NY Jets HC-Robert Saleh

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by SteveYoung:

Originally posted by NCommand:

New players this game who got to play their natural positions from college:

Antoine Exum - Free Safety
Marcell Harris - Strong Safety
D.J. Reed - Slot CB
D.J. Jones - NT
Solomon Thomas - IDT
Elijah Lee - WILL
Jullian Taylor - BE

Week 14

Lol. So what? Is any one of those players a starter on a top 15 D? No chance.

And if you are insinuating that Saleh has played guys out of position well:

Exum was forced to play SS because we had no-one else

Harris hasn't played anything but SS

DJ Reed was drafted to be a backup FS

DJ Jones has always been at NT

Thomas has had plenty of snaps inside

Lee has always been at WILL

Taylor has always been at BE when he isn't deactivated.

Right, like that was the point. Everybody and their mother going back to pre season could see guys like D.J. Jones, Lee & Reed should have been starting over Saleh's boys in Mitchell, M.Smith & Reed should have been challenging Williams the entire year at the slot. And in some cases, should have been active to play over crappy players.

Let's face it, your AA version of a DC loves HIS guys for a variety of reasons (system/comfort): AA, Mitchell, Ward, Powell, Mabin, M.Smith, etc.

The dude struggles identifying talent and putting players in position to succeed. It's no coincidence that the same week Kyle and Lynch go public and say they'd like to see ST more at one position and inside, he plays much more inside and has one of his better games. Saleh's had Exum at CB and then SS and now FS.

Guys like Harris...no biggie, he needed to heal, get active but would Saleh have ever tried him over Tartt if not for the shoulder injury?

My guess is clearly, ShanaLynch wanted to see the young kids and see what they have from their draft picks...so they're all playing at once and naturally, looked better and now Kyle is going public saying that guys like Mitchell, Garcon and M.Smith know this business...a couple guys Saleh prefers.

Who knows if any of these young players turn into anything great but getting them real snaps could help develop quality depth for next year at minimum...something we desperately need for a rebuilding team.

No youre off on a moonbeam again. Fact is we need vets on this d not youth that hasnt been scouted in a live game yet.

This d would look a lot better with bethea whitner or reid providing the deep eyes than ward or some future bag boy standing 5 yards deep in the end zone on 3rd and goal from the 1.

The antidote for our d will be the right mix of youth and experience not uber cheap rookies everywhere.

Preferably coached by someone besides salami.

Saleh reminds me so much of Greg Manusky. Just had no real idea what to do with the talent the team had.

Originally posted by thl408:

Originally posted by jonnydel:
Not in this defense. Theres a lot of responsibility on the underneath defenders to match crossingand vertical turning routes. Once q receiver goes full vertical the CB transitions to man coverage.

Think about how many times over the years you've seen Sherman running with receivers in deep post routes.

Hey jd, check out the cut up on the previous page where Harris and Lee match the vertical route. Who is wrong and should have covered the RB in the flat?

As an uneducated observer, it would seem that Lee should have gone to cover the RB. I don't know whether the Bronco Harris is covering is WR or TE, but RBs covering RBs is customary, if perhaps not in this defense. On the other side of the field, three 49ers end up covering one receiver. Perhaps it's my ignorance speaking, but the defense should be shifting to their right when the crossing pattern loaded the right side of the field.

Originally posted by cciowa:

Originally posted by Jeepzilla:

Originally posted by SteveYoung:

Oh look. A blown coverage by two KC DB's to lose the game.

So it does happen to other teams??

Fire Bob Sutton!!

Your tryin way to hard

pretty sure steve is acorn heads agent

LMAO. Nice try. I'm not going to engage you in a battle because it's not worth my time.

That said, I change my mind. I've been watching and playing football for over 30 years. I've probably forgotten more than you know. I could care less who we have at DC but its comical that you think a new coach could turn these guys we are currently starting into a top group. That is all that needs to be said.

Originally posted by NCommand:

Right, like that was the point. Everybody and their mother going back to pre season could see guys like D.J. Jones, Lee & Reed should have been starting over Saleh's boys in Mitchell, M.Smith & Reed should have been challenging Williams the entire year at the slot. And in some cases, should have been active to play over crappy players.

