i just found clarity

Eddie D was in his early 30's when he bought the team

It's worth reviewing Uncle Eddie's age in 1981. It certainly wasn't anywhere near the average of your exemplary sample

Edit: Again, I'm increasingly finding this ownership fetish objectionable. It completely overlooks the role that Carmen Policy played in our club's dominance. In Freudian terms, he was the Super Ego that held the team together between DeBartolo's ID and Walsh and Seifert's titanic Egos.

[ Edited by BubbaParisMVP on Oct 13, 2010 at 22:53:56 ]

Originally posted by davemo4:
just finished a beer and read the new sports illustrated and found the following info....Woody Johnson, 63...Jeff Lurie, 59....Bill Pollian, 67...Bob Kraft, 69...Dan Rooney, 78....

the 9ers have jed....28 years old....why are we fans stressing....there is no way this team can compete or will ever be good under this ownership....

no general manager...no quality coaches....no vision...no understanding.....whatever.....

Woah, Manusky is a really good coach. And to be fair Singletary would at least look like a good coach if he had a QB that was even worth a darn, like uh, I'll say it for the 10000th time McNabb I mean we'd be 4-1 with the man and we're 0-5 with you know who. But since Sing stuck with him for way to long it's too late Sing has to go.

Originally posted by waiting4number6:

Originally posted by davemo4:
just finished a beer and read the new sports illustrated and found the following info....Woody Johnson, 63...Jeff Lurie, 59....Bill Pollian, 67...Bob Kraft, 69...Dan Rooney, 78....

the 9ers have jed....28 years old....why are we fans stressing....there is no way this team can compete or will ever be good under this ownership....

no general manager...no quality coaches....no vision...no understanding.....whatever.....

Woah, Manusky is a really good coach. And to be fair Singletary would at least look like a good coach if he had a QB that was even worth a darn, like uh, I'll say it for the 10000th time McNabb I mean we'd be 4-1 with the man and we're 0-5 with you know who. But since Sing stuck with him for way to long it's too late Sing has to go.

No he wouldn't. He was 3-3 with Shaun Hill as the starter and 5-5 with Smith as the starter. THat's basically the same record. Then Shaun looked like he couldn't move our offense at all because of his arm, and he goes to Detroit and looks like a good QB? Seriously? First we all blamed it on Hill that he had a noodle arm and couldn't move the offense/score many points. Then we blamed it on Raye. Now we're blaming it on Smith. What is the common denominator there? SINGLETARY. Steve Young said he looked like he was meddling in the offense, Eric Branch said it, and even Singletary said after the eagles game "well I dont want to throw the ball around that much, I want to have a balance" after he said Mike Johnson would be the one calling the plays. SOon Smith will get benched for Carr and then we'll be blaming him or Mike Johnson. Fact is, Singletary likes meddling on offense rather than helping out his defense and he has no x's and o's knowledge.

Smith's not very good but he's not as bad as he's made out to be all the time either. He's a mediocre QB. But other teams win around their running attack. The Jets base their offense on a running game last year and made it to the conference championship game even though they had a rookie QB who threw 20 picks. The Chiefs this year have compensated for a mediocre QB in Cassel by running the ball a lot and they're 3-1. Flacco has the same passer rating and Smith and more picks than TDs, but the Ravens are 3-1 and Ray Rice is a beast. The Cardinals have no QB and they have won 3/5. These teams have compensated poor QB play with good defense and running game, exactly what Sing said he wanted to be. But the problem is, our running game consists of slamming Gore into the back of his OL and our defense is ranked 26th in the league. Sing is useless.

If we kept him around and gave him another QB and another OC what would he do then? Ruin a QB like Luck or Locker's development? Shackle the OC down. He had a good OC in Martz and he dumped him because even though Martz won games for him with a good passing attack and some decent yards per carry from Gore it made Sing nervous. It wasn't vanilla enough. Just like we need a new QB, we need a new HC and a new philosophy.

Originally posted by WillistheWall:

Originally posted by waiting4number6:

Originally posted by davemo4:
just finished a beer and read the new sports illustrated and found the following info....Woody Johnson, 63...Jeff Lurie, 59....Bill Pollian, 67...Bob Kraft, 69...Dan Rooney, 78....

the 9ers have jed....28 years old....why are we fans stressing....there is no way this team can compete or will ever be good under this ownership....

no general manager...no quality coaches....no vision...no understanding.....whatever.....

