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Originally posted by cortana49:
Originally posted by random49er:
Originally posted by SkyZer0:
Originally posted by random49er:
His arm strength isn't good enough to be accurate like alot of other QBs down the field and outside the hashes.
?
https://www.nbcsports.com/boston/new-england-patriots/jimmy-garoppolos-arm-strength-issue
You're digging a hole now. We're supposed to "listen" to opinions as opposed to "seeing" proof?
Originally posted by random49er:
Originally posted by cortana49:
You're digging a hole now. We're supposed to "listen" to opinions as opposed to "seeing" proof?
Proof of what??
Why were they discussing the same exact issues, discussing the same criticisms, 4 years ago w/a different team?
Do the issues they were discussing just "not exist" ??
Originally posted by random49er:
As NY would say, refer to post #58232. It has me acknowledging that he can certainly make the throws. He also has issues with the same throws, as I said before you ever replied.
A video doesn't refute anything when it's already been said 8 posts above yours on the same page that he CAN,...and that consistency is the issue in a number of areas and it ultimately (probably) relates to not having an elite arm in all areas, like a # of other QBs.
Beyond that, I was responding to jonny to begin with, making the simple argument that it's not elite and it's not an issue 49ers fans have just made up. The audio you refuse to acknowledge proves it's been an issue noticed by onlookers since then, before the 49ers. He has strengths, but he has weaknesses too. It's a 4+ year old clip!
Both teams have seen elite players at the QB position for multiple decades. NE and the 49ers are spoiled, but the ones that have been around know what's what.
Not going to delve any deeper with you due to where it ends up, which is off the topic of football.
) and trade for Darnold (
). Do you agree with either of these? If not, what do you propose?
Originally posted by eastie:
Seems the topic of debate is changing today in regards to what we have in JG, all in thanks to those that have brought FACTS to the table. So now, lets get on to what is KS going to dial up for this offense this week? Surely there are going to be some 'different' wrinkles to show the hawks?
Originally posted by Furlow:
Funny how that works, huh? Now the argument is "Jimmy doesn't have ELITE arm strength." Uhh yeah, we've known that. Lol.
Originally posted by Furlow:
Originally posted by SteveWallacesHelmet:
Originally posted by Jcool:
If you think there are 15 better QBs then he isnt good enough.
I also have said ad nauseam that I expect him to take a leap this year. Also, I said top 15. That doesnt mean I believe there are 15 better QBs than him. He is in the 10-15 range.
Originally posted by eastie:
Winning isn't enough for some on here. They insist that more needs to come form the QB. You said he needs to prove himself. MY thought is what more does he need to do to 'prove' himself? Isn't winning the ultimate proof? Hasn't he done that already by virtue of his winning percentage? If wins aren't enough, what is?
I guess it just comes down to me being tired of people using our team winning as the barometer for judging how good a QB is. Wins and Losses are a team stat. Tim Tebow won more starts than he lost. Is that all that matters? Or does it matter that he had horrendous accuracy and didnt look like an NFL QB?
Again, we can win with Jimmy. That has been proven. But last year we had a full healthy team and a dominant defense. That isnt the case this year. I dont understand why people have such a hard time separating record and player analysis in here. I dont see people in the offensive line thread talking down to everyone who thinks the line isnt any good because we have been winning with that line.
No. Not the entire season. This excuse is ridiculous. He was top 10 in almost every passing metric, and #1 or #2 in 3rd down passing last year. Get out of here with this nonsense. The only thing he's lacking are the "wow" plays that you see on Sportscenter, that's it. He's a boring QB, unless you're actually a student of the game and understand how a QB fits into the structure, personality, and success of the team.
Originally posted by random49er:
Originally posted by Furlow:
Funny how that works, huh? Now the argument is "Jimmy doesn't have ELITE arm strength." Uhh yeah, we've known that. Lol.
Tell that to Jonny.
