Josh Allen OLB/ILB/DE Kentucky

Originally posted by pdc20:

I maybe in the minority but I would trust more Josh Allen as a pure 4-3 DE than Burns.
Burns screams OLB for me.
I think the niners are waiting to see what the Cards will do with Bosa. If Bosa is there at two, he is the pick.
If not, trade down and then one of Allen, Burns, Sweat or Ferrell.
I could see Ferrell being the pick since he is a true 4-3 DE that plays with power and he has strong leadership and character.

I feel the exact opposite. I think Allen by far is best suited for a 3-4 OLB type role or playing SAM in this defense.

Burns is a pure edge rusher. He's got a highly refined skillset as a pass rusher and at 250 he doesn't weigh significantly less than guys like Cliff Avril, Chris Clemons, Yannick Ngakoue and others who have played Leo in this same scheme.


The main issue for Burns was weight. If he came in at 230...oh oh. Instead he showed up at 250 while retaining top flight athleticism. Overall his pass rushing skillset is probably second only to Bosa.

Originally posted by 49erBigMac:
That's my point Doc, he weighed in much heavier than I thought he would, and then tested worse than I expected.

I bet he tears up his pro day, but doesn't weigh in.

Those are your personal expectations though. Nothing to do with reality.

Originally posted by random49er:

Originally posted by 49erBigMac:

That's my point Doc, he weighed in much heavier than I thought he would, and then tested worse than I expected.

I bet he tears up his pro day, but doesn't weigh in.

Those are your personal expectations though. Nothing to do with reality.

Personal expectations after watching practically every snap they've both had this year.

In that evaluation I had Allen as the better athlete, my only other conclusion is that Allen wears his pads better.

Though I don't think that's the case, and I'm just not having that Allen didn't work hard enough for the combine.

The only other thing I can do as you guys won't use your eyes is place a wager.

I bet that Allen's pro day numbers beat Burns's combine ones.

Originally posted by Phoenix49ers:

Originally posted by pdc20:
I maybe in the minority but I would trust more Josh Allen as a pure 4-3 DE than Burns.
Burns screams OLB for me.
I think the niners are waiting to see what the Cards will do with Bosa. If Bosa is there at two, he is the pick.
If not, trade down and then one of Allen, Burns, Sweat or Ferrell.
I could see Ferrell being the pick since he is a true 4-3 DE that plays with power and he has strong leadership and character.

I feel the exact opposite. I think Allen by far is best suited for a 3-4 OLB type role or playing SAM in this defense.

Burns is a pure edge rusher. He's got a highly refined skillset as a pass rusher and at 250 he doesn't weigh significantly less than guys like Cliff Avril, Chris Clemons, Yannick Ngakoue and others who have played Leo in this same scheme.

The main issue for Burns was weight. If he came in at 230...oh oh. Instead he showed up at 250 while retaining top flight athleticism. Overall his pass rushing skillset is probably second only to Bosa.

That's where I was coming from before the draft.

I see Allen as the better overall player and a perfect fit for 3-4 OLB. Burns to me is the better pure pass rusher in the NFL once everything falls into place for him much like it did for Allen in terms of coaching, putting on weight.

Burns at 250 still moved super smooth. I think he can put on easy 10-15 lbs and keep that smoothness while giving himself ability to play with power.

Hopefully we get Bosa so it's a moot point anyways though.

Originally posted by Phoenix49ers:

Originally posted by pdc20:
I maybe in the minority but I would trust more Josh Allen as a pure 4-3 DE than Burns.
Burns screams OLB for me.
I think the niners are waiting to see what the Cards will do with Bosa. If Bosa is there at two, he is the pick.
If not, trade down and then one of Allen, Burns, Sweat or Ferrell.
I could see Ferrell being the pick since he is a true 4-3 DE that plays with power and he has strong leadership and character.

I feel the exact opposite. I think Allen by far is best suited for a 3-4 OLB type role or playing SAM in this defense.

Burns is a pure edge rusher. He's got a highly refined skillset as a pass rusher and at 250 he doesn't weigh significantly less than guys like Cliff Avril, Chris Clemons, Yannick Ngakoue and others who have played Leo in this same scheme.

The main issue for Burns was weight. If he came in at 230...oh oh. Instead he showed up at 250 while retaining top flight athleticism. Overall his pass rushing skillset is probably second only to Bosa.

Yup I agree with Phoenix. Allen is the perfect fit at OLB while Burns is much more suited to play DE in a 4-3 imo.

Allen makes sense if we get Fowler or Quinn IMO.

Originally posted by TheXFactor:

Allen makes sense if we get Fowler or Quinn IMO.

H*ll no to fowler !!! Quinn I'm ok with on a good deal...

Originally posted by tatdwolf49:

Originally posted by TheXFactor:
Allen makes sense if we get Fowler or Quinn IMO.

H*ll no to fowler !!! Quinn I'm ok with on a good deal...

Both are huge upgrades to what we have.

Burns always played with his hand in the dirt in FSU, this idea of him being a better olb is crazy. I'll be annoyed if Zona takes Bosa but Burns in a hopeful trade down scenario will make up for it

Originally posted by Phoenix49ers:
I feel the exact opposite. I think Allen by far is best suited for a 3-4 OLB type role or playing SAM in this defense.

Burns is a pure edge rusher. He's got a highly refined skillset as a pass rusher and at 250 he doesn't weigh significantly less than guys like Cliff Avril, Chris Clemons, Yannick Ngakoue and others who have played Leo in this same scheme.

The main issue for Burns was weight. If he came in at 230...oh oh. Instead he showed up at 250 while retaining top flight athleticism. Overall his pass rushing skillset is probably second only to Bosa.

Overuse of the word "pure." The consensus is that Allen is the better passrusher, whether pure, organic, inorganic, unfiltered, or whatever else.

And of course Burns can develop into the better of the two as time goes on,...but as of the past calendar year that's certainly not the case.

https://www.sbnation.com/nfl/2019/3/1/18242791/josh-allen-nfl-draft-2019-kentucky-scouting-report-film-breakdown-edge

Originally posted by random49er:
Overuse of the word "pure." The consensus is that Allen is the better passrusher, whether pure, organic, inorganic, unfiltered, or whatever else.

And of course Burns can develop into the better of the two as time goes on,...but as of the past calendar year that's certainly not the case.

I don't know about consensus. You can argue that he's the better all-around player but if your defense needs a guy to strictly go after QBs and nothing else, I'll take the more advanced pass rushing technique and skillset of Burns.

Originally posted by Phoenix49ers:

I don't know about consensus. You can argue that he's the better all-around player but if your defense needs a guy to strictly go after QBs and nothing else, I'll take the more advanced pass rushing technique and skillset of Burns.

Well we need way more than pass rush alone.

Originally posted by okdkid:

Well we need way more than pass rush alone.

Right now they need someone that can hunt down a QB. I don't care much about how they play in coverage or their ability to do one handed handstands or underwater basket weaving.


Whoever they feel will be the best at consistently pressuring the QB, that is who they should draft.

Originally posted by Phoenix49ers:
Whoever they feel will be the best at consistently pressuring the QB, that is who they should draft.

....with pick #2??

You generally aren't looking for a specialist or 1-trick pony @ #2. You're looking for VALUE.