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Jimmy Raye and Alex Smith

Originally posted by D_Niner:
Originally posted by Digger25:
Originally posted by lamontb:
Originally posted by tohara3:
Nice post! This offense can't get a touchdown or a small lead & then go into a shell. They have to keep attacking if we are gonna make a run the rest if the year.

Not gonna happen aslong as Smith keeps turning the ball over. They simply can't trust him to win games, and werer hiding him last night in the second half.

smith turned the ball over once last night, and the bears still didn't get much from it. cutler turns it over 4 times and they let him sling that rock all over the field. of course, he did throw a fifth pick, but he was still slinging it. ron turner, kept calling pass plays-and not because they were down by three scores or more. you have to let smith and his offensive weapons win the game-just like turner let cutler TRY and win it.

let me ask you this, if cutler was our QB and he was turning it over like he has been but throwing for 300+ yards and a couple of TD's, would you still feel the same way?

also, we ran 9 times in a 10+ play drive. i don't think that was hiding smith as much as it was just burning the clock. as mooch said, it was the 4 minute drill.

Didn't that happen with JTO last year...

LOL! JTO had a combo of INT's and fumbles. but this is kinda my point. so many people on here are judging alex without giving it time (i know i know. we aren't patient and we want to win now), but if you really really really want to know if this kid has IT, you let him play and let him try to win.

JTO had his shot, and within one season, his ass was out. now, you gave hill the same opportunity and well...we know where he is. now, give smith til the end of the season and if he continues with the bad play, you have your answer, but at least let the kid try and win some games.

if i was a bear fan, i would have seen enough of cutler to think that that trade was pure suckage.
Originally posted by nvchamp9ers:
Originally posted by D_Niner:
Originally posted by nvchamp9ers:
I don't know if you pride yourself as someone who knows anything about football but after reading several post and leaving suggestions on reviewing certain things(which you clearly haven't don't, especially regarding our Protection) but in this post, it is both ignorant and stupid. You claim "Alex Smith went into a shell after the INT" please review the film and look at our run to pass ratio and tell me how Alex Smith and not our playcaller went into a shell. FYI, the first drive went well bc it wasn't called at the game it was scripted to show what the defense gives you in certain situation. That first drive they showed that the shotgun both runs and intermediate routes would be there yet did we call those plays? No, we loved the I and short passes on 3rd down. Going Run run pass(count how many drives we did that after the INT) is not a QB going into a shell, it is an OC playing not to lose, not trying to win. Not to mention, I once again reviewed how many times we gave Alex Smith the NFL standard of 5 seconds of protection to go through his progressions properly, so why don't you do the same before you say "he needs to get rid of the ball sooner" that is just a beyond stupid comment when your QB doesn't have anytime to go through any progressions. In fact look and see how many times we gave up pressure in under 2 seconds! Seriously, if you want to make analysis's don't make them off feelings and opinions, go back watch the game, get some stats(I.E run to pass ratio before the INT when the O looked solid, and after the INT when it looked putrid, also look at protection time) I will give you a clue it was worse than last week when we provided "acceptable protection" of 5 seconds 13% of the time. Go check it out and then make analysis bc right now your defense of Jimmy Raye is laughable and just based on feelings/opnions instead of what really happened. Get real.


Obviously, you do pride yourself as one who knows something about football; but you fall short of that goal here...

Who gets a "standard 5 seconds of protection"? This is just dumb...

As for the Play calls pre and post interception look at how well they fared to see whats up. Pre INT we were getting an average of 5.5 yards per pass attempt. Post interception we were getting 3 yards per attempt and Alex's completion % dropped as well. Hell, he only completed one pass that went over 5 yards after that pick (a 20 yard play to Crabs).

Did you count how many time's we tried to have Alex convert a 3rd down with his arm after the INT? 6. Six times he tried and 5 times he failed. Were not just talking 3rd and 10 or 3rd and 15, we're talking 3rd and 5. Hell, he even failed to make a 3rd and 3... By comparison, he was 60% on 3rd down conversions before the INT (3 out of 5)...

If I had a QB who's play dropped off (less yards per attempt, lower completion %, and could not convert 3rd downs) I'd change my play calling to more run as well...

Fact is that Alex didn't help us win at all this game.


1. If you don't know that every O-line coach expects his line to give the QB 5 seconds(that is not just a made up number, that is what teams shoot for, and is even less what our O-line coach expects to get in college,which would be 6)

2. Look at the pass plays called in the after the INT and in a 3rd/5 ot 3rd/7, the defense knows what is coming, they know what to stop, you didn't answer how many times we went run, run pass, or run, run run. A lack of creative playcalling helps no one, not Gore and not A. Smith, not Gore not the O-line. Im am not sayin by anymeans that A. Smith played good, bc he didn't, but I think he played..ok, and Raye was a much bigger problem, as a coach, I have a big problem with what he did and it nearly cost us the game.

Look, I'm not going to do your homework for you... If you want to count plays, be my guest; but, don't be lazy and expect others to do it for you.

Also, I don't care if you consider yourself a coach or not; but, since you do, are you saying you wouldn't change the game calls because your QB has lost his confidence in the middle of the game and is only taking the dump-off passes? Maybe this is why you don't coach in the pro's...

As for you "standard 5 seconds", you never answered the question. Who gets a standard 5 seconds? You made a statement and have been called on it. Make with the facts or admit you were talking out your ass...
Originally posted by Digger25:
Originally posted by D_Niner:
Originally posted by Digger25:
Originally posted by lamontb:
Originally posted by tohara3:
Nice post! This offense can't get a touchdown or a small lead & then go into a shell. They have to keep attacking if we are gonna make a run the rest if the year.

Not gonna happen aslong as Smith keeps turning the ball over. They simply can't trust him to win games, and werer hiding him last night in the second half.

smith turned the ball over once last night, and the bears still didn't get much from it. cutler turns it over 4 times and they let him sling that rock all over the field. of course, he did throw a fifth pick, but he was still slinging it. ron turner, kept calling pass plays-and not because they were down by three scores or more. you have to let smith and his offensive weapons win the game-just like turner let cutler TRY and win it.

let me ask you this, if cutler was our QB and he was turning it over like he has been but throwing for 300+ yards and a couple of TD's, would you still feel the same way?

also, we ran 9 times in a 10+ play drive. i don't think that was hiding smith as much as it was just burning the clock. as mooch said, it was the 4 minute drill.

Didn't that happen with JTO last year...

LOL! JTO had a combo of INT's and fumbles. but this is kinda my point. so many people on here are judging alex without giving it time (i know i know. we aren't patient and we want to win now), but if you really really really want to know if this kid has IT, you let him play and let him try to win.

JTO had his shot, and within one season, his ass was out. now, you gave hill the same opportunity and well...we know where he is. now, give smith til the end of the season and if he continues with the bad play, you have your answer, but at least let the kid try and win some games.

if i was a bear fan, i would have seen enough of cutler to think that that trade was pure suckage.

I agree we need to keep letting Smith play for a couple more games; but, I wouldn't go as far as saying the rest of the season.

