If Roman Leaves, how about Chud?

Originally posted by kap2crab:

Originally posted by Marvin49:

Originally posted by SofaKing:

Originally posted by kap2crab:

Originally posted by Marvin49:
You guys are nuts.

If Roman leaves the replacement OC is already on the staff. They are NOT going to bring in a whole new system because its Harbaughs system to begin with.

I though maybe Drevno before he left, but perhaps Chryst. They might look at the Stanford staff as well.

Norv? Seriously? Not gonna happen.

You're contradicting yourself there. Also, there's no way that there's no way we wouldn't bring an outsider on. It's absolutely in the realm of possibility.

It's certainly possible, but less likely when you have an offensive HC. They tend to promote within, or hire someone who already has familiarity running their scheme. Defensive HCs are typically not married to any offensive scheme, nor have the expertise on that side of the ball, which is why you see so many of them cycle through coordinators of all backgrounds before finding the right fit.

Hiring someone from the Stanford staff would not be a contradiction, because they obviously run Harbaugh's scheme. Hiring a complete outsider would require the new OC to scrap much of what he did in the past, and adjust to a new philosophy. That doesn't happen often, which is why the Kelly-Shurmur pairing was so unique. It's the exception, not the rule.

Exactly. I'm glad someone understood my point.

Pep Hamilton might have been good, but he's in Indy now.

BTW, I'm not sying the OC SHOULD be Chryst. I'm saying its very possible it WILL by Chryst. Harbaugh has known Roman will get another job for some time. He won't be caught flat footed. I'm sure he has a plan and I'm pretty sure he probably already has his next guy on his staff already. Could be Cryst. Could be Morton. I thought it might be Drevno, but he's already got another job.

This isn't a Hostler reboot. Nolan panicked becasue they lost Norv late in the process. Harbaugh won't panic. He's known this was a possibility for a long time. A big reason why Harbaugh was hired was because he was an offensive coach. The team was tired of learning a new offense every single year. Harbaugh braight stability to the offensive side of the ball and they WILL NOT change that in order to bring in Norv Turner. Not gonna happen.

It will be a guy on the staff, a guy from Stanford, or someone he's worked with in the past. Count on it.

At this point though, Roman might stay...especially if the Niners keep winning.

I think it's all a toss up and no fan has any idea what the hell Harbaugh has in mind. It could very well be a promotion from within, it could very well be an outsider. I'm by no means on any sort of Norv Turner bandwagon, but hypothetically if we did hire Turner, it wouldn't be our offense adjusting to what Turner wants to do, it would be Turner adjusting to what we want to do.

...which he won't do. He's been running HIS offense forever...he's not going to change.

Harbaugh likes good coaches. He attracts them as well. There is a reason Mangini is here.

If there is someone out there he really likes, he may look outside the team...but that guy will have to be a West Coast guy and it would have to be an extraordinary circumstance. The system will not change again. I just don't see it happening. Its alot to ask for a name guy to come in and change everything he has done to be a part of this team. I guess it COULD happen, I just don't think it will.

Here is another take...Baalke. All of these coaching jobs are being filled quickly. How many OC's out there would be ideal in bringing a great system here and it being ideal for our personnel? We all know (and have known for a while) that Roman is 1 1/2 feet out the door so would Baalke be willing to bring in someone before Roman even left? Should he strike while the iron is hot? We all know he always has a plan and thinks ahead...if he doesn't move now, we may have no choice to hire within and that could potentially, be a step back if we stay with the same system/offensive philosophy.

Originally posted by Marvin49:
...which he won't do. He's been running HIS offense forever...he's not going to change.

Harbaugh likes good coaches. He attracts them as well. There is a reason Mangini is here.

If there is someone out there he really likes, he may look outside the team...but that guy will have to be a West Coast guy and it would have to be an extraordinary circumstance. The system will not change again. I just don't see it happening. Its alot to ask for a name guy to come in and change everything he has done to be a part of this team. I guess it COULD happen, I just don't think it will.

I agree...the longer we wait to see what happens with Roman the more likely we end up staying in house with the same system/offensive philosophy.

