Malik Hooker S Ohio State

Originally posted by NYniner85:

He never had a chance to play safety and was drafted to play slot to begin with...baalke special draft a guy and move him to a different position

You throw out Sam who had horrible measurables to play DE...Ward has fine measurables and athletic ability. Not even close to a fair comparison. He was looked at as one of the best safeties in that draft during the draft process

Oh come on, a GM does not have the authority to decide what position a player plays, that's all on the coaches.

Simple fact they clearly felt Reid was better for them in their system. Now they felt that Ward could help first at Nickel then at outside CB.

Ward is a good athlete, by all accounts is a great student of the game, and has decent ball skills. He could play the single high role, but let's not pretend he's elite

Originally posted by 49erBigMac:

Originally posted by NYniner85:
He never had a chance to play safety and was drafted to play slot to begin with...baalke special draft a guy and move him to a different position

You throw out Sam who had horrible measurables to play DE...Ward has fine measurables and athletic ability. Not even close to a fair comparison. He was looked at as one of the best safeties in that draft during the draft process

Oh come on, a GM does not have the authority to decide what position a player plays, that's all on the coaches.

Simple fact they clearly felt Reid was better for them in their system. Now they felt that Ward could help first at Nickel then at outside CB.

Ward is a good athlete, by all accounts is a great student of the game, and has decent ball skills. He could play the single high role, but let's not pretend he's elite

That's a load of baloney...Baalke drafted many players with the intention of where they would play in the NFL. He did it with R McDonald, Ward, Tank, and Cully. He had total control and that's one of the reasons we are where we are currently.

Where did I say he was elite? He was regarded as one of the best safeties in that draft class and a Jim Thorpe finalist for a reason. Also he doesn't have to be elite to be a good FS for us...Why can't he be a bigger Ricardo Allen (FS ATL)? He's a pretty damn good S.

this was Ward's strengths on his draft profile as a S...

"Intense, active and energetic. Zooms around the field and stands out on tape. Aggressive run supporter -- triggers quickly, flies downhill and chops down ball carriers. Breaks on throws and shows short-area burst to close. Has quick hands to snatch interceptions. Confident and energetic. Experienced and productive. Has a 38-inch vertical jump."

He was compared to Eric Weddle during the draft process.

IMO he would play much better with the ball in front of him and can cover ground as a single high safety...he's a solid tackler as well.

I'll add people act like Hooker is the only good FS in this draft...I'd grab Budda Baker or Marcus Williams based on value over Hooker.

If Hooker was a Thomas I'd argue day long to keep Ward at slot corner and draft the game changer. It's a win win. Opposed to gambling on Ward at safety while depleting your corners.

Is Hooker a Reed/ Thomas though? 1 year starter coming off a hip surgery that could affect his mobility.

Originally posted by NYniner85:

That's a load of baloney...Baalke drafted many players with the intention of where they would play in the NFL. He did it with R McDonald, Ward, Tank, and Cully. He had total control and that's one of the reasons we are where we are currently.

Where did I say he was elite? He was regarded as one of the best safeties in that draft class and a Jim Thorpe finalist for a reason. Also he doesn't have to be elite to be a good FS for us...Why can't he be a bigger Ricardo Allen (FS ATL)? He's a pretty damn good S.

this was Ward's strengths on his draft profile as a S...

"Intense, active and energetic. Zooms around the field and stands out on tape. Aggressive run supporter -- triggers quickly, flies downhill and chops down ball carriers. Breaks on throws and shows short-area burst to close. Has quick hands to snatch interceptions. Confident and energetic. Experienced and productive. Has a 38-inch vertical jump."

He was compared to Eric Weddle during the draft process.

IMO he would play much better with the ball in front of him and can cover ground as a single high safety...he's a solid tackler as well.

I'll add people act like Hooker is the only good FS in this draft...I'd grab Budda Baker or Marcus Williams based on value over Hooker.

I'm sorry but Baalke may have picked them to play certain roles but the coaches line the team up. Jim O'Neill was quoted saying they wanted to move Ward to Outside CB as they felt he was one of our 11 best players.

None of this is hate, none of this is propaganda. We may well be better off with Ward, Baker, Marcus Williams or Eddie Jackson allowing us to go elsewhere.

But as this is a Hooker thread, I don't think it's a stretch to say that we may be suited to take this Ballhawk with ridiculous range to man an important position for us, and more importantly IMO cause OC's to alter their game plans.

I watched some Jimmie Ward from college. First I'll say this, I hope the guy proves he can be a great single high FS. I like him, he's a good player for us. Hopefully the staff can see enough to get an answer to that in the offseason workouts before the draft, because if he can man the single high FS, it opens up even more in the draft. Hooker might still be the pick, but his need would drop, and make his value at 2 drop.

That being said, I simply didn't see enough to make me think he can. First thing that caught my eye was that he was listed as a SS. Wtf? This must be a typo. He's awfully small for a SS. But whatever, not important. So I watched some stuff, and I saw that he played these two spots the vast majority of the time: Slot Corner, Box Safety. He really did play like a SS in what I saw.

He was an animal. Close-ish to the line of scrimmage, and reallly really good as a corner (slot and outside). My hunch is that most of his picks are from his Slot/ Box Safety zone role. He did play off the screen a couple times, where I think it's two deep, or something, hard to tell, but didn't see.

Anyone able to find better stuff?

Here's two examples:

Hooker has awesome potential and I'd be excited and hopeful if we drafted him but I'd also be really nervous that his inexperience could lead to a terrible start and formation of bad habits or affect the kid in a negative way. Him also being hurt and unable to show what he can do at the combine or throughout the offseason process scares me as well.