These last 3 games he's played below average. Now I don't fault him too much against the Colts, but these last 2 were just sad. If he continues to play below average and we start losing again, I say we try Nate so we can evaluate where he's at and have a better idea of our draft needs.
Originally posted by D_Niner:
Originally posted by nvchamp9ers:
Originally posted by D_Niner:
Originally posted by nvchamp9ers:
I don't know if you pride yourself as someone who knows anything about football but after reading several post and leaving suggestions on reviewing certain things(which you clearly haven't don't, especially regarding our Protection) but in this post, it is both ignorant and stupid. You claim "Alex Smith went into a shell after the INT" please review the film and look at our run to pass ratio and tell me how Alex Smith and not our playcaller went into a shell. FYI, the first drive went well bc it wasn't called at the game it was scripted to show what the defense gives you in certain situation. That first drive they showed that the shotgun both runs and intermediate routes would be there yet did we call those plays? No, we loved the I and short passes on 3rd down. Going Run run pass(count how many drives we did that after the INT) is not a QB going into a shell, it is an OC playing not to lose, not trying to win. Not to mention, I once again reviewed how many times we gave Alex Smith the NFL standard of 5 seconds of protection to go through his progressions properly, so why don't you do the same before you say "he needs to get rid of the ball sooner" that is just a beyond stupid comment when your QB doesn't have anytime to go through any progressions. In fact look and see how many times we gave up pressure in under 2 seconds! Seriously, if you want to make analysis's don't make them off feelings and opinions, go back watch the game, get some stats(I.E run to pass ratio before the INT when the O looked solid, and after the INT when it looked putrid, also look at protection time) I will give you a clue it was worse than last week when we provided "acceptable protection" of 5 seconds 13% of the time. Go check it out and then make analysis bc right now your defense of Jimmy Raye is laughable and just based on feelings/opnions instead of what really happened. Get real.


Obviously, you do pride yourself as one who knows something about football; but you fall short of that goal here...

Who gets a "standard 5 seconds of protection"? This is just dumb...

As for the Play calls pre and post interception look at how well they fared to see whats up. Pre INT we were getting an average of 5.5 yards per pass attempt. Post interception we were getting 3 yards per attempt and Alex's completion % dropped as well. Hell, he only completed one pass that went over 5 yards after that pick (a 20 yard play to Crabs).

Did you count how many time's we tried to have Alex convert a 3rd down with his arm after the INT? 6. Six times he tried and 5 times he failed. Were not just talking 3rd and 10 or 3rd and 15, we're talking 3rd and 5. Hell, he even failed to make a 3rd and 3... By comparison, he was 60% on 3rd down conversions before the INT (3 out of 5)...

If I had a QB who's play dropped off (less yards per attempt, lower completion %, and could not convert 3rd downs) I'd change my play calling to more run as well...

Fact is that Alex didn't help us win at all this game.


1. If you don't know that every O-line coach expects his line to give the QB 5 seconds(that is not just a made up number, that is what teams shoot for, and is even less what our O-line coach expects to get in college,which would be 6)

2. Look at the pass plays called in the after the INT and in a 3rd/5 ot 3rd/7, the defense knows what is coming, they know what to stop, you didn't answer how many times we went run, run pass, or run, run run. A lack of creative playcalling helps no one, not Gore and not A. Smith, not Gore not the O-line. Im am not sayin by anymeans that A. Smith played good, bc he didn't, but I think he played..ok, and Raye was a much bigger problem, as a coach, I have a big problem with what he did and it nearly cost us the game.

Look, I'm not going to do your homework for you... If you want to count plays, be my guest; but, don't be lazy and expect others to do it for you.

Also, I don't care if you consider yourself a coach or not; but, since you do, are you saying you wouldn't change the game calls because your QB has lost his confidence in the middle of the game and is only taking the dump-off passes? Maybe this is why you don't coach in the pro's...

As for you "standard 5 seconds", you never answered the question. Who gets a standard 5 seconds? You made a statement and have been called on it. Make with the facts or admit you were talking out your ass...

Tom Brady, Aaron Rodgers (which is quite ironic bc he leads the leagues in sacks bc he holds onto the ball forever) Matt Ryan, Peyton Manning, Carson Palmer, Joe Flacco, Kyle Orton(except last week, where he was constantly under pressure). Most of the QB's and several others, get the standard 5 seconds on most throws, there is your answer.
Originally posted by nvchamp9ers:
Originally posted by D_Niner:
Originally posted by nvchamp9ers:
Originally posted by D_Niner:
Originally posted by nvchamp9ers:
I don't know if you pride yourself as someone who knows anything about football but after reading several post and leaving suggestions on reviewing certain things(which you clearly haven't don't, especially regarding our Protection) but in this post, it is both ignorant and stupid. You claim "Alex Smith went into a shell after the INT" please review the film and look at our run to pass ratio and tell me how Alex Smith and not our playcaller went into a shell. FYI, the first drive went well bc it wasn't called at the game it was scripted to show what the defense gives you in certain situation. That first drive they showed that the shotgun both runs and intermediate routes would be there yet did we call those plays? No, we loved the I and short passes on 3rd down. Going Run run pass(count how many drives we did that after the INT) is not a QB going into a shell, it is an OC playing not to lose, not trying to win. Not to mention, I once again reviewed how many times we gave Alex Smith the NFL standard of 5 seconds of protection to go through his progressions properly, so why don't you do the same before you say "he needs to get rid of the ball sooner" that is just a beyond stupid comment when your QB doesn't have anytime to go through any progressions. In fact look and see how many times we gave up pressure in under 2 seconds! Seriously, if you want to make analysis's don't make them off feelings and opinions, go back watch the game, get some stats(I.E run to pass ratio before the INT when the O looked solid, and after the INT when it looked putrid, also look at protection time) I will give you a clue it was worse than last week when we provided "acceptable protection" of 5 seconds 13% of the time. Go check it out and then make analysis bc right now your defense of Jimmy Raye is laughable and just based on feelings/opnions instead of what really happened. Get real.


Obviously, you do pride yourself as one who knows something about football; but you fall short of that goal here...

Who gets a "standard 5 seconds of protection"? This is just dumb...

As for the Play calls pre and post interception look at how well they fared to see whats up. Pre INT we were getting an average of 5.5 yards per pass attempt. Post interception we were getting 3 yards per attempt and Alex's completion % dropped as well. Hell, he only completed one pass that went over 5 yards after that pick (a 20 yard play to Crabs).

Did you count how many time's we tried to have Alex convert a 3rd down with his arm after the INT? 6. Six times he tried and 5 times he failed. Were not just talking 3rd and 10 or 3rd and 15, we're talking 3rd and 5. Hell, he even failed to make a 3rd and 3... By comparison, he was 60% on 3rd down conversions before the INT (3 out of 5)...

If I had a QB who's play dropped off (less yards per attempt, lower completion %, and could not convert 3rd downs) I'd change my play calling to more run as well...

Fact is that Alex didn't help us win at all this game.


1. If you don't know that every O-line coach expects his line to give the QB 5 seconds(that is not just a made up number, that is what teams shoot for, and is even less what our O-line coach expects to get in college,which would be 6)

2. Look at the pass plays called in the after the INT and in a 3rd/5 ot 3rd/7, the defense knows what is coming, they know what to stop, you didn't answer how many times we went run, run pass, or run, run run. A lack of creative playcalling helps no one, not Gore and not A. Smith, not Gore not the O-line. Im am not sayin by anymeans that A. Smith played good, bc he didn't, but I think he played..ok, and Raye was a much bigger problem, as a coach, I have a big problem with what he did and it nearly cost us the game.

Look, I'm not going to do your homework for you... If you want to count plays, be my guest; but, don't be lazy and expect others to do it for you.

Also, I don't care if you consider yourself a coach or not; but, since you do, are you saying you wouldn't change the game calls because your QB has lost his confidence in the middle of the game and is only taking the dump-off passes? Maybe this is why you don't coach in the pro's...

As for you "standard 5 seconds", you never answered the question. Who gets a standard 5 seconds? You made a statement and have been called on it. Make with the facts or admit you were talking out your ass...

Tom Brady, Aaron Rodgers (which is quite ironic bc he leads the leagues in sacks bc he holds onto the ball forever) Matt Ryan, Peyton Manning, Carson Palmer, Joe Flacco, Kyle Orton(except last week, where he was constantly under pressure). Most of the QB's and several others, get the standard 5 seconds on most throws, there is your answer.



