What is Kaeps worth....?

Originally posted by BrianGO:
Would love to hear the alternative.

"If he can't..." Go on. Tell us.

"Fire Harbaugh."?
"Sign Ryan Fitzpatrick for cheap."?

What is the "then"?

Draft a Quarterback in the 2nd Round. Groom him

Originally posted by Pillbusta:

Originally posted by Jakemall:
I understand what you both are saying...but...it is an option. While the tag is pricey...when you average it in with the fact that he'll make what, 900 k this season? Suddenly it looks pretty cheap. The threat of it will certainly be used in negotiating with the agent. "Yeah he's worth 16-18 million per year but this year he'll get 1..so let's average that in to a 6 year contract and we're looking at 14 million a year and call it a 6 year 85-90 million dollar contract."

If his agent doesn't budge, letting him play out his contract gives the 9ers a chance to keep the roster around him..maybe even improve it for another season..that is big.

This is an excellent point! You have a genius outlook on this. Use the rookie wage as leverage to negotiate a very reasonable rate for us! I can live with $14 mil annually as a fan but then I aibt Kap or Jed either

yes!! An excellent idea Jake. That sounds fair to me PIT, plus I also think Dalton's extension's gonna be more of a low ball reasonable contract due to his poor PLYOFF performance in a weak AFC. Now, do you think Kap would do smthg like this? How much do u think should be guaranteed?

"Kaepernick just isnt good enough! By the time he figures out passing from the pocket, he'll be old. Not the answer."

Originally posted by Niners99:


"Kaepernick just isnt good enough! By the time he figures out passing from the pocket, he'll be old. Not the answer."

Says go who wants to reward him with a $100 million contract

Originally posted by Pillbusta:

Originally posted by TheGoldDiggerrrr:
Can't even compare the two sports let alone the two positions.

A QB has the ball in his hands most every offensive play just as a pitcher does every defensive play. A QB as a passer is essentially a pitcher on offense. A QB and a pitcher more times than not has the greatest impact on your win probability than any other player. Yes the sports are drastically different but I would argue that the job of QB requires a lot more work as far as prep study and the physical toll it takes on your body. You don't rotate games amongst a bullpen and you don't get relief unless you stink or if are knocked out of the game. If a pitcher is judged by wins and losses by one measure then why can't a QB when he must do just about as much every snap and every game?

excellent post!!

Originally posted by Niners99:

Originally posted by Gavintech:

Originally posted by Niners99:
What do you get out of putting your own team down so much? Why cant you just be excited that we have a future at QB? If you have a good QB, you ALWAYS have a chance.

How in the world does someone saying the 49ers are a very good team = "putting down your own team" to you?

Touchdownboy1980 was saying, with no possible room for confusion, that the 49ers were a good team. He was pointing out how good the team is and you accuse him of putting them down?

YOU ARE THE ONE PUTTING THE TEAM DOWN and it seems like you are doing it in your never ending quest to make everything about how amazing Kaepernick is.

Im putting the team down? How so?

Hes putting our QB down by saying hes safely replaceable.

The funny thing about all the people who dont think Kap is good enough, is if he puts one single pass a foot higher, were probably SB Champs right now, and everyone would be falling over eachother calling him a legend in the making.

The anti-Kap people are probably the ones who said the same crap about Steve Young. Or the offspring of those fans. "Cant beat the Cowboys, hes no Montana. Cant win the big game. Comes up short. Lets move on."

Joe Montana is NEVER coming around again. People need to get over that fact and be happy we have a good, young QB for the first time since Steve Young took over. Only 49er fans would come away with "not good enough, not worth paying" after seeing Kap the last 1.5 seasons.

I just dont understand where people get off saying we should let Kap walk away.

b/c some are brain-dead and waiting for the 2nd coming of Montana!! lol Iron KapGun is an amazing dual threat and durable QB prospect and has an amazing future with our team and I love his potential!! I would take him over any young QB in the league right now (maybe except the OVERRATED LUCK). This fake ass obsession with singularly pocket passing QBs in this evolving NFL era (although this is a needed and desirable skillset), after witnessing one of the so called greatest PP-QBs P.Manning get curbed stomped in the Superbowl by a dual threat QB is laughable!