Originally posted by kap2crab:

Originally posted by cciowa:
roman and great play caller do not belong in the same sentence in my opinion

The 'like Roman' reference was in regards to the run game/blocking scheme creativity which he's shown to be great at.

until it works and then he runs away from it to try to show everyone he is smarter than the game, first and goal at the five yard line vs a bad defense is the perfect time to execute what you say he is "great" at.. what did he do?

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by Marvin49:
...which he won't do. He's been running HIS offense forever...he's not going to change.

Harbaugh likes good coaches. He attracts them as well. There is a reason Mangini is here.

If there is someone out there he really likes, he may look outside the team...but that guy will have to be a West Coast guy and it would have to be an extraordinary circumstance. The system will not change again. I just don't see it happening. Its alot to ask for a name guy to come in and change everything he has done to be a part of this team. I guess it COULD happen, I just don't think it will.

I agree...the longer we wait to see what happens with Roman the more likely we end up staying in house with the same system/offensive philosophy.

I think the system/offensive philosophy will stay the same regardless. That's Harbaugh. Roman is the OC, but the offense isn't all Roman. Harbaugh was hired to bring in HIS system. There may be a different guy calling the plays, but it will be a guy who runs the offense the way Harbaugh wants it run.

If peeps want the run first, TE loving offense to go away, then they better hope someone lures HARBAUGH away, not Roman. I for one love this offense even if there are calls here and there that frustrate me.

To all those "it's a passing league" guys, take a look at who the final 4 are right now in the NFC.

Originally posted by Marvin49:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by Marvin49:
...which he won't do. He's been running HIS offense forever...he's not going to change.

Harbaugh likes good coaches. He attracts them as well. There is a reason Mangini is here.

If there is someone out there he really likes, he may look outside the team...but that guy will have to be a West Coast guy and it would have to be an extraordinary circumstance. The system will not change again. I just don't see it happening. Its alot to ask for a name guy to come in and change everything he has done to be a part of this team. I guess it COULD happen, I just don't think it will.

I agree...the longer we wait to see what happens with Roman the more likely we end up staying in house with the same system/offensive philosophy.

I think the system/offensive philosophy will stay the same regardless. That's Harbaugh. Roman is the OC, but the offense isn't all Roman. Harbaugh was hired to bring in HIS system. There may be a different guy calling the plays, but it will be a guy who runs the offense the way Harbaugh wants it run.

If peeps want the run first, TE loving offense to go away, then they better hope someone lures HARBAUGH away, not Roman. I for one love this offense even if there are calls here and there that frustrate me.

To all those "it's a passing league" guys, take a look at who the final 4 are right now in the NFC.

Yeah, this is why I always call them HaRoMan but if I had to guess, it starts with Harbaugh and this is his Schemblacher/Stanford system (Roman's added wrinkles...Q formatons, some WCO designs, etc.) but this is his system and what he knows and subscribes mostly too; heavy run-focused with intermediate team-passing concepts and a mobile/running QB. And I agree...the only caveat here is if Baalke steps in here and makes Harbaugh go another direction. Then, would Harbaugh want to stay LT with "less control?" So odds are, it is what it is whether it's Roman as the symbolism of it all or not....it will STILL most likely end up being the same playbook, same system, same game plans next year with the same 6 or 7 men contributing to the compartmentalized game plans and in-game play calling.

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by Marvin49:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by Marvin49:
...which he won't do. He's been running HIS offense forever...he's not going to change.

Harbaugh likes good coaches. He attracts them as well. There is a reason Mangini is here.

If there is someone out there he really likes, he may look outside the team...but that guy will have to be a West Coast guy and it would have to be an extraordinary circumstance. The system will not change again. I just don't see it happening. Its alot to ask for a name guy to come in and change everything he has done to be a part of this team. I guess it COULD happen, I just don't think it will.

I agree...the longer we wait to see what happens with Roman the more likely we end up staying in house with the same system/offensive philosophy.

I think the system/offensive philosophy will stay the same regardless. That's Harbaugh. Roman is the OC, but the offense isn't all Roman. Harbaugh was hired to bring in HIS system. There may be a different guy calling the plays, but it will be a guy who runs the offense the way Harbaugh wants it run.