You need a new stopwatch...
Originally posted by D_Niner:
Originally posted by nvchamp9ers:
Originally posted by D_Niner:
Originally posted by nvchamp9ers:
Originally posted by D_Niner:
Originally posted by nvchamp9ers:
I don't know if you pride yourself as someone who knows anything about football but after reading several post and leaving suggestions on reviewing certain things(which you clearly haven't don't, especially regarding our Protection) but in this post, it is both ignorant and stupid. You claim "Alex Smith went into a shell after the INT" please review the film and look at our run to pass ratio and tell me how Alex Smith and not our playcaller went into a shell. FYI, the first drive went well bc it wasn't called at the game it was scripted to show what the defense gives you in certain situation. That first drive they showed that the shotgun both runs and intermediate routes would be there yet did we call those plays? No, we loved the I and short passes on 3rd down. Going Run run pass(count how many drives we did that after the INT) is not a QB going into a shell, it is an OC playing not to lose, not trying to win. Not to mention, I once again reviewed how many times we gave Alex Smith the NFL standard of 5 seconds of protection to go through his progressions properly, so why don't you do the same before you say "he needs to get rid of the ball sooner" that is just a beyond stupid comment when your QB doesn't have anytime to go through any progressions. In fact look and see how many times we gave up pressure in under 2 seconds! Seriously, if you want to make analysis's don't make them off feelings and opinions, go back watch the game, get some stats(I.E run to pass ratio before the INT when the O looked solid, and after the INT when it looked putrid, also look at protection time) I will give you a clue it was worse than last week when we provided "acceptable protection" of 5 seconds 13% of the time. Go check it out and then make analysis bc right now your defense of Jimmy Raye is laughable and just based on feelings/opnions instead of what really happened. Get real.


Obviously, you do pride yourself as one who knows something about football; but you fall short of that goal here...

Who gets a "standard 5 seconds of protection"? This is just dumb...

As for the Play calls pre and post interception look at how well they fared to see whats up. Pre INT we were getting an average of 5.5 yards per pass attempt. Post interception we were getting 3 yards per attempt and Alex's completion % dropped as well. Hell, he only completed one pass that went over 5 yards after that pick (a 20 yard play to Crabs).

Did you count how many time's we tried to have Alex convert a 3rd down with his arm after the INT? 6. Six times he tried and 5 times he failed. Were not just talking 3rd and 10 or 3rd and 15, we're talking 3rd and 5. Hell, he even failed to make a 3rd and 3... By comparison, he was 60% on 3rd down conversions before the INT (3 out of 5)...

If I had a QB who's play dropped off (less yards per attempt, lower completion %, and could not convert 3rd downs) I'd change my play calling to more run as well...

Fact is that Alex didn't help us win at all this game.


1. If you don't know that every O-line coach expects his line to give the QB 5 seconds(that is not just a made up number, that is what teams shoot for, and is even less what our O-line coach expects to get in college,which would be 6)

2. Look at the pass plays called in the after the INT and in a 3rd/5 ot 3rd/7, the defense knows what is coming, they know what to stop, you didn't answer how many times we went run, run pass, or run, run run. A lack of creative playcalling helps no one, not Gore and not A. Smith, not Gore not the O-line. Im am not sayin by anymeans that A. Smith played good, bc he didn't, but I think he played..ok, and Raye was a much bigger problem, as a coach, I have a big problem with what he did and it nearly cost us the game.

Look, I'm not going to do your homework for you... If you want to count plays, be my guest; but, don't be lazy and expect others to do it for you.

Also, I don't care if you consider yourself a coach or not; but, since you do, are you saying you wouldn't change the game calls because your QB has lost his confidence in the middle of the game and is only taking the dump-off passes? Maybe this is why you don't coach in the pro's...

As for you "standard 5 seconds", you never answered the question. Who gets a standard 5 seconds? You made a statement and have been called on it. Make with the facts or admit you were talking out your ass...

Tom Brady, Aaron Rodgers (which is quite ironic bc he leads the leagues in sacks bc he holds onto the ball forever) Matt Ryan, Peyton Manning, Carson Palmer, Joe Flacco, Kyle Orton(except last week, where he was constantly under pressure). Most of the QB's and several others, get the standard 5 seconds on most throws, there is your answer.



You need a new stopwatch...

good response to when you got your answer, you can't stick to football, you must always switch to jokes or attacks when left with no more options. I am a bad speller and u are someone who shifts the subject to personal things, now that we have that settled. We are done, you have your answers.
Originally posted by D_Niner:
Originally posted by Digger25:
Originally posted by D_Niner:
Originally posted by Digger25:
Originally posted by lamontb:
Originally posted by tohara3:
Nice post! This offense can't get a touchdown or a small lead & then go into a shell. They have to keep attacking if we are gonna make a run the rest if the year.

Not gonna happen aslong as Smith keeps turning the ball over. They simply can't trust him to win games, and werer hiding him last night in the second half.

smith turned the ball over once last night, and the bears still didn't get much from it. cutler turns it over 4 times and they let him sling that rock all over the field. of course, he did throw a fifth pick, but he was still slinging it. ron turner, kept calling pass plays-and not because they were down by three scores or more. you have to let smith and his offensive weapons win the game-just like turner let cutler TRY and win it.

let me ask you this, if cutler was our QB and he was turning it over like he has been but throwing for 300+ yards and a couple of TD's, would you still feel the same way?

also, we ran 9 times in a 10+ play drive. i don't think that was hiding smith as much as it was just burning the clock. as mooch said, it was the 4 minute drill.

Didn't that happen with JTO last year...

LOL! JTO had a combo of INT's and fumbles. but this is kinda my point. so many people on here are judging alex without giving it time (i know i know. we aren't patient and we want to win now), but if you really really really want to know if this kid has IT, you let him play and let him try to win.

JTO had his shot, and within one season, his ass was out. now, you gave hill the same opportunity and well...we know where he is. now, give smith til the end of the season and if he continues with the bad play, you have your answer, but at least let the kid try and win some games.

if i was a bear fan, i would have seen enough of cutler to think that that trade was pure suckage.

I agree we need to keep letting Smith play for a couple more games; but, I wouldn't go as far as saying the rest of the season.

These last 3 games he's played below average. Now I don't fault him too much against the Colts, but these last 2 were just sad. If he continues to play below average and we start losing again, I say we try Nate so we can evaluate where he's at and have a better idea of our draft needs.

good call. especially about davis and draft needs. but do you think our FO would be gun shy on pulling the trigger on a high profile QB in the draft?

and IMHO, by letting smith play out the year, you would not have much doubt of whether he is our future QB or not. a few more games and pulling him (for suckage) will only leave that question kinda dangling. i mean, he could stink it up for the next three games, but our defense wins us those games and we are in the thick of it (playoff run). do you want to pull him for a QB who has no experience in davis or pull a hill off the bench? it could happen man. i think that is how it will play out. ugly wins, so-so play from smith, awesome defense. playoff chase.
Originally posted by Digger25:
Originally posted by D_Niner:
Originally posted by Digger25:
Originally posted by D_Niner:
Originally posted by Digger25:
Originally posted by lamontb:
Originally posted by tohara3:
Nice post! This offense can't get a touchdown or a small lead & then go into a shell. They have to keep attacking if we are gonna make a run the rest if the year.

Not gonna happen aslong as Smith keeps turning the ball over. They simply can't trust him to win games, and werer hiding him last night in the second half.

smith turned the ball over once last night, and the bears still didn't get much from it. cutler turns it over 4 times and they let him sling that rock all over the field. of course, he did throw a fifth pick, but he was still slinging it. ron turner, kept calling pass plays-and not because they were down by three scores or more. you have to let smith and his offensive weapons win the game-just like turner let cutler TRY and win it.

let me ask you this, if cutler was our QB and he was turning it over like he has been but throwing for 300+ yards and a couple of TD's, would you still feel the same way?

also, we ran 9 times in a 10+ play drive. i don't think that was hiding smith as much as it was just burning the clock. as mooch said, it was the 4 minute drill.