Originally posted by BrianGO:

Originally posted by dj43:
"Talent," "Potential," "upside," are all terms that mean the same thing: not performing at the level hoped for.

We get all excited when he reels off a great run but depressed when he cannot get through his reads and find the open receiver, which is his main job. Good news. Bad news.

This upcoming season will be a big "salary test" season for BOTH Colin Kaepernick and Jim Harbaugh. If Harbaugh is to get the raise most people believe he wants (to be paid like other NFC West HCs), the 49ers will need to get past Seattle, and to do that, Kaepernick will have to be a better passer than he has been in the past. That means Harbaugh's future here depends on whether or not he can actually get Kaepernick to play like a big-time NFL QB, not just a running QB. If Harbaugh can do that, both will get a nice bump. If he can't...

Would love to hear the alternative.

"If he can't..." Go on. Tell us.

"Fire Harbaugh."?
"Sign Ryan Fitzpatrick for cheap."?

What is the "then"?

lol i know huh Everyone thinks the grass is greener on the other side but many teams keep drafting "franchise QB's" and it seems like every year they implode. Jacksonville, Cleveland, Oakland, Vikings, hell even the Rams etc. Smh..people dont know how hard it is to draft a franchise QB and we finally have a good prospect to build around and we compare him to Montana in after 1.5yrs...umm


A QB, like Kap who i'snt simply one dimensional, lacking mobility, and ARM strength, but one improving as both a PP and devastating X-factor as a runner. Kap will get better next year BUT lets not pretend Kap was some horrible pocket passer when Ive seen him even early in 2012 make some of the most beautiful throws in the pocket as any QB! Hell, in the Wildcard game against GB in 2012, the 2012 NFCCCG in ATL, the SB comeback in 2012, and his PassRtg went way up when CRABS returned in our 9 game winning streak of 2013.



Also, many of u forget Kap is not just a typical "running QB", hes shown an ability to be very accurate at times ( needs better touch) and has a cannon to fit it downfield and sometimes into tight windows, but most importantly, HES PROBABLY THE FASTEST, most athletic QB in the league...making his running gifts a DYNAMIC weapon that 99% of teams cant duplicate. AND HE WILL only GET BETTER at being a PP and selective runner with having such thick skin and extreme confidence in himself!

Originally posted by InglewoodCA9ers:
excellent post!!

b/c some are brain-dead and waiting for the 2nd coming of Montana!! lol Iron KapGun is an amazing dual threat and durable QB prospect and has an amazing future with our team and I love his potential!! I would take him over any young QB in the league right now (maybe except the OVERRATED LUCK). This fake ass obsession with singularly pocket passing QBs in this evolving NFL era (although this is a needed and desirable skillset), after witnessing one of the so called greatest PP-QBs P.Manning get curbed stomped in the Superbowl by a dual threat QB is laughable!

- I would actually prefer Steve Young over Montana in todays NFL
- Amazing is too broad of a term. Michael Vick is the most amazing QB I ever saw
- Most of the NFL would take Cam Newton over Kaepernick. Do you agree?
- How many tackles, interceptions or sacks did Russell Wilson have in the Super Bowl?
- Carson Palmer (Pocket Passer) defeated Seahawks @ Seattle. Kellen Clemons (Pocker Passer) had Rams on the goal line for the Win vs Seahawks.


I prefer to judge how the Elite QBs are
Peyton: Pocket
Brady: Pocket
Brees: Pocket
Rodgers: Pocket
Rivers: Pocket

Originally posted by Touchdownboy1980:

Originally posted by BrianGO:
Would love to hear the alternative.

"If he can't..." Go on. Tell us.

"Fire Harbaugh."?
"Sign Ryan Fitzpatrick for cheap."?

What is the "then"?

Draft a Quarterback in the 2nd Round. Groom him

Throw away a top ten franchise quarterback, and put the franchise on the shoulders of a random second round pick.

I see. Gotcha.

Originally posted by BrianGO:
Throw away a top ten franchise quarterback, and put the franchise on the shoulders of a random second round pick.

I see. Gotcha.

