Is Baas permanent answer at center?

Originally posted by oldninerdude:

Originally posted by MadDog49er:

Originally posted by Kilgore_Trout:

Originally posted by Allx9er:

Originally posted by MadDog49er:

Originally posted by Allx9er:
does anybody know how many years heitman has left on his contract? i know baas is on a one year deal.

Heitmann's contract runs through the next two years. He will be a free agent in 2012.

hmm...heitmann's 31-32 right, baas 25-26? and heitmann really only has a deal that's one year longer. interesting

It is obvious the team is trying to build an O-line that fits the identity Singletary wants for the team. Heitmann doesn't fit that identity, and it remains to be seen if Baas can be smash mouth or not at center. But my money is on him winning this job, for the season, because of his age and his upside. It follows the same line of thinking for why Iupati and Davis were inserted from practically the get. If Baas plays well through the preseason and in the opener and whatever remaining time Heitmann is out, there would be no reason to mess with the new and developing chemistry between the young guys.

Honestly, you don't know what you are talking about. So, please stop. When you say "Heitmann doesn't fit that identity", let me ask you a couple questions:
1) Who was the unquestioned starter at center before Heitmann's injury? Uh, Heitmann. Baas wasn't even in contention for the starting job.
2) If "Heitmann doesn't fit that identity", then why have the Niners bypassed drafting a center the past two years, including the 2009 Draft?
3) If "Heitmann doesn't fit that identity", then why did the Niners not pursue a center in free agency?

Heitmann was going to be the starter. This was unquestioned. The only reason Baas is getting snaps at all (he hasn't even been declared the starter for game 1 over Wragge yet), is because Heitmann is injured.

You don't know what you are talking about. Sorry, but your level of knowledge in the game is low. Watch the rest of the league, do some reading, and strip yourself of your bias against Heitmann. Until then, stop posting naive posts. They are embarrassing.

Well, this obviously needs some translation from the Intergalactic Maddog-Speak:

"Honestly, . . . " This means "Let me add the word 'honestly' to what I'm about to say, to counteract the impression that Immabout to bullsh*t you, cause that's what Immabout to do."

". . . you don't know what you're talking about." This translates: "the opinions you are expressing do not agree with my own, so I'm going to question your ethics, heritage, motives, lifestyle, religion, football knowledge, intellect, and right to exist."

"So please stop." This means: "So please stop disagreeing with me, it makes me feel uncomfortable."

"Who was the unquestioned starter at center before Heitmann's injury? Uh, Heitmann. Baas wasn't even in contention for the starter's job." This means: "I'm going to completely ignore the fact that Baas got multiple reps at center with the starters during OTAs and TC because its a fact that does not support my thesis."

". . . why have the Niners bypassed drafting a center the past two years, including the 2009 draft?" Translation: "Cody Wallace does not count as a center because he practiced and played a few snaps at guard, and besides, he was drafted by McCloughan, who's not even with the Niners anymore. Plus he was drafted in 2008, and that's so long ago (in light years) that I can barely remember it. On MY planet, there is no word for 'Cody Wallace' or anyone else who might disprove what I'm saying."

"If 'Heitmann doesn't fit that [smashmouth] identity,' then why did the Niners not pursue a center in free agency." Translation: "Imma gonna ignore the fact that there really wasn't a viable FA center available (Mawae being way too old) this year. I'm just going to ask the question, cause it seems to support my position. That's just the way I roll."

"Heitmann was going to be the starter. This was unquestioned." Translation: "It certainly was unquestioned BY ME, because I love Heitmann sooo much, and, well, you know he's just the greatest, an all. So I pretend that the coaches love him too. All that news and stuff about Baas and Wragge getting reps with the first team during OTAs, that wasn't really serious, cause that might have hurt his feelers. Next year, Ima pretend he was in the Pro Bowl. Maybe he'll send me his autographs."

"You don't know what you're talking about" "because you don't agree with me."

