John Lynch - 49ers GM

Originally posted by FL9r:

Originally posted by Kolohe:

Originally posted by 9moon:
Where JOEY at ?? time to sign JOEY !!!

Had enough of broke down Bosa's.

Amen

Amenhotep

Originally posted by miked1978:

Originally posted by Giedi:

I think first round picks are really only valuable if you can pick in the top 10 of the first round. If you aren't picking in the first ten picks, I think trading down is more valuable to the 49ers - the strength of their drafts are usually in the middle to later rounds anyway. The more shots you have in the middle rounds the more chances you get another Halton, Puni, Stout, Warner, or Kittle.

There is a lot of truth to this. Most teams only have a first round grade on 10-15 players in most drafts. Thats why you see a lot of 'reaches" in the mid to late part of the draft but they aren't really reaches in team's eyes because they didnt have a first round grade on the available players so they picked what fit them the most.

And the later you pick the worse the odds get in hitting on a pick. So if you can trade a late first round pick and get a proven pro bowl caliber player that you can lock down to a long term contract then to me its a no brainer. You'd have to have cap room of course and thats probably the main reason you don't see this more often.

Once the collective bargaining agreement kicked in to limit rookie salaries, I don't think the cap has a big impact on the draft.

What I think is happening on those reach picks is particular people, like maybe Kyle or Kocurek, falling in love with a certain player. I know for a fact that some of Kyle's and John's reach picks may have been becuase their player got poached by another Kyle Shanahan draft deciple or coach running another organization. About (i think) 30% of the NFL is run by former 49ers coaches or front office guys. I think it's a big problem for ShanaLynch.

Originally posted by Giedi:

Originally posted by miked1978:

Originally posted by Giedi:

I think first round picks are really only valuable if you can pick in the top 10 of the first round. If you aren't picking in the first ten picks, I think trading down is more valuable to the 49ers - the strength of their drafts are usually in the middle to later rounds anyway. The more shots you have in the middle rounds the more chances you get another Halton, Puni, Stout, Warner, or Kittle.

There is a lot of truth to this. Most teams only have a first round grade on 10-15 players in most drafts. Thats why you see a lot of 'reaches" in the mid to late part of the draft but they aren't really reaches in team's eyes because they didnt have a first round grade on the available players so they picked what fit them the most.

And the later you pick the worse the odds get in hitting on a pick. So if you can trade a late first round pick and get a proven pro bowl caliber player that you can lock down to a long term contract then to me its a no brainer. You'd have to have cap room of course and thats probably the main reason you don't see this more often.

Once the collective bargaining agreement kicked in to limit rookie salaries, I don't think the cap has a big impact on the draft.

What I think is happening on those reach picks is particular people, like maybe Kyle or Kocurek, falling in love with a certain player. I know for a fact that some of Kyle's and John's reach picks may have been becuase their player got poached by another Kyle Shanahan draft deciple or coach running another organization. About (i think) 30% of the NFL is run by former 49ers coaches or front office guys. I think it's a big problem for ShanaLynch.

I meant the cap comes into play when trading for a proven player. You will have to pay that player instead of having them on a rookie deal. If you're in position to do that then to me thats a no brainer, trade for the proven player.

Originally posted by All22:
Trading down is a garbage strategy. Just pick the best guys that fit our system and strategy. The only reason the strength of 49ers drafts is in the middle rounds is because those are the picks made by the scouts while Lynch (and Kyle) makes the Day 1 and Day 2 picks.

Usually when they let position coaches pick their guys we get gems (Dugger, Halton, Purdy, Huff etc).

If the 49ers FO was honest with themselves and let everyone stay in their own lanes our drafts would be better. Kyle should basically only pick WR's and late round RBs. John should only pick safeties.

A big part of player drafting and development is coaching. John Lynch as a player didn't play until a new regime happened in Tampa Bay and they had a scheme that fit John's talent. Also player confidence is important. All it takes is one guy on the 49ers staff to inject a negative belief in a player to tank his confidence - especially if he's a rookie.

That's why I think the current way the 49ers are drafting (it's a consensus kind of process) is well done, and they have gotten a lot of low round gems becauseof it. The whole organization believes in each and every player they pick.

As for the first round disappointments, I think 49ers are just getting poached too much in the first round. There are just too many other teams wanting the same kind of players Kyle and John want in the NFL.

Originally posted by CatchMaster80:
After the first 10 or 15 picks the talent level really starts to even out. There may be a top 10 talent that slips down to the bottom of the round because of an injury or some issue but by and large the blue chip guys are gone after the top 15.

