Week 14 2017: Thoughts after rewatching the games...

Hey also you have to give some love mabin-26 .,the rookie that buffalo release .you notice he slowed down hopkins ,also bourne showed you notice he can stretch the field .....also saleh needs to play more press coverage.give a receiver 10 yards is stupid

Originally posted by Stevec9932:

Nice post. I just ordered my Jimmy G jersey..

Lies! They are all sold out

Originally posted by CatchMaster80:

I'm new to the forum although I have been reading it for years. I also expect that I am older than most. I held season tickets from 1970 thru 2004. I saw the turnaround begin in 1980 when Walsh replaced DeBerg with Montana. We still were not great but you could feel the change it made. Remember this also followed a GM change from Joe Thomas to Carmen Policy. The entire organization was changing. Dead weight was shed in favor of guys who could make plays. I say all this because I can see a lot of this happening now. I see good things in Jimmy G but I don't want to go overboard. He looks like the right guy but I still want to see more games against better competition. He has the things you can't teach much like Joe Montana. The 2 things I think separate good from great are ability to move in the pocket and seeing the field. You can't teach these and they can't be tested at the combine which is one reason so many QB's fail. When you are playing scared it is hard to make accurate throws on time. Jimmy seems to be comfortable in the pocket and keeps his eyes downfield.

Welcome and great post! Cogent and eloquent, traits fairly uncommon around these parts

Originally posted by 15crabtree:

Hey also you have to give some love mabin-26 .,the rookie that buffalo release .you notice he slowed down hopkins ,also bourne showed you notice he can stretch the field .....also saleh needs to play more press coverage.give a receiver 10 yards is stupid

I think what slowed him down was the double coverage in the second half...bill O'Brian talked about it post game.

Originally posted by Giedi:
Great write up as usual, Marvin!

re: Fangio vs Saleh. I would say Saleh's defense is simpler in concept than Fangio's. I think that's the tipping point for me. You want a defensive scheme that is simple and for outside draftees and free agents to come in and understand it fairly quickly. Fangio's defense is complex, and the pattern matching that goes on involves a lot of reps and developed chemistry with each player. It's hard for Fangio to just plug and play a new player and I think that's why his defenses degrade over time.

Saleh's defense is basically a nickel defense, in my eyes, so I'm not surprised we're almost dead last in run defense (25th I think). But I think with a LEO and more development with regards to Solomon (don't give up on him yet - 2nd year is when we will really see their talent) that defense will improve next year under Saleh moreso than if Fangio were to come in.

This defense is a Seifert based defense, and his defenses have a good super bowl track record in our franchise history. I've never really seen Fangio's defense excel at the top level, maybe somebody who knows Fangio more than I do, can educate me on that aspect of it.

His scheme is simple and that is why Hopkins could not be stopped. Under Fangio the team had talent but the scheme helped slow down high power offenses like Greenbay. Look every third down how the wr are not getting jammed by our cbs, check the third down stats of the Defense I believe we are not very good under Saleh.

Originally posted by GORO:
His scheme is simple and that is why Hopkins could not be stopped. Under Fangio the team had talent but the scheme helped slow down high power offenses like Greenbay. Look every third down how the wr are not getting jammed by our cbs, check the third down stats of the Defense I believe we are not very good under Saleh.

we are 27th on third downs under Saleh and his simple scheme.

Originally posted by GORO:
we are 27th on third downs under Saleh and his simple scheme.

Id suggest beefed up pass rush in the offseason will improve this.

Originally posted by GORO:

Originally posted by Giedi:
Great write up as usual, Marvin!

re: Fangio vs Saleh. I would say Saleh's defense is simpler in concept than Fangio's. I think that's the tipping point for me. You want a defensive scheme that is simple and for outside draftees and free agents to come in and understand it fairly quickly. Fangio's defense is complex, and the pattern matching that goes on involves a lot of reps and developed chemistry with each player. It's hard for Fangio to just plug and play a new player and I think that's why his defenses degrade over time.

