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Oakland Athletics thread

Originally posted by IT21:
Originally posted by TheRambler:
Owners aren't gonna sell, sadly. At the very least it seems they are gonna stay in Oakland.

I honestly think in the next 15 years they will most likely sell to a group that moves the team out of Oakland. Maybe they'll actually build a stadium in Oakland. God knows. But the whole process is taking way too long for me to believe that'll happen. It should've started a decade ago

Call me optimistic, but I think MLB will strong arm Wolff and co into sh*tting or getting off the pot re Oakland. I think it depends on 1) Wolffe and co finally letting go of the San Jose pipe dream and focusing on Oakland, and 2) The City of Oakland making an effort to build a new ballpark. The City has openly said they prefer the A's over the Raiders, so that's a start.
And as far as "it should have happened a decade ago"... the same was true as to a new Niners stadium, and that got done eventually too
Originally posted by TheRambler:
Originally posted by IT21:
Originally posted by TheRambler:
Owners aren't gonna sell, sadly. At the very least it seems they are gonna stay in Oakland.

I honestly think in the next 15 years they will most likely sell to a group that moves the team out of Oakland. Maybe they'll actually build a stadium in Oakland. God knows. But the whole process is taking way too long for me to believe that'll happen. It should've started a decade ago

Call me optimistic, but I think MLB will strong arm Wolff and co into sh*tting or getting off the pot re Oakland. I think it depends on 1) Wolffe and co finally letting go of the San Jose pipe dream and focusing on Oakland, and 2) The City of Oakland making an effort to build a new ballpark. The City has openly said they prefer the A's over the Raiders, so that's a start.

Lol there is a mass exodus of teams leaving Oakland. The Warriors and Raiders are surely gone, and if the A's stay in the bay area it certainly won't be in Oakland. Not a chance that city builds a ballpark. Best chance would still be in the Hayward-Fremont corridor, but not under the garbage ownership they have now.
You guys remember that time when there was a plan to build a new stadium right in uptown? That would've looked really nice right now sitting right in the middle of one of the most up-and-coming, "hippest" areas of Oakland. Could've done what the Giants park did to the China Basin area. I think that was our best shot at getting a stadium done in Oakland. Of course Scott/Hoffman would've likely still been our ownership group who were even stingier than Wolff is.

f**king Jerry Brown. Wanted to put in a section 8 housing complex instead I think.

I'm not optimistic about the A's current ballpark situation. Oakland has yet to get serious with the A's stadium. They seem to prefer to keep kicking the can down the road and aren't in any rush considering they know that the A's can't move to San Jose. Where in Oakland are they proposing to build a stadium? Still pushing the Coliseum parking lot? Get real. That area is such a s**thole and a new stadium isn't going to solve all the issues surrounding that area. Unless they're planning to gentrify the s**t out of east oakland and push all the poor people out to the suburbs. Seems to be every city planner's idea of how to solve economic problems, push the poor people outside the city limits and make them somebody else's problem....

Back on topic:Basically, there arent really any viable options in Oakland and if MLB doesn't okay a move to San Jose, I think the A's move out of the area entirely. If Selig wasn't able/willing to get it done for his frat brother Wolff, than no way in hell is Manfred going to. Which I think is part of SF's motivation to pay hardball about renegotiating territorial rights, because they see the opportunity to have the entire Bay Area to themselves if the A's move out and worst case the A's build a stadium in Oakland and SF still has control of all that Silicon Valley money. Win win for the Giants.

But it's probably going to be 10 more years in purgatory before there's any kind of solution which means an endless cycle of firesales and rebuilds in our future.
I take back what I said about the Forest City housing development thing. Was just going off my memory of 11 years ago. A little research shows it was a way more complex issue and was definitely not section 8 housing. But I still maintain that this was our best chance to get a stadium built in Oakland.

Would love to see the A's get a cutting edge new ballpark in an attractive location in the city of Oakland. And for Lew Wolff to sell the team to someone who wants to keep the A's in Oakland as their foremost goal. And for the city to get serious about working with that new ownership group to come up with a feasible plan. That's the dream.

But more than anything I just want to see the A's not have to constantly be in rebuilding mode every two years. And not have to play in that broken down embarrassment of a wasteland they call the overstock.com coliseum. However that happens. The sooner the better. But at this point I'm too jaded to think anything is going to happen. It's time to tank for a higher draft pick guys! Woohoooo!!
[ Edited by AllTimeGreat on Jul 24, 2015 at 10:03 PM ]
A caught stealing at 3rd base in the 9th? Casilla was leaking oil and primed to cough it up, and that let him off the hook. Bonehed move
[ Edited by Bluesbro on Jul 26, 2015 at 6:30 PM ]
Originally posted by reno9er:
It must be incredibly difficult to be an A's fan. The organization is so poorly run from ownership to the front office, Bob Melvin is a quality baseball manager who is hamstrung by a GM who either by his own volition or with direction from the owner just guts the team at the big league level year after year.
It is tough as an A's fan. I don't think the FO is all that bad, if they had the money they could keep some of these players. Perhaps I am wrong, but the constant shuttling of good players out the door comes down to the lack of attendance and therefore profits. They have those tarps up there for a reason, because those seats would still be empty otherwise. I'm struggling to figure out how a new stadium would dramatically fix the attendance issue, which is an issue even when they field a winning team. What the hell happened to all the fans I remember filling the seats in the late '80s-early '90s? It's a "chicken and the egg" dynamic, is attendance low because the team constantly sends its talent packing, or does the team send its talent packing because they aren't profitable enough to keep them? It's probably both, but more so the former.