I have confidence in the coaching staff finding another Colin Kaepernick or Alex Smith. Plus imagine the quality of draft picks we could receive in return for a trade.

Giving Kaepernick right now the keys to the franchise for the next 7+ years is premature.

Originally posted by Touchdownboy1980:

Originally posted by BrianGO:

Throw away a top ten franchise quarterback, and put the franchise on the shoulders of a random second round pick.

I see. Gotcha.

I have confidence in the coaching staff finding another Colin Kaepernick or Alex Smith. Plus imagine the quality of draft picks we could receive in return for a trade.

Giving Kaepernick right now the keys to the franchise for the next 7+ years is premature.

Hate to break it to you, but someone has to drive. Id rather give the keys to Kap than some roll of the dice prospect. By the time a new player is ready to lead us to a title, many of our current stars will be in their twilight years.

Trying to draft a QB who will be BETTER than Kap is an enormous gamble. They dont grow on trees. You think if it were that easy, the Cowboys, Ravens, and Bears wouldve given their QB's mega deals?

There is SO much lingering bitterness by Niner fans who cant cope with having their heart broken any other way than directing all the blame to Kap.

Hes going to be just fine. He looked like garbage in SEA his first 2 tries, but he showed major improvements. There is still plenty of room for him to grow. Tossing him out before be reaches his full potential would be the biggest mistake in franchise history. Which is why it wont happen.

Find a Chargers fan and ask him "why didnt you keep Drew Brees?"

Originally posted by Niners99:
Hate to break it to you, but someone has to drive. Id rather give the keys to Kap than some roll of the dice prospect. By the time a new player is ready to lead us to a title, many of our current stars will be in their twilight years.

Trying to draft a QB who will be BETTER than Kap is an enormous gamble. They dont grow on trees. You think if it were that easy, the Cowboys, Ravens, and Bears wouldve given their QB's mega deals?

There is SO much lingering bitterness by Niner fans who cant cope with having their heart broken any other way than directing all the blame to Kap.

Hes going to be just fine. He looked like garbage in SEA his first 2 tries, but he showed major improvements. There is still plenty of room for him to grow. Tossing him out before be reaches his full potential would be the biggest mistake in franchise history. Which is why it wont happen.

Find a Chargers fan and ask him "why didnt you keep Drew Brees?"

Kaepernick is practically playing for free. No one is getting rid of him this year and probably not next year either. But in 2 seasons, if we still haven't broke thru with a title it might be time to hit the reset button and let the coaching staff try one more time.

Rivers was a fine consolation prize. Ultimately it was the front office and lack of defense that held back the Chargers not losing Brees. Remember that year New Orleans won a title, it was BountyGate and their defense put Warner and Favre into retirement

Originally posted by InglewoodCA9ers:

Originally posted by Pillbusta:

Originally posted by Jakemall:
I understand what you both are saying...but...it is an option. While the tag is pricey...when you average it in with the fact that he'll make what, 900 k this season? Suddenly it looks pretty cheap. The threat of it will certainly be used in negotiating with the agent. "Yeah he's worth 16-18 million per year but this year he'll get 1..so let's average that in to a 6 year contract and we're looking at 14 million a year and call it a 6 year 85-90 million dollar contract."

If his agent doesn't budge, letting him play out his contract gives the 9ers a chance to keep the roster around him..maybe even improve it for another season..that is big.

This is an excellent point! You have a genius outlook on this. Use the rookie wage as leverage to negotiate a very reasonable rate for us! I can live with $14 mil annually as a fan but then I aibt Kap or Jed either

yes!! An excellent idea Jake. That sounds fair to me PIT, plus I also think Dalton's extension's gonna be more of a low ball reasonable contract due to his poor PLYOFF performance in a weak AFC. Now, do you think Kap would do smthg like this? How much do u think should be guaranteed?

This doesn't sound realistic unless it's a short term deal. Six years would be a long time to give up the going rate. Of course, Kaepernick may not have confidence to roll the dice next year but that would surprise me. He seems pretty confident and aware of himself. One thing that could make his agent reasonable would be a number of top QBs coming into FAcy at the end of next year. Not sure how many there will be but if the market is glutted his price may go down...other than that the team has to hope he wants to keep his team strong and knows that's good for him in the long run--giving a discount toward that end.

