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Originally posted by jimrat201:
Originally posted by Oakland-Niner:
http://www.eastsideboxing.com/news.php?p=29340&more=1
I thought some of you guys might enjoy this great read before bed. No need to thank me.
Worst interview I ever read lol
Originally posted by Oakland-Niner:
I had a post on Eastsideboxing I thought I would share with you all. You can check my facts using the links below.
"The Bible of Boxing
Your arguments are far too simple. Just because Floyd and Pacman started at the same weight as boys (Yes, Boys) doesn't mean that's where they should end up as grown men. The body hit's its physical maturity around 25. So if you're a professional athlete with very little body fat, the weight you are at 25 is your mature natural weight as a highly tuned physical athlete. Manny is 32 almost 33. If you go back 8 years from 2011 he was 25 in 2003. At 25, he was fighting at Bantamweight which is a max of 122lbs. At the beginning of 2008 he was still fighting at Super Feather (130), but at the end of 2010 he fought as a light middleweight (154). So you're telling me that after he reached full maturity physically he gained 20 percent more muscle naturally? Worst, in two years (2008 to 2010 or 29-31) he gained 24lbs of muscle? That is very unlikely without PED."
http://boxing.about.com/od/records/a/pacquiao.htm
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Weight_class_(boxing)
Floyd Mayweather: “To say a guy goes from 105 pounds to this (welterweight), and it's all natural … come on, man…”
Manny Pacquiao made his pro debut against Edmund Enting Ignacio in January of 1995. He was 16 years old at the time and weighed in at 106 pounds. At 16 years old Floyd Mayweather Jr. won the 1993 USA National Golden Gloves tournament in the 106 pound division.
At 17 years old Manny Pacquiao climbed in to the ring in May of 1996 against John Medina and weighed 114 pounds. At the same tender age of 17 Mayweather captured a USA National Golden Gloves title again, this time at (you guessed it) 114 pounds.
The biggest difference between Pacquaio and Mayweather early in their careers is that Floyd opted to turn pro at 19 years old (after attending the 1996 Olympics where he won a bronze medal at 125 pounds) as a lightweight in his first professional fight in November of '96 (where he weighed in at 131 pounds). Mayweather remained at 130 pounds from his pro debut until 2002 when he ventured to lightweight as a 25 year old.
Pacquiao (who as mentioned above) turned professional in the Philippines at 16, remained between 114 pounds and 126 pounds from ages 20 through 25 until he met Erik Morales for the first time in his first foray at 130 pounds.
Thus in their mid 20′s both men were fighting at natural weights for their body type in and around the junior lightweight / lightweight divisions.
At 27 years old Mayweather took his first fight at 140 pounds against Demarcus Corley. Pacquiao made his first jump north of light welterweight when he fought Oscar De la Hoya at 29 years old tipping the scales at 142 pounds in what was officially a sanctioned welterweight contest.
Both men entered and spent their early 30′s as welterweights where we find both of them remaining to this day. Both fighters claim their “walk around weight” to be in the high 140′s and both men admittedly have an easy time making the welterweight limit of 147 pounds.
In his last three fights to date Mayweather has weighed 146, 146 and 146.5 pounds respectively to 145.75, 144.5 qnd 145 for Pacquiao in his last three outings.
As someone who has spent time in each of their training camps for the last six years, I can tell you unequivocally that these men are naturally very close to the same size. Floyd is slightly taller and longer while Manny is thicker with bigger legs.
In no way is this a case where Mayweather is a naturally bigger man while Pacquiao has sculpted and bulked up to walk around at the same weight. They are and always have been very close to the same size naturally.
So, something I've been thinking about for a long time are the lines that originate from the Mayweathers that Floyd fans repeat on here ad nauseum regarding why Pacquiao must be on PEDs. Aside from "Take the test, take the test, take the test!" those lines are
"Nobody starts out ordinary and becomes extraordinary"
and
"That's too much of a jump in weight, no one should be able to go up that far in weight and KO guys like Manny is knocking them out" (never mind that the only dramatic KO Manny has since moving up to 135 is Hatton, everyone else has been stopped by accumulation, a mercy stoppage, or gone the distance)
Now, either the Mayweathers must have never heard about a lot of fighters, or they must be saying that a bunch of fighters must have been on PEDs. Lets take a look.
Alexis Arguello
Lost 2 of his first 5 fights, one by KO. Went on to become an ATG with a record of 77-8. Obviously must have gotten some good PEDs along the way. I guess he was cycling off them when Ernesto Marcel beat him in the 70s, and those other bouts he sometimes dropped during his prime.
Hank Armstrong
Okay, a guy who lost 3 of his first 4 bouts and gets KOd at 120 is going to go on to be a top rated ATG and, within less than two years, win the belts at Featherweight, Lightweight, and Welterweight? And then go on to fight the Middleweight champ to a draw? Must have been PEDs.
Ezzard Charles
Picked up a number of losses and draws around his 20th fight, was knocked down 7 times in one of his losses at light heavyweight and 8 times in a fight at 168, goes on to win the Heavyweight title and KO guys weighing in as high as 260 pounds. PEDs strike again!
Jack Dempsey
Suffered a number of early defeats and draws, including one where he was KOd 10 seconds into the fight. The way he beat the s**t out of Willard must have been signs of roid rage.
Emile Griffith
Loses his 14th fight to a guy who would retire with a .500 record and drops another decision just a couple of fights later goes on to be Welterweight, Jr. Middle and Middleweight champion? Must have been PEDs.
Billy Conn
A guy who started his career 8-7 at Lightweight and Welterweight then go on to be Lightheavyweight champion and nearly beat one of the greatest Heavyweight champions of all time?!! Yeah right, no one could do that.