Originally posted by IT21:
Josh Donaldson is an MVP caliber talent that had 5 years of team control remaining. Arguably the best all around 3B in the league. I'm convinced they'll never keep anyone great, ever.

TBH I've gotten sick of it, I've already posted in here I don't care about the team as much as I used to. How can you when your favorite players are traded for minor league players over and over again? Especially players the caliber of Josh Donaldson.

I got sick of it to the point I question my own fanhood sometimes and I really just don't care about the A's this year, at all. Maybe I'll care again when I'm over trading Donaldson, Russell, and Cespedes but once that happens they'll probably trade Sonny Gray a month later.

Yeah, the Samardzija and Lester trades created too much empty space in the cupboards and they had to compensate for that by getting rid of Donaldson, and other players prematurely. You could feel the wind being taken out of the sails last season when they traded away Cespedes. Given the off-season trades the A's current record isn't surprising. I can't blame you one bit for being sick of the A's, or jumping off the wagon, I myself find it very tough to muster any enthusiasm for watching the games. These days being off the wagon seems to be a better place than on the wagon. The organization makes it very tough to root for them. That being said, this talent give-away has been going on for at least 15 years, if not 20, or all the way to the '70's, so its nothing new -- even if it is still disheartening.
I haven't jumped off the wagon. I just feel actual anger for trading Cespedes and Donaldson whenever I think about the A's. The trades literally make me mad.

They've been doing this for 2 decades but this time was different. I, along with the entire fan base were attached to the players because of how everything played out in 2012. Below .500 at the all star break to an incredible 2nd half. 15 walk off wins, winning 6 straight games (8 of our last 9) to win the division on the last day of the season by sweeping the Rangers. We were supposed to suck ass but were the funniest in sports I ever seen.

Even Josh Donaldson said the same thing in an interview last week. He said there was an emotional attachment between the players and the fans since 2012, and he's right. It's different than when we traded Swisher, Bradley, etc.

I still haven't gotten over it. I'm still an A's fan, I'm just a pissed off one.
The Donaldson trade doesn't bother me, really. Once the Cespedes/Lester trade backfired and led to the atrocious 2nd half of 2014 it was time to burn it all down, and trading Donaldson was part of that. Now that the bullpen imploded to sink 2015 just as it begun it's time for a true rebuild for sure.

Pretty decent return this week for three free agents who were not gonna get re-signed.
After watching where the A's were at this time last year, and where they are now, I really question WTF Billy Beane is doing.

Was this really the plan? Have the best team in baseball in July of 2014, screw up the chemistry with unnecessary trades, get edged in the WC game, trade most all your all-stars away in the offseason, trade the rest in 2015, go into full blown rebuild mode?

Its like he completely dismantled a young title contender for no good reason.

Originally posted by Niners99:
After watching where the A's were at this time last year, and where they are now, I really question WTF Billy Beane is doing.

Was this really the plan? Have the best team in baseball in July of 2014, screw up the chemistry with unnecessary trades, get edged in the WC game, trade most all your all-stars away in the offseason, trade the rest in 2015, go into full blown rebuild mode?

Its like he completely dismantled a young title contender for no good reason.

Let me first start off by saying that I'm not a Beane apologist by any means. But as someone who actually followed the A's closely let me provide some context. Yes, even though they had a very good year to that point, there were definite problems. The biggest thing was that our pitching was (rightly) unsustainable. We had guys having career years to that point, logging heavy innings (Kazmir, Chavez) who predictably fell off dramatically. Our offense was very very good. Beane thought that having a rotation of Samardijia, Gray, and Lester would carry us further than a lineup containing Cespedes but no Lester. As a Giants fan you should be able to appreciate the logic of trying to win with dominant pitching and a mediocre offense. Our playoff history also was likely a motivation. No matter who the players were, we have a tendency to choke spectacularly come playoff time. Maybe he thought by going "all in" we might be able to finally break through.

Of course we all saw what happened. Beane did not anticipate pretty much every one of our hitters to go into slumps. Nagging injuries played a factor. It's very likely that trading Cespedes put a stake right down the middle of our clubhouse chemistry and also contributed to our offense's collapse although that is difficult to prove emperically. They were clearly a very tight knit group who loved playing for eachother and played with a joy that was palpable.

