Jimmy Garoppolo, QB, Los Angeles Rams

Originally posted by CatchMaster80:
I think we have reached the point where we can see that Jimmy is a solid QB that should continue to improve as he plays more and learns his receivers better. He has a really quick release and a more than adequate arm. He still has an issue on really deep throws but I think that's more that they don't use the deep fly that often so there isn't a lot of emphasis on it in practice.

One thing Jimmy doesn't have and probably never will is that consistent ability to make plays when there just isn't anything there. Montana had it. Young had it. Favre had it. Rogers has it and so does Wilson. They all were able to scramble away from trouble and keep they play alive until something opened up downfield. Their receivers continued to run even after the pattern was broken because they knew that their QB had that ability to find them down field. This isn't a knock on Jimmy. It;s just an observation. The guys I noted are some of the best to ever play and it wasn't just their stats or passing ability that made them what they were. They had that "it factor" that is unpredictable and unteachable. You just knew these guys would beat you if you left them enough time or gave them an opening.

Define what you mean by ability to make plays when there isn't anything there?

Are you talking about finding covered guys for completions? Are you talking about running for big plays? Scrambling around until guys get open?

I think Jimmy has made several plays where he's gotten it done despite things not being there. So what's consistent enough?

The whole IT factor has been brought up before. Did Jimmy have IT vs the Saints? Did he have IT in 2017?

How many of those guys you mentioned had IT early in their starting careers? Favre has the record for picks in NFL history. He lost just as many as he won.

Jimmy definitely didn't play his best game yesterday but the narrative changes quickly if he gets a little more help. If George doesn't drop the ball while running on 3rd down odds are he's picking up that first down and Jimmy finishes that drive by running out the clock.

Maybe if Falcons score and we have time left on the clock to make a drive he gets it done then...hard to say.

It's clear Jimmy isn't an elite QB at this point and he's going to have his hot/cold games. As time goes on he should improve. Let's remember that early in his career Russell Wilson's book was "keep him in the pocket and you should win"

Originally posted by SkyZer0:

Originally posted by random49er:
On these roughing the passer calls, they're cutting us alotta breaks with the sacks today that Lamar Jackson surely would not get. I'll take it, but these teams will be fighting over these rules all offseason.

Like seeing that Kyle's trusting him a little more with the audibles too now.

why cuz he's black?

Because he's seen as a RB when he has the ball, even behind the LOS, by alot of people.

BTW...speaking of backs....who is the best back in the league this year? He's white, right?

Soooo...where are you headed with this?

Originally posted by random49er:

Originally posted by SkyZer0:

Originally posted by random49er:
On these roughing the passer calls, they're cutting us alotta breaks with the sacks today that Lamar Jackson surely would not get. I'll take it, but these teams will be fighting over these rules all offseason.

Like seeing that Kyle's trusting him a little more with the audibles too now.

why cuz he's black?

Because he's seen as a RB when he has the ball, even behind the LOS, by alot of people.

BTW...speaking of backs....who is the best back in the league this year? He's white, right?

Soooo...where are you headed with this?

reported

Originally posted by genus49:
Define what you mean by ability to make plays when there isn't anything there?

Are you talking about finding covered guys for completions? Are you talking about running for big plays? Scrambling around until guys get open?

I think Jimmy has made several plays where he's gotten it done despite things not being there. So what's consistent enough?

The whole IT factor has been brought up before. Did Jimmy have IT vs the Saints? Did he have IT in 2017?

How many of those guys you mentioned had IT early in their starting careers? Favre has the record for picks in NFL history. He lost just as many as he won.

Jimmy definitely didn't play his best game yesterday but the narrative changes quickly if he gets a little more help. If George doesn't drop the ball while running on 3rd down odds are he's picking up that first down and Jimmy finishes that drive by running out the clock.

Maybe if Falcons score and we have time left on the clock to make a drive he gets it done then...hard to say.

It's clear Jimmy isn't an elite QB at this point and he's going to have his hot/cold games. As time goes on he should improve. Let's remember that early in his career Russell Wilson's book was "keep him in the pocket and you should win"

I'm sorry if you can't see the difference between the amazing plays that Wilson and Rogers pull out of nowhere and what Jimmy does. He scrambles a little but rarely makes a big play downfield when he does. It's usually a safety valve pass. His receivers might not be open but part of that is knowing if you keep working your QB will see you.

