Aaron Lynch Thread

The reason why you'd normally want more of a speed rusher at Leo is cause the LT is more agile. I like Elvis odds better going after the RT...also, it's probably what he's been practicing for over a year. He's a pro doe so I know he can play both, RT seems to be the advantage on paper.

Agree?

Originally posted by thl408:
He had 2-3 sacks stunting inside. I don't think he ever rushed from the inside unless it was part of a blitz.

Here's the gif you requested. He was unblocked so there wasn't any 1v1 pass rush moves going on, which was what I was trying to show.

Thanks THL!!!!

You Da Man!!!!

Not to repeat what's been said 1000 times, but we're going to see a lot of rotation at virtually every spot in the front seven this season except maybe for MIKE.

We don't have a roster full of probowl 3-down players on defense like we had in the Willis heyday--we have young rotational guys who are still developing.

While we lack in experience, we excel in upside and versatility. It's up to Saleh to bring it all together and make it click.

My feeling is we're still a couple years away. I like the direction tho.

Originally posted by post_primitive:

Not to repeat what's been said 1000 times, but we're going to see a lot of rotation at virtually every spot in the front seven this season except maybe for MIKE.

We don't have a roster full of probowl 3-down players on defense like we had in the Willis heyday--we have young rotational guys who are still developing.

While we lack in experience, we excel in upside and versatility. It's up to Saleh to bring it all together and make it click.

My feeling is we're still a couple years away. I like the direction tho.

Well said. These splitting of roles to maximize specific strength and maintain health and conditioning is going to be new to a lot of fans.

Originally posted by SmokeCrabtrees:
The reason why you'd normally want more of a speed rusher at Leo is cause the LT is more agile. I like Elvis odds better going after the RT...also, it's probably what he's been practicing for over a year. He's a pro doe so I know he can play both, RT seems to be the advantage on paper.

Agree?

I think Elvis will be used on both sides just like in Blt. We talk more about base but the majority of the game is played in nickel. They'll move everyone around there. Elvis will likely be limited to passing downs too.

Originally posted by SmokeCrabtrees:

The reason why you'd normally want more of a speed rusher at Leo is cause the LT is more agile. I like Elvis odds better going after the RT...also, it's probably what he's been practicing for over a year. He's a pro doe so I know he can play both, RT seems to be the advantage on paper.

Agree?

Yeah, Elvis had a ton of success from that left edge. That said, per reports and John Lynch, it sounds like all four: Armstead, Elvis, Lynch and Pita are currently working exclusively from the LEO.

That said, don't be surprised if once TC starts, we start seeing some movement.

The coaches have time now to review roles now, we will have new players in Elvis and Thomas, etc. and players have had time to try out at different spots for the purpose of versatility.

NOW we'll probably see coaches move players into their more natural roles and where they expect them to play most of their snaps. We might start seeing guys like Garnett move to LG more, Buckner to the big end spot, Thomas taking snaps at the 3T, Lynch move back to the SAM, etc.

So we'll see.

Originally posted by tjd808185:

Originally posted by SmokeCrabtrees:

The reason why you'd normally want more of a speed rusher at Leo is cause the LT is more agile. I like Elvis odds better going after the RT...also, it's probably what he's been practicing for over a year. He's a pro doe so I know he can play both, RT seems to be the advantage on paper.

Agree?

I think Elvis will be used on both sides just like in Blt. We talk more about base but the majority of the game is played in nickel. They'll move everyone around there. Elvis will likely be limited to passing downs too.

Agreed...the opponent will dictate as well. If a team has a weak RT and Elvis is proving to be our best edge rusher, he might play exclusively on that left side in nickel.

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by post_primitive:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by post_primitive:
No thanks. Lining Lynch up at SAM is telegraphing the coverage.

So would Elvis at LEO. It's no secret. When those two are in, they are rushing the passer.

That's a poor comparison. LEOs aren't asked to cover.

You want someone at SAM who can cover; otherwise, everyone in the stadium knows you're blitzing. A good QB will exploit that all day.

The SAM in this defense rushes up to 70% of the time. But I get what you're saying.

When the 49ers are in nickel, there really won't be a Sam LB on the field. The notion that the Sam will rush the passer 70% of the time is based on the premise that the player that plays Sam in base will also stay on the field for nickel subpackages to play DE (hand in dirt, no coverage responsibility). Let's not think of Sam as a player, think of it as a position. A position that isn't on the field in nickel/dime.

So if the the 49ers play 70% in nickel/dime personnel, then the Sam position is really only on the field for 30% of the defensive snaps - the base snaps. It's possible that the Sam LB in base is played by one player (ABrooks), while the DE in nickel (non-Leo) is played by a different player (ALynch). The reason why Saleh wants a Sam that can also pass rush is that it adds flexibility into what kind of pressure packages he can dial up in base. It'll be a nice-to-have, but I can see him splitting the duties of Sam and nickel DE between different players since there's been talk about having a rotation.

Below is SEA in nickel personnel. Blue are the DBs. Orange are the LBs. There is no strongside LB, there is no Sam position. 'Sam position', meaning the guy that lines up on the TE side, plays contain against the run, and drops back into coverage on a passing play.

^ much more elegant way of putting it thl. Thank you.

The perfect scenario is having a Beasley at Sam who rarely leaves the field and kicks to de in nickel. I agree with thl that we don't have so it's going to be split it up more. But even Brooks can nickel rush and he's done that for years for us. It's just in the 3-4 people understand the nose comes out and you got 2 tackles, 2 ends then. Nothing has really changed there it's just now in a 4-3. You want the Sam to be able to rush in base so you can play like a 3-4 at times. Like everyone has been saying depth, rotation is going to be here our theme. We have Thomas, Lynch, AA, Dumervil, Brooks, Pita, Blair who can all slide outside. Well still skeptical on AA though.

