John Clayton's Insiders Coaches Winners and Losers

Originally posted by InsertNameHere:

Originally posted by ChazBoner:
no matter who we hire(d), we were gonna come out as "losers" because of what Harbaugh accomplished during his tenure.

This.

Nobody would've looked at it like an upgrade to a coach that accomplished as much as Harbaugh.

Now from all accounts Tomusula is a X's O's guy. I've read a lot of "doom and gloom" posts saying he's going to be just like Singletery and I don't think that's going to be the case at all.

Iagree ,folks like to downplay NFL Europe experience where he has some Head Coaching experience ,Plus he has over 30 years of Football experience, Now come on Guys ,surely He has Learned something in that time-frame,and Comparing Him to Singletary is Just Dumb,JT do know His X`s and O`s despite What you think of Him...I tell you what seeing is believing just watch.

Originally posted by jrouter4949:

Originally posted by InsertNameHere:

Originally posted by ChazBoner:
no matter who we hire(d), we were gonna come out as "losers" because of what Harbaugh accomplished during his tenure.

This.

Nobody would've looked at it like an upgrade to a coach that accomplished as much as Harbaugh.

Now from all accounts Tomusula is a X's O's guy. I've read a lot of "doom and gloom" posts saying he's going to be just like Singletery and I don't think that's going to be the case at all.

Iagree ,folks like to downplay NFL Europe experience where he has some Head Coaching experience ,Plus he has over 30 years of Football experience, Now come on Guys ,surely He has Learned something in that time-frame,and Comparing Him to Singletary is Just Dumb,JT do know His X`s and O`s despite What you think of Him...I tell you what seeing is believing just watch.

He's a position coach. That doesn't mean he knows his X's and O's, even on defense. He may know the plays and how to teach within them but the big talent is knowing how to use the X's and O's. For years we've been outschemed by the opposition who clearly had an upper hand in X's and O's against us. So really, at the end of the day, we're going to be reliant upon the OC and DC to be stellar and top notch at the real X's and O's of the game to give us the best chance at winning.

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by jrouter4949:

Originally posted by InsertNameHere:

Originally posted by ChazBoner:
no matter who we hire(d), we were gonna come out as "losers" because of what Harbaugh accomplished during his tenure.

This.

Nobody would've looked at it like an upgrade to a coach that accomplished as much as Harbaugh.

Now from all accounts Tomusula is a X's O's guy. I've read a lot of "doom and gloom" posts saying he's going to be just like Singletery and I don't think that's going to be the case at all.

Iagree ,folks like to downplay NFL Europe experience where he has some Head Coaching experience ,Plus he has over 30 years of Football experience, Now come on Guys ,surely He has Learned something in that time-frame,and Comparing Him to Singletary is Just Dumb,JT do know His X`s and O`s despite What you think of Him...I tell you what seeing is believing just watch.

He's a position coach. That doesn't mean he knows his X's and O's, even on defense. He may know the plays and how to teach within them but the big talent is knowing how to use the X's and O's. For years we've been outschemed by the opposition who clearly had an upper hand in X's and O's against us. So really, at the end of the day, we're going to be reliant upon the OC and DC to be stellar and top notch at the real X's and O's of the game to give us the best chance at winning.

True,but the HC job is to see that you are being outcoached and make some adjustments,you agree?

Originally posted by BuddyRyans46:
espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/12201701/coaching-hires-winners-losers-john-clayton-mailbag

He lists us a "loser." Relevant passage listed below:

1. San Francisco 49ers: "No knock on Jim Tomsula, but it's hard to sell fans on a relatively unknown defensive line coach replacing a guy who reached three consecutive conference title games. Harbaugh had the best/deepest and most experienced coaching staff in football during his tenure and it led to plenty of success before this year's decline. Now that coaching staff has been let go, en masse. Can Tomsula and Co. duplicate that success by the Bay? We'll see, but it seems highly unlikely. The bottom line is this: The Niners had one of the best coaches in the entire league, and they replaced him with a position coach who, at best, is an unknown quantity. That is a huge loss in my book."

His reasoning is pretty sound. They better win next season or the whole organization is going to look like a bunch of fools.

