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The Hurd pick was a shocker, but then again, when HC Kyle is scheming up plays, he is totally unpredictable, and can change in a heartbeat. Something doesn't work? Here , try this then. Or that. And boom, the opponents D is left dumbfounded, and in the dust. So yes it was a double pump fake out when Hurd's name came down.

Basically there are two ways to protect a QB, and a FR QB is even more important. Classic NFL protecting your QB entails getting more and quicker, stonger, bigger OLs. And not just guys who can run block...guys who can protect the passer. It isn't uncommon for an OL to do one well..but not the other.

For HC Shanahan, however, there is seemingly another route to pass protection...and that is to have so many multitalented targets who can get open quickly that they can't all be covered. If we come out in Run formation, and the opposition counters in Base, we now have a handful of guys in running sets who can become not just targets but superb targets. We have not however been able to do this successfully in the RZ. With Hurd, now we can. Line him up as a RB against a Base D, and he becomes a primary receiver. Same for Au jus. If we come out in a run formation on 3rd and short, kyle now has ability to turn our Run sets into passing ones.

So this time honored idea of having your QB completely , fully protected, is going to be challenged by HC Kyle, who has gone light on OGs, and heavy on multi talented WRs who can run. It seems whatever set kyle comes out in, if the D shifts to run D, then kyle changes the play to pass play,...but uses the same people he would have used against a run D.

That is where these multi talented , or multifaceted WRs come in. Or same for Au Jus. He comes in , D Shifts to Run D. Then kyle dials up Au jus , or Hurd in a passing play.

Clever line of thinking, and a bit risky for your QB. If he gets pasted,,, or has his knees cut out from under him., then not good news. But if done in 2.0 seconds, (Eli M needs 2.5,, and Brady same), then maybe, just maybe this interesting approach works out. Hurd also gives us that big WR in the RZ and on 3rd and long, with his jumping ability PLUS his monstrous sized hands.

So, maybe not getting starting OGs to protect JimmyG doesn't work out so badly after all. And if kyle can get this unusual method of offensive countering of D sets actually going, , maybe, just maybe, we have something special here.

The only downside, and it is a large one, if guys can't get open, heaven help our Qb.
Originally posted by pasodoc9er:
The Hurd pick was a shocker, but then again, when HC Kyle is scheming up plays, he is totally unpredictable, and can change in a heartbeat. Something doesn't work? Here , try this then. Or that. And boom, the opponents D is left dumbfounded, and in the dust. So yes it was a double pump fake out when Hurd's name came down.

Basically there are two ways to protect a QB, and a FR QB is even more important. Classic NFL protecting your QB entails getting more and quicker, stonger, bigger OLs. And not just guys who can run block...guys who can protect the passer. It isn't uncommon for an OL to do one well..but not the other.

For HC Shanahan, however, there is seemingly another route to pass protection...and that is to have so many multitalented targets who can get open quickly that they can't all be covered. If we come out in Run formation, and the opposition counters in Base, we now have a handful of guys in running sets who can become not just targets but superb targets. We have not however been able to do this successfully in the RZ. With Hurd, now we can. Line him up as a RB against a Base D, and he becomes a primary receiver. Same for Au jus. If we come out in a run formation on 3rd and short, kyle now has ability to turn our Run sets into passing ones.

So this time honored idea of having your QB completely , fully protected, is going to be challenged by HC Kyle, who has gone light on OGs, and heavy on multi talented WRs who can run. It seems whatever set kyle comes out in, if the D shifts to run D, then kyle changes the play to pass play,...but uses the same people he would have used against a run D.

That is where these multi talented , or multifaceted WRs come in. Or same for Au Jus. He comes in , D Shifts to Run D. Then kyle dials up Au jus , or Hurd in a passing play.

Clever line of thinking, and a bit risky for your QB. If he gets pasted,,, or has his knees cut out from under him., then not good news. But if done in 2.0 seconds, (Eli M needs 2.5,, and Brady same), then maybe, just maybe this interesting approach works out. Hurd also gives us that big WR in the RZ and on 3rd and long, with his jumping ability PLUS his monstrous sized hands.

So, maybe not getting starting OGs to protect JimmyG doesn't work out so badly after all. And if kyle can get this unusual method of offensive countering of D sets actually going, , maybe, just maybe, we have something special here.

The only downside, and it is a large one, if guys can't get open, heaven help our Qb.



It could just play out like the Lions game where Patricia just told his CBs to hold on to our receivers. And the refs swallowed their whistles with no flags. Then what do we do?

Just watch Jimmy get sacked. That's what we do. Oh yeah, and the camera will pan to Kyle yelling at the refs while they ignore him
Originally posted by Ensatsu:
Originally posted by pasodoc9er:
The Hurd pick was a shocker, but then again, when HC Kyle is scheming up plays, he is totally unpredictable, and can change in a heartbeat. Something doesn't work? Here , try this then. Or that. And boom, the opponents D is left dumbfounded, and in the dust. So yes it was a double pump fake out when Hurd's name came down.