Woah, Manusky is a really good coach. And to be fair Singletary would at least look like a good coach if he had a QB that was even worth a darn, like uh, I'll say it for the 10000th time McNabb I mean we'd be 4-1 with the man and we're 0-5 with you know who. But since Sing stuck with him for way to long it's too late Sing has to go.

No he wouldn't. He was 3-3 with Shaun Hill as the starter and 5-5 with Smith as the starter. THat's basically the same record. Then Shaun looked like he couldn't move our offense at all because of his arm, and he goes to Detroit and looks like a good QB? Seriously? First we all blamed it on Hill that he had a noodle arm and couldn't move the offense/score many points. Then we blamed it on Raye. Now we're blaming it on Smith. What is the common denominator there? SINGLETARY. Steve Young said he looked like he was meddling in the offense, Eric Branch said it, and even Singletary said after the eagles game "well I dont want to throw the ball around that much, I want to have a balance" after he said Mike Johnson would be the one calling the plays. SOon Smith will get benched for Carr and then we'll be blaming him or Mike Johnson. Fact is, Singletary likes meddling on offense rather than helping out his defense and he has no x's and o's knowledge.

Smith's not very good but he's not as bad as he's made out to be all the time either. He's a mediocre QB. But other teams win around their running attack. The Jets base their offense on a running game last year and made it to the conference championship game even though they had a rookie QB who threw 20 picks. The Chiefs this year have compensated for a mediocre QB in Cassel by running the ball a lot and they're 3-1. Flacco has the same passer rating and Smith and more picks than TDs, but the Ravens are 3-1 and Ray Rice is a beast. The Cardinals have no QB and they have won 3/5. These teams have compensated poor QB play with good defense and running game, exactly what Sing said he wanted to be. But the problem is, our running game consists of slamming Gore into the back of his OL and our defense is ranked 26th in the league. Sing is useless.

If we kept him around and gave him another QB and another OC what would he do then? Ruin a QB like Luck or Locker's development? Shackle the OC down. He had a good OC in Martz and he dumped him because even though Martz won games for him with a good passing attack and some decent yards per carry from Gore it made Sing nervous. It wasn't vanilla enough. Just like we need a new QB, we need a new HC and a new philosophy.

If we do the obvious thing and trade for McNabb we're 3-1. Hell against the Saints if we kick 2 FGs on 1st f'ing down instead of Alex throwing 2 picks we win. Let alone the Seattle, Falcon, and Philly games. Our defense is ranked low cuz of Alex, if well again McNabb was here we blow out Seattle like we were about to till Alex missed an easy TD, and then kept throwing the ball back to Seattle, and hell we limited the Saints on MNF, and kept Matty Ice under 20 in his house. We have a QB or uh the Pro Bowl QB we should of gotten we're 4-1 and sitting pretty. But that didn't happen because our front office can judge talent at about every position, but the most important one. Well at least on the bright side I guess we're like the most talented and best 0-5 in the history of the League whatever the hell that means.

lulZ

Originally posted by waiting4number6:

Originally posted by WillistheWall:

Originally posted by waiting4number6:

Originally posted by davemo4:
just finished a beer and read the new sports illustrated and found the following info....Woody Johnson, 63...Jeff Lurie, 59....Bill Pollian, 67...Bob Kraft, 69...Dan Rooney, 78....

the 9ers have jed....28 years old....why are we fans stressing....there is no way this team can compete or will ever be good under this ownership....

no general manager...no quality coaches....no vision...no understanding.....whatever.....

Woah, Manusky is a really good coach. And to be fair Singletary would at least look like a good coach if he had a QB that was even worth a darn, like uh, I'll say it for the 10000th time McNabb I mean we'd be 4-1 with the man and we're 0-5 with you know who. But since Sing stuck with him for way to long it's too late Sing has to go.

No he wouldn't. He was 3-3 with Shaun Hill as the starter and 5-5 with Smith as the starter. THat's basically the same record. Then Shaun looked like he couldn't move our offense at all because of his arm, and he goes to Detroit and looks like a good QB? Seriously? First we all blamed it on Hill that he had a noodle arm and couldn't move the offense/score many points. Then we blamed it on Raye. Now we're blaming it on Smith. What is the common denominator there? SINGLETARY. Steve Young said he looked like he was meddling in the offense, Eric Branch said it, and even Singletary said after the eagles game "well I dont want to throw the ball around that much, I want to have a balance" after he said Mike Johnson would be the one calling the plays. SOon Smith will get benched for Carr and then we'll be blaming him or Mike Johnson. Fact is, Singletary likes meddling on offense rather than helping out his defense and he has no x's and o's knowledge.