Originally posted by SteveWallacesHelmet:
Originally posted by Furlow:
Originally posted by SteveWallacesHelmet:
Originally posted by Jcool:
If you think there are 15 better QBs then he isnt good enough.
I also have said ad nauseam that I expect him to take a leap this year. Also, I said top 15. That doesnt mean I believe there are 15 better QBs than him. He is in the 10-15 range.
Originally posted by eastie:
Winning isn't enough for some on here. They insist that more needs to come form the QB. You said he needs to prove himself. MY thought is what more does he need to do to 'prove' himself? Isn't winning the ultimate proof? Hasn't he done that already by virtue of his winning percentage? If wins aren't enough, what is?
I guess it just comes down to me being tired of people using our team winning as the barometer for judging how good a QB is. Wins and Losses are a team stat. Tim Tebow won more starts than he lost. Is that all that matters? Or does it matter that he had horrendous accuracy and didnt look like an NFL QB?
Again, we can win with Jimmy. That has been proven. But last year we had a full healthy team and a dominant defense. That isnt the case this year. I dont understand why people have such a hard time separating record and player analysis in here. I dont see people in the offensive line thread talking down to everyone who thinks the line isnt any good because we have been winning with that line.
No. Not the entire season. This excuse is ridiculous. He was top 10 in almost every passing metric, and #1 or #2 in 3rd down passing last year. Get out of here with this nonsense. The only thing he's lacking are the "wow" plays that you see on Sportscenter, that's it. He's a boring QB, unless you're actually a student of the game and understand how a QB fits into the structure, personality, and success of the team.
3rd down passing last year was incredibly encouraging and was the main reason I believe Jimmy was on his way to getting into that next tier of QBs. No question 3rd down is the money down, and Jimmy was exceptional last year.
You can say no about the bolded, fine. But it is unquestionable that we had a much healthier team last year and a substantially more dominant defense. So under those circumstances, Jimmy has proven he can win a lot of games. Like I said, that isnt the case this year (regarding his supporting cast). Again, I dont understand why you feel that this is such a slight to Jimmy. Its not. It doesnt matter who the QB is. Wins/Losses are a team stat.
Originally posted by random49er:
Originally posted by Furlow:
Funny how that works, huh? Now the argument is "Jimmy doesn't have ELITE arm strength." Uhh yeah, we've known that. Lol.
Tell that to Jonny.
Originally posted by Furlow:
Originally posted by SteveWallacesHelmet:
Originally posted by Furlow:
Originally posted by SteveWallacesHelmet:
Originally posted by Jcool:
If you think there are 15 better QBs then he isnt good enough.
I also have said ad nauseam that I expect him to take a leap this year. Also, I said top 15. That doesnt mean I believe there are 15 better QBs than him. He is in the 10-15 range.
Originally posted by eastie:
Winning isn't enough for some on here. They insist that more needs to come form the QB. You said he needs to prove himself. MY thought is what more does he need to do to 'prove' himself? Isn't winning the ultimate proof? Hasn't he done that already by virtue of his winning percentage? If wins aren't enough, what is?
I guess it just comes down to me being tired of people using our team winning as the barometer for judging how good a QB is. Wins and Losses are a team stat. Tim Tebow won more starts than he lost. Is that all that matters? Or does it matter that he had horrendous accuracy and didnt look like an NFL QB?
Again, we can win with Jimmy. That has been proven. But last year we had a full healthy team and a dominant defense. That isnt the case this year. I dont understand why people have such a hard time separating record and player analysis in here. I dont see people in the offensive line thread talking down to everyone who thinks the line isnt any good because we have been winning with that line.
No. Not the entire season. This excuse is ridiculous. He was top 10 in almost every passing metric, and #1 or #2 in 3rd down passing last year. Get out of here with this nonsense. The only thing he's lacking are the "wow" plays that you see on Sportscenter, that's it. He's a boring QB, unless you're actually a student of the game and understand how a QB fits into the structure, personality, and success of the team.