If peeps want the run first, TE loving offense to go away, then they better hope someone lures HARBAUGH away, not Roman. I for one love this offense even if there are calls here and there that frustrate me.

To all those "it's a passing league" guys, take a look at who the final 4 are right now in the NFC.

Yeah, this is why I always call them HaRoMan but if I had to guess, it starts with Harbaugh and this is his Schemblacher/Stanford system (Roman's added wrinkles...Q formatons, some WCO designs, etc.) but this is his system and what he knows and subscribes mostly too; heavy run-focused with intermediate team-passing concepts and a mobile/running QB. And I agree...the only caveat here is if Baalke steps in here and makes Harbaugh go another direction. Then, would Harbaugh want to stay LT with "less control?" So odds are, it is what it is whether it's Roman as the symbolism of it all or not....it will STILL most likely end up being the same playbook, same system, same game plans next year with the same 6 or 7 men contributing to the compartmentalized game plans and in-game play calling.

...and I just don't see Baalke doing that.

For all the complaints about the passing O and odd calls in the redzone and short yardage, this is the 11th best scoring offense in the NFL that was missing some pretty significant pieces for large portions of the season. They still had the 3rd largest point differencial in the NFL (and yes, defense is a part of that stat as well).

For all of our Roman complaining, his offense was pretty damned effective this year and has improved steadily since Crabtree returned.

Bottom line, the formula works. Thats why the Niners were in the NFC Championship in 2011, the SB last year, and are in the Divisional Round this year. The defense is a big part of that but good defense isn't everything. That same defense had major issues late last year and it was the offense that saved the day vs GB and ATL.

Roman is this sites biggest whipping boy. While I admit there are times that he frustrates me, he is probably the best OC this team has had since Shanahan.

Originally posted by Marvin49:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by Marvin49:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by Marvin49:
...which he won't do. He's been running HIS offense forever...he's not going to change.

Harbaugh likes good coaches. He attracts them as well. There is a reason Mangini is here.

If there is someone out there he really likes, he may look outside the team...but that guy will have to be a West Coast guy and it would have to be an extraordinary circumstance. The system will not change again. I just don't see it happening. Its alot to ask for a name guy to come in and change everything he has done to be a part of this team. I guess it COULD happen, I just don't think it will.

I agree...the longer we wait to see what happens with Roman the more likely we end up staying in house with the same system/offensive philosophy.

I think the system/offensive philosophy will stay the same regardless. That's Harbaugh. Roman is the OC, but the offense isn't all Roman. Harbaugh was hired to bring in HIS system. There may be a different guy calling the plays, but it will be a guy who runs the offense the way Harbaugh wants it run.

If peeps want the run first, TE loving offense to go away, then they better hope someone lures HARBAUGH away, not Roman. I for one love this offense even if there are calls here and there that frustrate me.

To all those "it's a passing league" guys, take a look at who the final 4 are right now in the NFC.

Yeah, this is why I always call them HaRoMan but if I had to guess, it starts with Harbaugh and this is his Schemblacher/Stanford system (Roman's added wrinkles...Q formatons, some WCO designs, etc.) but this is his system and what he knows and subscribes mostly too; heavy run-focused with intermediate team-passing concepts and a mobile/running QB. And I agree...the only caveat here is if Baalke steps in here and makes Harbaugh go another direction. Then, would Harbaugh want to stay LT with "less control?" So odds are, it is what it is whether it's Roman as the symbolism of it all or not....it will STILL most likely end up being the same playbook, same system, same game plans next year with the same 6 or 7 men contributing to the compartmentalized game plans and in-game play calling.

...and I just don't see Baalke doing that.

For all the complaints about the passing O and odd calls in the redzone and short yardage, this is the 11th best scoring offense in the NFL that was missing some pretty significant pieces for large portions of the season. They still had the 3rd largest point differencial in the NFL (and yes, defense is a part of that stat as well).

For all of our Roman complaining, his offense was pretty damned effective this year and has improved steadily since Crabtree returned.

Bottom line, the formula works. Thats why the Niners were in the NFC Championship in 2011, the SB last year, and are in the Divisional Round this year. The defense is a big part of that but good defense isn't everything. That same defense had major issues late last year and it was the offense that saved the day vs GB and ATL.

