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2019 Defensive Progress & Robert Saleh Hot-seat Tracker

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  • DaBum
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 2,050
Originally posted by NCommand:
One massive concern I have is on the No Brakes podcast, Matt Barrows said we have spent 10 picks on DB's the last two years and still can't find even a decent CB opposite Sherman. Even more concerning is the fact that Sherman is literally locking down 1/3 of the field so how the hell do our CB's continue to be in isolation on the other side. He was saying teams would kill to have one lock down CB for this very reason. Now you can scheme to the weaker side.

Yep. Team needs to build secondary in FA where you know what you are getting because they can't develop the athletic guys they take.
Originally posted by thl408:
What Saleh is referring to in last year's comment is regarding the zone read. That GB play is a QB bootleg. You don't scrape exchange on a QB bootleg. Warner has a B gap to honor, after the playfake, his responsibility is to match the crosser.
Solly can cheat and play the boot, but that means he abandons his C gap responsibility. He chose to play the C gap. imo

I see. So is Solly just not recognizing it timely and biting inside (or just playing that C gap no matter what)? It looked like later in the game he was just rushing straight up field right at Rodgers (when he rolled out) and forced some errant throws.
Originally posted by DaBum:
Originally posted by NCommand:
One massive concern I have is on the No Brakes podcast, Matt Barrows said we have spent 10 picks on DB's the last two years and still can't find even a decent CB opposite Sherman. Even more concerning is the fact that Sherman is literally locking down 1/3 of the field so how the hell do our CB's continue to be in isolation on the other side. He was saying teams would kill to have one lock down CB for this very reason. Now you can scheme to the weaker side.

Yep. Team needs to build secondary in FA where you know what you are getting because they can't develop the athletic guys they take.

I agree the issue are the coaches here. Processes can be fixed, hopefully they are, soon.
Originally posted by tjd808185:
Great post. I imagine once we give him some edge rushers and a pass rush this d will be pretty good.

Yeah cause it's obvious the 3 FIRST ROUNDERS we drafted are clearly not enough.
Originally posted by TheXFactor:
Originally posted by cciowa:
Originally posted by Wewillwin:
Definitely need an ER. If we can get a pro-bowl caliber ER this offseason - i think we can have a top 10 defense. We have enough talent to be there but it's hard without having even an NFL-worthy player at the most important position on your defense.

the secondary aside from sherman is a mess. you got two decent linebackers and foster is hurt alot, you got buck and thats it,.,. sorry but the talent is not there to be any sort of a top 15 defense

you and susweel, constant negativity every single day.
This is the type of thing I can't stand. How come when someone has a critique or a simple fact of something that our team lacks its negativity? Do we live in fairyland where everything is all happy and nothing goes wrong? Seems like it here in the zone.
  • jcs
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 29,982
Originally posted by SupremeLeader16:
Originally posted by TheXFactor:
Originally posted by cciowa:
Originally posted by Wewillwin:
Definitely need an ER. If we can get a pro-bowl caliber ER this offseason - i think we can have a top 10 defense. We have enough talent to be there but it's hard without having even an NFL-worthy player at the most important position on your defense.

the secondary aside from sherman is a mess. you got two decent linebackers and foster is hurt alot, you got buck and thats it,.,. sorry but the talent is not there to be any sort of a top 15 defense

you and susweel, constant negativity every single day.
This is the type of thing I can't stand. How come when someone has a critique or a simple fact of something that our team lacks its negativity? Do we live in fairyland where everything is all happy and nothing goes wrong? Seems like it here in the zone.
That's why there are 3 threads on Saleh and two are there to defend him.
Originally posted by jcs:
Originally posted by SupremeLeader16:
Originally posted by TheXFactor:
Originally posted by cciowa:
Originally posted by Wewillwin:
Definitely need an ER. If we can get a pro-bowl caliber ER this offseason - i think we can have a top 10 defense. We have enough talent to be there but it's hard without having even an NFL-worthy player at the most important position on your defense.

the secondary aside from sherman is a mess. you got two decent linebackers and foster is hurt alot, you got buck and thats it,.,. sorry but the talent is not there to be any sort of a top 15 defense

you and susweel, constant negativity every single day.
This is the type of thing I can't stand. How come when someone has a critique or a simple fact of something that our team lacks its negativity? Do we live in fairyland where everything is all happy and nothing goes wrong? Seems like it here in the zone.
That's why there are 3 threads on Saleh and two are there to defend him.