But it's also impossible to know whether we would have even made the wild card game had we not made those moves. This team clearly had flaws, more so than Beane thought. Who knows what would have happened had the bullpen not blown the wildcard game (eerily foreshadowing this year)? Beane took a huge gamble but grabbed the wrong jenga piece and it all came toppling over. And despite all the offseason trades we probably would be in the wild card race this year had every member of our bullpen not turned into a gascan overnight.

Now we're all looking at the smoldering wreckage of a dumpster fire and wondering "holy s**t where do the A's go from here." Let's see what Beane can come up with next year. It might not make us competitive but with him at the helm it will certainly be interesting to say the least.
Originally posted by Niners99:
After watching where the A's were at this time last year, and where they are now, I really question WTF Billy Beane is doing.

Was this really the plan? Have the best team in baseball in July of 2014, screw up the chemistry with unnecessary trades, get edged in the WC game, trade most all your all-stars away in the offseason, trade the rest in 2015, go into full blown rebuild mode?

Its like he completely dismantled a young title contender for no good reason.

As I've said here and elsewhere many times, he overplayed his hand. It was un-Beanius like to make the big move (Lester) and I give him credit for going outside his normal comfort zone to try and make something happen...but I fault him big time because it WAS. NOT. NECESSARY. And it was just plain stupid to trade your best player, your cleanup hitter, your heart-and-soul, for 2-month rental of a pitcher you didn't need...and who oh by the way flamed spectacularly in the exact kind of game you got him for. And that doesn't speak to all the pressure now put on the rest of that lineup. or the fact if he would've waited until offseason he would have got a much greater return for Cespedes...although Cespedes was a player they should've spent some $$ to re-sign, or at least try.

And I can't stand Beane's arrogance, that he speaks down to people who question that trade, and he won't admit it was a bad move. That said, I'm actually okay with what's going on now, because I knew this team wasn't going anywhere so time to start over...again. I still expect Reddick and possibly Vogt to get dealt, and I would not even be shocked if he traded Gray. Of course if he actually did trade Gray it better be an absolute slam-dunk HAUL of top-shelf prospects and perhaps also currentl MLB player/s.

So what will happen is all these pieces will either come up to the A's within a year or two or get flipped for more chips, he'll hit on a couple under-the-radar vet FAs, and within 2-3 years the A's will go on another 3-4 year run where they're just good enough to compete and get bounced in first round of playoffs, then as those young players start to get really good, the A's will throw out the normal absolute BS of "small-market", then rinse and repeat.
Originally posted by AllTimeGreat:
Let me first start off by saying that I'm not a Beane apologist by any means. But as someone who actually followed the A's closely let me provide some context. Yes, even though they had a very good year to that point, there were definite problems. The biggest thing was that our pitching was (rightly) unsustainable. We had guys having career years to that point, logging heavy innings (Kazmir, Chavez) who predictably fell off dramatically. Our offense was very very good. Beane thought that having a rotation of Samardijia, Gray, and Lester would carry us further than a lineup containing Cespedes but no Lester. As a Giants fan you should be able to appreciate the logic of trying to win with dominant pitching and a mediocre offense. Our playoff history also was likely a motivation. No matter who the players were, we have a tendency to choke spectacularly come playoff time. Maybe he thought by going "all in" we might be able to finally break through.

Of course we all saw what happened. Beane did not anticipate pretty much every one of our hitters to go into slumps. Nagging injuries played a factor. It's very likely that trading Cespedes put a stake right down the middle of our clubhouse chemistry and also contributed to our offense's collapse although that is difficult to prove emperically. They were clearly a very tight knit group who loved playing for eachother and played with a joy that was palpable.

But it's also impossible to know whether we would have even made the wild card game had we not made those moves. This team clearly had flaws, more so than Beane thought. Who knows what would have happened had the bullpen not blown the wildcard game (eerily foreshadowing this year)? Beane took a huge gamble but grabbed the wrong jenga piece and it all came toppling over. And despite all the offseason trades we probably would be in the wild card race this year had every member of our bullpen not turned into a gascan overnight.

Now we're all looking at the smoldering wreckage of a dumpster fire and wondering "holy s**t where do the A's go from here." Let's see what Beane can come up with next year. It might not make us competitive but with him at the helm it will certainly be interesting to say the least.

Well said
Seeing some of these deadline deals for pitchers further emphasizes the fact that we grossly overpayed for Samardijia and Hamel. We gave up a top 10 (arguably top 5) prospect in all of baseball plus a top 50 prospect (McKinney) as well as a pitcher with major league experience and some level of success. Samardijia and Hamel were both having career years without a past track record of being elite (Hamel in particular). Hamel promptly turned back into a pumpkin and regressed to the mean (which we bore the brunt of). Then we gave away a perfectly solid Milone for a guy we released earlier in the season, and Milone would've put up better numbers than Hamel did.

You don't see anyone giving up anywhere close to the level of prospect value that the A's gave up. Even if Russel doesn't live up to his Barry Larkin comp, and McKinney doesn't turn into Mark Kotsay before the back injury, it will never be a "win" simply because we gave up way toomuch value for what we got in return.
The A's bullpen....
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