Smith's not very good but he's not as bad as he's made out to be all the time either. He's a mediocre QB. But other teams win around their running attack. The Jets base their offense on a running game last year and made it to the conference championship game even though they had a rookie QB who threw 20 picks. The Chiefs this year have compensated for a mediocre QB in Cassel by running the ball a lot and they're 3-1. Flacco has the same passer rating and Smith and more picks than TDs, but the Ravens are 3-1 and Ray Rice is a beast. The Cardinals have no QB and they have won 3/5. These teams have compensated poor QB play with good defense and running game, exactly what Sing said he wanted to be. But the problem is, our running game consists of slamming Gore into the back of his OL and our defense is ranked 26th in the league. Sing is useless.

If we kept him around and gave him another QB and another OC what would he do then? Ruin a QB like Luck or Locker's development? Shackle the OC down. He had a good OC in Martz and he dumped him because even though Martz won games for him with a good passing attack and some decent yards per carry from Gore it made Sing nervous. It wasn't vanilla enough. Just like we need a new QB, we need a new HC and a new philosophy.

If we do the obvious thing and trade for McNabb we're 3-1. Hell against the Saints if we kick 2 FGs on 1st f'ing down instead of Alex throwing 2 picks we win. Let alone the Seattle, Falcon, and Philly games. Our defense is ranked low cuz of Alex, if well again McNabb was here we blow out Seattle like we were about to till Alex missed an easy TD, and then kept throwing the ball back to Seattle, and hell we limited the Saints on MNF, and kept Matty Ice under 20 in his house. We have a QB or uh the Pro Bowl QB we should of gotten we're 4-1 and sitting pretty. But that didn't happen because our front office can judge talent at about every position, but the most important one. Well at least on the bright side I guess we're like the most talented and best 0-5 in the history of the League whatever the hell that means.

Not all of those INTs were Alex's fault. Some of them were bounced off Crab's hands. He turns the ball over too much but you're playing a stupid game right here. You're saying that McNabb would've done everything that Alex did well, and done it without the mistakes. And the reality is if you change one thing you change everything that happened in that game. How do you know McNabb would've made the TD drive that Smith did to tie the Saints? Then the defense lets them down. So what you're saying is McNabb wouldn't have had any INTs and would've led a last second drive? He's a good QB but he hasn't been perfect in his career either. It's not like McNabb could've done anything about the snap over Smith's head that went for a safety and led to another TD. And the Chiefs game? Nothing McNabb could've done about that, Sing got plainly outcoached right there.

Like I said, Smith is A REASON why we've lost. But he's not the WHOLE reason. If you honestly think we'd by 5-0 or whatever you're somewhat delusional. I think at best we'd be 3-2 with McNabb. Which is pretty good and we should've gone after him. But it could easily be 1-4 or 2-3. And it's not like Sing can evaluate QBs anyway since he stuck with Smith over a guy like McNabb anyway so why do you want to keep him around exactly?

Originally posted by waiting4number6:

Originally posted by davemo4:
just finished a beer and read the new sports illustrated and found the following info....Woody Johnson, 63...Jeff Lurie, 59....Bill Pollian, 67...Bob Kraft, 69...Dan Rooney, 78....

the 9ers have jed....28 years old....why are we fans stressing....there is no way this team can compete or will ever be good under this ownership....

no general manager...no quality coaches....no vision...no understanding.....whatever.....

Woah, Manusky is a really good coach. And to be fair Singletary would at least look like a good coach if he had a QB that was even worth a darn, like uh, I'll say it for the 10000th time McNabb I mean we'd be 4-1 with the man and we're 0-5 with you know who. But since Sing stuck with him for way to long it's too late Sing has to go.

Dude, Shaun Hill had a 87.5 QB rating under Martz in 2008 and Singletary threw it away to bring in Raye. Hill's performance dropped dramatically in Raye's system and he got benched. McNabb is a WCO QB who's more inaccurate than even Alex. With Sing's hands on an Offense, ain't no QB doing well here, unless their name is Manning or Brady.

