MadDog49er Pre-Combine Top Rated Defense by Position

MadDog49er · 2015-02-19T10:54:39-08:00

Combine fever in the air. Going into this big week, this is my list of best defensive players by position, with a few notes. The positions can be a bit fuzzy since the 43 and 34 schemes can call upon different types of players. Hybrid 3-4 OLBs- I am making this a 3-4 defense category since the top guys are all geared toward playing the 34 OLB role. I can create a second catagory down the road for 43 DEs, but for now staring at the best edge players. Fowler is so violent, can hold up against the run, and is the only guy on this list (maybe you can include Dupree) who could start as a 43 DE right now. Can drop back in coverage. Tons of hits and hurries. Ray was nearly impossible to defend this year. Great on the edge, great up the middle. Lightning quick feet. I am a bit concerned about arm length (it should be pretty short), but against one of the best OT's in this draft, DJ Humphries, three sacks, including two where he destroyed him. Explosive burst. Beasley is one dimensional- he is fast around the corner. He looks about 230-235 pounds on the field. Hopefully, he has stacked on ten good pounds this offseason. Gregory is the best athlete of the group. Potential out of the universe. I saw not enough consistency beating opponents to have him over the top three. But, he may be drafted first in this group. Dupree also hyper athletic, but just like Gregory, I didn't see consistency. In both players, I left watching a combined ten games feeling that they could have been so much more productive. I have Nate Orchard at number six, and to be honest, I can easily see him leapfrogging Beasley, Gregory and Dupree. as I continue to study his game. My three through six is razor thin. I also like the potential of Danielle Hunter. Raw as sushi, but long, long, long. Deep group. 1. Dante Fowler 2. Shane Ray 3. Vic Beasley 4. Randy Gregory 5. Bud Dupree 43DT/34DE/34 NT- What a group. Williams is the best player in the draft, and I don't think it is close. Slam dunk to me. Can play the 43DT or 34DE role with brilliance. Has all the tools. Can't wait to see what he does in this league. Shelton is such a unique athlete for a big man that he can play the 43DT, the 34 NT and the 34DE role. So versatile because of his strength, size and foot speed. Worthy of a top ten pick. Looked great during Senior Bowl week. Really tough call between Davis and Goldman and Armstead to me. Goldman had the superior year of football of the group. So strong, and has excellent movement skills. Can play, like Shelton, any of the 34 and 43 roles except for a 43DE. Played really well in big games. Davis sleptwalked through this year, and then destroyed the field at the Senior Bowl. I graded him the best player on the field during the Senior Bowl game, and dominating Senior Bowl weeks almost always translate to excellent pro careers. So disruptive in both rushing and defending the run. Can easily play the 34 DE role, along with the 43DT position. Armstead has the biggest upside. Huge, and an amazing athlete. Should blow up the combine. How many 6'7", 300 pounds can run a sub 4.95. I expect Armstead to do it. Played really well against OSU in the championship game, which I have seen three times. Was a problem for the OL all game long. What a group!!! 1. Leonard Williams 2. Danny Shelton 3. Carl Davis 4. Eddie Goldman 5. Arik Armstead ILBs and 43 Wills and Sams- Some of these players may be pushed outside as a 43 Will or Sam, so I will separate them from the edge rushers. A couple years ago, I loved Bobby Wagner and called him a top ten talent. Dawson is the same player. Impact, impact, impact. Watched every defensive snap in 7 TCU games in the past few weeks, and every week he makes plays all over the field. Blitzes, covers well, forces turnovers (nearly 1 per game in the key games they played this year). Diagnoses plays better than anyone in the draft this year. People are sleeping on him now, but he is a flat out stud. I love this kid. Nobody know where Thompson will play at the next level. Maybe, I should post him in the safety area. All I know is the kid is a baller. Great athlete. Curious about his weight. I hope he stays as a 43 backer. Makes so many key plays. Perryman is going to measure really short, but who cares. He is a downhill thumper, but has athleticism to stay on the field all three downs. Kendrick is the least athletic of this group, but is a tackling machine. Superb read and react. Smart football player. Good citizen and leader. He and Perryman neck and neck for me. McKinney is another stud 3 down backer. Not as solid in play recognition as the guys at the top of the list, but has a killer burst once he rolls. 