted by lamontb:
Heitmann is a good piece of the o line. He's not great but very solid. why move a very solid player and replace him with a very shaky player who hasn't played that position since college?

Solid?!!!

Refer back to the Rocky Bernard sa... *ahem* Air Bomb on Alex and then tell me the man is solid. Bernard came through COMPLETELY unblocked and he was Heitman's man. This is not the first time someone just blew right by him either.

Kwame does it the Zone is ready to castrate him. Heitman does it and he's considered solid because he understands the assignment schemes.

~Ceadder
What he needs is a bigger helmet so he can think.
Originally posted by dj43:
Somebody please show me how this team would improve if David (slewfoot) Baas was the center! Of all the starting linemen on the team right now, he is the least likely to be back next year. Come on people. Watch all three of those guys in the middle of the line and tell me who is the weak link. Who is it that is constantly having to help the guy beside them?

Don't just watch the ball. Watch the line play.









I need to leave this thread before I get some warning.

Okay ummm I pay attention to the Line play at all times. I live for the replays that show Frank going up the middle. Or the QB standing tall in the pocket or otherwise. It gives me a chance to see who is playing out of position.

This season with Heitman at Center he is CONSTANTLY having to be helped out and it doesn't matter which Guard is doing the assisting. Also guys just blow right by him. How can people even say that Heitman is not a problem?

He has his moments but so to did Kwame. I don't think that he needs to go, but he definitely should NOT be playing Center.

Baas was drafted to BE the Center. Nolan didn't get him off the bench in what, the first two years the Kid was with the team? Not sure but I don't think he even played a role on the ST Lines. That retards growth more than it helps it. Baas is no Larry Allen but he's not bad and it's annoying that we aren't trying to get him worked into the spot he was drafted for. He has the demeanor for it. Something I don't believe Heitman has ever had.

When Rocky Bernard(or anyone else for that matter) went right by him Heitman didn't even ATTEMPT to shove the man off is route. Didn't even look at him. How the hell can you be the Center and not see someone as big as a house run by you? I think most of us have worn a helmet at some point and while they don't give you great peripheral vision they don't blind you like a carriage horse either.

*PFAH* If I have to endure another episode like that I might have to save the team the hassle and just cap myself. It's pathetic.

~Ceadder
Originally posted by YuNGaCE:
What he needs is a bigger helmet so he can think.

Who Heitman or Baas? When you say he it's not specific enough. Sorry.


Originally posted by solidg2000:
The zone has a rager for Heitmann
it's been true since he broke his leg
it wasn't a coincedence that every time he comes off the field because of injury our run game improves. It's not the guards, it's the center!

I've said it many times, and got into many arguments about this subject. Of course if we get better guards Heitmann will look better, but we would still suck running behind the center. It's funny how people bash on Baas' speed yet he always seems to get in front during his pulls on running plane

Very true. There are always two Linemen downfield when Frank breaks or almost breaks one. Staley and Baas. And they are always in a scrum of sorts.

~Ceadder
[ Edited by Ceadderman on Jan 5, 2010 at 2:05 AM ]
Originally posted by E-49er:
Originally posted by 4evrfan:
Originally posted by MadMartz:
Originally posted by PatrickJira411:
http://bentley.umich.edu/athdept/football/fballam/aabaasd.htm

In his first season at the center position Baas was a consensus All-American a shared the Rimington Trophy as the nation's outstanding center. Baas started the season at left guard but moved to center at the outset of the conference slate and helped guide the Wolverines to a share of the Big Ten title. U-M's rushing offense gained 106 yards per game prior to Baas' position shift but finished the conference schedule third in the ground attack at 175 yards per contest. He was named the 2004 Big Ten Offensive Lineman of the Year and became the 12th player in U-M football history to gain All-Big Ten first team honors at least three times during his career

So what? Doesn't mean squat when you get to the NFL and you should know tht. And Heitmann happens to be a very highly regarded center amongst his fellow players from everything I've read. Like another post said, played at Pro Bowl level last year and while not quite as impressive this year, was probably the most consistent O-lineman we had. You want to try Baas at center, fine, btu don't drag Heitmann thru the mud when he doesn't deserve it. There are guys who are still unconvinced Aubrayo Franklin is the read deal too.

Exactly! What he did in college doesn't mean squat. Tony Madarich was a great Tackle in college but is one of the biggest busts in the NFL. Heittman makes all the calls for the o-line. thats a pretty important job. I would not trust that job to Baas as a starter just because he did well there in college. Fact is both guard positions need to be improved as well as RT. Maybe the resign Pashos to take care of RT and sign an free agent OL for one guard and draft another.

Wasn't Mandarich busted for steroids? I'm just sayin is all.