The only way the 49ers ownership can save face is by Tomsula bringing home a Lombardi trophy.

Time will tell if that happens or not, but is anyone here placing bets that it will?

Originally posted by BuddyRyans46:
espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/12201701/coaching-hires-winners-losers-john-clayton-mailbag

He lists us a "loser." Relevant passage listed below:

1. San Francisco 49ers: "No knock on Jim Tomsula, but it's hard to sell fans on a relatively unknown defensive line coach replacing a guy who reached three consecutive conference title games. Harbaugh had the best/deepest and most experienced coaching staff in football during his tenure and it led to plenty of success before this year's decline. Now that coaching staff has been let go, en masse. Can Tomsula and Co. duplicate that success by the Bay? We'll see, but it seems highly unlikely. The bottom line is this: The Niners had one of the best coaches in the entire league, and they replaced him with a position coach who, at best, is an unknown quantity. That is a huge loss in my book."

hey but at least Jed saved a bunch of money.

Originally posted by 49er-from-Yavin-IV:
The only way the 49ers ownership can save face is by Tomsula bringing home a Lombardi trophy.

Time will tell if that happens or not, but is anyone here placing bets that it will?

they are in a lose lose,, if we win a trophy, people will say it was the players from another coach who did it

lol at people who thought clayton was full of s**t when he reported on the niner problems last year but now he is the brain of mr spock.

Originally posted by BuddyRyans46:
espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/12201701/coaching-hires-winners-losers-john-clayton-mailbag

He lists us a "loser." Relevant passage listed below:

1. San Francisco 49ers: "No knock on Jim Tomsula, but it's hard to sell fans on a relatively unknown defensive line coach replacing a guy who reached three consecutive conference title games. Harbaugh had the best/deepest and most experienced coaching staff in football during his tenure and it led to plenty of success before this year's decline. Now that coaching staff has been let go, en masse. Can Tomsula and Co. duplicate that success by the Bay? We'll see, but it seems highly unlikely. The bottom line is this: The Niners had one of the best coaches in the entire league, and they replaced him with a position coach who, at best, is an unknown quantity. That is a huge loss in my book."

Decent, if unnecessary, summary by John C. He's just relaying the obvious. We lost an all star coaching staff with demonstrated success. We're replacing it with a D-Line coach and whatever coordinators might be available in late January. Anything is possible but the odds say we take a nose dive into the cement next year. In that case we hope we can get a better staff assembled for 2016. Who knows Baalke may already know where he wants to go in 2016.

Bottom line, we probably take a further step back in 2015, but hope springs eternal.

Originally posted by OneMoreRing:

Decent, if unnecessary, summary by John C. He's just relaying the obvious. We lost an all star coaching staff with demonstrated success. We're replacing it with a D-Line coach and whatever coordinators might be available in late January. Anything is possible but the odds say we take a nose dive into the cement next year. In that case we hope we can get a better staff assembled for 2016. Who knows Baalke may already know where he wants to go in 2016.

Bottom line, we probably take a further step back in 2015, but hope springs eternal.

This business of losing an all star coaching staff appears to have become received wisdom here. So, educate me.

Fangio had a blinder of a run with massive talent, although he hadn't seemed quite so good before. Donatell, yes certainly sorry to see him go. On the offensive side, though, I am fascinated to learn who these all-star coaches were and what they were doing last year. Rathman was ok. I didn't see much else on the O.

Originally posted by English:

Originally posted by OneMoreRing:
Decent, if unnecessary, summary by John C. He's just relaying the obvious. We lost an all star coaching staff with demonstrated success. We're replacing it with a D-Line coach and whatever coordinators might be available in late January. Anything is possible but the odds say we take a nose dive into the cement next year. In that case we hope we can get a better staff assembled for 2016. Who knows Baalke may already know where he wants to go in 2016.

Bottom line, we probably take a further step back in 2015, but hope springs eternal.

This business of losing an all star coaching staff appears to have become received wisdom here. So, educate me.

Fangio had a blinder of a run with massive talent, although he hadn't seemed quite so good before. Donatell, yes certainly sorry to see him go. On the offensive side, though, I am fascinated to learn who these all-star coaches were and what they were doing last year. Rathman was ok. I didn't see much else on the O.