They should rename this site "49ers happy happy joy joy if you say anything bad you get banned zone". But then again that's too long a name to type.
Great post, OTC...and solid posts by many of you including NC, Niner GM, etc.

Clearly, we are all concerned about the overall play of the defense, especially after we saw growth last season, particularly in the second half. To me, the biggest questions this season are these....

1) Why have Witherspoon and Colbert, who are excellent athletes and played very well last season, regressed so far? It surely isn't a talent issue so what is the problem?
2) Why hasn't the team found a way to utilize Solomon Thomas more effectively? The guy does have talent but it clearly isn't being tapped or developed.
3) Why aren't young players like Sheldon Day, DJ Reed, and T Moore playing more, especially considering the ineffectiveness of other players?
4) Again, why are there so many missed assignments and obvious mental errors happening?....and week after week? The team is tackling better and being penalized less but the defense seems to be incapable of making a play when it really counts.
5) Why has the team forced so few turnovers? Many teams are taught to tackle the ball or recognize when the offensive player is vulnerable to a strip. Is the coaching staff teaching them how to punch the ball out? If not, why not?
6) Why is it that the defense seems really unprepared to play the game, especially in the first quarter and a half? That hasn't been the case with the offense.

I think we have established that these maddening issues are not all about talent....or lack thereof.
I think we have also established that the blame should not be all on Saleh. The guy has enough on his plate without having to coach his own coaches Therefore, I tend to think that these breakdowns are a matter of inexperience and that there are simply not enough veteran defensive coaches on the staff. Harbaugh's staff, in contrast, was full of established coaches at every defensive position. So is Sean McVay's. Within the Niners staff now, however, there is clearly something lacking... Do they need a damn good whacking?

Cheers!
  • cciowa
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 54,469
Originally posted by jcs:
Originally posted by SupremeLeader16:
Originally posted by TheXFactor:
Originally posted by cciowa:
Originally posted by Wewillwin:
Definitely need an ER. If we can get a pro-bowl caliber ER this offseason - i think we can have a top 10 defense. We have enough talent to be there but it's hard without having even an NFL-worthy player at the most important position on your defense.

the secondary aside from sherman is a mess. you got two decent linebackers and foster is hurt alot, you got buck and thats it,.,. sorry but the talent is not there to be any sort of a top 15 defense

you and susweel, constant negativity every single day.
This is the type of thing I can't stand. How come when someone has a critique or a simple fact of something that our team lacks its negativity? Do we live in fairyland where everything is all happy and nothing goes wrong? Seems like it here in the zone.
That's why there are 3 threads on Saleh and two are there to defend him.
exactly. do you think they would allow three threads to be critical of kyle or lynch? you know its a fantasy when you hear we are the best 7 15 team or whatever kyles record is. in the history of the nfl. and stop with the . well we should be 3 2 or 4 1.please.
Originally posted by cciowa:
Originally posted by jcs:
Originally posted by SupremeLeader16:
Originally posted by TheXFactor:
Originally posted by cciowa:
Originally posted by Wewillwin:
Definitely need an ER. If we can get a pro-bowl caliber ER this offseason - i think we can have a top 10 defense. We have enough talent to be there but it's hard without having even an NFL-worthy player at the most important position on your defense.

the secondary aside from sherman is a mess. you got two decent linebackers and foster is hurt alot, you got buck and thats it,.,. sorry but the talent is not there to be any sort of a top 15 defense

you and susweel, constant negativity every single day.
This is the type of thing I can't stand. How come when someone has a critique or a simple fact of something that our team lacks its negativity? Do we live in fairyland where everything is all happy and nothing goes wrong? Seems like it here in the zone.
That's why there are 3 threads on Saleh and two are there to defend him.
exactly. do you think they would allow three threads to be critical of kyle or lynch? you know its a fantasy when you hear we are the best 7 15 team or whatever kyles record is. in the history of the nfl. and stop with the . well we should be 3 2 or 4 1.please.

There are a multitude of negative threads and negative comments and yet "they" have not stopped them.

Originally posted by longterm9erfan:
Great post, OTC...and solid posts by many of you including NC, Niner GM, etc.