Roman is this sites biggest whipping boy. While I admit there are times that he frustrates me, he is probably the best OC this team has had since Shanahan.

That isn't the question here anymore though.

The question is, "Can this system/philosophy/game planning/play calling WIN the Superbowl?"

Originally posted by Marvin49:
I think the system/offensive philosophy will stay the same regardless. That's Harbaugh. Roman is the OC, but the offense isn't all Roman. Harbaugh was hired to bring in HIS system. There may be a different guy calling the plays, but it will be a guy who runs the offense the way Harbaugh wants it run.

If peeps want the run first, TE loving offense to go away, then they better hope someone lures HARBAUGH away, not Roman. I for one love this offense even if there are calls here and there that frustrate me.

To all those "it's a passing league" guys, take a look at who the final 4 are right now in the NFC.

Great point! Even the Saints have become much more of a running offense this year. And all three other teams had more running plays than passing plays this season.

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by Marvin49:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by Marvin49:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by Marvin49:
...which he won't do. He's been running HIS offense forever...he's not going to change.

Harbaugh likes good coaches. He attracts them as well. There is a reason Mangini is here.

If there is someone out there he really likes, he may look outside the team...but that guy will have to be a West Coast guy and it would have to be an extraordinary circumstance. The system will not change again. I just don't see it happening. Its alot to ask for a name guy to come in and change everything he has done to be a part of this team. I guess it COULD happen, I just don't think it will.

I agree...the longer we wait to see what happens with Roman the more likely we end up staying in house with the same system/offensive philosophy.

I think the system/offensive philosophy will stay the same regardless. That's Harbaugh. Roman is the OC, but the offense isn't all Roman. Harbaugh was hired to bring in HIS system. There may be a different guy calling the plays, but it will be a guy who runs the offense the way Harbaugh wants it run.

If peeps want the run first, TE loving offense to go away, then they better hope someone lures HARBAUGH away, not Roman. I for one love this offense even if there are calls here and there that frustrate me.

To all those "it's a passing league" guys, take a look at who the final 4 are right now in the NFC.

Yeah, this is why I always call them HaRoMan but if I had to guess, it starts with Harbaugh and this is his Schemblacher/Stanford system (Roman's added wrinkles...Q formatons, some WCO designs, etc.) but this is his system and what he knows and subscribes mostly too; heavy run-focused with intermediate team-passing concepts and a mobile/running QB. And I agree...the only caveat here is if Baalke steps in here and makes Harbaugh go another direction. Then, would Harbaugh want to stay LT with "less control?" So odds are, it is what it is whether it's Roman as the symbolism of it all or not....it will STILL most likely end up being the same playbook, same system, same game plans next year with the same 6 or 7 men contributing to the compartmentalized game plans and in-game play calling.

...and I just don't see Baalke doing that.

For all the complaints about the passing O and odd calls in the redzone and short yardage, this is the 11th best scoring offense in the NFL that was missing some pretty significant pieces for large portions of the season. They still had the 3rd largest point differencial in the NFL (and yes, defense is a part of that stat as well).

For all of our Roman complaining, his offense was pretty damned effective this year and has improved steadily since Crabtree returned.

Bottom line, the formula works. Thats why the Niners were in the NFC Championship in 2011, the SB last year, and are in the Divisional Round this year. The defense is a big part of that but good defense isn't everything. That same defense had major issues late last year and it was the offense that saved the day vs GB and ATL.

Roman is this sites biggest whipping boy. While I admit there are times that he frustrates me, he is probably the best OC this team has had since Shanahan.

That isn't the question here anymore though.

The question is, "Can this system/philosophy/game planning/play calling WIN the Superbowl?"

Yes. IMO anyway.

Originally posted by Marvin49:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by Marvin49:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by Marvin49:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by Marvin49:
...which he won't do. He's been running HIS offense forever...he's not going to change.

Harbaugh likes good coaches. He attracts them as well. There is a reason Mangini is here.

If there is someone out there he really likes, he may look outside the team...but that guy will have to be a West Coast guy and it would have to be an extraordinary circumstance. The system will not change again. I just don't see it happening. Its alot to ask for a name guy to come in and change everything he has done to be a part of this team. I guess it COULD happen, I just don't think it will.