Originally posted by binary2nd:

Originally posted by waiting4number6:

Originally posted by davemo4:
just finished a beer and read the new sports illustrated and found the following info....Woody Johnson, 63...Jeff Lurie, 59....Bill Pollian, 67...Bob Kraft, 69...Dan Rooney, 78....

the 9ers have jed....28 years old....why are we fans stressing....there is no way this team can compete or will ever be good under this ownership....

no general manager...no quality coaches....no vision...no understanding.....whatever.....

Woah, Manusky is a really good coach. And to be fair Singletary would at least look like a good coach if he had a QB that was even worth a darn, like uh, I'll say it for the 10000th time McNabb I mean we'd be 4-1 with the man and we're 0-5 with you know who. But since Sing stuck with him for way to long it's too late Sing has to go.

Dude, Shaun Hill had a 87.5 QB rating under Martz in 2008 and Singletary threw it away to bring in Raye. Hill's performance dropped dramatically in Raye's system and he got benched. McNabb is a WCO QB who's more inaccurate than even Alex. With Sing's hands on an Offense, ain't no QB doing well here, unless their name is Manning or Brady.

THANK YOU. This is exactly what I've been trying to tell him.

Originally posted by WillistheWall:

Originally posted by waiting4number6:

Originally posted by WillistheWall:

Originally posted by waiting4number6:

Originally posted by davemo4:
just finished a beer and read the new sports illustrated and found the following info....Woody Johnson, 63...Jeff Lurie, 59....Bill Pollian, 67...Bob Kraft, 69...Dan Rooney, 78....

the 9ers have jed....28 years old....why are we fans stressing....there is no way this team can compete or will ever be good under this ownership....

no general manager...no quality coaches....no vision...no understanding.....whatever.....

Woah, Manusky is a really good coach. And to be fair Singletary would at least look like a good coach if he had a QB that was even worth a darn, like uh, I'll say it for the 10000th time McNabb I mean we'd be 4-1 with the man and we're 0-5 with you know who. But since Sing stuck with him for way to long it's too late Sing has to go.

No he wouldn't. He was 3-3 with Shaun Hill as the starter and 5-5 with Smith as the starter. THat's basically the same record. Then Shaun looked like he couldn't move our offense at all because of his arm, and he goes to Detroit and looks like a good QB? Seriously? First we all blamed it on Hill that he had a noodle arm and couldn't move the offense/score many points. Then we blamed it on Raye. Now we're blaming it on Smith. What is the common denominator there? SINGLETARY. Steve Young said he looked like he was meddling in the offense, Eric Branch said it, and even Singletary said after the eagles game "well I dont want to throw the ball around that much, I want to have a balance" after he said Mike Johnson would be the one calling the plays. SOon Smith will get benched for Carr and then we'll be blaming him or Mike Johnson. Fact is, Singletary likes meddling on offense rather than helping out his defense and he has no x's and o's knowledge.

Smith's not very good but he's not as bad as he's made out to be all the time either. He's a mediocre QB. But other teams win around their running attack. The Jets base their offense on a running game last year and made it to the conference championship game even though they had a rookie QB who threw 20 picks. The Chiefs this year have compensated for a mediocre QB in Cassel by running the ball a lot and they're 3-1. Flacco has the same passer rating and Smith and more picks than TDs, but the Ravens are 3-1 and Ray Rice is a beast. The Cardinals have no QB and they have won 3/5. These teams have compensated poor QB play with good defense and running game, exactly what Sing said he wanted to be. But the problem is, our running game consists of slamming Gore into the back of his OL and our defense is ranked 26th in the league. Sing is useless.

If we kept him around and gave him another QB and another OC what would he do then? Ruin a QB like Luck or Locker's development? Shackle the OC down. He had a good OC in Martz and he dumped him because even though Martz won games for him with a good passing attack and some decent yards per carry from Gore it made Sing nervous. It wasn't vanilla enough. Just like we need a new QB, we need a new HC and a new philosophy.

