There are 99 users in the forums

Coaches Film Analysis: 2017 Season

Shop Find 49ers gear online
  • thl408
  • Moderator
  • Posts: 20,394
Originally posted by jgarf08:
Another screen for some reason sorry I've been so attracted to it. It's 2nd and 9 and 12 pers. Seahawks are playing Man Free which they did most of the game interchanging it with Cover 3 and Cover 2 in passing situations. Picture is post motion. 49ers ran a similar concept earlier trying to hit Juice on the wheel. Was well set up and good timing on the call catching Seattle in man. Up front faking stretch like they typically do on their playaction boots. V route by #1 up top, drag by Goodwin and flat wheel by the Y.

Here it is at the release. CJ does a good job of getting width and buying time to get the ball off. Again Hyde looks like he gets too much width but I believe this one is on the Oline and more than likely poor awareness on behalf of Staley.

All 5 Linemen get out on the screen, only 1 defender left to get a big play. On any screen you should typically have 1 Linemen out to the flats, 1 to run the alley, and 1 to be a rat killer (turnback). Here all 5 Linemen looking back inside but I assure you someone was coached to pick up the defender covering the back or covering the PS flats. Poor awareness and execution and 7 yard loss.

Again, great play design and timing, but offense just not clicking. I can tell you as a OC one of the most frustrating things was getting Olinemen to understand the screen game, it is a battle but maybe that's why I'm looking for work. Imagine on the NFL level that is a easier fight, particularly with how athletic these Olinemen are getting which blows me away every time I watch the coaches film.
This is one of those plays the team talks about in meetings during the week where you wait for the look you want from the defense, you get it, you call the play, it's been practiced. The ball is snapped, "got 'em!". Son of a b***h! Missed block.
Kyle's offense is pass first and that lends itself well to setting up the defense for screens. While the fault may lay with Staley here, Tomlinson/Fusco don't seem like guards that excel in the screen game. We've talked a lot about improving the guards this coming offseason.
Originally posted by thl408:
Originally posted by jonnydel:
No. He's calling stuff like BW used to. Has the possibility of the deep play and you look for the deep play first and work down from there. One of the issues that makes it look that way is that CJ can rush his reads. I've seen him move to the 3rd route in the progression by his 2nd drop back step and he never gave the concept the chance to work. It's hard for a guy in his position because you like a QB that can move quickly through progressions but you also have to stick with it until you can know what it will be. For example, there was a play we had a drive concept going and he moved off the drive to his 3rd progression after the LB took 2 dropback steps. The in route on the drive concept was open, but he had already moved off the concept and then hung on to the ball too long.

It'll look like the play was too long in developing but it was there to be made.
Crazy. I have that play cutup and ready to go. I titled it "CJ too fast". If you put up the film thread I can show the rest. Unless you are referring to another play.
nope, that was it . Funny I'm working on the OP to a film thread now
  • thl408
  • Moderator
  • Posts: 20,394
Originally posted by jonnydel:
nope, that was it . Funny I'm working on the OP to a film thread now

Cool. Yeah just like you described. CJ is still dropping back when he decides to move off of the Drive concept and look to the left side where he wanted Brieda on a Corner route vs a CB that has outside leverage. Brieda isn't winning that. CJ could have looked at it presnap and knew Brieda wasn't going to win that battle.
Originally posted by thl408:
Originally posted by jonnydel:
nope, that was it . Funny I'm working on the OP to a film thread now

Cool. Yeah just like you described. CJ is still dropping back when he decides to move off of the Drive concept and look to the left side where he wanted Brieda on a Corner route vs a CB that has outside leverage. Brieda isn't winning that. CJ could have looked at it presnap and knew Brieda wasn't going to win that battle.