I agree...the longer we wait to see what happens with Roman the more likely we end up staying in house with the same system/offensive philosophy.

I think the system/offensive philosophy will stay the same regardless. That's Harbaugh. Roman is the OC, but the offense isn't all Roman. Harbaugh was hired to bring in HIS system. There may be a different guy calling the plays, but it will be a guy who runs the offense the way Harbaugh wants it run.

If peeps want the run first, TE loving offense to go away, then they better hope someone lures HARBAUGH away, not Roman. I for one love this offense even if there are calls here and there that frustrate me.

To all those "it's a passing league" guys, take a look at who the final 4 are right now in the NFC.

Yeah, this is why I always call them HaRoMan but if I had to guess, it starts with Harbaugh and this is his Schemblacher/Stanford system (Roman's added wrinkles...Q formatons, some WCO designs, etc.) but this is his system and what he knows and subscribes mostly too; heavy run-focused with intermediate team-passing concepts and a mobile/running QB. And I agree...the only caveat here is if Baalke steps in here and makes Harbaugh go another direction. Then, would Harbaugh want to stay LT with "less control?" So odds are, it is what it is whether it's Roman as the symbolism of it all or not....it will STILL most likely end up being the same playbook, same system, same game plans next year with the same 6 or 7 men contributing to the compartmentalized game plans and in-game play calling.

...and I just don't see Baalke doing that.

For all the complaints about the passing O and odd calls in the redzone and short yardage, this is the 11th best scoring offense in the NFL that was missing some pretty significant pieces for large portions of the season. They still had the 3rd largest point differencial in the NFL (and yes, defense is a part of that stat as well).

For all of our Roman complaining, his offense was pretty damned effective this year and has improved steadily since Crabtree returned.

Bottom line, the formula works. Thats why the Niners were in the NFC Championship in 2011, the SB last year, and are in the Divisional Round this year. The defense is a big part of that but good defense isn't everything. That same defense had major issues late last year and it was the offense that saved the day vs GB and ATL.

Roman is this sites biggest whipping boy. While I admit there are times that he frustrates me, he is probably the best OC this team has had since Shanahan.

That isn't the question here anymore though.

The question is, "Can this system/philosophy/game planning/play calling WIN the Superbowl?"

Yes. IMO anyway.

Fully respect that opinion!

Originally posted by NCommand:
That isn't the question here anymore though.

The question is, "Can this system/philosophy/game planning/play calling WIN the Superbowl?"

Considering the offense put up 31 points in the Superbowl... Yes this "system/philosophy/game planning/play calling" can WIN the Superbowl.

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by Marvin49:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by Marvin49:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by Marvin49:
...which he won't do. He's been running HIS offense forever...he's not going to change.

Harbaugh likes good coaches. He attracts them as well. There is a reason Mangini is here.

If there is someone out there he really likes, he may look outside the team...but that guy will have to be a West Coast guy and it would have to be an extraordinary circumstance. The system will not change again. I just don't see it happening. Its alot to ask for a name guy to come in and change everything he has done to be a part of this team. I guess it COULD happen, I just don't think it will.

I agree...the longer we wait to see what happens with Roman the more likely we end up staying in house with the same system/offensive philosophy.

I think the system/offensive philosophy will stay the same regardless. That's Harbaugh. Roman is the OC, but the offense isn't all Roman. Harbaugh was hired to bring in HIS system. There may be a different guy calling the plays, but it will be a guy who runs the offense the way Harbaugh wants it run.

If peeps want the run first, TE loving offense to go away, then they better hope someone lures HARBAUGH away, not Roman. I for one love this offense even if there are calls here and there that frustrate me.

To all those "it's a passing league" guys, take a look at who the final 4 are right now in the NFC.

Yeah, this is why I always call them HaRoMan but if I had to guess, it starts with Harbaugh and this is his Schemblacher/Stanford system (Roman's added wrinkles...Q formatons, some WCO designs, etc.) but this is his system and what he knows and subscribes mostly too; heavy run-focused with intermediate team-passing concepts and a mobile/running QB. And I agree...the only caveat here is if Baalke steps in here and makes Harbaugh go another direction. Then, would Harbaugh want to stay LT with "less control?" So odds are, it is what it is whether it's Roman as the symbolism of it all or not....it will STILL most likely end up being the same playbook, same system, same game plans next year with the same 6 or 7 men contributing to the compartmentalized game plans and in-game play calling.