"Sorry, but your level of knowledge in the game is low." This means: "I'm repeating this simply for effect, cause the first time I said it, you may not have been properly and sufficiently insulted and humiliated. 'Your level of knowledge in the game is low.' Better add a quart."

". . . strip yourself of your bias against Heitmann." Translation: "Watch him play in your skivies. It's very liberating."

". . . stop posting naive posts. They are embarrassing." Translation: "Your views do not conform to those of myself and others from my planet. One of us is wrong, and it would be embarrassing if it were me, so it must be you. But stop anyway, just in case its me."

Those of us from this planet, Earth, hope this helps. Or at least amuses somewhat.

Wow! You must write professionally. Remind me to keep on your good side. =) Edit: And very funny!

[ Edited by Kilgore_Trout on Aug 21, 2010 at 00:09:14 ]

Time to join MadDog's defense (not that he really needs me). I agree with MadDog that you won't find any sportswriter anywhere that says that Eric Heitman of the 49ers needs to be replaced (like many of you, I read most of the articles on the Webzone). Now some sportswriters may not know much about offensive line, but there are many analysts out there today that are former players. You would think that at least some of them would be able to identify whether Eric is a liability on the line.

On the other hand, when is the last time that Eric went to the Pro Bowl? The answer, of course, is never. He is not viewed as an elite center in the NFL. As such, he could lose his job to a player that the 49ers believe has a chance to be elite. Is Baas that player? I think at this point we would have to say probably not, however he will have several more games to argue the case. Even if the 49ers decide that Baas is better than Eric, Eric should probably not be on the bench. I think Rachal is in danger of losing his starting job, and if Baas continues to play well, either Baas or Eric will take over the RG spot. I always thought that with Iupati being drafted, it was not a foregone conclusion that Baas would be on the bench. He only needed to prove that he was at least the second best guard of the three: Rachal, Iupati, and himself.

It's funny. Heitmann is clearly the best Olineman we have and everybody bashes him, lol.

Originally posted by truekingcarlos:
It's funny. Heitmann is clearly the best Olineman we have and everybody bashes him, lol.

Heitman gets pushed back often it seems. Baas is a nasty dude and would think he's a stronger run blocker. Whoever plays next to Iupati is going to look good in the run game. This is Baas' shot.

Originally posted by Kilgore_Trout:

Originally posted by MadDog49er:

Originally posted by Kilgore_Trout:

Originally posted by Allx9er:

Originally posted by MadDog49er:

Originally posted by Allx9er:
does anybody know how many years heitman has left on his contract? i know baas is on a one year deal.

Heitmann's contract runs through the next two years. He will be a free agent in 2012.

hmm...heitmann's 31-32 right, baas 25-26? and heitmann really only has a deal that's one year longer. interesting

It is obvious the team is trying to build an O-line that fits the identity Singletary wants for the team. Heitmann doesn't fit that identity, and it remains to be seen if Baas can be smash mouth or not at center. But my money is on him winning this job, for the season, because of his age and his upside. It follows the same line of thinking for why Iupati and Davis were inserted from practically the get. If Baas plays well through the preseason and in the opener and whatever remaining time Heitmann is out, there would be no reason to mess with the new and developing chemistry between the young guys.

Honestly, you don't know what you are talking about. So, please stop. When you say "Heitmann doesn't fit that identity", let me ask you a couple questions:
1) Who was the unquestioned starter at center before Heitmann's injury? Uh, Heitmann. Baas wasn't even in contention for the starting job.
2) If "Heitmann doesn't fit that identity", then why have the Niners bypassed drafting a center the past two years, including the 2009 Draft?
3) If "Heitmann doesn't fit that identity", then why did the Niners not pursue a center in free agency?

Heitmann was going to be the starter. This was unquestioned. The only reason Baas is getting snaps at all (he hasn't even been declared the starter for game 1 over Wragge yet), is because Heitmann is injured.

You don't know what you are talking about. Sorry, but your level of knowledge in the game is low. Watch the rest of the league, do some reading, and strip yourself of your bias against Heitmann. Until then, stop posting naive posts. They are embarrassing.