Let's face it, your AA version of a DC loves HIS guys for a variety of reasons (system/comfort): AA, Mitchell, Ward, Powell, Mabin, M.Smith, etc.

The dude struggles identifying talent and putting players in position to succeed. It's no coincidence that the same week Kyle and Lynch go public and say they'd like to see ST more at one position and inside, he plays much more inside and has one of his better games. Saleh's had Exum at CB and then SS and now FS.

Guys like Harris...no biggie, he needed to heal, get active but would Saleh have ever tried him over Tartt if not for the shoulder injury?

My guess is clearly, ShanaLynch wanted to see the young kids and see what they have from their draft picks...so they're all playing at once and naturally, looked better and now Kyle is going public saying that guys like Mitchell, Garcon and M.Smith know this business...a couple guys Saleh prefers.

Who knows if any of these young players turn into anything great but getting them real snaps could help develop quality depth for next year at minimum...something we desperately need for a rebuilding team.

Every DC has his guys. They are dependable and execute the plays.

I read an article about how New Orleans wanted to get Marcus Davenport on the field more but they have Alex Okafor starting over him because he is a reliable veteran not a raw rookie.

Lee, Reed and Jones got their chance because the guys ahead of them stunk. That doesnt mean any of those 3 should be starting next year as I think we need to upgrade at all 8 positions not including Sherman, Buckner and Warner.

As for having guys like Exum at multiple positions don't you think that was out of necessity? Who else would he have started?

Originally posted by Paul_Hofer:

Originally posted by thl408:

Originally posted by jonnydel:
Not in this defense. Theres a lot of responsibility on the underneath defenders to match crossingand vertical turning routes. Once q receiver goes full vertical the CB transitions to man coverage.

Think about how many times over the years you've seen Sherman running with receivers in deep post routes.

Hey jd, check out the cut up on the previous page where Harris and Lee match the vertical route. Who is wrong and should have covered the RB in the flat?

As an uneducated observer, it would seem that Lee should have gone to cover the RB. I don't know whether the Bronco Harris is covering is WR or TE, but RBs covering RBs is customary, if perhaps not in this defense. On the other side of the field, three 49ers end up covering one receiver. Perhaps it's my ignorance speaking, but the defense should be shifting to their right when the crossing pattern loaded the right side of the field.

The player Harris turned around to cover is a WR. I think you are correct that Lee should shift over to cover the RB. Normally it's the Hook defender (Lee) that turns and runs with the crossing route, but that's when the crossing route is behind the LB level. On this play, with the crossing route coming in front of Lee, not behind him, Lee has too much room to make up when he decides to turn and run with it. He should have saw that Harris got him then move over to cover the area Harris just vacated (RB in the flat).

Originally posted by SteveYoung:
LMAO. Nice try. I'm not going to engage you in a battle because it's not worth my time.

That said, I change my mind. I've been watching and playing football for over 30 years. I've probably forgotten more than you know. I could care less who we have at DC but its comical that you think a new coach could turn these guys we are currently starting into a top group. That is all that needs to be said.

we need a bunch of new players no doubt, we also need new coaches and i link that to the fact we have been amongst the worst tackling teams in the nfl. of course this entire thing goes back to lynch if you absolve the dc of our struggles and then if you are in the camp where its more the coaches than players it goes to lynch. since you have played and coached for 30 years and have this vast knowledge others lack, would you have allowed the packers wide outs to use the sidelines late in the game knowing they had no time outs thus feeding right into their hand and thus leading to a bad loss. that is on your dc boy. that is just one example of his ineptness

Originally posted by SteveYoung:

Originally posted by cciowa:

Originally posted by Jeepzilla:

Originally posted by SteveYoung:
Oh look. A blown coverage by two KC DB's to lose the game.

So it does happen to other teams??

Fire Bob Sutton!!

Your tryin way to hard

pretty sure steve is acorn heads agent

LMAO. Nice try. I'm not going to engage you in a battle because it's not worth my time.

That said, I change my mind. I've been watching and playing football for over 30 years. I've probably forgotten more than you know. I could care less who we have at DC but its comical that you think a new coach could turn these guys we are currently starting into a top group. That is all that needs to be said.

What else is new?

And coaches make a difference. Not sure how anyone who says they've been playing football for years could argue otherwise.