...and I just don't see Baalke doing that.

For all the complaints about the passing O and odd calls in the redzone and short yardage, this is the 11th best scoring offense in the NFL that was missing some pretty significant pieces for large portions of the season. They still had the 3rd largest point differencial in the NFL (and yes, defense is a part of that stat as well).

For all of our Roman complaining, his offense was pretty damned effective this year and has improved steadily since Crabtree returned.

Bottom line, the formula works. Thats why the Niners were in the NFC Championship in 2011, the SB last year, and are in the Divisional Round this year. The defense is a big part of that but good defense isn't everything. That same defense had major issues late last year and it was the offense that saved the day vs GB and ATL.

Roman is this sites biggest whipping boy. While I admit there are times that he frustrates me, he is probably the best OC this team has had since Shanahan.

That isn't the question here anymore though.

The question is, "Can this system/philosophy/game planning/play calling WIN the Superbowl?"

Regardless of the site's collective view of Roman as the OC, the answer to that question has to be "Yes".

First, to win the SB, you first need to get there and the offense is not the reason why the 49ers have not won the SB the last 2 years. In 2011, the offense was more conservative but that was largely due to personnel -- maximizing Alex Smith strengths, limited options at WR (Crabtree was dinged most of the year, Morgan got hurt, Edwards didn't work out), the defense and special teams became great as the year went along -- and specific game circumstances (e.g. Williams' two fumbles in the NFC Championship Game).

In 2012, the offense became much more explosive after Kaep took over, but due to injuries to the DL that killed the pass rush, fatigue and whatever else, the defense took a step back towards the end of the season, as did the special teams. But for the offense, the 49ers probably don't make it to the SB last year. We can debate the last 4 play calls at the end of the SB but the defense and special teams (i.e. Jacoby Jones' kick-off return) did give up 34 points and given the way that game was going, there was no guarantee that even if the 49ers had scored that Flacco couldn't have gotten the Ravens in position for a game winning or game tying FG.

Even this year, for all of the complaints and hand wringing about Kaep's play, Roman's play calling, Crabtree's injury, the first significant injuries to the OL in 3 years, etc., the 49ers still scored more points than they did in 2012. Granted, some of that is due to the defense's overall revival and more consistent special teams play, but still, it is not like the 49ers scored 100 less points than 2012 or won less games. They scored more points and won 1 more game.

Lets also not forget that the 4 teams the 49ers struggled against and lost to this year are all made the playoffs and are still playing among the final 8 and 3 of those teams are among the top 5 overall in defense by both yards allowed and points allowed, which the 49ers played before Crabtree returned and we all know how much better the offense has looked since Crabtree came back. So, 3 of the 4 worst offensive performances of the year came against 3 of the best defensive teams in the league. What a shock.

Could the offense be better. Sure, but it is a huge leap from that to questioning whether it is holding the 49ers back from winning the SB. The reasons the offense has struggled this year are varied. I am sure there are play calls Roman would like to have back or game plans he would do differently but there are plenty of other contributing factors (e.g. Crabtree's injury, the league adjusting to Kaep, the OL not playing as well overall or being as healthy as in past years, protecting Kaep with no real confidence in the back-up QB options, etc.).

If he doesn't get the Vikings job good chance Roman is coming back.

Originally posted by Jcool:

Originally posted by NCommand:
That isn't the question here anymore though.

The question is, "Can this system/philosophy/game planning/play calling WIN the Superbowl?"

Considering the offense put up 31 points in the Superbowl... Yes this "system/philosophy/game planning/play calling" can WIN the Superbowl.

If I recall, it's the most points ever scored by a team who LOST the SB.

Lets be real...if going into the game we'd been told we'd get 31 points, 99% of us would have expected to win the game. I've never thought the offense was why they lost. It was lapses on D that they'd been able to overcome in their two playoff games and the Kick Return that did them in.