Agree 💯 %, those generational genetic freaks are gone usually after those top 10 to 15 picks. That's why if you are picking 32, might as well get more day two and day three picks by trading down. Its a team game, and so for example - I think a all pro DLine and an All Pro Defensive backfield beats a Hall of fame DLine with a good (but not great) defensive backfield. In other words, another approach to the draft is to get more good players versus just getting one great player.

Originally posted by Giedi:
Agree 💯 %, those generational genetic freaks are gone usually after those top 10 to 15 picks. That's why if you are picking 32, might as well get more day two and day three picks by trading down. Its a team game, and so for example - I think a all pro DLine and an All Pro Defensive backfield beats a Hall of fame DLine with a good (but not great) defensive backfield. In other words, another approach to the draft is to get more good players versus just getting one great player.

This. I believe you nailed the 49ers approach to the draft. It is to get more good players versus just getting one great player. Where they draft means they are not going to get that elite player. I think they supplement via trade and if they can get an elite player via trade they will. It is perhaps why I hope they may go after Wilson . . . we'll see.

Originally posted by Giedi:

Originally posted by FL9r:

Originally posted by Kolohe:

Originally posted by 9moon:
Where JOEY at ?? time to sign JOEY !!!

Had enough of broke down Bosa's.

Amen

Amenhotep

Absolutely not, Nick even said Joey wasn't serious about training for football at this point.

Originally posted by AJinUT:

Originally posted by Giedi:
Agree 💯 %, those generational genetic freaks are gone usually after those top 10 to 15 picks. That's why if you are picking 32, might as well get more day two and day three picks by trading down. Its a team game, and so for example - I think a all pro DLine and an All Pro Defensive backfield beats a Hall of fame DLine with a good (but not great) defensive backfield. In other words, another approach to the draft is to get more good players versus just getting one great player.

This. I believe you nailed the 49ers approach to the draft. It is to get more good players versus just getting one great player. Where they draft means they are not going to get that elite player. I think they supplement via trade and if they can get an elite player via trade they will. It is perhaps why I hope they may go after Wilson . . . we'll see.

The NFL is a numbers game. By that I mean the number of healthy players you have is almost as important as who you draft or who your coach is. Drafting more good players vs one great player makes sense because injuries are so common. A lot of top draft picks get injured in that first year.

As I was typing this the station I was listening too was talking about draft picks. They called the bottom of the first round dead man walking territory for GMs. They were pointing out that the Seahawks and Niners will both be drafting at the end of the round as usual so the 3rd rounder the Hawks gave up is like a 4th rounder and then 4th the Niners gave up is like a 5th rounder.

Downs, Thomas, or Wilson? They have to get one of these, right?

Originally posted by CatchMaster80:

Originally posted by AJinUT:

Originally posted by Giedi:
Agree 💯 %, those generational genetic freaks are gone usually after those top 10 to 15 picks. That's why if you are picking 32, might as well get more day two and day three picks by trading down. Its a team game, and so for example - I think a all pro DLine and an All Pro Defensive backfield beats a Hall of fame DLine with a good (but not great) defensive backfield. In other words, another approach to the draft is to get more good players versus just getting one great player.

This. I believe you nailed the 49ers approach to the draft. It is to get more good players versus just getting one great player. Where they draft means they are not going to get that elite player. I think they supplement via trade and if they can get an elite player via trade they will. It is perhaps why I hope they may go after Wilson . . . we'll see.

The NFL is a numbers game. By that I mean the number of healthy players you have is almost as important as who you draft or who your coach is. Drafting more good players vs one great player makes sense because injuries are so common. A lot of top draft picks get injured in that first year.

Pearsall, Stribling and Williams cosign this statement.

Originally posted by Cosmo:

Originally posted by CatchMaster80:

Originally posted by AJinUT:

Originally posted by Giedi:
Agree 💯 %, those generational genetic freaks are gone usually after those top 10 to 15 picks. That's why if you are picking 32, might as well get more day two and day three picks by trading down. Its a team game, and so for example - I think a all pro DLine and an All Pro Defensive backfield beats a Hall of fame DLine with a good (but not great) defensive backfield. In other words, another approach to the draft is to get more good players versus just getting one great player.

This. I believe you nailed the 49ers approach to the draft. It is to get more good players versus just getting one great player. Where they draft means they are not going to get that elite player. I think they supplement via trade and if they can get an elite player via trade they will. It is perhaps why I hope they may go after Wilson . . . we'll see.

The NFL is a numbers game. By that I mean the number of healthy players you have is almost as important as who you draft or who your coach is. Drafting more good players vs one great player makes sense because injuries are so common. A lot of top draft picks get injured in that first year.