Didn't that happen with JTO last year...

LOL! JTO had a combo of INT's and fumbles. but this is kinda my point. so many people on here are judging alex without giving it time (i know i know. we aren't patient and we want to win now), but if you really really really want to know if this kid has IT, you let him play and let him try to win.

JTO had his shot, and within one season, his ass was out. now, you gave hill the same opportunity and well...we know where he is. now, give smith til the end of the season and if he continues with the bad play, you have your answer, but at least let the kid try and win some games.

if i was a bear fan, i would have seen enough of cutler to think that that trade was pure suckage.

I agree we need to keep letting Smith play for a couple more games; but, I wouldn't go as far as saying the rest of the season.

These last 3 games he's played below average. Now I don't fault him too much against the Colts, but these last 2 were just sad. If he continues to play below average and we start losing again, I say we try Nate so we can evaluate where he's at and have a better idea of our draft needs.

good call. especially about davis and draft needs. but do you think our FO would be gun shy on pulling the trigger on a high profile QB in the draft?

and IMHO, by letting smith play out the year, you would not have much doubt of whether he is our future QB or not. a few more games and pulling him (for suckage) will only leave that question kinda dangling. i mean, he could stink it up for the next three games, but our defense wins us those games and we are in the thick of it (playoff run). do you want to pull him for a QB who has no experience in davis or pull a hill off the bench? it could happen man. i think that is how it will play out. ugly wins, so-so play from smith, awesome defense. playoff chase.

The play from any QB we put in the game resides on the play of the Oline.
Originally posted by nvchamp9ers:
Originally posted by D_Niner:
Originally posted by nvchamp9ers:
Originally posted by D_Niner:
Originally posted by nvchamp9ers:
Originally posted by D_Niner:
Originally posted by nvchamp9ers:
I don't know if you pride yourself as someone who knows anything about football but after reading several post and leaving suggestions on reviewing certain things(which you clearly haven't don't, especially regarding our Protection) but in this post, it is both ignorant and stupid. You claim "Alex Smith went into a shell after the INT" please review the film and look at our run to pass ratio and tell me how Alex Smith and not our playcaller went into a shell. FYI, the first drive went well bc it wasn't called at the game it was scripted to show what the defense gives you in certain situation. That first drive they showed that the shotgun both runs and intermediate routes would be there yet did we call those plays? No, we loved the I and short passes on 3rd down. Going Run run pass(count how many drives we did that after the INT) is not a QB going into a shell, it is an OC playing not to lose, not trying to win. Not to mention, I once again reviewed how many times we gave Alex Smith the NFL standard of 5 seconds of protection to go through his progressions properly, so why don't you do the same before you say "he needs to get rid of the ball sooner" that is just a beyond stupid comment when your QB doesn't have anytime to go through any progressions. In fact look and see how many times we gave up pressure in under 2 seconds! Seriously, if you want to make analysis's don't make them off feelings and opinions, go back watch the game, get some stats(I.E run to pass ratio before the INT when the O looked solid, and after the INT when it looked putrid, also look at protection time) I will give you a clue it was worse than last week when we provided "acceptable protection" of 5 seconds 13% of the time. Go check it out and then make analysis bc right now your defense of Jimmy Raye is laughable and just based on feelings/opnions instead of what really happened. Get real.


Obviously, you do pride yourself as one who knows something about football; but you fall short of that goal here...

Who gets a "standard 5 seconds of protection"? This is just dumb...

As for the Play calls pre and post interception look at how well they fared to see whats up. Pre INT we were getting an average of 5.5 yards per pass attempt. Post interception we were getting 3 yards per attempt and Alex's completion % dropped as well. Hell, he only completed one pass that went over 5 yards after that pick (a 20 yard play to Crabs).

Did you count how many time's we tried to have Alex convert a 3rd down with his arm after the INT? 6. Six times he tried and 5 times he failed. Were not just talking 3rd and 10 or 3rd and 15, we're talking 3rd and 5. Hell, he even failed to make a 3rd and 3... By comparison, he was 60% on 3rd down conversions before the INT (3 out of 5)...

If I had a QB who's play dropped off (less yards per attempt, lower completion %, and could not convert 3rd downs) I'd change my play calling to more run as well...

Fact is that Alex didn't help us win at all this game.


1. If you don't know that every O-line coach expects his line to give the QB 5 seconds(that is not just a made up number, that is what teams shoot for, and is even less what our O-line coach expects to get in college,which would be 6)

2. Look at the pass plays called in the after the INT and in a 3rd/5 ot 3rd/7, the defense knows what is coming, they know what to stop, you didn't answer how many times we went run, run pass, or run, run run. A lack of creative playcalling helps no one, not Gore and not A. Smith, not Gore not the O-line. Im am not sayin by anymeans that A. Smith played good, bc he didn't, but I think he played..ok, and Raye was a much bigger problem, as a coach, I have a big problem with what he did and it nearly cost us the game.

Look, I'm not going to do your homework for you... If you want to count plays, be my guest; but, don't be lazy and expect others to do it for you.

Also, I don't care if you consider yourself a coach or not; but, since you do, are you saying you wouldn't change the game calls because your QB has lost his confidence in the middle of the game and is only taking the dump-off passes? Maybe this is why you don't coach in the pro's...

As for you "standard 5 seconds", you never answered the question. Who gets a standard 5 seconds? You made a statement and have been called on it. Make with the facts or admit you were talking out your ass...

Tom Brady, Aaron Rodgers (which is quite ironic bc he leads the leagues in sacks bc he holds onto the ball forever) Matt Ryan, Peyton Manning, Carson Palmer, Joe Flacco, Kyle Orton(except last week, where he was constantly under pressure). Most of the QB's and several others, get the standard 5 seconds on most throws, there is your answer.



You need a new stopwatch...

good response to when you got your answer, you can't stick to football, you must always switch to jokes or attacks when left with no more options. I am a bad speller and u are someone who shifts the subject to personal things, now that we have that settled. We are done, you have your answers.

Look your the one who always talks down to people on here and starts off with the personal attacks. I'm just talking to you in a way that you like to talk to others. If it gets your panties in a twist, then don't do it to others (ya know, you better be able to take it if you can dish it)...

The reason I'm laughing at you is because I know that you know enough about football to know what you posted was pure BS.. On occasion these guys may get 5 seconds; but, in no way is that the norm. Of course it's a goal to give the QB as much time as he needs; just as it's a goal to keep the opposition to as low a score as possible. These are John Madden "Duh" Facts (you know the ones)... But to claim that this is average and try to defend that is just embarrassing...
Originally posted by Digger25:
Originally posted by D_Niner:
Originally posted by Digger25:
Originally posted by D_Niner:
Originally posted by Digger25:
Originally posted by lamontb:
Originally posted by tohara3:
Nice post! This offense can't get a touchdown or a small lead & then go into a shell. They have to keep attacking if we are gonna make a run the rest if the year.

Not gonna happen aslong as Smith keeps turning the ball over. They simply can't trust him to win games, and werer hiding him last night in the second half.

smith turned the ball over once last night, and the bears still didn't get much from it. cutler turns it over 4 times and they let him sling that rock all over the field. of course, he did throw a fifth pick, but he was still slinging it. ron turner, kept calling pass plays-and not because they were down by three scores or more. you have to let smith and his offensive weapons win the game-just like turner let cutler TRY and win it.

let me ask you this, if cutler was our QB and he was turning it over like he has been but throwing for 300+ yards and a couple of TD's, would you still feel the same way?

also, we ran 9 times in a 10+ play drive. i don't think that was hiding smith as much as it was just burning the clock. as mooch said, it was the 4 minute drill.