All the guys I mentioned had that ability from the beginning. It's not something you learn. You either have it or you don't. It's what separates the legendary from the good QB's. After the Niners beat the Cowboys in the 1981 NFC championship game the Dallas coach said it's all Montana, there's nothing else there. Favre threw a lot of INT's but he made amazing plays too. How good would the Seahawks be without Wilson? The book that said keep him in the pocket was fine except people had trouble keeping him in there. This isn't about arm talent. It's a quality that's impossible to measure that some guys just seem to have. These guys are the elite. the best of the best. That doesn't mean Jimmy sucks. He's a good QB and may lead us to a SB but it's also one of the reasons he isn't looked upon as elite around the league. There aren't many highlight reel plays where you go how in the world did he do that. Nothing wrong with being a good or even great QB since there are only a handful that ever really reach the legendary status.

Mahommes seems to be a young guy that has that kind of ability. Jackson is a great runner but I haven't seen him making the amazing pass plays off his running since most of his running is by design.

Originally posted by genus49:
Define what you mean by ability to make plays when there isn't anything there?

Are you talking about finding covered guys for completions? Are you talking about running for big plays? Scrambling around until guys get open?

I think Jimmy has made several plays where he's gotten it done despite things not being there. So what's consistent enough?

The whole IT factor has been brought up before. Did Jimmy have IT vs the Saints? Did he have IT in 2017?

How many of those guys you mentioned had IT early in their starting careers? Favre has the record for picks in NFL history. He lost just as many as he won.

Jimmy definitely didn't play his best game yesterday but the narrative changes quickly if he gets a little more help. If George doesn't drop the ball while running on 3rd down odds are he's picking up that first down and Jimmy finishes that drive by running out the clock.

Maybe if Falcons score and we have time left on the clock to make a drive he gets it done then...hard to say.

It's clear Jimmy isn't an elite QB at this point and he's going to have his hot/cold games. As time goes on he should improve. Let's remember that early in his career Russell Wilson's book was "keep him in the pocket and you should win"

Good post and completely agree, especially considering this is still very early in Jimmy's career as a starting NFL QB. As he continues to gain this valuable experience, he will continue to get better & better - I have no doubt about it.

Originally posted by LottDMontanaO:

Originally posted by genus49:

Define what you mean by ability to make plays when there isn't anything there?

Are you talking about finding covered guys for completions? Are you talking about running for big plays? Scrambling around until guys get open?

I think Jimmy has made several plays where he's gotten it done despite things not being there. So what's consistent enough?

The whole IT factor has been brought up before. Did Jimmy have IT vs the Saints? Did he have IT in 2017?

How many of those guys you mentioned had IT early in their starting careers? Favre has the record for picks in NFL history. He lost just as many as he won.

Jimmy definitely didn't play his best game yesterday but the narrative changes quickly if he gets a little more help. If George doesn't drop the ball while running on 3rd down odds are he's picking up that first down and Jimmy finishes that drive by running out the clock.

Maybe if Falcons score and we have time left on the clock to make a drive he gets it done then...hard to say.

It's clear Jimmy isn't an elite QB at this point and he's going to have his hot/cold games. As time goes on he should improve. Let's remember that early in his career Russell Wilson's book was "keep him in the pocket and you should win"

Good post and completely agree, especially considering this is still very early in Jimmy's career as a starting NFL QB. As he continues to gain this valuable experience, he will continue to get better & better - I have no doubt about it.

No doubt he will get better! IMHO. We were all hoping it was this year, because we're impatient. Maybe it will happen yet. But he is basically a untested QB. He needs sometime playing for experience to take over games. Just the way it is.

Its amazing Jimmy G and his offense put up 48 points on this Saints defense. They are smothering the Colts offense right now.

Originally posted by LasVegasWally:

Originally posted by okdkid:

I'm willing to be critical of Garoppolo. But I think he was okay yesterday. That fade to Kittle (if that's what you want to call it) was awful. But other than that...I thought he did well.