Kyle needs to hammer it home...."when I call Offensive Weapon Drive, you stick with the drive concept!!!!"
Originally posted by jgarf08:
Yes and no.I see Kilgore doing a good job on the 2nd level but where he struggles IMO is on the 1st level and at the point of attack. He allows too much penetration when reach a shade which to me is problematic but to your point I think his footwork and angles are proper. He certainly struggles in pass pro, he was responsible for one of the sacks where it looked like Tomlinson got beat but Kilgore was double reading and should have had Tomlinson's inside gap but was late getting over.

While I'm at it some quick thoughts about the Seahawks game and in general.

QBs - CJ is what he is and god bless him for fighting through the beating he has taken throughout the course of his starts until the end of the game Sunday. I am more impressed with his physical talent than I thought I would be earlier in the year, has a good zip on the ball, fairly accurate, feet are solid and shown the ability to throw from unbalanced sets. However, I still don't think he sees the field well reluctantly taking the check down too often when he has time and the progression is clean. He also is reluctant to throw into some tight windows but ones that are wide open to the NFL standard. Rookie problems for sure, just doesn't have the anticipation and trust he needs to be successful.

With Jimmy G I am real interested to see if Kyle keeps the pass game pretty vanilla like he has with CJ or if expands a little bit as Jimmy G gets more comfortable. Excited to see the kid play, was a big fan of his coming out in college, something to watch with him is how well he sets his feet, something he picked up from Brady and my old tutor Tom Martinez. His balance and pocket movement is fantastic, much like Brady.

RBs - Hyde has really impressed me with his running this year, hard downhill and motivated, showed a lot of heart this season. That being said he still pretty undisciplined in the run game, and that's a big problem given the scheme (again think Coach Gibbs). He also a is minus player in the pass game. His struggles in pass pro is well documented and he is not a great route runner and obviously has shown a fair amount of drops (as the entire offense has). So as much as Lynch and Kyle are talking up Hyde, don't be surprised if they don't even offer him a contract regardless of the market rate, I think they move on.

In this system the RB being pivotal in the pass game is essential, as we saw with the Falcons last season, hoping they can find someone in the draft next year to add this dimension.

WRs - I would have cut Bourne on Monday morning for showing up the QB and being undisciplined, but that's a big pet peeve of mine, happens in the NFL too often.
This may be an unpopular opinion but I am a big fan of Goodwin. He's becoming a better route runner through the course of the year and his speed is a true weapon for the offense. He is starting to make some contested catches but still needs to improve his hands to be a consistent Z WR in the offense. Also if Goodwin is able to get better through contact, mainly at the 2nd level and improve his thought process on his routes (stems/where to attack) he'll be a great 2nd/3rd WR.

OL - If you guys need a good drinking game watch Magnuson and take a shot every time he touches a Seahawk in the run game and anytime he stops the momentum of a pass rusher. Spoiler alert - you won't be drinking much. He was a big minus player as I already stated.

Tomlinson - not a bad player just needs to be more consistent at the POA - tends to lean too much and be early with his hands, gets him in trouble.

Fusco didn't stand out to the negative or the positive. Staley is starting to age and that's hard to see. He is starting to put himself in poor body positions which is something he never used to do and it gets him beat. Still an above average LT but the end is closer in sight than I comfortable admitting.

I'll post some clips here shortly. Thanks!

I love these. Well done and really appreciate these. Nice, honest, objective assessments.

I haven't spotlighted Tomlinson a ton but haven't felt the need to...PFF also has him at poor at 46.9 rated #43. Depth player like Kilgore and two you'd like to upgrade even there.

I totally get that stance on Hyde too.
Hola all you football fanatics. You have to be to still be wandering into a football forum when your team is 1-10.....

But all the negativity aside - we have some film to go through.

Once again the evil empire came out victorious. But we will press on, learn and hopefully be ready to dismantle the web of tyranny hanging over the northwest region of our beautiful country.

It was a rough game to watch from CJ's perspective. When things were open he often times didn't have any protection(Magnusson's foot problem was a major problem.....) or he rushed through his progressions or his pocket awareness - or lack thereof, failed him.