If we do the obvious thing and trade for McNabb we're 3-1. Hell against the Saints if we kick 2 FGs on 1st f'ing down instead of Alex throwing 2 picks we win. Let alone the Seattle, Falcon, and Philly games. Our defense is ranked low cuz of Alex, if well again McNabb was here we blow out Seattle like we were about to till Alex missed an easy TD, and then kept throwing the ball back to Seattle, and hell we limited the Saints on MNF, and kept Matty Ice under 20 in his house. We have a QB or uh the Pro Bowl QB we should of gotten we're 4-1 and sitting pretty. But that didn't happen because our front office can judge talent at about every position, but the most important one. Well at least on the bright side I guess we're like the most talented and best 0-5 in the history of the League whatever the hell that means.

Not all of those INTs were Alex's fault. Some of them were bounced off Crab's hands. He turns the ball over too much but you're playing a stupid game right here. You're saying that McNabb would've done everything that Alex did well, and done it without the mistakes. And the reality is if you change one thing you change everything that happened in that game. How do you know McNabb would've made the TD drive that Smith did to tie the Saints? Then the defense lets them down. So what you're saying is McNabb wouldn't have had any INTs and would've led a last second drive? He's a good QB but he hasn't been perfect in his career either. It's not like McNabb could've done anything about the snap over Smith's head that went for a safety and led to another TD. And the Chiefs game? Nothing McNabb could've done about that, Sing got plainly outcoached right there.

Like I said, Smith is A REASON why we've lost. But he's not the WHOLE reason. If you honestly think we'd by 5-0 or whatever you're somewhat delusional. I think at best we'd be 3-2 with McNabb. Which is pretty good and we should've gone after him. But it could easily be 1-4 or 2-3. And it's not like Sing can evaluate QBs anyway since he stuck with Smith over a guy like McNabb anyway so why do you want to keep him around exactly?

The moron leads the League in INT's and he had a Garo uypremian type fumble against Philly, Gore had 2 fumbles, but Gore has been great all year, ALex has been doing stuff like that all year long (watch the only TD Washington had in Super Bowl 7 if you dont know who that is I probably got the spelling wrong but still). He doesn't commit that fumble for TD or the other 2 TO's we win. He gets us down the field ONE TIME ONLY ONCE, after we're up 14-0 for just a FG we win, even with Nate's fumble ONE F'ING FG. If again we kick 2 FGs on 1st down going into score we win instead 2 INT's. If ALex could hit a wide open Norris then we up 10-0 and we can run the ball control the clock keep playing the great D we were playing before Alex literally threw the game away. IE 4-1 with hell maybe Shaun Hill, let alone A PRO BOWL QB who I don't even like, but compared to Alex he's freaking Steve Young. And I don't want ALex or Sing around anymore. The fact Sing didn't bench Alex after week no even during week 1, but now it's week 5 and we should be 4-1 and we're 0-5 cuz of this moronic QB, uh unh Sing should be fired and Alex should be cut and should of been banned from starting 2 years ago, but Jed is too stupid and immature to do either of those things.

[ Edited by waiting4number6 on Oct 13, 2010 at 23:30:16 ]

Originally posted by binary2nd:

Originally posted by waiting4number6:

Originally posted by davemo4:
just finished a beer and read the new sports illustrated and found the following info....Woody Johnson, 63...Jeff Lurie, 59....Bill Pollian, 67...Bob Kraft, 69...Dan Rooney, 78....

the 9ers have jed....28 years old....why are we fans stressing....there is no way this team can compete or will ever be good under this ownership....

no general manager...no quality coaches....no vision...no understanding.....whatever.....

Woah, Manusky is a really good coach. And to be fair Singletary would at least look like a good coach if he had a QB that was even worth a darn, like uh, I'll say it for the 10000th time McNabb I mean we'd be 4-1 with the man and we're 0-5 with you know who. But since Sing stuck with him for way to long it's too late Sing has to go.

Dude, Shaun Hill had a 87.5 QB rating under Martz in 2008 and Singletary threw it away to bring in Raye. Hill's performance dropped dramatically in Raye's system and he got benched. McNabb is a WCO QB who's more inaccurate than even Alex. With Sing's hands on an Offense, ain't no QB doing well here, unless their name is Manning or Brady.

Shaun basically beat the Vikes in Minnesota if it wasn't for black magic Favre, it's and even still we were 3-1 and then he couldn't throw for some reason part it was the line, but the main problem he couldn't throw down field or throw well at all. It was like watching Nick Folk fall apart, but like Nick, Shaun is awake again. So hey maybe he was injured, but with McNabb in here shoot we are 4-1. Hell if we kick 2 FGs on 1st down going into score we beat New Orleans, let alone having any type of good QB in here.