3rd down passing last year was incredibly encouraging and was the main reason I believe Jimmy was on his way to getting into that next tier of QBs. No question 3rd down is the money down, and Jimmy was exceptional last year.
You can say no about the bolded, fine. But it is unquestionable that we had a much healthier team last year and a substantially more dominant defense. So under those circumstances, Jimmy has proven he can win a lot of games. Like I said, that isnt the case this year (regarding his supporting cast). Again, I dont understand why you feel that this is such a slight to Jimmy. Its not. It doesnt matter who the QB is. Wins/Losses are a team stat.
Then why are QB's judged so harshly on their W/L record in the regular season? And even more so in the playoffs? And ultimately by their W/L record in the Super Bowl? You act like this is something that fans of Jimmy G made up lol.
Originally posted by SteveWallacesHelmet:
Originally posted by Furlow:
Originally posted by SteveWallacesHelmet:
Originally posted by Furlow:
Originally posted by SteveWallacesHelmet:
Originally posted by Jcool:
If you think there are 15 better QBs then he isnt good enough.
I also have said ad nauseam that I expect him to take a leap this year. Also, I said top 15. That doesnt mean I believe there are 15 better QBs than him. He is in the 10-15 range.
Originally posted by eastie:
Winning isn't enough for some on here. They insist that more needs to come form the QB. You said he needs to prove himself. MY thought is what more does he need to do to 'prove' himself? Isn't winning the ultimate proof? Hasn't he done that already by virtue of his winning percentage? If wins aren't enough, what is?
I guess it just comes down to me being tired of people using our team winning as the barometer for judging how good a QB is. Wins and Losses are a team stat. Tim Tebow won more starts than he lost. Is that all that matters? Or does it matter that he had horrendous accuracy and didnt look like an NFL QB?
Again, we can win with Jimmy. That has been proven. But last year we had a full healthy team and a dominant defense. That isnt the case this year. I dont understand why people have such a hard time separating record and player analysis in here. I dont see people in the offensive line thread talking down to everyone who thinks the line isnt any good because we have been winning with that line.
No. Not the entire season. This excuse is ridiculous. He was top 10 in almost every passing metric, and #1 or #2 in 3rd down passing last year. Get out of here with this nonsense. The only thing he's lacking are the "wow" plays that you see on Sportscenter, that's it. He's a boring QB, unless you're actually a student of the game and understand how a QB fits into the structure, personality, and success of the team.
3rd down passing last year was incredibly encouraging and was the main reason I believe Jimmy was on his way to getting into that next tier of QBs. No question 3rd down is the money down, and Jimmy was exceptional last year.
You can say no about the bolded, fine. But it is unquestionable that we had a much healthier team last year and a substantially more dominant defense. So under those circumstances, Jimmy has proven he can win a lot of games. Like I said, that isnt the case this year (regarding his supporting cast). Again, I dont understand why you feel that this is such a slight to Jimmy. Its not. It doesnt matter who the QB is. Wins/Losses are a team stat.
Then why are QB's judged so harshly on their W/L record in the regular season? And even more so in the playoffs? And ultimately by their W/L record in the Super Bowl? You act like this is something that fans of Jimmy G made up lol.
I am not.
People use W/L record as a way to try to prove their POV. Alex Smith is deemed a winner by you and his fans without using context. Then if you bring up his horrendous postseason record (something you say QBs are judged more harshly on than the regular season), those same people try to provide context to explain the record. Its happening in here too. Like I said before, Tim Tebow has a winning record in the NFL. Most would agree he wasnt a very good QB. But based on the W/L record being a measuring stick, wouldnt people then agree Tebow was really good? You can say the same for Kaepernick. He is 4-2 in the playoffs, but most dont believe he is good.
I have never used record as a way to judge QB play, nor will I. Jimmy can play exceptional football, and we could lose. I wouldnt blame Jimmy for the loss if he was playing great. On the flipside, he could play poorly and still win. I wouldnt say Jimmy won the game if he played s**tty.
Like I have said for a long time on here, a team's record is not a good way to judge QB value.