Clearly, we are all concerned about the overall play of the defense, especially after we saw growth last season, particularly in the second half. To me, the biggest questions this season are these....

1) Why have Witherspoon and Colbert, who are excellent athletes and played very well last season, regressed so far? It surely isn't a talent issue so what is the problem?
2) Why hasn't the team found a way to utilize Solomon Thomas more effectively? The guy does have talent but it clearly isn't being tapped or developed.
3) Why aren't young players like Sheldon Day, DJ Reed, and T Moore playing more, especially considering the ineffectiveness of other players?
4) Again, why are there so many missed assignments and obvious mental errors happening?....and week after week? The team is tackling better and being penalized less but the defense seems to be incapable of making a play when it really counts.
5) Why has the team forced so few turnovers? Many teams are taught to tackle the ball or recognize when the offensive player is vulnerable to a strip. Is the coaching staff teaching them how to punch the ball out? If not, why not?
6) Why is it that the defense seems really unprepared to play the game, especially in the first quarter and a half? That hasn't been the case with the offense.

I think we have established that these maddening issues are not all about talent....or lack thereof.
I think we have also established that the blame should not be all on Saleh. The guy has enough on his plate without having to coach his own coaches Therefore, I tend to think that these breakdowns are a matter of inexperience and that there are simply not enough veteran defensive coaches on the staff. Harbaugh's staff, in contrast, was full of established coaches at every defensive position. So is Sean McVay's. Within the Niners staff now, however, there is clearly something lacking... Do they need a damn good whacking?

Cheers!

Good post LT! Legit concerns and questions.
[ Edited by NCommand on Oct 20, 2018 at 5:36 AM ]
Not really saleh focused but Blair is our best edge guy right now. Marsh, Thomas, AA and anyone else we have at BE or at leo are underperforming which opens the door for a rookie to come in next year and play. Blair has a place at BE and at Leo if not for depth and rotating in.
  • bud49
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 1,208
So if Solly and Warner are doing their jobs then the breakdown would be on the CB? I see what Barrows is talking about at the CB position if Sherm is locking his side down then there should be help given to the other side.
[ Edited by bud49 on Oct 20, 2018 at 9:32 AM ]
Sherman said it's not Saleh's fault their defense hasn't been good...it's poor execution from the players. Shanahan's not going to fire a guy he has faith in...it's just that simple. It's obvious there are some guys who just aren't a good fit for RS's defense...Thomas tops the list in my book. Lynch will have to do a better job drafting players that are a better fit.
Originally posted by NCommand:
Originally posted by longterm9erfan:
Great post, OTC...and solid posts by many of you including NC, Niner GM, etc.

Clearly, we are all concerned about the overall play of the defense, especially after we saw growth last season, particularly in the second half. To me, the biggest questions this season are these....

1) Why have Witherspoon and Colbert, who are excellent athletes and played very well last season, regressed so far? It surely isn't a talent issue so what is the problem?
2) Why hasn't the team found a way to utilize Solomon Thomas more effectively? The guy does have talent but it clearly isn't being tapped or developed.
3) Why aren't young players like Sheldon Day, DJ Reed, and T Moore playing more, especially considering the ineffectiveness of other players?
4) Again, why are there so many missed assignments and obvious mental errors happening?....and week after week? The team is tackling better and being penalized less but the defense seems to be incapable of making a play when it really counts.
5) Why has the team forced so few turnovers? Many teams are taught to tackle the ball or recognize when the offensive player is vulnerable to a strip. Is the coaching staff teaching them how to punch the ball out? If not, why not?
6) Why is it that the defense seems really unprepared to play the game, especially in the first quarter and a half? That hasn't been the case with the offense.

I think we have established that these maddening issues are not all about talent....or lack thereof.
I think we have also established that the blame should not be all on Saleh. The guy has enough on his plate without having to coach his own coaches Therefore, I tend to think that these breakdowns are a matter of inexperience and that there are simply not enough veteran defensive coaches on the staff. Harbaugh's staff, in contrast, was full of established coaches at every defensive position. So is Sean McVay's. Within the Niners staff now, however, there is clearly something lacking... Do they need a damn good whacking?

Cheers!

Good post LT! Legit concerns and questions.

Thanks man.... Let's hope the coaching staff and front office reads these posts!

Cheers mate...
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