I can't disagree with anything you wrote in its factuality, but I can point out that coaches make mistakes, and Heitmann hasn't ever looked very impressive at center. Further, with each passing year he has looked to be losing more and more strength as evidenced by how he is routinely shoved around. Also, realize that I'm not saying he was the worst member of the O-line last year, I think Snyder was far and away the worst, and then Heitmann and Rachal were runners up. (Baas was very disappointing, but he he showed flashes where he absolutely dominated. --- I've never seen that from Heitmann at center.)

The tape doesn't lie. You can go to the stats, but we all know what we see on Sundays. One last thing. Why are you so defensive of Heitmann? Is it loyalty? Because I can respect that. I won't agree with it, but at least it is a good reason.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EYYEoGXpHE8

Im not gonna say Heitmann is a great player but he is a good solid Center. He has definately been the best player on the OL for years now. Our OGs have been very mediocre. For every 1 good game Baas and Rachal have had there is 4 bad games. Theres more tape of Baas missing blocks, getting pushed back and same goes for Rachal. Way more than Heitmann who is usually the victim of a double team or going against the monster of opposing DLs. I definately wouldnt say Heitmann has lost strength. If anything the guys on either side have him have gotten worse since 06. Pair Heitmann up with some OGs that can stay consistent and our interior is pretty damn good. IF we dont well we already know the results.



Why anyone is replacing Heitmann with Baas is just at this point. First its pre-season and every defense is in vanilla mode. Second it was 1 game vs a Colts team who has always been bad vs the run. Third Baas always gets gimpy and usually practices like s**t. If hes practicing like ass at center it affects the whole OL. 49ers need to upgrade their C, definately but they also need to upgrade the RG. We need a young stud whos played Center for more than 1 year in college. We need a RG who isnt raw and who is more NFL ready than Rachal. We also need a OC who isnt so damn predictable when running the ball. We also need short yardage RB most of all.


The biggest problem in short yardage isnt really the OL but the RB. Gores a fantastic back no question but he isnt much of a short yardage guy. Hes prone to fumbles in those situations and he isnt the make his own holes type of RB. Which is probably why they finally wised up and drafted a power back. Dixon has the size the make a hole and push the pile. Hes a 6ft1 230+ power back whos Gores complete opposite. With a NFL regimen Dixon is more than likely to add muscle and end up a 240+ back who can fill in at the redzone or 3rd/4th n short. When Dixon gets up to par our short yardage issues should go from 12th to top 5 imo. Unless Raye is complete dogs**t and f**ks up our season.

Originally posted by Kilgore_Trout:

Originally posted by MadDog49er:

Originally posted by Kilgore_Trout:

Originally posted by Allx9er:

Originally posted by MadDog49er:

Originally posted by Allx9er:
does anybody know how many years heitman has left on his contract? i know baas is on a one year deal.

Heitmann's contract runs through the next two years. He will be a free agent in 2012.

hmm...heitmann's 31-32 right, baas 25-26? and heitmann really only has a deal that's one year longer. interesting

It is obvious the team is trying to build an O-line that fits the identity Singletary wants for the team. Heitmann doesn't fit that identity, and it remains to be seen if Baas can be smash mouth or not at center. But my money is on him winning this job, for the season, because of his age and his upside. It follows the same line of thinking for why Iupati and Davis were inserted from practically the get. If Baas plays well through the preseason and in the opener and whatever remaining time Heitmann is out, there would be no reason to mess with the new and developing chemistry between the young guys.

Honestly, you don't know what you are talking about. So, please stop. When you say "Heitmann doesn't fit that identity", let me ask you a couple questions:
1) Who was the unquestioned starter at center before Heitmann's injury? Uh, Heitmann. Baas wasn't even in contention for the starting job.
2) If "Heitmann doesn't fit that identity", then why have the Niners bypassed drafting a center the past two years, including the 2009 Draft?
3) If "Heitmann doesn't fit that identity", then why did the Niners not pursue a center in free agency?