Saleh's defense is basically a nickel defense, in my eyes, so I'm not surprised we're almost dead last in run defense (25th I think). But I think with a LEO and more development with regards to Solomon (don't give up on him yet - 2nd year is when we will really see their talent) that defense will improve next year under Saleh moreso than if Fangio were to come in.

This defense is a Seifert based defense, and his defenses have a good super bowl track record in our franchise history. I've never really seen Fangio's defense excel at the top level, maybe somebody who knows Fangio more than I do, can educate me on that aspect of it.

His scheme is simple and that is why Hopkins could not be stopped. Under Fangio the team had talent but the scheme helped slow down high power offenses like Greenbay. Look every third down how the wr are not getting jammed by our cbs, check the third down stats of the Defense I believe we are not very good under Saleh.

The difference is Aldon. Saleh does not have Aldon. If Saleh has an Aldon kind of player, that defense improves dramatically in all statistical phases. I'm confident that if ShanaLynch finds a similar player like an Aldon Smith for the LEO position, that defense will almost be as effective as Fangio's defenses under Harbaugh. Keep in mind this defense is a derived from the Seifert Elephant defense and that defense revolves around the LEO/Elephant and where he rushes and/or where he drops back in coverage. Right now the defense looks slow and ineffective and that's because we don't have a top notch edge rusher yet.

Originally posted by Giedi:
Great write up as usual, Marvin!

re: Fangio vs Saleh. I would say Saleh's defense is simpler in concept than Fangio's. I think that's the tipping point for me. You want a defensive scheme that is simple and for outside draftees and free agents to come in and understand it fairly quickly. Fangio's defense is complex, and the pattern matching that goes on involves a lot of reps and developed chemistry with each player. It's hard for Fangio to just plug and play a new player and I think that's why his defenses degrade over time.

Saleh's defense is basically a nickel defense, in my eyes, so I'm not surprised we're almost dead last in run defense (25th I think). But I think with a LEO and more development with regards to Solomon (don't give up on him yet - 2nd year is when we will really see their talent) that defense will improve next year under Saleh moreso than if Fangio were to come in.

This defense is a Seifert based defense, and his defenses have a good super bowl track record in our franchise history. I've never really seen Fangio's defense excel at the top level, maybe somebody who knows Fangio more than I do, can educate me on that aspect of it.

The run defense looks a lot better if you look at yards per attempt rather than yards per game. I disagreed that the run defense is almost dead last. That statement is applicable to last year though.

Originally posted by genus49:
I'm souring more and more on Saquon...only because of how talented this RB class is and I think Ronald Jones or Rashaad Penny later in the draft could give us the better value.

Agreed. It's just so hard to endorse putting that high of an investment into an RB imo. If you KNOW you're getting David Johnson or Le'Veon Bell, then fine. But you can never know that for sure. (And neither of those guys were 1st rounders!) The biggest difference between Zeke Elliot and DeMarco Murray right now is their respective O-lines--football's just such a team sport. And historically we've seen it time and again: QB play and defense win championships, superstar RBs do not.

Fix the O-line and add another good receiver, then Hyde and Breida would look like a great tandem.

Better bet is take the best corner/tackle/pass-rusher available (Bradley Chubb, please) and call it a day.

For me the big difference with JG is when he goes to pass I get the feeling that it's going to get caught by a 9er. Going way back over the years most of the time when a 9er QB went back for a pass I held my breath and just hoped it was going to be a pick. JG just gives me the confidence to finally enjoy the passing game. I don't know maybe I'm going full fanboy here, but I'm going to enjoy while I can.

