Roster Status - Are we really that depleted of talent?

Originally posted by elguapo:

I stopped reading when he said Wagner. Yeah right. He is not even close. What he was a top 10 lb ONCE??? And that was when Willis and bow were both injured. Mosley? He is a solid tackler but beyond that......

Did he just say Staley was above average??? Sorry I had to keep reading bc I needed a good laugh. And Hyde when healthy is a top 10 back with his power and tackle breaking ability.

Wow. Too dam funny of a post

Learn to read. Staley is a very good LT. We don't have anyone else who I consider above average for their position on offense (comparing T. Smith against #1 WR's). Saying we have one player who is above average can mean we have several average players and one really good one.

Mosley and Wagner are way better in coverage than Bowman post-injury.

I feel we have alot of decent depth at alot of positions but those same positions are lacking above average talent

Originally posted by elguapo:
I stopped reading when he said Wagner. Yeah right. He is not even close. What he was a top 10 lb ONCE??? And that was when Willis and bow were both injured. Mosley? He is a solid tackler but beyond that......

Did he just say Staley was above average??? Sorry I had to keep reading bc I needed a good laugh. And Hyde when healthy is a top 10 back with his power and tackle breaking ability.

Wow. Too dam funny of a post

lol Bowman came off and ACL last year and still flexed on the league. That guy would really take 33 year old Derrick Johnson over a now even healthier and younger Bowman?

I would say we are strong at the RB, TE, G, DE, OLB, CB, S

Huge questions at QB, WR, C, OT, NT, ILB depth...

Don't know too much about the talent but it feels like we are full,of Ducks, Corner Backs and Aussies. Sounds like a weird Yoko Ono type party in the seventies.

This team is full of all pros and pro bowlers

Ok,, "Staley is a very good to above average LT" ...we all would agree to that. But Joe is also an ALL PRO LT, and that is where Guapo and I would disagree with you. Big difference between "very good and above average" and being an all pro for multiple yrs. Huge difference.

Also, eastcoast, I think you will find a lot more folks that think Bow is stiil an excellent LB than those who think he is not in top 10. That is where the "quibble" is.

On another subject, it is worth repeating that rather than are we depleted, or are we not that good, the pink elephant in the room is Harbaw and tomsul's absolute refusal to play all but their vets. Part of the job of being HC is to find out exactly what you have on the bench and to coach them up and make them better. Tomsul ...ah, not worth discussing...just a total loss of one yr....but Harbaw, had 4 yrs to develop guys, yet an awful lot of them never got off the bench. We went thru 2 drafts for sure, but probably a 3rd, where intelligent drafting was impossible, in that Harbaw would just not play guys on the bench and find out what they had...or didn't have. It wasn't criminal, but it sure as heck was gross negligence. Playing nothing but vets and one or two top draft picks every yr is certainly getting your best guys on the field. But not playing guys who might even be better...well that's a college coach for you. Harbaw certainly organized all the talent that had accumulated over the 9 yrs of picking in top 7-10. But did he develop those guys sitting on the bench...or even give them a shot? No. And that leads ultimately to an overall decline in talent on the team, when you end up drafting wtih no idea what you have already sitting on the pine. That is the mark of a short timer, not a NFL coach who plans to be around a long time.

In the end he got fired...ok, mutually agreed to separation....but he should have been fired a yr earlier. True it would have been hard to pull that off, so we did ok with the "firing/separation" after the 2014 season. But it could have/ should have....been a yr earlier. NO way the fan base nor owner would have signed off on that tho.

Originally posted by NinerGM:
Very inexperienced team with brand new and very young coaches. This can only be solved with time.

This^^^. We have a lot of really young players and a noticeable shortage of superstars on this team. Quite a few of the young bucks need to step up in a major way for our team to stand a chance. I think the biggest wildcard next year will be the health of one Carlos Hyde. If he can remain healthy all year long, we'll be in decent shape. That said, I'm still second guessing trading up to select Joshua Garnett. Love Garnett and I'm excited he's on the team but I think we'll end up missing those draft picks.

Would feel a lot better if we had spent a high pick on a back up RB.

Originally posted by NinerGM:
Very inexperienced team with brand new and very young coaches. This can only be solved with time.

This...it's remarkable that in a rebuild year last year, how little experience players got. Take a look at who had the most snaps and then go down the list. You'll find yourself saying, "These numbers should be inverted!" And probably feeling like, "What a waste of a year! "

Offensive Personnel: (2015 Snap Count)
QB: Blaine Gabbert (509); Colin Kaepernick (502), Jeff Driskel (0), Thad Lewis (0) & Dylan Thompson (0)
There's nothing like splitting time at QB.

RB1: Carlos Hyde (292); Mike Davis (126) & Kendall Gaskins (91)
RB2: DuJuan Harris (61); Shaun Draughn (253), Kelvin Taylor (0) & Jarryd Hayne (63)
When your #1 RB only plays a few games and still ends up leading in snaps, that's a bad year...rash of injuries.

MTE: Bruce Miller (143); Busta Anderson (0) & Devon Cajuste (0)
TE: Garrett Celek (399) & Vance McDonald (468); Blake Bell (352) & Jamie Childers (0)
Your most used TE only had 468 snaps all year. That's less than half (46%) of the offensive snaps. And I'm not sure they would have been used that much if not for switching QB's and to the WCO half way through the year.