Basically there are two ways to protect a QB, and a FR QB is even more important. Classic NFL protecting your QB entails getting more and quicker, stonger, bigger OLs. And not just guys who can run block...guys who can protect the passer. It isn't uncommon for an OL to do one well..but not the other.

For HC Shanahan, however, there is seemingly another route to pass protection...and that is to have so many multitalented targets who can get open quickly that they can't all be covered. If we come out in Run formation, and the opposition counters in Base, we now have a handful of guys in running sets who can become not just targets but superb targets. We have not however been able to do this successfully in the RZ. With Hurd, now we can. Line him up as a RB against a Base D, and he becomes a primary receiver. Same for Au jus. If we come out in a run formation on 3rd and short, kyle now has ability to turn our Run sets into passing ones.

So this time honored idea of having your QB completely , fully protected, is going to be challenged by HC Kyle, who has gone light on OGs, and heavy on multi talented WRs who can run. It seems whatever set kyle comes out in, if the D shifts to run D, then kyle changes the play to pass play,...but uses the same people he would have used against a run D.

That is where these multi talented , or multifaceted WRs come in. Or same for Au Jus. He comes in , D Shifts to Run D. Then kyle dials up Au jus , or Hurd in a passing play.

Clever line of thinking, and a bit risky for your QB. If he gets pasted,,, or has his knees cut out from under him., then not good news. But if done in 2.0 seconds, (Eli M needs 2.5,, and Brady same), then maybe, just maybe this interesting approach works out. Hurd also gives us that big WR in the RZ and on 3rd and long, with his jumping ability PLUS his monstrous sized hands.

So, maybe not getting starting OGs to protect JimmyG doesn't work out so badly after all. And if kyle can get this unusual method of offensive countering of D sets actually going, , maybe, just maybe, we have something special here.

The only downside, and it is a large one, if guys can't get open, heaven help our Qb.



It could just play out like the Lions game where Patricia just told his CBs to hold on to our receivers. And the refs swallowed their whistles with no flags. Then what do we do?

Just watch Jimmy get sacked. That's what we do. Oh yeah, and the camera will pan to Kyle yelling at the refs while they ignore him

If they are to do that, I'm sure Kyle is creative enough to scheme guys open with all these weapons.
Originally posted by pasodoc9er:
The Hurd pick was a shocker, but then again, when HC Kyle is scheming up plays, he is totally unpredictable, and can change in a heartbeat. Something doesn't work? Here , try this then. Or that. And boom, the opponents D is left dumbfounded, and in the dust. So yes it was a double pump fake out when Hurd's name came down.

Basically there are two ways to protect a QB, and a FR QB is even more important. Classic NFL protecting your QB entails getting more and quicker, stonger, bigger OLs. And not just guys who can run block...guys who can protect the passer. It isn't uncommon for an OL to do one well..but not the other.

For HC Shanahan, however, there is seemingly another route to pass protection...and that is to have so many multitalented targets who can get open quickly that they can't all be covered. If we come out in Run formation, and the opposition counters in Base, we now have a handful of guys in running sets who can become not just targets but superb targets. We have not however been able to do this successfully in the RZ. With Hurd, now we can. Line him up as a RB against a Base D, and he becomes a primary receiver. Same for Au jus. If we come out in a run formation on 3rd and short, kyle now has ability to turn our Run sets into passing ones.

So this time honored idea of having your QB completely , fully protected, is going to be challenged by HC Kyle, who has gone light on OGs, and heavy on multi talented WRs who can run. It seems whatever set kyle comes out in, if the D shifts to run D, then kyle changes the play to pass play,...but uses the same people he would have used against a run D.

That is where these multi talented , or multifaceted WRs come in. Or same for Au Jus. He comes in , D Shifts to Run D. Then kyle dials up Au jus , or Hurd in a passing play.

Clever line of thinking, and a bit risky for your QB. If he gets pasted,,, or has his knees cut out from under him., then not good news. But if done in 2.0 seconds, (Eli M needs 2.5,, and Brady same), then maybe, just maybe this interesting approach works out. Hurd also gives us that big WR in the RZ and on 3rd and long, with his jumping ability PLUS his monstrous sized hands.

So, maybe not getting starting OGs to protect JimmyG doesn't work out so badly after all. And if kyle can get this unusual method of offensive countering of D sets actually going, , maybe, just maybe, we have something special here.

The only downside, and it is a large one, if guys can't get open, heaven help our Qb.

I don't think getting open will be an issue this year. Garcon was awful and once Goodwin went down, there was no one left. Pettis emerged late, people will definitely be accounting for George Kittle, you have to respect Goodwin's speed, and then there is our slew of running backs. Different case this year, no matter who is at QB. I hope that we don't even have to draft an offensive skill position next year (imagine that) and can invest our picks on OL and defense.
  • Giedi
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Doc, regarding the OLine, I think quickness and speed over strength. Again how much *power* do you need as an OLineman to block for a screen pass or draw play? You need quick quickness and agility. Same thing with the zone run. You need timing and coordination more than power and strength.