I guess you can tune out all the other NFL voices that lauded Harbaughs staff for the last 4 years, but you can't tune out the numbers. Harbaugh took a team that had not seen the playoffs in 9 years and ended their previous season 6-10 to 13-3 in one year and then won 2 playoff games with Alex Smith...

Fangio took a defense that allowed 346 points and only allowed 229, 2nd best in the league that year. And the next year there was a super bowl berth, followed by yet another NFC championship game...this was a rock star staff, and we're highly unlikely to get anywhere close to where they went (I hope I am wrong but the simple odds are against it)

2010 San Francisco 49ers 6-10
Scored 305 points (19.1/g), 24th of 32 in the NFL. Allowed 346 points (21.6/g), 16th

2011 San Francisco 49ers
Scored 380 points (23.8/g), 11th of 32 in the NFL. Allowed 229 points (14.3/g), 2nd. Differential of 151 points

Originally posted by OneMoreRing:

I guess you can tune out all the other NFL voices that lauded Harbaughs staff for the last 4 years, but you can't tune out the numbers. Harbaugh took a team that had not seen the playoffs in 9 years and ended their previous season 6-10 to 13-3 in one year and then won 2 playoff games with Alex Smith...

Fangio took a defense that allowed 346 points and only allowed 229, 2nd best in the league that year. And the next year there was a super bowl berth, followed by yet another NFC championship game...this was a rock star staff, and we're highly unlikely to get anywhere close to where they went (I hope I am wrong but the simple odds are against it)

2010 San Francisco 49ers 6-10
Scored 305 points (19.1/g), 24th of 32 in the NFL. Allowed 346 points (21.6/g), 16th

2011 San Francisco 49ers
Scored 380 points (23.8/g), 11th of 32 in the NFL. Allowed 229 points (14.3/g), 2nd. Differential of 151 points

you realize the defensive roster was very different from '10 to '11

Originally posted by boast:

Originally posted by OneMoreRing:
I guess you can tune out all the other NFL voices that lauded Harbaughs staff for the last 4 years, but you can't tune out the numbers. Harbaugh took a team that had not seen the playoffs in 9 years and ended their previous season 6-10 to 13-3 in one year and then won 2 playoff games with Alex Smith...

Fangio took a defense that allowed 346 points and only allowed 229, 2nd best in the league that year. And the next year there was a super bowl berth, followed by yet another NFC championship game...this was a rock star staff, and we're highly unlikely to get anywhere close to where they went (I hope I am wrong but the simple odds are against it)

2010 San Francisco 49ers 6-10
Scored 305 points (19.1/g), 24th of 32 in the NFL. Allowed 346 points (21.6/g), 16th

2011 San Francisco 49ers
Scored 380 points (23.8/g), 11th of 32 in the NFL. Allowed 229 points (14.3/g), 2nd. Differential of 151 points

you realize the defensive roster was very different from '10 to '11

It was different, I wouldn't say very different - they lost some good players (Nate Clements) and gained some others (Aldon Smith). Many of the pieces were the same - not going to list them all for you, you can look them up yourself.

Amazed anyone wants to argue that we lost an all star coaching staff this month.

Originally posted by OneMoreRing:
I guess you can tune out all the other NFL voices that lauded Harbaughs staff for the last 4 years, but you can't tune out the numbers. Harbaugh took a team that had not seen the playoffs in 9 years and ended their previous season 6-10 to 13-3 in one year and then won 2 playoff games with Alex Smith...

Fangio took a defense that allowed 346 points and only allowed 229, 2nd best in the league that year. And the next year there was a super bowl berth, followed by yet another NFC championship game...this was a rock star staff, and we're highly unlikely to get anywhere close to where they went (I hope I am wrong but the simple odds are against it)

2010 San Francisco 49ers 6-10
Scored 305 points (19.1/g), 24th of 32 in the NFL. Allowed 346 points (21.6/g), 16th

2011 San Francisco 49ers
Scored 380 points (23.8/g), 11th of 32 in the NFL. Allowed 229 points (14.3/g), 2nd. Differential of 151 points

What about the numbers for 2014?