Originally posted by waiting4number6:

Originally posted by binary2nd:

Originally posted by waiting4number6:

Originally posted by davemo4:
just finished a beer and read the new sports illustrated and found the following info....Woody Johnson, 63...Jeff Lurie, 59....Bill Pollian, 67...Bob Kraft, 69...Dan Rooney, 78....

the 9ers have jed....28 years old....why are we fans stressing....there is no way this team can compete or will ever be good under this ownership....

no general manager...no quality coaches....no vision...no understanding.....whatever.....

Woah, Manusky is a really good coach. And to be fair Singletary would at least look like a good coach if he had a QB that was even worth a darn, like uh, I'll say it for the 10000th time McNabb I mean we'd be 4-1 with the man and we're 0-5 with you know who. But since Sing stuck with him for way to long it's too late Sing has to go.

Dude, Shaun Hill had a 87.5 QB rating under Martz in 2008 and Singletary threw it away to bring in Raye. Hill's performance dropped dramatically in Raye's system and he got benched. McNabb is a WCO QB who's more inaccurate than even Alex. With Sing's hands on an Offense, ain't no QB doing well here, unless their name is Manning or Brady.

Shaun basically beat the Vikes in Minnesota if it wasn't for black magic Favre, it's and even still we were 3-1 and then he couldn't throw for some reason part it was the line, but the main problem he couldn't throw down field or throw well at all. It was like watching Nick Folk fall apart, but like Nick, Shaun is awake again. So hey maybe he was injured, but with McNabb in here shoot we are 4-1. Hell if we kick 2 FGs on 1st down going into score we beat New Orleans, let alone having any type of good QB in here.

So you're blaming it on a mysterious injury or the line but the dropoff in Shaun's performance had nothing to do with Sing/Raye? Seriously? Read what you wrote dude. "it was like watching nick folk fall apart, but like Nick, Shaun is awake again". Jeez and the only thing that changed was he went to a different team with a more intelligent coaching staff

Originally posted by WillistheWall:

Originally posted by waiting4number6:

Originally posted by binary2nd:

Originally posted by waiting4number6:

Originally posted by davemo4:
just finished a beer and read the new sports illustrated and found the following info....Woody Johnson, 63...Jeff Lurie, 59....Bill Pollian, 67...Bob Kraft, 69...Dan Rooney, 78....

the 9ers have jed....28 years old....why are we fans stressing....there is no way this team can compete or will ever be good under this ownership....

no general manager...no quality coaches....no vision...no understanding.....whatever.....

Woah, Manusky is a really good coach. And to be fair Singletary would at least look like a good coach if he had a QB that was even worth a darn, like uh, I'll say it for the 10000th time McNabb I mean we'd be 4-1 with the man and we're 0-5 with you know who. But since Sing stuck with him for way to long it's too late Sing has to go.

Dude, Shaun Hill had a 87.5 QB rating under Martz in 2008 and Singletary threw it away to bring in Raye. Hill's performance dropped dramatically in Raye's system and he got benched. McNabb is a WCO QB who's more inaccurate than even Alex. With Sing's hands on an Offense, ain't no QB doing well here, unless their name is Manning or Brady.

Shaun basically beat the Vikes in Minnesota if it wasn't for black magic Favre, it's and even still we were 3-1 and then he couldn't throw for some reason part it was the line, but the main problem he couldn't throw down field or throw well at all. It was like watching Nick Folk fall apart, but like Nick, Shaun is awake again. So hey maybe he was injured, but with McNabb in here shoot we are 4-1. Hell if we kick 2 FGs on 1st down going into score we beat New Orleans, let alone having any type of good QB in here.

So you're blaming it on a mysterious injury or the line but the dropoff in Shaun's performance had nothing to do with Sing/Raye? Seriously? Read what you wrote dude. "it was like watching nick folk fall apart, but like Nick, Shaun is awake again". Jeez and the only thing that changed was he went to a different team with a more intelligent coaching staff

Partly it was the coachings fault, but weeks 1-4 he was good as he could be better than he is now, cuz then he wasn't turning the ball over he is now in Mo-Town. But he could not throw NFL balls like his performance he just wasn't doing it, he just didn't do it. Now I still wanted him to stay in because I knew Alex wasn't worth anything and Shaun had and still has a winning record as a starter.