Pearsall, Stribling and Williams cosign this statement.

It's that way for a lot of teams. The Giants lost Dart and Skatebo last year. The Vikings, Jets, Saints, Chiefs and Cardinals all lost their first round picks to injury already this year. Stribling was a 2nd rounder because we traded back but he was our top pick.

Originally posted by ScoutingBall:
DEFO is going to be a one year rental. Lynch said he wanted moves that helped not only this year but in the future too. This move doesn't. Not really sure we needed another DT as much as we need EDGE pass rush. We will see if Lynch addresses that later.

Would've much rather gotten Nelson and extended him. We will be without Trent in the near future and Nelson would be an anchor on the OL.

All said, I like the move and give Lynch props for going for it.

Buckner is 32 years old, on an expiring contract, and has already made his big money. For starters, NOBODY is offering him close to a max contract at his age.

On top of that, he has already seen that the grass isn't greener on the other side and has realized winning means something to him. It is very realistic to see him coming back on a a team friendly 1-2 year deal beyond this season, especially if they win the Super Bowl.

Originally posted by miked1978:

Originally posted by Giedi:

Originally posted by miked1978:

Originally posted by Giedi:

I think first round picks are really only valuable if you can pick in the top 10 of the first round. If you aren't picking in the first ten picks, I think trading down is more valuable to the 49ers - the strength of their drafts are usually in the middle to later rounds anyway. The more shots you have in the middle rounds the more chances you get another Halton, Puni, Stout, Warner, or Kittle.

There is a lot of truth to this. Most teams only have a first round grade on 10-15 players in most drafts. Thats why you see a lot of 'reaches" in the mid to late part of the draft but they aren't really reaches in team's eyes because they didnt have a first round grade on the available players so they picked what fit them the most.

And the later you pick the worse the odds get in hitting on a pick. So if you can trade a late first round pick and get a proven pro bowl caliber player that you can lock down to a long term contract then to me its a no brainer. You'd have to have cap room of course and thats probably the main reason you don't see this more often.

Once the collective bargaining agreement kicked in to limit rookie salaries, I don't think the cap has a big impact on the draft.

What I think is happening on those reach picks is particular people, like maybe Kyle or Kocurek, falling in love with a certain player. I know for a fact that some of Kyle's and John's reach picks may have been becuase their player got poached by another Kyle Shanahan draft deciple or coach running another organization. About (i think) 30% of the NFL is run by former 49ers coaches or front office guys. I think it's a big problem for ShanaLynch.

I meant the cap comes into play when trading for a proven player. You will have to pay that player instead of having them on a rookie deal. If you're in position to do that then to me thats a no brainer, trade for the proven player.

The first round pick 5th year player option has definitely impacted draft choices as well as contract extensions.

It encourages teams to trade for pick 31 or 32 and take a QB (or other high demand position) instead of waiting for the top of round 2.

It also discourages the drafting of some positions like OC and OG. The ravens lost Linderbaum because they didnt want to exercise the 5th year option (it included all OL salaries including OTs and not just OC).

Originally posted by Tigerlaw:
The first round pick 5th year player option has definitely impacted draft choices as well as contract extensions.

It encourages teams to trade for pick 31 or 32 and take a QB (or other high demand position) instead of waiting for the top of round 2.

It also discourages the drafting of some positions like OC and OG. The ravens lost Linderbaum because they didnt want to exercise the 5th year option (it included all OL salaries including OTs and not just OC).

can you explain the bolded part?

Originally posted by SB49er4life:

Originally posted by ScoutingBall:
DEFO is going to be a one year rental. Lynch said he wanted moves that helped not only this year but in the future too. This move doesn't. Not really sure we needed another DT as much as we need EDGE pass rush. We will see if Lynch addresses that later.

Would've much rather gotten Nelson and extended him. We will be without Trent in the near future and Nelson would be an anchor on the OL.

All said, I like the move and give Lynch props for going for it.

Buckner is 32 years old, on an expiring contract, and has already made his big money. For starters, NOBODY is offering him close to a max contract at his age.

On top of that, he has already seen that the grass isn't greener on the other side and has realized winning means something to him. It is very realistic to see him coming back on a a team friendly 1-2 year deal beyond this season, especially if they win the Super Bowl.

I can see DeFo taking a reasonable 2-3 year deal to close out his career here, especially if the 49ers have some playoff success to end this season. The familiarity with the franchise will get him to stay. Just hope there aren't any hard feelings from him getting traded to IND.