Agree

If he had more time to throw it's have been a different game.

One throw to Sanders was 20ft beyond his reach with no pressure, more near INTs, more balls bounced 2ft in front on the WRs, balls thrown behind other times. Other that that, yeah he looked Ok...

Originally posted by 808niner4lyphe:
Its amazing Jimmy G and his offense put up 48 points on this Saints defense. They are smothering the Colts offense right now.

He is still my QB!

Originally posted by CatchMaster80:

Originally posted by genus49:

Define what you mean by ability to make plays when there isn't anything there?

Are you talking about finding covered guys for completions? Are you talking about running for big plays? Scrambling around until guys get open?

I think Jimmy has made several plays where he's gotten it done despite things not being there. So what's consistent enough?

The whole IT factor has been brought up before. Did Jimmy have IT vs the Saints? Did he have IT in 2017?

How many of those guys you mentioned had IT early in their starting careers? Favre has the record for picks in NFL history. He lost just as many as he won.

Jimmy definitely didn't play his best game yesterday but the narrative changes quickly if he gets a little more help. If George doesn't drop the ball while running on 3rd down odds are he's picking up that first down and Jimmy finishes that drive by running out the clock.

Maybe if Falcons score and we have time left on the clock to make a drive he gets it done then...hard to say.

It's clear Jimmy isn't an elite QB at this point and he's going to have his hot/cold games. As time goes on he should improve. Let's remember that early in his career Russell Wilson's book was "keep him in the pocket and you should win"

I'm sorry if you can't see the difference between the amazing plays that Wilson and Rogers pull out of nowhere and what Jimmy does. He scrambles a little but rarely makes a big play downfield when he does. It's usually a safety valve pass. His receivers might not be open but part of that is knowing if you keep working your QB will see you.

All the guys I mentioned had that ability from the beginning. It's not something you learn. You either have it or you don't. It's what separates the legendary from the good QB's. After the Niners beat the Cowboys in the 1981 NFC championship game the Dallas coach said it's all Montana, there's nothing else there. Favre threw a lot of INT's but he made amazing plays too. How good would the Seahawks be without Wilson? The book that said keep him in the pocket was fine except people had trouble keeping him in there. This isn't about arm talent. It's a quality that's impossible to measure that some guys just seem to have. These guys are the elite. the best of the best. That doesn't mean Jimmy sucks. He's a good QB and may lead us to a SB but it's also one of the reasons he isn't looked upon as elite around the league. There aren't many highlight reel plays where you go how in the world did he do that. Nothing wrong with being a good or even great QB since there are only a handful that ever really reach the legendary status.

Mahommes seems to be a young guy that has that kind of ability. Jackson is a great runner but I haven't seen him making the amazing pass plays off his running since most of his running is by design.

I wasn't being an ass. I was legit curious on what you were using for your criteria of having that it factor.

Are you talking about scramble drill plays? If so I guess I disagree that that is what makes great QBs.

I also think Jimmy definitely has that IF that's what the coaches wanted. I don't think it's a coincidence that we saw a lot more of those make something out of nothing plays in his 2017 starts because he was still grasping the offense and there was more make a play vs execute the designed play.

Seattle basically coached their guys for scramble drills so Wilson could scramble around and chuck it down the field. As I said the early way to stop Seattle on offense was by stopping the run and keeping Russ in the pocket...if you think that's what great QBs are made of I will respectfully disagree.

We have one of the best playcallers in the game right now. I don't want to see Jimmy playing out of the system that much.

And did Steve have that IT factor in the USFL or with Tampa Bay?

I think it's too early to claim Jimmy doesn't have it. How many opportunities has he had to actually lead a game winning drive this year? How many times was he successful vs not during those times?

Originally posted by SkyZer0:

Originally posted by random49er:

Originally posted by SkyZer0:

Originally posted by random49er:
On these roughing the passer calls, they're cutting us alotta breaks with the sacks today that Lamar Jackson surely would not get. I'll take it, but these teams will be fighting over these rules all offseason.

Like seeing that Kyle's trusting him a little more with the audibles too now.

why cuz he's black?

Because he's seen as a RB when he has the ball, even behind the LOS, by alot of people.