When he had time our receivers struggled to get separation(wait, we have receivers still on the team? I thought they all got hurt). One thing Seattle did to our guys and makes it really hard was that they would maul our guys off the line. They had apparently learned from when KS played them last year in the playoffs and how he used RB's in the pass game. Whenever our RB's came out of the backfield on passing routes the LB's looked to flatten them and it took away a lot of plays. I think there was a number of plays where the RB's out were the primary target but the timing of everything got thrown off when our guys got knocked around.

The run game was particularly hard to watch in the first half. A lot of missed assignments and just bad blocking techniques.

On defense I don't think we were as bad as the score showed. Our run D was pretty good throughout the game. The stars on the line were Buck and Mitchell with ST coming in 3rd IMO. ST showed a lot more than the last time I saw him on the field. Which is very encouraging. It looks like the light bulb is starting to come on and he's playing much more disciplined. I think there was a lot of, "let me show everyone what I can do!!!" when he first came in and he's settling in. Look for him to really start to flash coming down the stretch in this season.

Reuben Foster was great. He's continuing to show why ShanaLynch had him as their #3 player on the board. I like Coyle in the run game - he's playing the MIKE well for that role but is a big liability in the passing game. I think he'll be a long shot to stay with the team as anything other than a backup/special teams guy. Look for the team to pair another stud LB with Foster. That should really help our CB's out.

Speaking of CB's I'll also be surprised if D. Johnson sticks with us in a starting capacity. He's not terrible on deep balls but his hips get turned way too easily and he shows almost no ability to contest any deeper breaking routes. DIGs, Comebacks, Deep outs, are all converted with ease against him.

ShanaLynch are gonna have a tough decision with Reid next year. He showed more in that game than any of our other safeties save for A. Colbert against the Giants. He was really good in run support, had the good INT and ended up all over the field.

What broke our defense down was time and they started to press. Against R. Wilson and his street ball you have to keep the midget in the pocket. You don't even have to rush him, just don't let him out to play street ball. He's a one-read QB most of the time and if you take that away he looks to scramble around and make a throw. He was able to do that in the 2nd half and it started to break the defense down. In the first half we ran a lot of delayed rushes and contains from our ends that kept him from doing that and you saw a number of times when he went to scramble but there was a guy waiting for him so he threw it away. But, the team started to press and he made a few throws here and there where the players started to feel like they needed to get home on the pass rush and that's when the whole thing started to buckle. That and the guys were getting tired as our offense - the passing game specifically, really struggled in the 2nd half.

Anyhoo, hope y'alls Thursday is going well and hope this thread won't be too depressing!

P.S. It sucks beyond belief that JG's first start is in Chicago. Their all-22 is hardly all-22. It's the worst angle in the world.....I HATE watching film from Chicago and might explain why they suck, they can't see anything from the film.....lol
Here was a big missed opportunity in the 1st quarter and one where CJ's rookieness got the better of him.

6:47 1st QTR


We got a lot going on in this play. We're trying to get the ball to Hyde, it's an old WCO staple - the "texas" concept. We're going to jazz it up a bit and throw in some motion from the Flanker to help reveal coverage. By lining T. Taylor up outside the TE in the flanker and then motioning him across it will reveal whether or not this single safety look is cover 1 man or cover 3 zone. With Maxwell traveling with Taylor it reveals cover 1 man and they'll have a "lurk" or hole defender on this one. I like the addition of the shallow crosser here from the slot as it adds 2 dimensions. You get a "trail" concept that mixes with the TE's in route to create a "mesh" concept. We run a short out from Taylor with the texas or circle or angle route(whatever verbiage you use) which is the texas concept. The idea is to isolate a RB on a LB. The drag and quick outs both stretch the defense away from the angle or texas route giving your RB a lot of room to maneuver 1v1.



