Is drafting OL a solution for next year?

Man, don't starting getting all rational and sheeyat....this is the Webzone, dammit!!!!

So when should we draft them? You do know it's very rare a good young OL will be available in FA right?

[ Edited by kronik on Jan 8, 2010 at 17:04:58 ]

Originally posted by kronik:
So when should we draft them? You do know it's very rare a good young OL will be available in FA right?

I don't want to speak for the n00b, but he's not saying absolutely don't draft an OL...he's just saying that we as fans shouldn't confuse this with having the problem "fixed" for next year. It's likely going to take some time before the rookie OT (whoever it is) begins to pay some dividends...the question is, will we fans realize this or will we want to get rid of the guy (like we always do) if he doesn't immediately make things better?

[ Edited by GoFD74 on Jan 8, 2010 at 17:08:45 ]

There are not going to be any proven studs available as Unrestricted Free Agents. All the good young players will be given contract extensions or tagged as Franchise or Transition players. Teams usually don't give away good young linemen.

Tackles drafted in the first round can come in and play well immediately, there are plenty of examples of this over the past few years. I personally have no doubt that we can find a lineman in this draft that can play much better next season than Adam Snyder played this season.

Originally posted by GoFD74:

Originally posted by kronik:
So when should we draft them? You do know it's very rare a good young OL will be available in FA right?

I don't want to speak for the n00b, but he's not saying absolutely don't draft an OL...he's just saying that we as fans shouldn't confuse this with having the problem "fixed" for next year. It's likely going to take some time before the rookie OT (whoever it is) begins to pay some dividends...the question is, will we fans realize this or will we want to get rid of the guy (like we always do) if he doesn't immediately make things better?

I don't think that's what this n00b is saying. He is saying "This is not why you draft for need ...blah blah.." I am getting the message that he doesn't want to draft any OL in the 1st round.

[ Edited by kronik on Jan 8, 2010 at 17:19:11 ]

Originally posted by kronik:

Originally posted by GoFD74:

Originally posted by kronik:
So when should we draft them? You do know it's very rare a good young OL will be available in FA right?

I don't want to speak for the n00b, but he's not saying absolutely don't draft an OL...he's just saying that we as fans shouldn't confuse this with having the problem "fixed" for next year. It's likely going to take some time before the rookie OT (whoever it is) begins to pay some dividends...the question is, will we fans realize this or will we want to get rid of the guy (like we always do) if he doesn't immediately make things better?

I don't think that's whatthis n00b is saying. He is saying "This is not why you draft for need ...blah blah.." I am getting the message that he doesn't want to draft any OL in the 1st round.

Ok...then he's wrong, specifically because a guy like Bryan Bulaga, Trent Williams or even Anthony Davis (at least one of the three) will likely be sitting there when we pick, and they would all grade out around that area more or less. So that would be picking for value, even though it happens to address a need as well. Now, if we reach for Jason Fox or Ciron Black in the 1st round, then he has a point.

To me, the bigger issue is, drafting an OT doesn't mean the problem is immediately solved. But hopefully most fans know this already.

Originally posted by GoFD74:

Originally posted by kronik:
So when should we draft them? You do know it's very rare a good young OL will be available in FA right?

I don't want to speak for the n00b, but he's not saying absolutely don't draft an OL...he's just saying that we as fans shouldn't confuse this with having the problem "fixed" for next year. It's likely going to take some time before the rookie OT (whoever it is) begins to pay some dividends...the question is, will we fans realize this or will we want to get rid of the guy (like we always do) if he doesn't immediately make things better?

I disagree. A guy like Davis, Bugala, or Williams may have the Michael Oher effect at the RT position. I think you'd see a significant upgrade immediately, although there may be a rough patch here or there.

Look at the Panthers for example. When they got Otah, and signed Wharton and Gross, they flopped those guys all over the OL, and they still had a potent rushing attack and blocking scheme.