Heitmann was going to be the starter. This was unquestioned. The only reason Baas is getting snaps at all (he hasn't even been declared the starter for game 1 over Wragge yet), is because Heitmann is injured.

You don't know what you are talking about. Sorry, but your level of knowledge in the game is low. Watch the rest of the league, do some reading, and strip yourself of your bias against Heitmann. Until then, stop posting naive posts. They are embarrassing.

I can't disagree with anything you wrote in its factuality, but I can point out that coaches make mistakes, and Heitmann hasn't ever looked very impressive at center. Further, with each passing year he has looked to be losing more and more strength as evidenced by how he is routinely shoved around. Also, realize that I'm not saying he was the worst member of the O-line last year, I think Snyder was far and away the worst, and then Heitmann and Rachal were runners up. (Baas was very disappointing, but he he showed flashes where he absolutely dominated. --- I've never seen that from Heitmann at center.)

The tape doesn't lie. You can go to the stats, but we all know what we see on Sundays. One last thing. Why are you so defensive of Heitmann? Is it loyalty? Because I can respect that. I won't agree with it, but at least it is a good reason.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EYYEoGXpHE8

Did you just say that Heitmann and Rachal were runners up for 2nd worst on the O-line last season???
WOW. Did you watch any games last season? Besides Snyder, Rachal was easily the worst player on the O-line last season. Rachal couldn't pick up a stunt if his life depended on it.
To add to that, Rachal better pray that rookie A.Davis doesn't excel next to him at RT. If he does, Rachal will be exposed for what he is. A slow, lumbering mass that couldn't pass block to save his life. Rachal is just another garbage pick that we can thank Scotty for.

I don't care about who starts at center. If Baas can get the job done, then great. Lets not forget that Heitmann was originally a guard. I wouldn't mind seeing him go back to guard when he returns and maybe take Rachal's job.

Hmmm, Maiocco has now given the first sportswriter hint of Baas challenging Heitman:

http://www.csnbayarea.com/08/21/10/img-srchttpcsnbayareacomcommonglobal_ima/landing.html?full_args=08/21/10/img-srchttpcsnbayareacomcommonglobal_ima/landing&blockID=294872&feedID=5936

From Ben
Is Baas better than Heitman at playing Center? Sure seemed like he moved the pile...

Matt Maiocco
No, Baas is not better than Heitmann . . . right now. But Baas was very impressive in Indianapolis. It looks as if he's really taken over at the center spot. Now, if he continues to improve and the 49ers play well with him in there, the coaches will have a decision to make when Heitmann returns.

Originally posted by AKfanster:

Originally posted by Kilgore_Trout:

Originally posted by MadDog49er:

Originally posted by Kilgore_Trout:

Originally posted by Allx9er:

Originally posted by MadDog49er:

Originally posted by Allx9er:
does anybody know how many years heitman has left on his contract? i know baas is on a one year deal.

Heitmann's contract runs through the next two years. He will be a free agent in 2012.

hmm...heitmann's 31-32 right, baas 25-26? and heitmann really only has a deal that's one year longer. interesting

It is obvious the team is trying to build an O-line that fits the identity Singletary wants for the team. Heitmann doesn't fit that identity, and it remains to be seen if Baas can be smash mouth or not at center. But my money is on him winning this job, for the season, because of his age and his upside. It follows the same line of thinking for why Iupati and Davis were inserted from practically the get. If Baas plays well through the preseason and in the opener and whatever remaining time Heitmann is out, there would be no reason to mess with the new and developing chemistry between the young guys.

Honestly, you don't know what you are talking about. So, please stop. When you say "Heitmann doesn't fit that identity", let me ask you a couple questions:
1) Who was the unquestioned starter at center before Heitmann's injury? Uh, Heitmann. Baas wasn't even in contention for the starting job.
2) If "Heitmann doesn't fit that identity", then why have the Niners bypassed drafting a center the past two years, including the 2009 Draft?
3) If "Heitmann doesn't fit that identity", then why did the Niners not pursue a center in free agency?

Heitmann was going to be the starter. This was unquestioned. The only reason Baas is getting snaps at all (he hasn't even been declared the starter for game 1 over Wragge yet), is because Heitmann is injured.