All I know is that I'm gonna start calling Heitman, "Hymen", cause all the fellas like to bust her cherry. And depending on the day you ask her she'll still tell you she's pure.

Well that's how I feel Heitman is playing for us. Depending on the fan he's All Pro. Which we know is not true but for some reason nobody throws the BS card down.

~Ceadder
I like the argument that he sets the line blocking assignments
yet how many times have we seen a 3 or 4 man rush where no one blocks a guy. That's a assignment error. Hence that is heitmanns error.
Then they go to the better guard argument, but clearly Larry allen was hall of fame guard and smiley was very good too. Heitmann was still clearly the weak link then and struggled to get a push up the middle then too

since his broken leg, heitmann has been at or below average
Originally posted by solidg2000:
I like the argument that he sets the line blocking assignments
yet how many times have we seen a 3 or 4 man rush where no one blocks a guy. That's a assignment error. Hence that is heitmanns error.

Then they go to the better guard argument, but clearly Larry allen was hall of fame guard and smiley was very good too. Heitmann was still clearly the weak link then and struggled to get a push up the middle then too

since his broken leg, heitmann has been at or below average

~Ceadder
Ok...first, Baas wasn't drafted to be our C...he played the position for half of his senior season at Mich due to OL injuries. The rest of his time in Ann Arbor he played LG.

If Heitmann's the problem, then why have the OC's raved about him? Martz said he was one of the best C's he's seen...definitely underrated. Methinks it's more the interior of our OL...neither Baas nor Rachal have been consistent in their pass blocking...Heitmann may not be the strongest blocker around, but when the two guys alongside him aren't either, then why single him out? It's a team game. Here's another thought...when's the last time you saw either Baas or Rachal lead a sweep...or a screen? They haven't, because they're not mobile enough...which is a primary reason Raye doesn't call them.
  • tmg808
  • Info N/A
The problem with that is that the Center is responsible for the calls and reads on the offensive line. I don't think Baas can handle those responsibilities. He may have been an OK college center but the NFL is a whole different beast.
Originally posted by tmg808:
The problem with that is that the Center is responsible for the calls and reads on the offensive line. I don't think Baas can handle those responsibilities. He may have been an OK college center but the NFL is a whole different beast.

"Baas was the only player in the country to be named finalist for two of the three awards presented to linemen."

You were saying?

It was said MANY times that he was drafted with Center in mind.

And sorry but as much as I respect Martz Offensive mind, He also though JTO was the best QB on our roster. How'd that work out again?

I like Heitman I just think that knowing the schemes is NOT even close enough to being a solid Center. So you help a guy that can be a solid Center catch up in the terminology and the schemes.

There is nothing wrong with sliding him to the Right and Rachal to Baas Left, picking up a solid FA player and drafting for the future. As much as these guys get injured it's only the smart thing to do.

I can show you instance for instance where Hymen is gettin busted all day long. No, I do not expect perfection but when a house runs past you something is rotten in denmark. Corva I respect what you're saying but there are too many instances when Heitman fails epically.

If he's still our Starting Center and the same things keep happening I'm going to get his Jersey from NFL shop.com and have Hymen stenciled on it. Then I'm going to send it to him to wear. Either Coach will get the message or EH will fix it.

~Ceadder
[ Edited by Ceadderman on Jan 5, 2010 at 7:22 AM ]
Originally posted by CorvaNinerFan:
Ok...first, Baas wasn't drafted to be our C...he played the position for half of his senior season at Mich due to OL injuries. The rest of his time in Ann Arbor he played LG.

If Heitmann's the problem, then why have the OC's raved about him? Martz said he was one of the best C's he's seen...definitely underrated. Methinks it's more the interior of our OL...neither Baas nor Rachal have been consistent in their pass blocking...Heitmann may not be the strongest blocker around, but when the two guys alongside him aren't either, then why single him out? It's a team game. Here's another thought...when's the last time you saw either Baas or Rachal lead a sweep...or a screen? They haven't, because they're not mobile enough...which is a primary reason Raye doesn't call them.

On running plays rachal and baas always kill their man and clear huge holes. While heitmann usually gets pushed back.

Heitmann was a great center, before he broke his leg
Any person who think that Heitmann has not played well the past two years doesn't understand the first thing about football. Sorry, but this is not even an area for debate. He was our best lineman now the past two years.

Next subject: Move McKillop into the starting lineup and replace Patrick Willis.

P.S. Replace our best lineman for David Baas? Scary.
[ Edited by MadDog49er on Jan 5, 2010 at 9:18 AM ]
The writing is on the wall people! Does anyone else wonder why Sing wanted to get Cody Wallace in the game and see what he could do at Center? Its not because we have an all pro center, thats for sure!