Didn't that happen with JTO last year...

LOL! JTO had a combo of INT's and fumbles. but this is kinda my point. so many people on here are judging alex without giving it time (i know i know. we aren't patient and we want to win now), but if you really really really want to know if this kid has IT, you let him play and let him try to win.

JTO had his shot, and within one season, his ass was out. now, you gave hill the same opportunity and well...we know where he is. now, give smith til the end of the season and if he continues with the bad play, you have your answer, but at least let the kid try and win some games.

if i was a bear fan, i would have seen enough of cutler to think that that trade was pure suckage.

I agree we need to keep letting Smith play for a couple more games; but, I wouldn't go as far as saying the rest of the season.

These last 3 games he's played below average. Now I don't fault him too much against the Colts, but these last 2 were just sad. If he continues to play below average and we start losing again, I say we try Nate so we can evaluate where he's at and have a better idea of our draft needs.

good call. especially about davis and draft needs. but do you think our FO would be gun shy on pulling the trigger on a high profile QB in the draft?

and IMHO, by letting smith play out the year, you would not have much doubt of whether he is our future QB or not. a few more games and pulling him (for suckage) will only leave that question kinda dangling. i mean, he could stink it up for the next three games, but our defense wins us those games and we are in the thick of it (playoff run). do you want to pull him for a QB who has no experience in davis or pull a hill off the bench? it could happen man. i think that is how it will play out. ugly wins, so-so play from smith, awesome defense. playoff chase.

For me the thing is, if the guy is helping us win or not causing us to lose, then lets keep playing him while were still in the playoff picture. Once that door is closed, if this is not our QB of the future and we think we may have something with a younger (less damaged) player, then why not see what we have there and start the build for the future.

So to answer your question, if were wining despite Smith then put Hill back in. If were wining and Smith isn't making it more difficult on the team to pull out these ugly wins then keep playing the guy. If were losing and were not going to make the playoffs, then lets see the new kid...
Originally posted by D_Niner:
Originally posted by nvchamp9ers:
Originally posted by D_Niner:
Originally posted by nvchamp9ers:
Originally posted by D_Niner:
Originally posted by nvchamp9ers:
Originally posted by D_Niner:
Originally posted by nvchamp9ers:
I don't know if you pride yourself as someone who knows anything about football but after reading several post and leaving suggestions on reviewing certain things(which you clearly haven't don't, especially regarding our Protection) but in this post, it is both ignorant and stupid. You claim "Alex Smith went into a shell after the INT" please review the film and look at our run to pass ratio and tell me how Alex Smith and not our playcaller went into a shell. FYI, the first drive went well bc it wasn't called at the game it was scripted to show what the defense gives you in certain situation. That first drive they showed that the shotgun both runs and intermediate routes would be there yet did we call those plays? No, we loved the I and short passes on 3rd down. Going Run run pass(count how many drives we did that after the INT) is not a QB going into a shell, it is an OC playing not to lose, not trying to win. Not to mention, I once again reviewed how many times we gave Alex Smith the NFL standard of 5 seconds of protection to go through his progressions properly, so why don't you do the same before you say "he needs to get rid of the ball sooner" that is just a beyond stupid comment when your QB doesn't have anytime to go through any progressions. In fact look and see how many times we gave up pressure in under 2 seconds! Seriously, if you want to make analysis's don't make them off feelings and opinions, go back watch the game, get some stats(I.E run to pass ratio before the INT when the O looked solid, and after the INT when it looked putrid, also look at protection time) I will give you a clue it was worse than last week when we provided "acceptable protection" of 5 seconds 13% of the time. Go check it out and then make analysis bc right now your defense of Jimmy Raye is laughable and just based on feelings/opnions instead of what really happened. Get real.


Obviously, you do pride yourself as one who knows something about football; but you fall short of that goal here...

Who gets a "standard 5 seconds of protection"? This is just dumb...

As for the Play calls pre and post interception look at how well they fared to see whats up. Pre INT we were getting an average of 5.5 yards per pass attempt. Post interception we were getting 3 yards per attempt and Alex's completion % dropped as well. Hell, he only completed one pass that went over 5 yards after that pick (a 20 yard play to Crabs).

Did you count how many time's we tried to have Alex convert a 3rd down with his arm after the INT? 6. Six times he tried and 5 times he failed. Were not just talking 3rd and 10 or 3rd and 15, we're talking 3rd and 5. Hell, he even failed to make a 3rd and 3... By comparison, he was 60% on 3rd down conversions before the INT (3 out of 5)...

If I had a QB who's play dropped off (less yards per attempt, lower completion %, and could not convert 3rd downs) I'd change my play calling to more run as well...

Fact is that Alex didn't help us win at all this game.


1. If you don't know that every O-line coach expects his line to give the QB 5 seconds(that is not just a made up number, that is what teams shoot for, and is even less what our O-line coach expects to get in college,which would be 6)

2. Look at the pass plays called in the after the INT and in a 3rd/5 ot 3rd/7, the defense knows what is coming, they know what to stop, you didn't answer how many times we went run, run pass, or run, run run. A lack of creative playcalling helps no one, not Gore and not A. Smith, not Gore not the O-line. Im am not sayin by anymeans that A. Smith played good, bc he didn't, but I think he played..ok, and Raye was a much bigger problem, as a coach, I have a big problem with what he did and it nearly cost us the game.

Look, I'm not going to do your homework for you... If you want to count plays, be my guest; but, don't be lazy and expect others to do it for you.

Also, I don't care if you consider yourself a coach or not; but, since you do, are you saying you wouldn't change the game calls because your QB has lost his confidence in the middle of the game and is only taking the dump-off passes? Maybe this is why you don't coach in the pro's...

As for you "standard 5 seconds", you never answered the question. Who gets a standard 5 seconds? You made a statement and have been called on it. Make with the facts or admit you were talking out your ass...

Tom Brady, Aaron Rodgers (which is quite ironic bc he leads the leagues in sacks bc he holds onto the ball forever) Matt Ryan, Peyton Manning, Carson Palmer, Joe Flacco, Kyle Orton(except last week, where he was constantly under pressure). Most of the QB's and several others, get the standard 5 seconds on most throws, there is your answer.



You need a new stopwatch...

good response to when you got your answer, you can't stick to football, you must always switch to jokes or attacks when left with no more options. I am a bad speller and u are someone who shifts the subject to personal things, now that we have that settled. We are done, you have your answers.

Look your the one who always talks down to people on here and starts off with the personal attacks. I'm just talking to you in a way that you like to talk to others. If it gets your panties in a twist, then don't do it to others (ya know, you better be able to take it if you can dish it)...

The reason I'm laughing at you is because I know that you know enough about football to know what you posted was pure BS.. On occasion these guys may get 5 seconds; but, in no way is that the norm. Of course it's a goal to give the QB as much time as he needs; just as it's a goal to keep the opposition to as low a score as possible. These are John Madden "Duh" Facts (you know the ones)... But to claim that this is average and try to defend that is just embarrassing...

My panties are in no way twisted lol, I think perhaps my wording is wrong. I won't claim 5 seconds is the norm but it is in fact the goal/standard of all teams/coaches. The guys mentioned obviously do not always have 5 seconds as they often have it gone in less then that but when the time is needed, these guys more often then not get the 5 seconds they are expecting as a QB. Is that the NFL norm? No, but it is what the best QB's get and expect. It is part of what sets apart the best teams from the worse, it is the standard/norm for the best Offenses out there.