You don't know what you are talking about. Sorry, but your level of knowledge in the game is low. Watch the rest of the league, do some reading, and strip yourself of your bias against Heitmann. Until then, stop posting naive posts. They are embarrassing.

I can't disagree with anything you wrote in its factuality, but I can point out that coaches make mistakes, and Heitmann hasn't ever looked very impressive at center. Further, with each passing year he has looked to be losing more and more strength as evidenced by how he is routinely shoved around. Also, realize that I'm not saying he was the worst member of the O-line last year, I think Snyder was far and away the worst, and then Heitmann and Rachal were runners up. (Baas was very disappointing, but he he showed flashes where he absolutely dominated. --- I've never seen that from Heitmann at center.)

The tape doesn't lie. You can go to the stats, but we all know what we see on Sundays. One last thing. Why are you so defensive of Heitmann? Is it loyalty? Because I can respect that. I won't agree with it, but at least it is a good reason.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EYYEoGXpHE8

Did you just say that Heitmann and Rachal were runners up for 2nd worst on the O-line last season???
WOW. Did you watch any games last season? Besides Snyder, Rachal was easily the worst player on the O-line last season. Rachal couldn't pick up a stunt if his life depended on it.
To add to that, Rachal better pray that rookie A.Davis doesn't excel next to him at RT. If he does, Rachal will be exposed for what he is. A slow, lumbering mass that couldn't pass block to save his life. Rachal is just another garbage pick that we can thank Scotty for.

I don't care about who starts at center. If Baas can get the job done, then great. Lets not forget that Heitmann was originally a guard. I wouldn't mind seeing him go back to guard when he returns and maybe take Rachal's job.

I admit it wasn't fair to equate Rachal and Heitmann in terms of equally poor performance. By my own admission, I have said that I would like to see Heitmann replace Rachal (or anyone for that matter) when he returns. But just as I never bought into the Shaun Hill hype (I shouldn't have a better arm than an NFL QB), I've never boughten into the Eric Heitmann hype. There is nothing about his play that has ever inspired me. I don't have a single memory of him doing anything impressive. On the flip side, I have countless memories of him getting shoved straight back in the running game. As long as he has been the center, the O-line has been bad. Of course that doesn't necessarily fall on him, but he has been a part of the failure.

Originally posted by NinerGM:
The real problem nobody is talking about at RG - Chilo Rachal.

Haha, except his name is found all throughout this thread...

Originally posted by Kilgore_Trout:

Originally posted by oldninerdude:

Originally posted by MadDog49er:

Originally posted by Kilgore_Trout:

Originally posted by Allx9er:

Originally posted by MadDog49er:

Originally posted by Allx9er:
does anybody know how many years heitman has left on his contract? i know baas is on a one year deal.

Heitmann's contract runs through the next two years. He will be a free agent in 2012.

hmm...heitmann's 31-32 right, baas 25-26? and heitmann really only has a deal that's one year longer. interesting

It is obvious the team is trying to build an O-line that fits the identity Singletary wants for the team. Heitmann doesn't fit that identity, and it remains to be seen if Baas can be smash mouth or not at center. But my money is on him winning this job, for the season, because of his age and his upside. It follows the same line of thinking for why Iupati and Davis were inserted from practically the get. If Baas plays well through the preseason and in the opener and whatever remaining time Heitmann is out, there would be no reason to mess with the new and developing chemistry between the young guys.

Honestly, you don't know what you are talking about. So, please stop. When you say "Heitmann doesn't fit that identity", let me ask you a couple questions:
1) Who was the unquestioned starter at center before Heitmann's injury? Uh, Heitmann. Baas wasn't even in contention for the starting job.
2) If "Heitmann doesn't fit that identity", then why have the Niners bypassed drafting a center the past two years, including the 2009 Draft?
3) If "Heitmann doesn't fit that identity", then why did the Niners not pursue a center in free agency?