The key when playing against man-coverage is for your receivers to win leverage to the correct sides. Here, Bourne does a good job of avoiding the jam and winning inside leverage.



This is one play where our offensive line does a really good job. Both our Tackles drive their men upfield - which is exactly what they're taught and the interior holds up perfectly. Wagner jumps on and mauls Goodwin on his drag and K.J. Wright hammers Hyde coming out of the backfield before he can make his break.



CJ wants to get Hyde the ball and actually pulls down his throw when he see's how much his route has been disrupted. Kittle is getting held - but who calls that on Seattle? The key here is that the pump to Hyde draws the full attention of Earl Thomas who drives on the texas route. BTW, bourne has won and is heading for the middle of the field that Thomas is vacating.



CJ has a perfect pocket and a WR breaking wide open down the middle of the field with the safety running down on the RB - throw the ball man!!! Instead he starts to roll out right.



He runs himself into pressure and then tries to throw it to Hyde who's now double covered. He misses the wide open Bourne and gets himself clobbered on the play..... Sometimes rookies gon rook...

Don't we want the LB's to come up and make contact with our RB's? I mean, that is the ideal reason for running a play action is to get the LBs to pull forward. On pass plays, if they are pulling all the way forward to the LOS to bump out backs, then we should have slants and 0-14 yard routes open all day in the middle.
[ Edited by Joecool on Nov 30, 2017 at 12:00 PM ]
  • thl408
  • Moderator
  • Posts: 20,394
The Reid INT.
vs Cover 1 blitz
Wilson has high-low reads to each side of the field with both Corner routes designed to horizontally stretch the FS. The thin blue lines note the man coverage assignments; Reid vs Graham.


Both Reid and Spoon want to play with outside leverage to funnel towards the FS. Coyle follows the playaction and in doing so creates a pick on Reid. Eli gets a free run at Wilson as Wilson boots directly towards Eli's side of the field.


Coyle's pick on Reid causes Reid to lose outside leverage. Now Graham has the advantage on the outbreaking Corner route.


Eli doesn't allow Wilson to get set and step into the throw, and this will cause the pass to be underthrown.


INT'ed.
  • thl408
  • Moderator
  • Posts: 20,394
Originally posted by Joecool:
Don't we want the LB's to come up and make contact with our RB's? I mean, that is the ideal reason for running a play action is to get the LBs to pull forward. If they are pulling all the way forward to the LOS to bump out backs, then we should have slants and 0-14 yard routes open all day in the middle.

SEA did a good job gameplanning vs the 49ers. You know that play where CJ/Hoyer use playaction to suck up the LBs then immediately throw a pass over the middle? We've seen it numerous times this season. There was a play where the 49ers tried this and the SEA LB (playing zone) completely turned his head around to identify the WR coming across the middle, and took that pass away.

What I think jonnyd is referring to, and one play stands out to me, is Hyde running an angle route out of the backfield. I don't think there was playaction. But the LB was very physical and jammed Hyde hard. So hard it killed Hyde's momentum and threw the timing of the play off. I can show both these plays if jd doesn't.

Man... you can see how ticked off Bourne was that he didn't get the ball. Could've been a TD. Let's hope Jimmy sees and completes plays like this that are there to be made.

I know even stars miss guys (in the same game, RW never saw a wide open Jimmy Graham from a busted coverage), but it's agonizing to look at these failures to capitalize on golden opportunities.
  • Furlow
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 10,058
Originally posted by jonnydel:
Here was a big missed opportunity in the 1st quarter and one where CJ's rookieness got the better of him.