[ Edited by nvchamp9ers on Nov 13, 2009 at 15:57:20 ]
Originally posted by nvchamp9ers:
Originally posted by D_Niner:
Originally posted by nvchamp9ers:
Originally posted by D_Niner:
Originally posted by nvchamp9ers:
Originally posted by D_Niner:
Originally posted by nvchamp9ers:
Originally posted by D_Niner:
Originally posted by nvchamp9ers:
I don't know if you pride yourself as someone who knows anything about football but after reading several post and leaving suggestions on reviewing certain things(which you clearly haven't don't, especially regarding our Protection) but in this post, it is both ignorant and stupid. You claim "Alex Smith went into a shell after the INT" please review the film and look at our run to pass ratio and tell me how Alex Smith and not our playcaller went into a shell. FYI, the first drive went well bc it wasn't called at the game it was scripted to show what the defense gives you in certain situation. That first drive they showed that the shotgun both runs and intermediate routes would be there yet did we call those plays? No, we loved the I and short passes on 3rd down. Going Run run pass(count how many drives we did that after the INT) is not a QB going into a shell, it is an OC playing not to lose, not trying to win. Not to mention, I once again reviewed how many times we gave Alex Smith the NFL standard of 5 seconds of protection to go through his progressions properly, so why don't you do the same before you say "he needs to get rid of the ball sooner" that is just a beyond stupid comment when your QB doesn't have anytime to go through any progressions. In fact look and see how many times we gave up pressure in under 2 seconds! Seriously, if you want to make analysis's don't make them off feelings and opinions, go back watch the game, get some stats(I.E run to pass ratio before the INT when the O looked solid, and after the INT when it looked putrid, also look at protection time) I will give you a clue it was worse than last week when we provided "acceptable protection" of 5 seconds 13% of the time. Go check it out and then make analysis bc right now your defense of Jimmy Raye is laughable and just based on feelings/opnions instead of what really happened. Get real.


Obviously, you do pride yourself as one who knows something about football; but you fall short of that goal here...

Who gets a "standard 5 seconds of protection"? This is just dumb...

As for the Play calls pre and post interception look at how well they fared to see whats up. Pre INT we were getting an average of 5.5 yards per pass attempt. Post interception we were getting 3 yards per attempt and Alex's completion % dropped as well. Hell, he only completed one pass that went over 5 yards after that pick (a 20 yard play to Crabs).

Did you count how many time's we tried to have Alex convert a 3rd down with his arm after the INT? 6. Six times he tried and 5 times he failed. Were not just talking 3rd and 10 or 3rd and 15, we're talking 3rd and 5. Hell, he even failed to make a 3rd and 3... By comparison, he was 60% on 3rd down conversions before the INT (3 out of 5)...

If I had a QB who's play dropped off (less yards per attempt, lower completion %, and could not convert 3rd downs) I'd change my play calling to more run as well...

Fact is that Alex didn't help us win at all this game.


1. If you don't know that every O-line coach expects his line to give the QB 5 seconds(that is not just a made up number, that is what teams shoot for, and is even less what our O-line coach expects to get in college,which would be 6)

2. Look at the pass plays called in the after the INT and in a 3rd/5 ot 3rd/7, the defense knows what is coming, they know what to stop, you didn't answer how many times we went run, run pass, or run, run run. A lack of creative playcalling helps no one, not Gore and not A. Smith, not Gore not the O-line. Im am not sayin by anymeans that A. Smith played good, bc he didn't, but I think he played..ok, and Raye was a much bigger problem, as a coach, I have a big problem with what he did and it nearly cost us the game.

Look, I'm not going to do your homework for you... If you want to count plays, be my guest; but, don't be lazy and expect others to do it for you.

Also, I don't care if you consider yourself a coach or not; but, since you do, are you saying you wouldn't change the game calls because your QB has lost his confidence in the middle of the game and is only taking the dump-off passes? Maybe this is why you don't coach in the pro's...

As for you "standard 5 seconds", you never answered the question. Who gets a standard 5 seconds? You made a statement and have been called on it. Make with the facts or admit you were talking out your ass...

Tom Brady, Aaron Rodgers (which is quite ironic bc he leads the leagues in sacks bc he holds onto the ball forever) Matt Ryan, Peyton Manning, Carson Palmer, Joe Flacco, Kyle Orton(except last week, where he was constantly under pressure). Most of the QB's and several others, get the standard 5 seconds on most throws, there is your answer.



You need a new stopwatch...

good response to when you got your answer, you can't stick to football, you must always switch to jokes or attacks when left with no more options. I am a bad speller and u are someone who shifts the subject to personal things, now that we have that settled. We are done, you have your answers.

Look your the one who always talks down to people on here and starts off with the personal attacks. I'm just talking to you in a way that you like to talk to others. If it gets your panties in a twist, then don't do it to others (ya know, you better be able to take it if you can dish it)...

The reason I'm laughing at you is because I know that you know enough about football to know what you posted was pure BS.. On occasion these guys may get 5 seconds; but, in no way is that the norm. Of course it's a goal to give the QB as much time as he needs; just as it's a goal to keep the opposition to as low a score as possible. These are John Madden "Duh" Facts (you know the ones)... But to claim that this is average and try to defend that is just embarrassing...

My panties are in no way twisted lol, I think perhaps my wording is wrong. I won't claim 5 seconds is the norm but it is in fact the goal/standard of all teams/coaches. The guys mentioned obviously do not always have 5 seconds as they often have it gone in less then that but when the time is needed, these guys more often then not get the 5 seconds they are expecting as a QB. Is that the NFL norm? No, but it is what the best QB's get and expect. It is part of what sets apart the best teams from the worse, it is the standard/norm for the best Offenses out there.

Now I can agree with that...
Originally posted by nvchamp9ers:
Originally posted by D_Niner:
Originally posted by nvchamp9ers:
Originally posted by D_Niner:
Originally posted by nvchamp9ers:
Originally posted by D_Niner:
Originally posted by nvchamp9ers:
Originally posted by D_Niner:
Originally posted by nvchamp9ers:
I don't know if you pride yourself as someone who knows anything about football but after reading several post and leaving suggestions on reviewing certain things(which you clearly haven't don't, especially regarding our Protection) but in this post, it is both ignorant and stupid. You claim "Alex Smith went into a shell after the INT" please review the film and look at our run to pass ratio and tell me how Alex Smith and not our playcaller went into a shell. FYI, the first drive went well bc it wasn't called at the game it was scripted to show what the defense gives you in certain situation. That first drive they showed that the shotgun both runs and intermediate routes would be there yet did we call those plays? No, we loved the I and short passes on 3rd down. Going Run run pass(count how many drives we did that after the INT) is not a QB going into a shell, it is an OC playing not to lose, not trying to win. Not to mention, I once again reviewed how many times we gave Alex Smith the NFL standard of 5 seconds of protection to go through his progressions properly, so why don't you do the same before you say "he needs to get rid of the ball sooner" that is just a beyond stupid comment when your QB doesn't have anytime to go through any progressions. In fact look and see how many times we gave up pressure in under 2 seconds! Seriously, if you want to make analysis's don't make them off feelings and opinions, go back watch the game, get some stats(I.E run to pass ratio before the INT when the O looked solid, and after the INT when it looked putrid, also look at protection time) I will give you a clue it was worse than last week when we provided "acceptable protection" of 5 seconds 13% of the time. Go check it out and then make analysis bc right now your defense of Jimmy Raye is laughable and just based on feelings/opnions instead of what really happened. Get real.


Obviously, you do pride yourself as one who knows something about football; but you fall short of that goal here...

Who gets a "standard 5 seconds of protection"? This is just dumb...

As for the Play calls pre and post interception look at how well they fared to see whats up. Pre INT we were getting an average of 5.5 yards per pass attempt. Post interception we were getting 3 yards per attempt and Alex's completion % dropped as well. Hell, he only completed one pass that went over 5 yards after that pick (a 20 yard play to Crabs).

