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Big Wide Receivers

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Originally posted by NYniner85:
You do realize kyle moves around all these WRs around

"Predominantly."

But hell yes...can't wait. I know he'll never run Goodwin on a slant inside the 20 again though.
Originally posted by NYniner85:
No he wouldn't have...dude was dealing with a broken neck himself lol. He's been injured more than Goodwin here.

I think every single person wants a guy that can get open like Pettis and high pt/make contested catches...MY point is those WRs don't grow on trees. Hence why I threw our AJ and Julio. Those types of guys are top 10 draft picks and as you saw there wasn't that in this past draft.

That's why you gotta be bigger bodied for the Z.
Originally posted by NCommand:
That last part comes with chemistry. No different than chucking it up deep to Goodwin because of his speed.

Taller receivers certainly have more challenges in 3-cones the same as smaller receivers struggle with contested catches, contact, catching radius, high pointing, etc.

The key is balance across all 3 WR position. I think we have that now while still being versatile. Like Cossell, Butler was my favorite for the Z, even over Deebo as that 6'5" frame can be an asset there but everything else, Deebo matches how Kyle uses the Z to perfection; maybe even better than Butler.

It's actually quit different when Godwin has 3 steps on the DB vs a WR having a 6-1 CB all over him and your just throwing the ball up. Again Kyle's scheme is all about timing not just chucking it up to a WR hoping he comes down with it.

There's a post in here talking about how ineffective stuff like a fade is.

I'd love if we had a team full of Hopkins/jones WRs...we gotta stop acting like those types of WRs grow on trees because they just don't.
Originally posted by NCommand:
That's why you gotta be bigger bodied for the Z.

I was under the impression that the Z (flanker) is off the LOS and is typically your speed guy
I was just listening to the Colts GM on a radio show and he was saying how tough it is to evaluate wide receivers now because college teams are passing so much that a ton of guys have big stats. Add to that how many great receivers come from small colleges and can get overlooked sometimes. Rice, John Taylor, Owens, Antonio Brown, and Randy Moss are just a few that could have been overlooked without good scouting or dumb luck.
Originally posted by NYniner85:
Originally posted by NCommand:
That's why you gotta be bigger bodied for the Z.

I was under the impression that the Z (flanker) is off the LOS and is typically your speed guy

Strong side with the TE. X is the weak side with the open field (Pettis' play area).
Originally posted by NCommand:
Originally posted by 9ers4eva:
Originally posted by NCommand:
Deebo, chronic hamstrings and ankle injury and Hurd, shoulder, MCL and concussions.

LOL, this FO. SMH.

No denying Deebo and Hurd play with an ass-kicking mentality though compared to Pettis and Goodwin though. Those are passive players IMHO. Taylor has a tough mentality though too.

A bigger WR also has a larger target area to hit which can cause injuries. See Gronkowski, Rob.

Players get hurt in the NFL because it's a physical league. I konw you want this narrative that it's some front office issue the 9ers have with injuried players but the reality is it doesn't matter who we sign they are one bad hit away from injury. EVERY GUY.

And a bigger catch radius helps your QB too...more trust to throw it up there, less accuracy needed under duress, etc...save your QB from getting hit so often and having to have pin point accuracy to smaller guys and perfect timing in tight windows (see JG's first 3 games last year).

But your point is valid...more mass to hit. Good thing it's 2019 and you can't touch receivers anymore.



This is exactly what I was thinking

Bill Walsh and the West Coast offense system has always favored taller wide receivers
Originally posted by CatchMaster80:
I was just listening to the Colts GM on a radio show and he was saying how tough it is to evaluate wide receivers now because college teams are passing so much that a ton of guys have big stats. Add to that how many great receivers come from small colleges and can get overlooked sometimes. Rice, John Taylor, Owens, Antonio Brown, and Randy Moss are just a few that could have been overlooked without good scouting or dumb luck.

It's very true...the spread passing game has made it nearly impossible to properly evaluate WR's and OL.

The irony is that all OL do in college now is pass protect and the NFL still stinks at it. God we need some interior pass protection. Kyle likes his veterans though...understandable.
Originally posted by SlowDownBoy:
This is exactly what I was thinking

Bill Walsh and the West Coast offense system has always favored taller wide receivers

JR and JT were "big" WR's at that time. Then came Harper and Irvin. Total mismatch for our little CB's like Eric Davis.
Originally posted by NCommand:
Strong side with the TE. X is the weak side with the open field (Pettis' play area).

I understand the X is outside the hash on the weak side...but the Z is usually off the LOS which allows for a free release

The Z receiver, which was previously known as the flanker, lines up off the line of scrimmage. This player can motion in and out of the formation. These players are often speed players that don't have to worry about an immediate jam from a defensive player
.

Originally posted by CatchMaster80:
I was just listening to the Colts GM on a radio show and he was saying how tough it is to evaluate wide receivers now because college teams are passing so much that a ton of guys have big stats. Add to that how many great receivers come from small colleges and can get overlooked sometimes. Rice, John Taylor, Owens, Antonio Brown, and Randy Moss are just a few that could have been overlooked without good scouting or dumb luck.

Great stuff here. Excellent post, especially as it pertains to small schools.

And to your point, there have been teams who have found lots of success without drafting WR high or utilizing the UDFA market. Doug Baldwin was undrafted, Victor Cruz was undrafted, Colston was drafted as TE in 7th round, and posted 6 seasons of over 1,000 yards receiving.

I think it all comes down to QB play, and scheme.
Originally posted by NCommand:
JR and JT were "big" WR's at that time. Then came Harper and Irvin. Total mismatch for our little CB's like Eric Davis.

They were?
Originally posted by Scottie15:
Great stuff here. Excellent post, especially as it pertains to small schools.

And to your point, there have been teams who have found lots of success without drafting WR high or utilizing the UDFA market. Doug Baldwin was undrafted, Victor Cruz was undrafted, Colston was drafted as TE in 7th round, and posted 6 seasons of over 1,000 yards receiving.

I think it all comes down to QB play, and scheme.

Your last sentence is on point...WR is probably one of the most dependent positions in football.
Originally posted by NCommand:
Originally posted by SlowDownBoy:
This is exactly what I was thinking

Bill Walsh and the West Coast offense system has always favored taller wide receivers

JR and JT were "big" WR's at that time. Then came Harper and Irvin. Total mismatch for our little CB's like Eric Davis.


Yes but also remember when we had rice Owen and Stokes I'm a field at the same time

Young at his best statistical year passing yardage wise because they were all big targets

Remember seeing over the offensive line is already hard enough then having to spot a small wide receiver and hit him in stride makes it even harder because they tend to be quicker

Getting a bigger Target in stride it's much easier and much more obvious to see
Originally posted by NYniner85:
Originally posted by Scottie15:
Great stuff here. Excellent post, especially as it pertains to small schools.

And to your point, there have been teams who have found lots of success without drafting WR high or utilizing the UDFA market. Doug Baldwin was undrafted, Victor Cruz was undrafted, Colston was drafted as TE in 7th round, and posted 6 seasons of over 1,000 yards receiving.

I think it all comes down to QB play, and scheme.

Your last sentence is on point...WR is probably one of the most dependent positions in football.

Well that is where top WR talent becomes key.

Josh Gordon, widely considered one of the top WRs at the time, was able to ball out with horrible QB play and rotating door of QBs.

Same goes for OBJ, or most of the top producing receivers who can overcome horrible QB play.
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