Does the injury linger? I know it's not a knee injury but hips can have their share of issues. We laughed at Baalke for drafting hurt players...wouldn't this be the same situation?

If he at least worked out then we can see that he can still do some of those things that made him an elite FS prospect. Making one handed grabs from the jugs machine doesn't do it for me. It's cool to see but don't see him doing that in games while standing still.

Originally posted by NYniner85:

That's a load of baloney...Baalke drafted many players with the intention of where they would play in the NFL. He did it with R McDonald, Ward, Tank, and Cully. He had total control and that's one of the reasons we are where we are currently.

Where did I say he was elite? He was regarded as one of the best safeties in that draft class and a Jim Thorpe finalist for a reason. Also he doesn't have to be elite to be a good FS for us...Why can't he be a bigger Ricardo Allen (FS ATL)? He's a pretty damn good S.

this was Ward's strengths on his draft profile as a S...

"Intense, active and energetic. Zooms around the field and stands out on tape. Aggressive run supporter -- triggers quickly, flies downhill and chops down ball carriers. Breaks on throws and shows short-area burst to close. Has quick hands to snatch interceptions. Confident and energetic. Experienced and productive. Has a 38-inch vertical jump."

He was compared to Eric Weddle during the draft process.

IMO he would play much better with the ball in front of him and can cover ground as a single high safety...he's a solid tackler as well.

I'll add people act like Hooker is the only good FS in this draft...I'd grab Budda Baker or Marcus Williams based on value over Hooker.

I like ward, but the same spot you got that strengths description from lists him as a 2nd to 3rd round prospect.

Originally posted by adrianlesnar:
I like ward, but the same spot you got that strengths description from lists him as a 2nd to 3rd round prospect.

They had Aaron Donald listed as a 4th-5th round prospect. What's your point?

They don't update their predictions after the offseason process/combine does it's thing.

Hooker's ball skills and range are insanely impressive. I wouldn't be mad if we selected him early in the 1st round but the comparison to Earl Thomas is shallow. ET is such a good run defender, sells out his body to make tackles. Hooker appears like he'll be a liability in that department, at least early on in his career.

Originally posted by genus49:

They had Aaron Donald listed as a 4th-5th round prospect. What's your point?

They don't update their predictions after the offseason process/combine does it's thing.

Point was he said Jimmie Ward was looked at as a top safety prospect during the draft. He was not.

Aaron Donald is irrelevant...

Btw...nfl.com who had ward as a 2nd to 3rd round prospect, had Aaron Donald as a 1st round prospect....

In regards to Ward the majority of scouting reports seem to prefer his ability to cover out of the slots. He was safety in college but as pointed out he mostly played in the box, slot coverage. I think he's worth a shot at free safety but I wouldn't pass on a great fs prospect because of him. He's a perfectly good slot corner and you play 5 deep on secondary 70% of the time. This isn't sending AA to the bench.

As if Thomas was the most important player on the Seattle defense... he is not. He is not even the most important safety on that team (according to the players on that defense).

Drafting a safety at number 2 as a team with as little talent as the Niners is just insane, especially if you've already got 2 first and one second round safety on the team. Safety is easily one of the two positions where the Niners have the most talent. And that's where you waste your pick?

Santa Clara Brownies!

Originally posted by zugschef:
As if Thomas was the most important player on the Seattle defense... he is not. He is not even the most important safety on that team (according to the players on that defense).

Drafting a safety at number 2 as a team with as little talent as the Niners is just insane, especially if you've already got 2 first and one second round safety on the team. Safety is easily one of the two positions where the Niners have the most talent. And that's where you waste your pick?

Santa Clara Brownies!

This is also a Deep, Deep db class and there should be plenty of talent available in the 2nd and 3rd round to shore up the deepest defensive position on the team.

Originally posted by adrianlesnar:

I like ward, but the same spot you got that strengths description from lists him as a 2nd to 3rd round prospect.

So? Go look at the top S in the league and when they were drafted...a ton of 2nd and 3rd rd picks.

CBS had his as the 45th best prospect...

45. Jimmie Ward, SS, Northern Illinois (5-11, 191, Sr.): The top senior safety on the board, Ward is a versatile defensive back with cornerback movement skills and the physical mentality of a safety. He takes aggressive, confident angles in zone, but also shows the feet and athleticism to play tight in man coverage.

He moved up the boards because of versatility.

What mayock said..."He's a true free safety. The concern is frame (5-foot-11, 193 pounds) and durability is an issue. He can play strong safety, but I worry about his frame over a 16-game season. This is a kid who's a natural center fielder, but he'll move up to make a play (against the run)." -- Mike Mayock

Let him play FS and get pass breakups and INTs, he has the body and athletic ability to do it.

Originally posted by tjd808185:

In regards to Ward the majority of scouting reports seem to prefer his ability to cover out of the slots. He was safety in college but as pointed out he mostly played in the box, slot coverage. I think he's worth a shot at free safety but I wouldn't pass on a great fs prospect because of him. He's a perfectly good slot corner and you play 5 deep on secondary 70% of the time. This isn't sending AA to the bench.

I haven't read scout reports saying he was a better fit for the slot, more that he has the ability to do it. He played SS more than FS in college due to his tackling ability. He lacks the size to do that in the NFL.

This is what mayock said...

"He's a true free safety. The concern is frame (5-foot-11, 193 pounds) and durability is an issue. He can play strong safety, but I worry about his frame over a 16-game season. This is a kid who's a natural center fielder, but he'll move up to make a play (against the run)." -- Mike Mayock