Heitmann was going to be the starter. This was unquestioned. The only reason Baas is getting snaps at all (he hasn't even been declared the starter for game 1 over Wragge yet), is because Heitmann is injured.

You don't know what you are talking about. Sorry, but your level of knowledge in the game is low. Watch the rest of the league, do some reading, and strip yourself of your bias against Heitmann. Until then, stop posting naive posts. They are embarrassing.

Well, this obviously needs some translation from the Intergalactic Maddog-Speak:

"Honestly, . . . " This means "Let me add the word 'honestly' to what I'm about to say, to counteract the impression that Immabout to bullsh*t you, cause that's what Immabout to do."

". . . you don't know what you're talking about." This translates: "the opinions you are expressing do not agree with my own, so I'm going to question your ethics, heritage, motives, lifestyle, religion, football knowledge, intellect, and right to exist."

"So please stop." This means: "So please stop disagreeing with me, it makes me feel uncomfortable."

"Who was the unquestioned starter at center before Heitmann's injury? Uh, Heitmann. Baas wasn't even in contention for the starter's job." This means: "I'm going to completely ignore the fact that Baas got multiple reps at center with the starters during OTAs and TC because its a fact that does not support my thesis."

". . . why have the Niners bypassed drafting a center the past two years, including the 2009 draft?" Translation: "Cody Wallace does not count as a center because he practiced and played a few snaps at guard, and besides, he was drafted by McCloughan, who's not even with the Niners anymore. Plus he was drafted in 2008, and that's so long ago (in light years) that I can barely remember it. On MY planet, there is no word for 'Cody Wallace' or anyone else who might disprove what I'm saying."

"If 'Heitmann doesn't fit that [smashmouth] identity,' then why did the Niners not pursue a center in free agency." Translation: "Imma gonna ignore the fact that there really wasn't a viable FA center available (Mawae being way too old) this year. I'm just going to ask the question, cause it seems to support my position. That's just the way I roll."

"Heitmann was going to be the starter. This was unquestioned." Translation: "It certainly was unquestioned BY ME, because I love Heitmann sooo much, and, well, you know he's just the greatest, an all. So I pretend that the coaches love him too. All that news and stuff about Baas and Wragge getting reps with the first team during OTAs, that wasn't really serious, cause that might have hurt his feelers. Next year, Ima pretend he was in the Pro Bowl. Maybe he'll send me his autographs."

"You don't know what you're talking about" "because you don't agree with me."

"Sorry, but your level of knowledge in the game is low." This means: "I'm repeating this simply for effect, cause the first time I said it, you may not have been properly and sufficiently insulted and humiliated. 'Your level of knowledge in the game is low.' Better add a quart."

". . . strip yourself of your bias against Heitmann." Translation: "Watch him play in your skivies. It's very liberating."

". . . stop posting naive posts. They are embarrassing." Translation: "Your views do not conform to those of myself and others from my planet. One of us is wrong, and it would be embarrassing if it were me, so it must be you. But stop anyway, just in case its me."

Those of us from this planet, Earth, hope this helps. Or at least amuses somewhat.

Wow! You must write professionally. Remind me to keep on your good side. =) Edit: And very funny!

Well, frankly, Maddog makes it easy, sometimes.

I actually like and respect Maddog, and have read many of his posts and thought to myself, "that's very well said."

He does, however, have a tendency sometimes to attack and insult others if they don't agree with him. I'm just trying, in my own small way, to convince him that he could eliminate that part of his style without sacrificing his message or his persona. This board would be so much the better for it. Throwing insults around only distracts from the discussion. IMHO.

Could you imagine a guy with as much football knowledge as Maddog who could politely and courteously argue his points--without sacrificing his sense of humor or his sometimes pointed sarcasm, but without the insults?

Point is that none of us knows it all. Which means that we're all still learning.

My hope is that Maddog sees my post as the joke it was intended to be, laughs, and maybe treats the rest of us with a little more patience and courtesy.

He was touted as a talented 'Center' when he was drafted out of Michigan, but never was really given much time there since entering the NFL.