BTW...speaking of backs....who is the best back in the league this year? He's white, right?

Soooo...where are you headed with this?

reported

The right thing to do although I know AA meetings can be tough.

We're all here to support one of our own, brother!

Rather than reply individually to a few posts, I'll just say this.

Even going by probably PFF's "bad game" reviews for Jimmy, the last three "bad games" he's had were Seattle, Baltimore, and yesterday. I wouldn't even call Baltimore a bad game or performance from him myself but they did. Which made me question their analysis but that's beside the point at the moment.

Let's say they were all "bad games". All losses to be sure.

Both Seattle and from my understanding yesterday the offensive line was getting beat like a rented mule and receivers were dropping passes. I guess he missed on a few as well but again I couldn't watch the game myself. Also in the Seattle game and yesterday we had changes on the offensive line. Admittedly I'm not sure how much that should have effected yesterday since Garland played last week when Richburg went out. Other than Richburg is obviously better and Grady Jarrett is pretty good as well.

But when the offensive line is a sieve it leads to some off target throws and less than desirable games from the quarterback. When receivers aren't getting open or are dropping the balls that also compounds the problem. In other words, when everything falls apart around him it's hard for Jimmy to win a game by himself. Similarly when weather conditions are less than ideal so too maybe is Jimmy as a passer. I don't know why that is so hard for PFF to realize let alone some of our own fans. And that isn't making excuses but is just plain common sense, to me.

I suppose I could say how we look at and evaluate quarterbacks is fascinating in and of itself. Watching Brees some tonight, and yes he has Michael Thomas and it was one game but I could say he's just as good if not better than Brady in terms of being a quarterback and a passer. Some have said of course Rodgers is if not better just in that sense. But people think Brady is the "best of all time" because he's been in this great situation, essentially. And yes he's contributed to it mightily. But I don't have any reason to believe that Brees, Rodgers, and others couldn't have the same kind of results over there that he's had. Just an observation that of course as always we focus on, and praise and blame the quarterback more than is right to begin with.

This guy is my soulmate

Originally posted by OhioNiner:

Rather than reply individually to a few posts, I'll just say this.

Even going by probably PFF's "bad game" reviews for Jimmy, the last three "bad games" he's had were Seattle, Baltimore, and yesterday. I wouldn't even call Baltimore a bad game or performance from him myself but they did. Which made me question their analysis but that's beside the point at the moment.

Let's say they were all "bad games". All losses to be sure.

Both Seattle and from my understanding yesterday the offensive line was getting beat like a rented mule and receivers were dropping passes. I guess he missed on a few as well but again I couldn't watch the game myself. Also in the Seattle game and yesterday we had changes on the offensive line. Admittedly I'm not sure how much that should have effected yesterday since Garland played last week when Richburg went out. Other than Richburg is obviously better and Grady Jarrett is pretty good as well.

But when the offensive line is a sieve it leads to some off target throws and less than desirable games from the quarterback. When receivers aren't getting open or are dropping the balls that also compounds the problem. In other words, when everything falls apart around him it's hard for Jimmy to win a game by himself. Similarly when weather conditions are less than ideal so too maybe is Jimmy as a passer. I don't know why that is so hard for PFF to realize let alone some of our own fans. And that isn't making excuses but is just plain common sense, to me.

I suppose I could say how we look at and evaluate quarterbacks is fascinating in and of itself. Watching Brees some tonight, and yes he has Michael Thomas and it was one game but I could say he's just as good if not better than Brady in terms of being a quarterback and a passer. Some have said of course Rodgers is if not better just in that sense. But people think Brady is the "best of all time" because he's been in this great situation, essentially. And yes he's contributed to it mightily. But I don't have any reason to believe that Brees, Rodgers, and others couldn't have the same kind of results over there that he's had. Just an observation that of course as always we focus on, and praise and blame the quarterback more than is right to begin with.

Just remember Drew Brees from San Diego. A guy who was so good the team used the #1 overall pick they got with him playing on Eli Manning.

Some guys need time and the right fit. I'm confident Kyle and the 49ers are the right fit. Jimmy will grow as a passer with time and stuff like the Saints game will become the norm where we start to expect games like that vs worrying about his turnovers or questionable decision making.