Yes we need better players but Saleh is not showing he's able to get more out of less the way great coaches do. We should always want to have the best guys not only on the roster but coaching those guys.

Originally posted by cciowa:

we need a bunch of new players no doubt, we also need new coaches and i link that to the fact we have been amongst the worst tackling teams in the nfl. of course this entire thing goes back to lynch if you absolve the dc of our struggles and then if you are in the camp where its more the coaches than players it goes to lynch. since you have played and coached for 30 years and have this vast knowledge others lack, would you have allowed the packers wide outs to use the sidelines late in the game knowing they had no time outs thus feeding right into their hand and thus leading to a bad loss. that is on your dc boy. that is just one example of his ineptness

I'm no great Saleh fan, but I think it's ridiculous people still think we're a bad tackling team, we've actually been one of the best since about week 5. It needed fixing and it has been.

Originally posted by cciowa:

we need a bunch of new players no doubt, we also need new coaches and i link that to the fact we have been amongst the worst tackling teams in the nfl. of course this entire thing goes back to lynch if you absolve the dc of our struggles and then if you are in the camp where its more the coaches than players it goes to lynch. since you have played and coached for 30 years and have this vast knowledge others lack, would you have allowed the packers wide outs to use the sidelines late in the game knowing they had no time outs thus feeding right into their hand and thus leading to a bad loss. that is on your dc boy. that is just one example of his ineptness

Saleh called the correct coverage. It was press coverage with two safeties deep and LBers covering the deep middle. There was no other call that could have been made or any other coverages that would have made a difference.

Go back and check. Maybin had a safety over the top. He just got roasted for 3 completions in a row. Adams beat him every single time and after that Maybin didn't play again because Jimmy Ward came back from injury.

At the end of the day do you really expect Greg Maybin to be able to cover Davante Adams with the best QB in the league throwing to him?

If we had a better CB covering Adams and were able to put some pressure on Rodgers we win that game. It had very little to do with Saleh's playcalls.

No offense but uneducated people will always place the blame on the DC. There was a thing on the NFL network not too long ago about how average fans put way too much emphasis on defensive playcalling. If we lack the players to execute the playcall there is nothing we can do. Plain and simple.

Originally posted by 49erBigMac:

I'm no great Saleh fan, but I think it's ridiculous people still think we're a bad tackling team, we've actually been one of the best since about week 5. It needed fixing and it has been.

I was just going to say this.

Originally posted by genus49:

What else is new?

And coaches make a difference. Not sure how anyone who says they've been playing football for years could argue otherwise.

Yes we need better players but Saleh is not showing he's able to get more out of less the way great coaches do. We should always want to have the best guys not only on the roster but coaching those guys.

So you think Wade Phillips would be able to take our group of misfit backups and street free agents like Greg Maybin, Tyvis Powell, Elijah Lee, Antone Exum, Mark Nzeocha and Cassius Marsh among others and turn them into something they aren't? Even veterans like Malcolm Smith and Earl Mitchell are below average starters at best. Late round rookies like DJ Reed and Marcell Harris were not good aside from last week.

That's not the way it goes man.

Originally posted by SteveYoung:

Every DC has his guys. They are dependable and execute the plays.

I read an article about how New Orleans wanted to get Marcus Davenport on the field more but they have Alex Okafor starting over him because he is a reliable veteran not a raw rookie.

Lee, Reed and Jones got their chance because the guys ahead of them stunk. That doesnt mean any of those 3 should be starting next year as I think we need to upgrade at all 8 positions not including Sherman, Buckner and Warner.

As for having guys like Exum at multiple positions don't you think that was out of necessity? Who else would he have started?

Oh I'm not debating the tactic to go with veterans or scheme guys over first or second year players. I think Saleh is so focused on keeping his head above water that he's missed out on where this rebuild is at and that's centered around player development...something I think he's done a poor job of so far. Had he been more experienced he might have actually helped his case going with some of these younger players systematically over the tapped out vets esp. if they've had 13 games to develop over.

This reminds me so much of 2014 when people blamed Harbaugh for all of the problems and thought Baalke was infallible.

Originally posted by TheWooLick:
This reminds me so much of 2014 when people blamed Harbaugh for all of the problems and thought Baalke was infallible.

i will step up and say you are talking about me. i was really wrong. this time though i am smarter,.,. i blame both the gm and dc