Jersey Joe Walcott
A guy who starts at Middleweight and suffers losses in his 7th and 12th fights goes on to be heavyweight champion? Can't happen. No one who starts off that bad can do anything like that.
Bernard Hopkins
A guy losing his first fight to another guy making his debut is going to go on to rule the Middleweight division for a decade and still be a force at 46? Must be PEDs!
Julio Cesar Chavez
I mean, a guy who starts off at 116 and has guys with losing records going the distance with him, but is later knocking out guys at junior middle in 2 rounds? Definitely roids. I mean, just look at the size of the dude's head!
Roberto Duran
Duran started his career at 120, and won titles all the way up to Middleweight. He won the Middleweight title knocked down Iran Barkley who went on to KO heavyweights. A former 120 pounder taking shots from a guy who knocked out heavyweight and hurting that other fighter? Roberto must have been a steroid popper. The physique gives it away.
So really, the Mayweathers either are ignoring all this history in leveling their accusations against Pacquiao, or they just don't know s**t about boxing history!
Originally posted by Oakland-Niner:
Sorry, but that is a very poorly written article. It presents the numbers in a way that's confusing. Here is all you need to know;
Keep in mind they are only a year apart in age.
Mayweather- Started his career fighting at 131lb and now fights around 146 (1996-present). If you click on the link below and look at his fights and weight gain, it looks like a very natural progression of a fighter moving up. Every several years he moves up about 5 pounds.
http://boxrec.com/list_bouts.php?human_id=000352&cat=boxer
Manny - In 1996 he was fighting at 112, which is 15 pounds less than Mayweather that year. He spent most of his career fighting under 125 and only a few years fighting up to, but not over 130lb. Then in 2008, he went from 130 up to 147 in two years.
http://boxrec.com/list_bouts.php?human_id=6129&cat=boxer
P.S. The author of your article obviously has a vested interest as he has been invited to Pacs camp and was granted an interview that talked about his weight. Give me a break.
Oh yeah, it's also clear the writer selected time periods and fights of Mayweather that make it look like he and many are progressing the same. However that is false. Look at the weight of each fighter from the beginning of their careers.
Originally posted by HaiGuise:
Sorry but your argument on weight is still weak. Pac had to starve to fight Morales and others, yet had his struggles to maintain a higher weight against guys like Margarito and Cotto. Just because one goes up 25 or so lbs in 2 years doesn't automatically mean steroids, which you seem to imply. Basically, you're making an argument out of two extremes and there is no other basis to back up your steroid beliefs.
Originally posted by Oakland-Niner:Originally posted by HaiGuise:Sorry but your argument on weight is still weak. Pac had to starve to fight Morales and others, yet had his struggles to maintain a higher weight against guys like Margarito and Cotto. Just because one goes up 25 or so lbs in 2 years doesn't automatically mean steroids, which you seem to imply. Basically, you're making an argument out of two extremes and there is no other basis to back up your steroid beliefs.
I'm pretty sure there is nothing we could say to convince each other, but I'll try.
It's not just the weight gain, it's the power. Add to the fact his lame arguments as to why he wont do olympic tests (scared of needles...lol) and things seem very fishy. Take the test, Floyd will too. If Floyd comes up with another reason, then I'll be the first to call him a coward.
BTW, I'm not arguing that the weight gain "proves" he's on PEDs, just that it is suspicious enough to be considered. If I was PBF I would have him take the test too.
Originally posted by blizzuntz:
He isn't scared of needles. He already agreed to Olympic
Style testing n whatever local state testing allows. Mayweather is
The b***h now
Originally posted by Oakland-Niner:
Originally posted by blizzuntz:
He isn't scared of needles. He already agreed to Olympic
Style testing n whatever local state testing allows. Mayweather is
The b***h now
Link? Anything that I have googled is all he say, she say. Its that simple.
Top Rank promoter Bob Arum wants to be absolutely clear: Manny Pacquiao has agreed to undergo Olympic-style drug testing to fight Mayweather. Forget all the stuff about being afraid of needles or fears of feeling weak because of the amount of blood drawn. Pacquiao is ready to take the tests.
"For a year and a half we've agreed to it," said Arum, who promotes Pacquiao. "I don't know what [Mayweather's] talking about. They keep repeating 'Take the test. Take the test.' We've already agreed to that. There should be no issues now."
Mayweather said last week the only obstacle preventing the much talked about fight with Pacquiao was the Filipino agreeing to be randomly tested for performance enhancing drugs. "If you've got nothing to hide, take the test," Mayweather said repeatedly last week in Las Vegas.
Originally posted by HaiGuise:
Originally posted by Oakland-Niner:
Originally posted by blizzuntz:
He isn't scared of needles. He already agreed to Olympic
Style testing n whatever local state testing allows. Mayweather is
The b***h now
Link? Anything that I have googled is all he say, she say. Its that simple.
http://www.nypost.com/p/sports/boxing/money_wants_merchant_out_iUXW4gSRpMY1VuDZcbikWJ
Top Rank promoter Bob Arum wants to be absolutely clear: Manny Pacquiao has agreed to undergo Olympic-style drug testing to fight Mayweather. Forget all the stuff about being afraid of needles or fears of feeling weak because of the amount of blood drawn. Pacquiao is ready to take the tests.
"For a year and a half we've agreed to it," said Arum, who promotes Pacquiao. "I don't know what [Mayweather's] talking about. They keep repeating 'Take the test. Take the test.' We've already agreed to that. There should be no issues now."
Mayweather said last week the only obstacle preventing the much talked about fight with Pacquiao was the Filipino agreeing to be randomly tested for performance enhancing drugs. "If you've got nothing to hide, take the test," Mayweather said repeatedly last week in Las Vegas.
For a year and a half, this was all make believe......right.....ok.