Originally posted by CatchMaster80:
I'm new to the forum although I have been reading it for years. I also expect that I am older than most. I held season tickets from 1970 thru 2004. I saw the turnaround begin in 1980 when Walsh replaced DeBerg with Montana. We still were not great but you could feel the change it made. Remember this also followed a GM change from Joe Thomas to Carmen Policy. The entire organization was changing. Dead weight was shed in favor of guys who could make plays. I say all this because I can see a lot of this happening now. I see good things in Jimmy G but I don't want to go overboard. He looks like the right guy but I still want to see more games against better competition. He has the things you can't teach much like Joe Montana. The 2 things I think separate good from great are ability to move in the pocket and seeing the field. You can't teach these and they can't be tested at the combine which is one reason so many QB's fail. When you are playing scared it is hard to make accurate throws on time. Jimmy seems to be comfortable in the pocket and keeps his eyes downfield.

Welcome to the board. Thank you for pointing out the many similarities between what happened after Eddie D starting listening to Al Davis and dumped Joe Thomas...and all the rest that followed.

The vibe is very much the same.

Marv...interesting run down.

OL: for sure the interior needs a major overhaul. I'm thinking Garnett & the team have put a lot into remaking his body and I'd love to see him succeed. Assuming that happens, I'd say Lynch should sign the best FA C he can find. There are some outstanding OG's in the draft...at least it's shaping up that way.

Outside UFA: My hope is Lynch signs a good vet CB and WR, two positions that are vital to the team's success.

Team UFA: Hyde would be at the top of my list to re-sign, assuming he'd be willing to sign a reasonable contract. If not, draft a good RB who fits Coach's scheme. One guy I'd keep my eye on is McNichols. Lynch signed him kind of under-the-radar to the PS, but he's a good sized RB who's an excellent receiver. I might re-sign Reid, his versatility is a redeeming quality. Definitely let Lynch, Kilgore, Fusco, & DJ go. Johnson hasn't taken advantage of his opportunity to start and in my mind has been a liability. Lynch has to acquire a very good CB to play alongside Witherspoon for obvious reasons.

Despite Celek's big plays, I'm not sure he's the kind of playmaker the offense needs. I'd like to see Hikutini improve his blocking so we see more of him on the field. What I'd love to see is Lynch draft either Hurst or Andrews, both big-time playmakers. Hurst is arguably the better blocker of the two, but both guys can be big time mismatches.

I'm totally with you on the positive vibe...our team hasn't won back-to-back games since 2014 and it feels great. Garoppolo has brought so much to the team...not just his passing, but his smarts, confidence and yeah maybe some much-needed swagger. When I think of what he could do behind a better OL, more WR and TE talent, I can't help but get excited.

I'm impressed with Saleh...for a first time DC, I think he's done a darn good job. The youngsters like Thomas, Blair, Buckner, Armstead, Day, et al should all be better next year. Foster could well be not only the next great Niner LB, but one of the best in the NFL. He needs some help...Malcolm Smith should be ready to go next season. But, let's face it, Harold isn't the answer. Lynch will need to sign or draft his replacement.

Draft: I get the calls for Barkley, he's one of those all-purpose RB's that come along every 10 years or so. That said, if Lynch re-signs Hyde, and with Joe Williams healthy, I'd rather see JL pull the trigger on Bradley Chubb. I think he could be a heckuva LEO. It's a position that if Chubb can make his mark, would elevate Saleh's defense to some pretty lofty levels. Elite pass rushers are just a lot harder to find than RB's. I'd expect Lynch to draft an OT and probably an interior OL, a QB (although not high in the draft), CB, LB, TE and WR.

RE: Dontae Johnson and Hopkins...

Hopkins has made a lot of other DBs look just like Johnson. The man is a freak.

As noted above, after Mabin came in, the 49ers were throwing the entire repertoire of defensive tactics at Hopkins to slow him down. Thankfully, it was Colbert's helmet that finally shut him down for good.

Originally posted by dj43:
RE: Dontae Johnson and Hopkins...

Hopkins has made a lot of other DBs look just like Johnson. The man is a freak.

As noted above, after Mabin came in, the 49ers were throwing the entire repertoire of defensive tactics at Hopkins to slow him down. Thankfully, it was Colbert's helmet that finally shut him down for good.

What were they doing different compared to when DJ was in the game?