Did you count how many time's we tried to have Alex convert a 3rd down with his arm after the INT? 6. Six times he tried and 5 times he failed. Were not just talking 3rd and 10 or 3rd and 15, we're talking 3rd and 5. Hell, he even failed to make a 3rd and 3... By comparison, he was 60% on 3rd down conversions before the INT (3 out of 5)...

If I had a QB who's play dropped off (less yards per attempt, lower completion %, and could not convert 3rd downs) I'd change my play calling to more run as well...

Fact is that Alex didn't help us win at all this game.


1. If you don't know that every O-line coach expects his line to give the QB 5 seconds(that is not just a made up number, that is what teams shoot for, and is even less what our O-line coach expects to get in college,which would be 6)

2. Look at the pass plays called in the after the INT and in a 3rd/5 ot 3rd/7, the defense knows what is coming, they know what to stop, you didn't answer how many times we went run, run pass, or run, run run. A lack of creative playcalling helps no one, not Gore and not A. Smith, not Gore not the O-line. Im am not sayin by anymeans that A. Smith played good, bc he didn't, but I think he played..ok, and Raye was a much bigger problem, as a coach, I have a big problem with what he did and it nearly cost us the game.

Look, I'm not going to do your homework for you... If you want to count plays, be my guest; but, don't be lazy and expect others to do it for you.

Also, I don't care if you consider yourself a coach or not; but, since you do, are you saying you wouldn't change the game calls because your QB has lost his confidence in the middle of the game and is only taking the dump-off passes? Maybe this is why you don't coach in the pro's...

As for you "standard 5 seconds", you never answered the question. Who gets a standard 5 seconds? You made a statement and have been called on it. Make with the facts or admit you were talking out your ass...

Tom Brady, Aaron Rodgers (which is quite ironic bc he leads the leagues in sacks bc he holds onto the ball forever) Matt Ryan, Peyton Manning, Carson Palmer, Joe Flacco, Kyle Orton(except last week, where he was constantly under pressure). Most of the QB's and several others, get the standard 5 seconds on most throws, there is your answer.



You need a new stopwatch...

good response to when you got your answer, you can't stick to football, you must always switch to jokes or attacks when left with no more options. I am a bad speller and u are someone who shifts the subject to personal things, now that we have that settled. We are done, you have your answers.

Look your the one who always talks down to people on here and starts off with the personal attacks. I'm just talking to you in a way that you like to talk to others. If it gets your panties in a twist, then don't do it to others (ya know, you better be able to take it if you can dish it)...

The reason I'm laughing at you is because I know that you know enough about football to know what you posted was pure BS.. On occasion these guys may get 5 seconds; but, in no way is that the norm. Of course it's a goal to give the QB as much time as he needs; just as it's a goal to keep the opposition to as low a score as possible. These are John Madden "Duh" Facts (you know the ones)... But to claim that this is average and try to defend that is just embarrassing...

My panties are in no way twisted lol, I think perhaps my wording is wrong. I won't claim 5 seconds is the norm but it is in fact the goal/standard of all teams/coaches. The guys mentioned obviously do not always have 5 seconds as they often have it gone in less then that but when the time is needed, these guys more often then not get the 5 seconds they are expecting as a QB. Is that the NFL norm? No, but it is what the best QB's get and expect. It is part of what sets apart the best teams from the worse, it is the standard/norm for the best Offenses out there.

sorry to jump in this mix, but didn't singletary have an "ALARM" that went off after X amount of seconds? i tried to look up the article on MM blog but couldn't find. do you guys recall how much time was on the alarm before it went off? 5 seconds seems like a lot (for the O line).
Originally posted by Digger25:
Originally posted by nvchamp9ers:
Originally posted by D_Niner:
Originally posted by nvchamp9ers:
Originally posted by D_Niner:
Originally posted by nvchamp9ers:
Originally posted by D_Niner:
Originally posted by nvchamp9ers:
Originally posted by D_Niner:
Originally posted by nvchamp9ers:
I don't know if you pride yourself as someone who knows anything about football but after reading several post and leaving suggestions on reviewing certain things(which you clearly haven't don't, especially regarding our Protection) but in this post, it is both ignorant and stupid. You claim "Alex Smith went into a shell after the INT" please review the film and look at our run to pass ratio and tell me how Alex Smith and not our playcaller went into a shell. FYI, the first drive went well bc it wasn't called at the game it was scripted to show what the defense gives you in certain situation. That first drive they showed that the shotgun both runs and intermediate routes would be there yet did we call those plays? No, we loved the I and short passes on 3rd down. Going Run run pass(count how many drives we did that after the INT) is not a QB going into a shell, it is an OC playing not to lose, not trying to win. Not to mention, I once again reviewed how many times we gave Alex Smith the NFL standard of 5 seconds of protection to go through his progressions properly, so why don't you do the same before you say "he needs to get rid of the ball sooner" that is just a beyond stupid comment when your QB doesn't have anytime to go through any progressions. In fact look and see how many times we gave up pressure in under 2 seconds! Seriously, if you want to make analysis's don't make them off feelings and opinions, go back watch the game, get some stats(I.E run to pass ratio before the INT when the O looked solid, and after the INT when it looked putrid, also look at protection time) I will give you a clue it was worse than last week when we provided "acceptable protection" of 5 seconds 13% of the time. Go check it out and then make analysis bc right now your defense of Jimmy Raye is laughable and just based on feelings/opnions instead of what really happened. Get real.


Obviously, you do pride yourself as one who knows something about football; but you fall short of that goal here...

Who gets a "standard 5 seconds of protection"? This is just dumb...

As for the Play calls pre and post interception look at how well they fared to see whats up. Pre INT we were getting an average of 5.5 yards per pass attempt. Post interception we were getting 3 yards per attempt and Alex's completion % dropped as well. Hell, he only completed one pass that went over 5 yards after that pick (a 20 yard play to Crabs).

Did you count how many time's we tried to have Alex convert a 3rd down with his arm after the INT? 6. Six times he tried and 5 times he failed. Were not just talking 3rd and 10 or 3rd and 15, we're talking 3rd and 5. Hell, he even failed to make a 3rd and 3... By comparison, he was 60% on 3rd down conversions before the INT (3 out of 5)...

If I had a QB who's play dropped off (less yards per attempt, lower completion %, and could not convert 3rd downs) I'd change my play calling to more run as well...

Fact is that Alex didn't help us win at all this game.


1. If you don't know that every O-line coach expects his line to give the QB 5 seconds(that is not just a made up number, that is what teams shoot for, and is even less what our O-line coach expects to get in college,which would be 6)

2. Look at the pass plays called in the after the INT and in a 3rd/5 ot 3rd/7, the defense knows what is coming, they know what to stop, you didn't answer how many times we went run, run pass, or run, run run. A lack of creative playcalling helps no one, not Gore and not A. Smith, not Gore not the O-line. Im am not sayin by anymeans that A. Smith played good, bc he didn't, but I think he played..ok, and Raye was a much bigger problem, as a coach, I have a big problem with what he did and it nearly cost us the game.

Look, I'm not going to do your homework for you... If you want to count plays, be my guest; but, don't be lazy and expect others to do it for you.

Also, I don't care if you consider yourself a coach or not; but, since you do, are you saying you wouldn't change the game calls because your QB has lost his confidence in the middle of the game and is only taking the dump-off passes? Maybe this is why you don't coach in the pro's...

As for you "standard 5 seconds", you never answered the question. Who gets a standard 5 seconds? You made a statement and have been called on it. Make with the facts or admit you were talking out your ass...