Both sides are correct in this argument. Heitmann is neither a weakness of the team nor a strength. We have been bad and talentless for so long that he ws the best we had and the one player we didn't have to worry about. However, now we are way more talented and deep than we have been in the past and we are probably gonna cut players that would have been the best at their position 3 or 4 years ago so it is natural to start looking to upgrade positions where we can. Heitmann can be replaced by a better center but I am not ready to say that better center is currently on our team.

Maddog is right that if the team thought they needed to upgrade their center position they could have easily taken the C from Florida over Iupati unless they thought that Iupati was head and shoulder the BPA, the Center position usually has more value in the 1st round.

I do disagree with Maddog on the fact that if the team valued Baas more they would have offered him a longer contract than just a 1 year tender. I am pretty sure they value Franklin but just need to see him produce at a high level for a longer period of time before they decide to pay him or let him walk. I think its the same case with Baas. Also we have a history of offering the backups long term deals and waiting on the starters to prove themselves. That is why Snyder is signed to a longer deal than Baas even though they were drafted in the same year. Therefore, the fact that they only signed Baas to a 1 year deal means they are still hoping he can prove to them that he is worth extending. at a higher rate than a backup salary.

Originally posted by oldninerdude:

Originally posted by Kilgore_Trout:

Originally posted by oldninerdude:

Originally posted by MadDog49er:

Originally posted by Kilgore_Trout:

Originally posted by Allx9er:

Originally posted by MadDog49er:

Originally posted by Allx9er:
does anybody know how many years heitman has left on his contract? i know baas is on a one year deal.

Heitmann's contract runs through the next two years. He will be a free agent in 2012.

hmm...heitmann's 31-32 right, baas 25-26? and heitmann really only has a deal that's one year longer. interesting

It is obvious the team is trying to build an O-line that fits the identity Singletary wants for the team. Heitmann doesn't fit that identity, and it remains to be seen if Baas can be smash mouth or not at center. But my money is on him winning this job, for the season, because of his age and his upside. It follows the same line of thinking for why Iupati and Davis were inserted from practically the get. If Baas plays well through the preseason and in the opener and whatever remaining time Heitmann is out, there would be no reason to mess with the new and developing chemistry between the young guys.

Honestly, you don't know what you are talking about. So, please stop. When you say "Heitmann doesn't fit that identity", let me ask you a couple questions:
1) Who was the unquestioned starter at center before Heitmann's injury? Uh, Heitmann. Baas wasn't even in contention for the starting job.
2) If "Heitmann doesn't fit that identity", then why have the Niners bypassed drafting a center the past two years, including the 2009 Draft?
3) If "Heitmann doesn't fit that identity", then why did the Niners not pursue a center in free agency?

Heitmann was going to be the starter. This was unquestioned. The only reason Baas is getting snaps at all (he hasn't even been declared the starter for game 1 over Wragge yet), is because Heitmann is injured.

You don't know what you are talking about. Sorry, but your level of knowledge in the game is low. Watch the rest of the league, do some reading, and strip yourself of your bias against Heitmann. Until then, stop posting naive posts. They are embarrassing.

Well, this obviously needs some translation from the Intergalactic Maddog-Speak:

"Honestly, . . . " This means "Let me add the word 'honestly' to what I'm about to say, to counteract the impression that Immabout to bullsh*t you, cause that's what Immabout to do."

". . . you don't know what you're talking about." This translates: "the opinions you are expressing do not agree with my own, so I'm going to question your ethics, heritage, motives, lifestyle, religion, football knowledge, intellect, and right to exist."

"So please stop." This means: "So please stop disagreeing with me, it makes me feel uncomfortable."

"Who was the unquestioned starter at center before Heitmann's injury? Uh, Heitmann. Baas wasn't even in contention for the starter's job." This means: "I'm going to completely ignore the fact that Baas got multiple reps at center with the starters during OTAs and TC because its a fact that does not support my thesis."