So you are looking for OLinemen that are different from all the power and gap blocking teams out there. You still need good athletes, dont get me wrong, but it's the timing, coordination and all five olinemen thinking the same thing every single snap. I.e. the intangibles more than the tangibles that matter with shanahan.

I think you can find good athletic quick but maybe under-powered OLinemen in the later rounds, or maybe undrafted. The key is finding linemen with the ability to subdue thier individuality and meld their mind with the rest of the oLine guys and act as one mind vs a power man on man blocker where its mano a mano. Keep in mind even the backups have to mind meld too!
  • Giedi
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Originally posted by LifelongNiner:
I don't think getting open will be an issue this year. Garcon was awful and once Goodwin went down, there was no one left. Pettis emerged late, people will definitely be accounting for George Kittle, you have to respect Goodwin's speed, and then there is our slew of running backs. Different case this year, no matter who is at QB. I hope that we don't even have to draft an offensive skill position next year (imagine that) and can invest our picks on OL and defense.
Man I hope you are right and that comes true.
Great post guys! I think Shanahan put to many eggs into his McKinnon basket on offense last year then when he went down he had to scramble everything he had worked on all offseason. Now he will have so many different weapons to use he only needs his franchise quarterback to stay on the field this year. Great job by Shanahan, Lynch & Peters in building this squad Brick-by-Brick.
Unstated in the O.P. Is the obvious...if the ball is gone in 2.0 seconds, then JimmyG stays upright...altho we sure had a lot of defenses take a big shot at him or Mullie, long after ball was gone. Yes i like the idea of kyle not needing to draft even one O ball handler next yr.

Yes also to Giedi who is correct,..with ZBS, guys just need to learn to think as a group, not individually. The kicker here is, that not many of the new guys have distinguished themselves as pass blockers, and for that you need quick , big , strong , fast OLs with good, strong , quick hands. We seem to be short in talent there. So perhaps in UDFA , AAF, perhaps cuts such as KC and MN because they are up against their cap. So yes, maybe we find some OLs there.

I bet my lunch money tho, you find guys there, i will be very surprised if they can pass protect. So this new tack may work but will the OL do its job and protect JG for 2.0 seconds. I have reason to question that...116 hits in 2017 and a mere `126 QB hits in 2018. FRankly no matter what kyle does, if that isnt taken care of we wont have a QB to throw to all those targets. So hopefully, somebody somewhere is able to block for JG. Right now this remains the weak link in kyle's New O.
[ Edited by pasodoc9er on Apr 27, 2019 at 12:42 PM ]
This sounds a lot like how Steve Spurier got points on the board, and all his QBs murdered.
Originally posted by tohara3:
Great post guys! I think Shanahan put to many eggs into his McKinnon basket on offense last year then when he went down he had to scramble everything he had worked on all offseason. Now he will have so many different weapons to use he only needs his franchise quarterback to stay on the field this year. Great job by Shanahan, Lynch & Peters in building this squad Brick-by-Brick.

You could literally say that about every team in the NFL

  • Giedi
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Originally posted by TheFunkyChicken:
This sounds a lot like how Steve Spurier got points on the board, and all his QBs murdered.

They dont allow the QB to be murdered nowadays, that a 15 yard penalty.

Seriously though, I think Kyle feels good about his OLine. I may disagree and you may disagree but that's the reality. Otherwise why a punter in the 4th vs an OLineman? Me, I'd want the biggest and baddest Olineman protecting Jimmy, but there's other ways to protect him, like having a defense that can hold leads, and a good versatile running attack that takes pressure off the QB to throw a million times a game.
Dynasty? Personally I'd be thrilled with 8-8 and at least shown in the "in the hunt" section of the playoff picture graphic they show later in the season. But glad the dynasty is back, looking forward to it.
[ Edited by DelCed2486 on Apr 27, 2019 at 1:00 PM ]
We ain't building no damn Dynasty we are building a steady solid .500 club
The intent is something like this:

The Niner offense comes out with Jet in the backfield, Kittle at TE, and Goodwin, Samuel and Pettis at WR. Any of these guys can run any of the pass routes. One is gonna a be matched up on a slower LB no matter how the defense attacks.

It's a huge advantage.
  • jcs
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Originally posted by Giedi:
Doc, regarding the OLine, I think quickness and speed over strength. Again how much *power* do you need as an OLineman to block for a screen pass or draw play? You need quick quickness and agility. Same thing with the zone run. You need timing and coordination more than power and strength.

So you are looking for OLinemen that are different from all the power and gap blocking teams out there. You still need good athletes, dont get me wrong, but it's the timing, coordination and all five olinemen thinking the same thing every single snap. I.e. the intangibles more than the tangibles that matter with shanahan.

I think you can find good athletic quick but maybe under-powered OLinemen in the later rounds, or maybe undrafted. The key is finding linemen with the ability to subdue thier individuality and meld their mind with the rest of the oLine guys and act as one mind vs a power man on man blocker where its mano a mano. Keep in mind even the backups have to mind meld too!
The Key is having a great Oline coach that can mold talent...we haven't had one of those since McKittrick
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