Factor in a guy like Iupati, which guys of his caliber and below can be effective starters immediately, and I don't see the merit in the point.

Originally posted by kronik:

Originally posted by GoFD74:

Originally posted by kronik:
So when should we draft them? You do know it's very rare a good young OL will be available in FA right?

I don't want to speak for the n00b, but he's not saying absolutely don't draft an OL...he's just saying that we as fans shouldn't confuse this with having the problem "fixed" for next year. It's likely going to take some time before the rookie OT (whoever it is) begins to pay some dividends...the question is, will we fans realize this or will we want to get rid of the guy (like we always do) if he doesn't immediately make things better?

I don't think that's what this n00b is saying. He is saying "This is not why you draft for need ...blah blah.." I am getting the message that he doesn't want to draft any OL in the 1st round.

This seems to be a good year to draft OT. I think what he's saying may apply if there were few that were first round worthy, and if they're gone by our pick we should take the BPA rather than reach for someone. But I don't think that's the case this year, there will be talented lineman when we pick.

Originally posted by GEEK:

Originally posted by GoFD74:

Originally posted by kronik:
So when should we draft them? You do know it's very rare a good young OL will be available in FA right?

I don't want to speak for the n00b, but he's not saying absolutely don't draft an OL...he's just saying that we as fans shouldn't confuse this with having the problem "fixed" for next year. It's likely going to take some time before the rookie OT (whoever it is) begins to pay some dividends...the question is, will we fans realize this or will we want to get rid of the guy (like we always do) if he doesn't immediately make things better?

I disagree. A guy like Davis, Bugala, or Williams may have the Michael Oher effect at the RT position. I think you'd see a significant upgrade immediately, although there may be a rough patch here or there.

Look at the Panthers for example. When they got Otah, and signed Wharton and Gross, they flopped those guys all over the OL, and they still had a potent rushing attack and blocking scheme.

Factor in a guy like Iupati, which guys of his caliber and below can be effective starters immediately, and I don't see the merit in the point.

Upgrade from Snyder, absolutely (though I'm afraid that's not saying much)...but it will still take some time for the rookie to really hit his stride. I guess we're really talking semantics here, because I worry that most fans will just automatically think that the drafting of a RT (or even an additional OG) will solve our o-line issues.

Don't get me wrong, I'm for using one of those picks on an OT...I'm just not going to deceive myself into thinking that it's going to be smooth sailing for the o-line after that.

Like we did it with Staley in 2007 and the Jags did it with Monroe and Britton in 2009, I think we need to draft a couple of talented youngsters and throw them into the fire.

But at the same time plan-B should be re-signing Pashos and/or Sims as well as retaining Baas in case the new blood struggles.

Originally posted by GoFD74:

Originally posted by GEEK:

Originally posted by GoFD74:

Originally posted by kronik:
So when should we draft them? You do know it's very rare a good young OL will be available in FA right?

I don't want to speak for the n00b, but he's not saying absolutely don't draft an OL...he's just saying that we as fans shouldn't confuse this with having the problem "fixed" for next year. It's likely going to take some time before the rookie OT (whoever it is) begins to pay some dividends...the question is, will we fans realize this or will we want to get rid of the guy (like we always do) if he doesn't immediately make things better?

I disagree. A guy like Davis, Bugala, or Williams may have the Michael Oher effect at the RT position. I think you'd see a significant upgrade immediately, although there may be a rough patch here or there.

Look at the Panthers for example. When they got Otah, and signed Wharton and Gross, they flopped those guys all over the OL, and they still had a potent rushing attack and blocking scheme.

Factor in a guy like Iupati, which guys of his caliber and below can be effective starters immediately, and I don't see the merit in the point.

Upgrade from Snyder, absolutely (though I'm afraid that's not saying much)...but it will still take some time for the rookie to really hit his stride. I guess we're really talking semantics here, because I worry that most fans will just automatically think that the drafting of a RT (or even an additional OG) will solve our o-line issues.