". . . why have the Niners bypassed drafting a center the past two years, including the 2009 draft?" Translation: "Cody Wallace does not count as a center because he practiced and played a few snaps at guard, and besides, he was drafted by McCloughan, who's not even with the Niners anymore. Plus he was drafted in 2008, and that's so long ago (in light years) that I can barely remember it. On MY planet, there is no word for 'Cody Wallace' or anyone else who might disprove what I'm saying."

"If 'Heitmann doesn't fit that [smashmouth] identity,' then why did the Niners not pursue a center in free agency." Translation: "Imma gonna ignore the fact that there really wasn't a viable FA center available (Mawae being way too old) this year. I'm just going to ask the question, cause it seems to support my position. That's just the way I roll."

"Heitmann was going to be the starter. This was unquestioned." Translation: "It certainly was unquestioned BY ME, because I love Heitmann sooo much, and, well, you know he's just the greatest, an all. So I pretend that the coaches love him too. All that news and stuff about Baas and Wragge getting reps with the first team during OTAs, that wasn't really serious, cause that might have hurt his feelers. Next year, Ima pretend he was in the Pro Bowl. Maybe he'll send me his autographs."

"You don't know what you're talking about" "because you don't agree with me."

"Sorry, but your level of knowledge in the game is low." This means: "I'm repeating this simply for effect, cause the first time I said it, you may not have been properly and sufficiently insulted and humiliated. 'Your level of knowledge in the game is low.' Better add a quart."

". . . strip yourself of your bias against Heitmann." Translation: "Watch him play in your skivies. It's very liberating."

". . . stop posting naive posts. They are embarrassing." Translation: "Your views do not conform to those of myself and others from my planet. One of us is wrong, and it would be embarrassing if it were me, so it must be you. But stop anyway, just in case its me."

Those of us from this planet, Earth, hope this helps. Or at least amuses somewhat.

Wow! You must write professionally. Remind me to keep on your good side. =) Edit: And very funny!

Well, frankly, Maddog makes it easy, sometimes.

I actually like and respect Maddog, and have read many of his posts and thought to myself, "that's very well said."

He does, however, have a tendency sometimes to attack and insult others if they don't agree with him. I'm just trying, in my own small way, to convince him that he could eliminate that part of his style without sacrificing his message or his persona. This board would be so much the better for it. Throwing insults around only distracts from the discussion. IMHO.

Could you imagine a guy with as much football knowledge as Maddog who could politely and courteously argue his points--without sacrificing his sense of humor or his sometimes pointed sarcasm, but without the insults?

Point is that none of us knows it all. Which means that we're all still learning.

My hope is that Maddog sees my post as the joke it was intended to be, laughs, and maybe treats the rest of us with a little more patience and courtesy.

Oh yea, I had already recognized that in him as I've read this board for a few years now. I know he doesn't mean anything by it --- all bark, no bite --- so it goes on the net. =)

Originally posted by flynhayn15:
Both sides are correct in this argument. Heitmann is neither a weakness of the team nor a strength. We have been bad and talentless for so long that he ws the best we had and the one player we didn't have to worry about. However, now we are way more talented and deep than we have been in the past and we are probably gonna cut players that would have been the best at their position 3 or 4 years ago so it is natural to start looking to upgrade positions where we can. Heitmann can be replaced by a better center but I am not ready to say that better center is currently on our team.

Maddog is right that if the team thought they needed to upgrade their center position they could have easily taken the C from Florida over Iupati unless they thought that Iupati was head and shoulder the BPA, the Center position usually has more value in the 1st round.

I do disagree with Maddog on the fact that if the team valued Baas more they would have offered him a longer contract than just a 1 year tender. I am pretty sure they value Franklin but just need to see him produce at a high level for a longer period of time before they decide to pay him or let him walk. I think its the same case with Baas. Also we have a history of offering the backups long term deals and waiting on the starters to prove themselves. That is why Snyder is signed to a longer deal than Baas even though they were drafted in the same year. Therefore, the fact that they only signed Baas to a 1 year deal means they are still hoping he can prove to them that he is worth extending. at a higher rate than a backup salary.

Great post. This is pretty much how I see it.