X WR: Torrey Smith (772); Jerome Simpson (85) & Bryce Treggs (0)
Y WR (SLOT): Bruce Ellington (143); Aaron Burbridge (0), DeAndrew White (30) & DiAndre Campbell (0)
Z WR: DeAndre Smelter (0); Quinton Patton (424), Dres Anderson (0) & Eric Rogers (0)
Your #1 FA only plays 772 snaps and without Boldin, the next closest is Patton at 424? Why even have WR's then. LOL

LOT: Joe Staley (1,011); Fahn Cooper (0)
LG: Zane Beadles (1,058); Andrew Tiller (614), Blake Muir & Jordan Devey (388)
C: Daniel Kilgore (267); Ian Silberman (0)
RG: Joshua Garnett (0); Erik Pears (1,011), Brandon Thomas (0) & Marcus Martin (819)
ROT: Trenton Brown (186); John Theus (0) & Colin Kelly (0)
Nothing speaks to dysfunction like Pears and Devey racking up a collective 1,400 snaps! Fans should see the big 0 next to Thomas and want to puke, along with only 186 for Brown and 614 for Tiller. Kilgore, coming back from injury only had 267 himself. Ouch.

Defensive Personnel:
RDE: DeForest Bucker (0); Ronald Blair (0), Alex Balducci (0) & Tony Jerod Eddie (290)
NT: Quinton Dial (640); Mike Purcell (288), Darren Lake (0) & Garrison Smith (0) (Ian Williams - 659)
LDE: Arik Armstead (375); Kaleb Ramsey (0) & Demetrius Cherry (0) (Glenn Dorsey - 45)
Like with Tiller and Brown, it's hard to fathom that with the Dorsey injury, our #1 draft pick only got 375 snaps. That's 34% of the total snaps. Your other more experienced RDE only had twice that! And when your NT is leading in snaps at 60% of the snaps, something is badly off. Good ol' TJE.

ELEPHANT: Tank Carradine (223)
WILL: Eli Harold (337); Marcus Rush (0), Ray-Ray Armstrong (0) & Kevin Anderson (0)
SAM: Aaron Lynch (793); Ahmad Brooks (741), Corey Lemonier (271), Jason Fanaika & Lenny Jones (0)
Yeah. Your rotational pass rusher gets 337 chances to grow/develop.

TED: Gerald Hodges (366); Michael Wilhoite (616)
MIKE: Navarro Bowman (1,098); Shayne Skov (8) & Nick Bellore (7)
ROBBER: Jaquiski Tartt (719)
Ahhhh, here we go. We've got a player coming back from major knee reconstruction. Let's give him EVERY snap.

RCB: Dontae Johnson (366); Rashard Robinson (0) & Marcus Cromartie (122)
SLOT (S/CB): Keith Reaser (79); Will Redmond (0), Prince Charles Iworah (0) & Kyle Sebetic (0)
LCB: Tramaine Brock (1,064); Kenneth Acker (807) & Chris Davis (17)
FS: Eric Reid (1,113); L.J. McCray (0) & Jered Bell (0)
SS: Jimmie Ward (730); Antoine Bethea (440)
Same concept with the OL. Better players getting less snaps. Injuries forced a lot of shifts here so that also affects the development.

Originally posted by jreff22:
No idea what we have at WR
QB is a giant ?
Can the RB's stay healthy
Is the OL "fixed"
Can we generate a pass rush
Do we have legit starters at CB

Will Chips system work against the West

QB isn't as giant of a ? as people make it. Its more of a hot take taking point for the idiots at ESPN. Judging by Kap's offseason of surgeries he probably shouldn't have seen the field after the second game. Gabbert proved himself to be a more than adequate back up. Both of these guys have infinite more talent that Nick Foles, and look what Chip Kelly did with him.

The biggest reason the Niners won't win many games next year is the schedule. It's brutal. The team will be better with better coaching but will probably win the same amount of games.

Originally posted by jreff22:
No idea what we have at WR
QB is a giant ?
Can the RB's stay healthy
Is the OL "fixed"
Can we generate a pass rush
Do we have legit starters at CB

Will Chips system work against the West

Boldin is the only appearant change, we stil have Smith, Ells, and Patton. Smelter, Rodgers, and the rest are capable of 4th/5th type roles. I think were solid!
Kaep, Gabbert are functional, and can at least be game managers.
We drafted a RB, and Drougn filled in great with the fkd. Oline we had., We will be fine, and I hear we may still be trying to bring in Ryan Matthews. Also always FA, esp. june 1st. I say solid!
Dats a good question(pass rush).
We have a plethora of CB's , and we get all back healthy-solid!.

Chips system should and will work here. Better coaching, scheme, and knowledge of the game. Solid.
The only question I see both of us having is ,"can we generate a pass rush.

We are depleted at the skill positions.

It all sounds cute in may lol

Originally posted by Lutch57:

Originally posted by jreff22:
No idea what we have at WR
QB is a giant ?
Can the RB's stay healthy
Is the OL "fixed"
Can we generate a pass rush
Do we have legit starters at CB

Will Chips system work against the West

QB isn't as giant of a ? as people make it. Its more of a hot take taking point for the idiots at ESPN. Judging by Kap's offseason of surgeries he probably shouldn't have seen the field after the second game. Gabbert proved himself to be a more than adequate back up. Both of these guys have infinite more talent that Nick Foles, and look what Chip Kelly did with him.

The biggest reason the Niners won't win many games next year is the schedule. It's brutal. The team will be better with better coaching but will probably win the same amount of games.

Im a lil more optimistic. We won 5 games last year, and could've won 3 more (we had da Giants, fk. Eli !!), but we were almost another 8-8 team like the year before; with all the defections, injurys, and poor coaching, injured players, NO Oline!!, So with all improvements added, and healthy players returning- I say we win those 3-4 games we shud have last year and go 8-8/9-7..

We're on the way back.