Don't get me wrong, I'm for using one of those picks on an OT...I'm just not going to deceive myself into thinking that it's going to be smooth sailing for the o-line after that.

First of all, I'm not a Noob. I've been part of the Webzone since 2002. Second of all, I'm not saying that we shouldn't draft an OL with one or both first round picks. I'm saying it wouldn't make sense to pass up a superior NFL prospect because we are trying too hard to address the OL woes with this draft by next year. The best case scenario is that the BPA is an OT/G and that he performs at a high level in his rookie year. The stars would really have to align for this to happen. The worst case is the Kwame effect or even Chilo Rachal over Desean (even though the jury is still out on Chilo).

Chances are even if the BPA is OT/G, that won't fix the OL by next year...see Baas, Kwame, Chilo, etc.... We'll probably have to wait a couple of seasons to see any dividends.

Originally posted by GEEK:

Originally posted by GoFD74:

Originally posted by kronik:
So when should we draft them? You do know it's very rare a good young OL will be available in FA right?

I don't want to speak for the n00b, but he's not saying absolutely don't draft an OL...he's just saying that we as fans shouldn't confuse this with having the problem "fixed" for next year. It's likely going to take some time before the rookie OT (whoever it is) begins to pay some dividends...the question is, will we fans realize this or will we want to get rid of the guy (like we always do) if he doesn't immediately make things better?

I disagree. A guy like Davis, Bugala, or Williams may have the Michael Oher effect at the RT position. I think you'd see a significant upgrade immediately, although there may be a rough patch here or there.

Look at the Panthers for example. When they got Otah, and signed Wharton and Gross, they flopped those guys all over the OL, and they still had a potent rushing attack and blocking scheme.

Factor in a guy like Iupati, which guys of his caliber and below can be effective starters immediately, and I don't see the merit in the point.

You may like Davis, Bulaga, or Williams, but it doesn't mean any of them will fix our OL by next year. When was the last time that all of the OL prospects drafted in the first round tore it up their rookie year? Usually you only have one out of six first rounders have a real impact in their first year. And by the way, there are some good OL prospects this year, but I don't see any Joe Thomas' or Orlando Paces.

Originally posted by GoFD74:
Man, don't starting getting all rational and sheeyat....this is the Webzone, dammit!!!!

Originally posted by GoFD74:

Originally posted by kronik:

Originally posted by GoFD74:

Originally posted by kronik:
So when should we draft them? You do know it's very rare a good young OL will be available in FA right?

I don't want to speak for the n00b, but he's not saying absolutely don't draft an OL...he's just saying that we as fans shouldn't confuse this with having the problem "fixed" for next year. It's likely going to take some time before the rookie OT (whoever it is) begins to pay some dividends...the question is, will we fans realize this or will we want to get rid of the guy (like we always do) if he doesn't immediately make things better?

I don't think that's whatthis n00b is saying. He is saying "This is not why you draft for need ...blah blah.." I am getting the message that he doesn't want to draft any OL in the 1st round.

Ok...then he's wrong, specifically because a guy like Bryan Bulaga, Trent Williams or even Anthony Davis (at least one of the three) will likely be sitting there when we pick, and they would all grade out around that area more or less. So that would be picking for value, even though it happens to address a need as well. Now, if we reach for Jason Fox or Ciron Black in the 1st round, then he has a point.

To me, the bigger issue is, drafting an OT doesn't mean the problem is immediately solved. But hopefully most fans know this already.

Then again, there has been plenty of evidence from recent drafts that drafting lineman early can really work out. Take a look at the Pro Bowl tackles for the AFC this year:

* Jake Long, Miami (injured)
* Ryan Clady, Denver
# D'Brickashaw Ferguson, N.Y. Jets
Joe Thomas, Cleveland

Except for D'Brick, the other guys were high 1st round picks who moved into the starting lineup and excelled right away. We can only hope the Niners pick the right guys and get the immediate return like the Dolphins, Browns, and Broncos did.