1. Paul Dawson 2. Shaq Thompson 3. Denzel Perryman 4. Eric Kendricks 5. Benardrick McKinney S- My upset flavor of the week is TCU's Chris Hackett. Watched a ton of games, and saw a really well-rounded stud centerfielder who likes to come up and hit people. Played against some good offensive teams, and help up pretty well. I like his length, and hustle on the field. Collins is vastly overrated by pundits. He is a good football player, and the best SS in the draft. But, I see second round value. Some drafts have him top ten. Crazy. Doesn't have the explosive burst to be an elite player, and was covered up a ton by the athletes on Alabama's team. Missed numerous tackles in key games. Again, a good football player. But, not elite. Sample can cover a lot of ground as a deep back. Good deep speed and helped Holliman get all those picks this year. Better of the two Louisville safeties. Harris is a solid overall player. Smart, covers ground well, and is not afraid of contact. Prewitt looks like a tweener between FS and SS. Does not cover as well as the other FS on this list, but also is a player with good football IQ. A pretty mediocre group this year compared to some of the other positions 1. Chris Hackett 2. Landon Collins 3. James Sample 4. Anthony Harris 5. Cody Prewitt CB- And, then there was CB. To me, this is a nightmare to grade. I really like four players over the rest right now, and each have excellent qualities. Call it razor thin. Waynes is ready to play and start right now. Not sure the other guys are ready Day One. Always in good position, never lazy, fiesty. Played well in OSU game when the rest of the defense was slaughtered. Athletically, not the best upside of the group. Johnson is so smooth, and long. I love the recovery speed on this kid and his willingness to tackle. He is going to have an outstanding pro career. Collins is the wild card in the group. Super tall and long, looks a bit wild on the field, but you can see the burst and energy. A big talented lump of clay that is not far away from making a huge impact. I can't see him starting the first year- too green. PJ Williams is a technician. Least athletic of the group, but covers really well. Never gets roasted deep, Sometimes will allow too many dink and dunk passes underneath. Epic battle with DeVante Parker one of the best one-on-one challenges of the year. Really fun to watch each guy take on the other. Peters is a guy who many have as their number one. Not me. Great athletic ability, but often lazy. Doesn't get set like many of the top CBs on the board and that allows WRs to make plays underneath. It also causes him way too many pass interference calls. The Hawaii game kills me. You can see how much talent he possesses and great hands. But, played down to the level of competition. I am not as down on him for "Chokegate". It seems like whatever happened is in the past. Of the last group, from 6+, such an interesting group of players. I love Gunter's length, and how he looked during Senior Bowl week. Ton of upside. White is a mighty mouse, short but will fight on every down. He wants to be great, and he looked great during Senior Bowl week. Really played well for TCU this year. Doran Grant completely being ignored, which is a joke. He played against some stud receivers down the stretch and matched up superbly. Held Amari Cooper in check for most of the night in the semi-final game. His game has progressed so far in the past year, it is staggering. Great depth at corner this year. So many sleeper candidates. 1. Trae Waynes 2. Kevin Johnson 3. Jalen Collins 4. PJ Williams 5. Marcus Peters 6. Ladarius Gunter/Kevin White/Doran Grant/You fill in the blank Looking forward to seeing how the combine will shape my board. In the end, the games are the real barometer and make up the vast majority of a team's final grade on a player. The medicals and interviews are not seen by the public, but hold much more weight than forty speed/long jump/vertical and more. In the end, we know DGB is a great athlete. We don't need a forty time to tell us that. The question is whether he can look GMs in the eye in interviews and be trusted. Such is the case with many players. Cheers and have fun