Tom Brady, Aaron Rodgers (which is quite ironic bc he leads the leagues in sacks bc he holds onto the ball forever) Matt Ryan, Peyton Manning, Carson Palmer, Joe Flacco, Kyle Orton(except last week, where he was constantly under pressure). Most of the QB's and several others, get the standard 5 seconds on most throws, there is your answer.



You need a new stopwatch...

good response to when you got your answer, you can't stick to football, you must always switch to jokes or attacks when left with no more options. I am a bad speller and u are someone who shifts the subject to personal things, now that we have that settled. We are done, you have your answers.

Look your the one who always talks down to people on here and starts off with the personal attacks. I'm just talking to you in a way that you like to talk to others. If it gets your panties in a twist, then don't do it to others (ya know, you better be able to take it if you can dish it)...

The reason I'm laughing at you is because I know that you know enough about football to know what you posted was pure BS.. On occasion these guys may get 5 seconds; but, in no way is that the norm. Of course it's a goal to give the QB as much time as he needs; just as it's a goal to keep the opposition to as low a score as possible. These are John Madden "Duh" Facts (you know the ones)... But to claim that this is average and try to defend that is just embarrassing...

My panties are in no way twisted lol, I think perhaps my wording is wrong. I won't claim 5 seconds is the norm but it is in fact the goal/standard of all teams/coaches. The guys mentioned obviously do not always have 5 seconds as they often have it gone in less then that but when the time is needed, these guys more often then not get the 5 seconds they are expecting as a QB. Is that the NFL norm? No, but it is what the best QB's get and expect. It is part of what sets apart the best teams from the worse, it is the standard/norm for the best Offenses out there.

sorry to jump in this mix, but didn't singletary have an "ALARM" that went off after X amount of seconds? i tried to look up the article on MM blog but couldn't find. do you guys recall how much time was on the alarm before it went off? 5 seconds seems like a lot (for the O line).

i think they wanted it gone in 3 in training camp
Originally posted by brucesf49:
Originally posted by Digger25:
Originally posted by nvchamp9ers:
Originally posted by D_Niner:
Originally posted by nvchamp9ers:
Originally posted by D_Niner:
Originally posted by nvchamp9ers:
Originally posted by D_Niner:
Originally posted by nvchamp9ers:
Originally posted by D_Niner:
Originally posted by nvchamp9ers:
I don't know if you pride yourself as someone who knows anything about football but after reading several post and leaving suggestions on reviewing certain things(which you clearly haven't don't, especially regarding our Protection) but in this post, it is both ignorant and stupid. You claim "Alex Smith went into a shell after the INT" please review the film and look at our run to pass ratio and tell me how Alex Smith and not our playcaller went into a shell. FYI, the first drive went well bc it wasn't called at the game it was scripted to show what the defense gives you in certain situation. That first drive they showed that the shotgun both runs and intermediate routes would be there yet did we call those plays? No, we loved the I and short passes on 3rd down. Going Run run pass(count how many drives we did that after the INT) is not a QB going into a shell, it is an OC playing not to lose, not trying to win. Not to mention, I once again reviewed how many times we gave Alex Smith the NFL standard of 5 seconds of protection to go through his progressions properly, so why don't you do the same before you say "he needs to get rid of the ball sooner" that is just a beyond stupid comment when your QB doesn't have anytime to go through any progressions. In fact look and see how many times we gave up pressure in under 2 seconds! Seriously, if you want to make analysis's don't make them off feelings and opinions, go back watch the game, get some stats(I.E run to pass ratio before the INT when the O looked solid, and after the INT when it looked putrid, also look at protection time) I will give you a clue it was worse than last week when we provided "acceptable protection" of 5 seconds 13% of the time. Go check it out and then make analysis bc right now your defense of Jimmy Raye is laughable and just based on feelings/opnions instead of what really happened. Get real.


Obviously, you do pride yourself as one who knows something about football; but you fall short of that goal here...

Who gets a "standard 5 seconds of protection"? This is just dumb...

As for the Play calls pre and post interception look at how well they fared to see whats up. Pre INT we were getting an average of 5.5 yards per pass attempt. Post interception we were getting 3 yards per attempt and Alex's completion % dropped as well. Hell, he only completed one pass that went over 5 yards after that pick (a 20 yard play to Crabs).

Did you count how many time's we tried to have Alex convert a 3rd down with his arm after the INT? 6. Six times he tried and 5 times he failed. Were not just talking 3rd and 10 or 3rd and 15, we're talking 3rd and 5. Hell, he even failed to make a 3rd and 3... By comparison, he was 60% on 3rd down conversions before the INT (3 out of 5)...

If I had a QB who's play dropped off (less yards per attempt, lower completion %, and could not convert 3rd downs) I'd change my play calling to more run as well...

Fact is that Alex didn't help us win at all this game.


1. If you don't know that every O-line coach expects his line to give the QB 5 seconds(that is not just a made up number, that is what teams shoot for, and is even less what our O-line coach expects to get in college,which would be 6)

2. Look at the pass plays called in the after the INT and in a 3rd/5 ot 3rd/7, the defense knows what is coming, they know what to stop, you didn't answer how many times we went run, run pass, or run, run run. A lack of creative playcalling helps no one, not Gore and not A. Smith, not Gore not the O-line. Im am not sayin by anymeans that A. Smith played good, bc he didn't, but I think he played..ok, and Raye was a much bigger problem, as a coach, I have a big problem with what he did and it nearly cost us the game.

Look, I'm not going to do your homework for you... If you want to count plays, be my guest; but, don't be lazy and expect others to do it for you.

Also, I don't care if you consider yourself a coach or not; but, since you do, are you saying you wouldn't change the game calls because your QB has lost his confidence in the middle of the game and is only taking the dump-off passes? Maybe this is why you don't coach in the pro's...

As for you "standard 5 seconds", you never answered the question. Who gets a standard 5 seconds? You made a statement and have been called on it. Make with the facts or admit you were talking out your ass...

Tom Brady, Aaron Rodgers (which is quite ironic bc he leads the leagues in sacks bc he holds onto the ball forever) Matt Ryan, Peyton Manning, Carson Palmer, Joe Flacco, Kyle Orton(except last week, where he was constantly under pressure). Most of the QB's and several others, get the standard 5 seconds on most throws, there is your answer.



You need a new stopwatch...

good response to when you got your answer, you can't stick to football, you must always switch to jokes or attacks when left with no more options. I am a bad speller and u are someone who shifts the subject to personal things, now that we have that settled. We are done, you have your answers.

Look your the one who always talks down to people on here and starts off with the personal attacks. I'm just talking to you in a way that you like to talk to others. If it gets your panties in a twist, then don't do it to others (ya know, you better be able to take it if you can dish it)...

The reason I'm laughing at you is because I know that you know enough about football to know what you posted was pure BS.. On occasion these guys may get 5 seconds; but, in no way is that the norm. Of course it's a goal to give the QB as much time as he needs; just as it's a goal to keep the opposition to as low a score as possible. These are John Madden "Duh" Facts (you know the ones)... But to claim that this is average and try to defend that is just embarrassing...

My panties are in no way twisted lol, I think perhaps my wording is wrong. I won't claim 5 seconds is the norm but it is in fact the goal/standard of all teams/coaches. The guys mentioned obviously do not always have 5 seconds as they often have it gone in less then that but when the time is needed, these guys more often then not get the 5 seconds they are expecting as a QB. Is that the NFL norm? No, but it is what the best QB's get and expect. It is part of what sets apart the best teams from the worse, it is the standard/norm for the best Offenses out there.

sorry to jump in this mix, but didn't singletary have an "ALARM" that went off after X amount of seconds? i tried to look up the article on MM blog but couldn't find. do you guys recall how much time was on the alarm before it went off? 5 seconds seems like a lot (for the O line).

i think they wanted it gone in 3 in training camp

AWESOME! our line is 1.5 seconds off our training camp goal of 3 seconds!