Originally posted by tjd808185:

Originally posted by GhostOfBaalke:

We were talking about a rotation . Nobody would have him as base Sam

You talked about using him like Beasley and I just wanted to show you that doesn't quite work because he can't cover like Vic. He's much closer to Brooks Reed in this defense. It's a little confusing because we'll be in nickel 60% of the time anyways. I do see Elvis and Lynch as the primary ends there. It's just when we are in base I think Lynch is more of a fit at Leo than Sam. Not to say you can't use him some there but Brooks, Pita, Harold are better fits.

Naw I didn't. I said that Saleh said the Sam rushes 70 percent of the time in this d. And that would explain why Vic got so many sacks at Sam. Vic is a more complete player than Lynch, so he's able to stay in on any down though.

Originally posted by GhostOfBaalke:

Originally posted by tjd808185:

Originally posted by GhostOfBaalke:

We were talking about a rotation . Nobody would have him as base Sam

You talked about using him like Beasley and I just wanted to show you that doesn't quite work because he can't cover like Vic. He's much closer to Brooks Reed in this defense. It's a little confusing because we'll be in nickel 60% of the time anyways. I do see Elvis and Lynch as the primary ends there. It's just when we are in base I think Lynch is more of a fit at Leo than Sam. Not to say you can't use him some there but Brooks, Pita, Harold are better fits.

Naw I didn't. I said that Saleh said the Sam rushes 70 percent of the time in this d. And that would explain why Vic got so many sacks at Sam. Vic is a more complete player than Lynch, so he's able to stay in on any down though.

Nothing wrong with having two different guys to get the job done doe. You don't HAVE to have 3 down players.. in some cases/drives it's more beneficial and you'll have better play from two different guys.

Originally posted by thl408:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by post_primitive:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by post_primitive:

No thanks. Lining Lynch up at SAM is telegraphing the coverage.

So would Elvis at LEO. It's no secret. When those two are in, they are rushing the passer.

That's a poor comparison. LEOs aren't asked to cover.

You want someone at SAM who can cover; otherwise, everyone in the stadium knows you're blitzing. A good QB will exploit that all day.

The SAM in this defense rushes up to 70% of the time. But I get what you're saying.

When the 49ers are in nickel, there really won't be a Sam LB on the field. The notion that the Sam will rush the passer 70% of the time is based on the premise that the player that plays Sam in base will also stay on the field for nickel subpackages to play DE (hand in dirt, no coverage responsibility). Let's not think of Sam as a player, think of it as a position. A position that isn't on the field in nickel/dime.

So if the the 49ers play 70% in nickel/dime personnel, then the Sam position is really only on the field for 30% of the defensive snaps - the base snaps. It's possible that the Sam LB in base is played by one player (ABrooks), while the DE in nickel (non-Leo) is played by a different player (ALynch). The reason why Saleh wants a Sam that can also pass rush is that it adds flexibility into what kind of pressure packages he can dial up in base. It'll be a nice-to-have, but I can see him splitting the duties of Sam and nickel DE between different players since there's been talk about having a rotation.

Below is SEA in nickel personnel. Blue are the DBs. Orange are the LBs. There is no strongside LB, there is no Sam position. 'Sam position', meaning the guy that lines up on the TE side, plays contain against the run, and drops back into coverage on a passing play.

Awesome breakdown...thanks.

Question could a guy like Malcom smith play the SAM in base downs? Or would he be too small?

Originally posted by NYniner85:

Originally posted by thl408:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by post_primitive:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by post_primitive:

No thanks. Lining Lynch up at SAM is telegraphing the coverage.

So would Elvis at LEO. It's no secret. When those two are in, they are rushing the passer.

That's a poor comparison. LEOs aren't asked to cover.

You want someone at SAM who can cover; otherwise, everyone in the stadium knows you're blitzing. A good QB will exploit that all day.

The SAM in this defense rushes up to 70% of the time. But I get what you're saying.

When the 49ers are in nickel, there really won't be a Sam LB on the field. The notion that the Sam will rush the passer 70% of the time is based on the premise that the player that plays Sam in base will also stay on the field for nickel subpackages to play DE (hand in dirt, no coverage responsibility). Let's not think of Sam as a player, think of it as a position. A position that isn't on the field in nickel/dime.

So if the the 49ers play 70% in nickel/dime personnel, then the Sam position is really only on the field for 30% of the defensive snaps - the base snaps. It's possible that the Sam LB in base is played by one player (ABrooks), while the DE in nickel (non-Leo) is played by a different player (ALynch). The reason why Saleh wants a Sam that can also pass rush is that it adds flexibility into what kind of pressure packages he can dial up in base. It'll be a nice-to-have, but I can see him splitting the duties of Sam and nickel DE between different players since there's been talk about having a rotation.

Below is SEA in nickel personnel. Blue are the DBs. Orange are the LBs. There is no strongside LB, there is no Sam position. 'Sam position', meaning the guy that lines up on the TE side, plays contain against the run, and drops back into coverage on a passing play.

Awesome breakdown...thanks.

Question could a guy like Malcom smith play the SAM in base downs? Or would he be too small?

Too small. Me and Hero discussed, on paper we're perfect run some 4-3 over fronts cause then you can utilize a MLB/WILL as your SAM but it takes time and you have to learn the under front like the back of your hand before running over fronts.

Originally posted by SmokeCrabtrees:

Too small. Me and Hero discussed, on paper we're perfect run some 4-3 over fronts cause then you can utilize a MLB/WILL as your SAM but it takes time and you have to learn the under front like the back of your hand before running over fronts.

That's what I thought...thanks Bro