Feb 19, 2015 at 11:16 AM

theninermaniac
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Posts: 3,430

You had PJ Williams 20 overall on your big board, now he's the 4th best CB on your defensive rankings. What gives?

You had K Johnson in the 50s on big board but now he's the second best CB?

Feb 19, 2015 at 11:22 AM

HarboutTHAT
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Marcus Peters didn't make the top 5 corners... This list isn't solely based on talent.

Feb 19, 2015 at 11:23 AM

lamontb
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Where is Marcus Peters on your CB list?

Feb 19, 2015 at 11:43 AM

Phoenix49ers
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Originally posted by HarboutTHAT:
Marcus Peters didn't make the top 5 corners... This list isn't solely based on talent.

I wouldn't put Marcus Peters in the top 5 either. I see Waynes, Johnson, Williams and Collins definitely ahead of him at minimum. I really like Johnson a lot, he's got fantastic instincts at CB, he'll piss off the measurables crowd part of the fanbase with whatever teams draft him because of his fairly short arms and smaller build but I see him being an absolute impact player in the NFL.

Feb 19, 2015 at 11:45 AM

vrabbit
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if I've interpreted MadDog's work correctly anytime a player has serious character concerns they take a big hit on his grade. My guess as to why Peters isn't listed.

Feb 19, 2015 at 11:58 AM

MadDog49er
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Originally posted by HarboutTHAT:
Marcus Peters didn't make the top 5 corners... This list isn't solely based on talent.

Edited. Poor multitasking today. Thanks for catching. See my note on why I have him at number five.

[ Edited by MadDog49er on Feb 19, 2015 at 11:59 AM ]

Feb 19, 2015 at 11:59 AM

MadDog49er
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Posts: 19,400

Originally posted by vrabbit:
if I've interpreted MadDog's work correctly anytime a player has serious character concerns they take a big hit on his grade. My guess as to why Peters isn't listed.

Not as big of a ding for me. A part of the the equation. I am just not sold on him on the field. The talent is undeniable. Not sure about the consistency.

Feb 19, 2015 at 12:02 PM

Hoovtrain
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Posts: 34,820

So for those better at this than me, based on this list and the top 5 Offense list, who is BPA between the top 5 DL (minus Williams) and the top WR (minus the #1 WR)? For instance if the top 4 DL and top 4 WR are still on the board at #15, who would be the BPA overall? And what would be the bigger drop off in talent between the 1st round tier of DL/WR and round 2? Is there a better chance to grab a comparable talent in round 2 for WR or DL? Hopefully that made sense. Just trying to figure out the better bang for our buck in terms of what position should be picked first.

Feb 19, 2015 at 12:02 PM

MadDog49er
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Originally posted by theninermaniac:
You had PJ Williams 20 overall on your big board, now he's the 4th best CB on your defensive rankings. What gives?

You had K Johnson in the 50s on big board but now he's the second best CB?

Watching a lot of work on corners this week, especially on Johnson and Waynes and Collins. It has been my hardest area to discern this draft season of any position. Some, like OG and WR, jump out at me. CB and S and OT is a real challenge right now, which isn't always the case.

I still think Williams is terrific. Just saw a couple games earlier today that bothered me slightly. However, the battle with Parker was epic.

Feb 19, 2015 at 12:09 PM

#10

MadDog49er
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Originally posted by Hoovtrain:
So for those better at this than me, based on this list and the top 5 Offense list, who is BPA between the top 5 DL (minus Williams) and the top WR (minus the #1 WR)? For instance if the top 4 DL and top 4 WR are still on the board at #15, who would be the BPA overall? And what would be the bigger drop off in talent between the 1st round tier of DL/WR and round 2? Is there a better chance to grab a comparable talent in round 2 for WR or DL? Hopefully that made sense. Just trying to figure out the better bang for our buck in terms of what position should be picked first.

Lot of depth at WR and DL this year. Tons of 34 DE's will be still on the board in the third round (McCathy, Anderson, Hardison, maybe Preston Smith). At WR, another bumper crop in some combination of Lockett, Crowder, Agholor, Greene, Goodley, etc. And, interior OL line as well: John Miller, maybe Laken Tomlinson, etc.

Feb 20, 2015 at 7:05 PM

#11

ninergold
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Posts: 846

With the talent at DL, WR and RB, is this a year where they draft starters at all of those positions?

Feb 20, 2015 at 8:16 PM

#12

tohara3
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Great job MadDog49er