Here are the FA QBs for 2015...not a particularly strong group.


http://overthecap.com/freeagents.php?Position=QB&Year=2015

Newton and Kaepernick on the market at the same time would be intriguing!

Originally posted by Touchdownboy1980:

Originally posted by Niners99:

Hate to break it to you, but someone has to drive. Id rather give the keys to Kap than some roll of the dice prospect. By the time a new player is ready to lead us to a title, many of our current stars will be in their twilight years.

Trying to draft a QB who will be BETTER than Kap is an enormous gamble. They dont grow on trees. You think if it were that easy, the Cowboys, Ravens, and Bears wouldve given their QB's mega deals?

There is SO much lingering bitterness by Niner fans who cant cope with having their heart broken any other way than directing all the blame to Kap.

Hes going to be just fine. He looked like garbage in SEA his first 2 tries, but he showed major improvements. There is still plenty of room for him to grow. Tossing him out before be reaches his full potential would be the biggest mistake in franchise history. Which is why it wont happen.

Find a Chargers fan and ask him "why didnt you keep Drew Brees?"

Kaepernick is practically playing for free. No one is getting rid of him this year and probably not next year either. But in 2 seasons, if we still haven't broke thru with a title it might be time to hit the reset button and let the coaching staff try one more time.

Rivers was a fine consolation prize. Ultimately it was the front office and lack of defense that held back the Chargers not losing Brees. Remember that year New Orleans won a title, it was BountyGate and their defense put Warner and Favre into retirement

All waiting is going to do is make us look cheap and break trust with Kap.

Rivers was a fine consolation prize if you dont mind never winning a Super Bowl. Hes never been good enough, regardless of the rest of his team. The year NO got in trouble for BountyGate was 2011, not 2009.

It is incredibly unrealistic to make Kap win a title if he wants fair market value. Especially when crappy QB's are getting that kind of money. You pay him 100 mil because hes going to keep you contending for a title for years, not because he already won one.

Originally posted by Niners99:

Originally posted by Touchdownboy1980:

Originally posted by Niners99:
Hate to break it to you, but someone has to drive. Id rather give the keys to Kap than some roll of the dice prospect. By the time a new player is ready to lead us to a title, many of our current stars will be in their twilight years.

Trying to draft a QB who will be BETTER than Kap is an enormous gamble. They dont grow on trees. You think if it were that easy, the Cowboys, Ravens, and Bears wouldve given their QB's mega deals?

There is SO much lingering bitterness by Niner fans who cant cope with having their heart broken any other way than directing all the blame to Kap.

Hes going to be just fine. He looked like garbage in SEA his first 2 tries, but he showed major improvements. There is still plenty of room for him to grow. Tossing him out before be reaches his full potential would be the biggest mistake in franchise history. Which is why it wont happen.

Find a Chargers fan and ask him "why didnt you keep Drew Brees?"

Kaepernick is practically playing for free. No one is getting rid of him this year and probably not next year either. But in 2 seasons, if we still haven't broke thru with a title it might be time to hit the reset button and let the coaching staff try one more time.

Rivers was a fine consolation prize. Ultimately it was the front office and lack of defense that held back the Chargers not losing Brees. Remember that year New Orleans won a title, it was BountyGate and their defense put Warner and Favre into retirement

All waiting is going to do is make us look cheap and break trust with Kap.

Rivers was a fine consolation prize if you dont mind never winning a Super Bowl. Hes never been good enough, regardless of the rest of his team. The year NO got in trouble for BountyGate was 2011, not 2009.

It is incredibly unrealistic to make Kap win a title if he wants fair market value. Especially when crappy QB's are getting that kind of money. You pay him 100 mil because hes going to keep you contending for a title for years, not because he already won one.

Plus Rivers being a nice consolation prize doesnt make sense when you remember Brees won a title. The only thing Rivers won is a whole lot of derp meme pictures.

You take care of players early so they stay. It makes other players want to come play for the team. Waiting too long makes you look cheap, and nobody wants to play for a cheap team.