6:47 1st QTR


We got a lot going on in this play. We're trying to get the ball to Hyde, it's an old WCO staple - the "texas" concept. We're going to jazz it up a bit and throw in some motion from the Flanker to help reveal coverage. By lining T. Taylor up outside the TE in the flanker and then motioning him across it will reveal whether or not this single safety look is cover 1 man or cover 3 zone. With Maxwell traveling with Taylor it reveals cover 1 man and they'll have a "lurk" or hole defender on this one. I like the addition of the shallow crosser here from the slot as it adds 2 dimensions. You get a "trail" concept that mixes with the TE's in route to create a "mesh" concept. We run a short out from Taylor with the texas or circle or angle route(whatever verbiage you use) which is the texas concept. The idea is to isolate a RB on a LB. The drag and quick outs both stretch the defense away from the angle or texas route giving your RB a lot of room to maneuver 1v1.



The key when playing against man-coverage is for your receivers to win leverage to the correct sides. Here, Bourne does a good job of avoiding the jam and winning inside leverage.



This is one play where our offensive line does a really good job. Both our Tackles drive their men upfield - which is exactly what they're taught and the interior holds up perfectly. Wagner jumps on and mauls Goodwin on his drag and K.J. Wright hammers Hyde coming out of the backfield before he can make his break.



CJ wants to get Hyde the ball and actually pulls down his throw when he see's how much his route has been disrupted. Kittle is getting held - but who calls that on Seattle? The key here is that the pump to Hyde draws the full attention of Earl Thomas who drives on the texas route. BTW, bourne has won and is heading for the middle of the field that Thomas is vacating.



CJ has a perfect pocket and a WR breaking wide open down the middle of the field with the safety running down on the RB - throw the ball man!!! Instead he starts to roll out right.



He runs himself into pressure and then tries to throw it to Hyde who's now double covered. He misses the wide open Bourne and gets himself clobbered on the play..... Sometimes rookies gon rook...


Great analysis. This is frustrating to watch.
Beathard bailed too early. Completely turn his head away from downfield, and started scrambling — Kaep style.
Originally posted by thl408:
Originally posted by Joecool:
Don't we want the LB's to come up and make contact with our RB's? I mean, that is the ideal reason for running a play action is to get the LBs to pull forward. If they are pulling all the way forward to the LOS to bump out backs, then we should have slants and 0-14 yard routes open all day in the middle.

SEA did a good job gameplanning vs the 49ers. You know that play where CJ/Hoyer use playaction to suck up the LBs then immediately throw a pass over the middle? We've seen it numerous times this season. There was a play where the 49ers tried this and the SEA LB (playing zone) completely turned his head around to identify the WR coming across the middle, and took that pass away.

What I think jonnyd is referring to, and one play stands out to me, is Hyde running an angle route out of the backfield. I don't think there was playaction. But the LB was very physical and jammed Hyde hard. So hard it killed Hyde's momentum and threw the timing of the play off. I can show both these plays if jd doesn't.

The one I showed is one of em, right?
  • thl408
  • Moderator
  • Posts: 20,394
This is on the 49ers first drive of the game. Protection will be good and CJ will have a clean pocket against a coverage that CJ sees everyday in practice since SEA and SF run a similar defense.
To CJ's left is a commonly seen route combination run against Cover1 and Cover3 where the #1 and #3 run Curls, with the #2 running a Fade.
To CJ's right is a vertical stretch with orange and the backside Dig (red) that is very effective against Cover3.
vs Cover3


CJ takes the snap and looks left. He then pump fakes it to Taylor. The two Curls (purple/yellow) are not going to get it done on 3rd & 11. The Fade route from the #2 is defeated by the sideline deep 1/3 (the Fade from #2 is mainly for Cover1).


With CJ looking left, and pump faking left, this manipulates the weakside Hook defender (blue) to slide towards the strongside. In the picture below, CJ is now throwing to Taylor. But with a clean pocket to step up into, all the hard work has been done to set up the backside Dig.


Taylor's route had little chance to convert, and with a pump fake to draw defenders to Taylor, it now has no chance in hell.


+6, punt. Versus Cover3, look to the strongside to freeze the underneath defenders, then target the backside Dig. While this isn't easy to do, it's against a coverage that CJ sees a lot in practice and should be able to execute.
Share 49erswebzone