2013 - Week 10: Thoughts after rewatching the game

Originally posted by sdcindy:

Originally posted by Axl49:

Originally posted by Marvin49:

Originally posted by sdcindy:
My problem with Kap is that he seems to be regressing (and showing the career stats don't show that). In fact, he barely looks like the same guy as last year. He just appears to be indecisive. And we can't just blame the WR's. Wilson and Luck seem to be able to throw to no-name receivers when their top receivers are out with injuries (along with Brady, Brees, etc). The difference is that they throw their receivers open, something Kap doesn't seem to do. They also seem to be more comfortable going to their 2nd, 3rd, even 4th choice than Kap does. In fact I am now questioning whether Kap is the right quarterback to lead the 49ers. Sigh.

Relax.

Kap is was RAW as hell coming out of college. He was considered a project. He wasn't supposed to be ready to play yet.

Kaps number have dived for several reasons and his targets are a HUGE reason why. Not the only one, but a very big one. Kap will be fine. Every single game he plays he's learning. Every mistake teaches a lesson. Most QBs don't hit the scene the way Kap did last year. He is capable of being that guy. Its in there. He just needs to figure out what to do when he's not getting a lot of help. Go look at Tom Brady's number this year.

People like to dismiss it, but don't think the receivers aren't a he part of the problem.

You can't "throw open" every receiver. You especially can't expect that from a guy this early in his career. All the great QBs in the NFL had really bad games early on.

I dont think people are worried about "bad" games its that our offense passing the ball is an absolute JOKE. Kap needs to take some blame for that he is the QB plain and simple.

Right. When has Kap said, this loss is on me guys? Being a leader means you have to accept responsibility, even when it is not all your fault.

WTF!?!

When the hell has he blamed anyone else?

He has ALWAYS either said "I need to play better", or "We need to play better".

Are we just making sh*t up now?

Originally posted by Imfasterthanur:

Originally posted by Phoenix49ers:

Originally posted by Imfasterthanur:
Haha. While I wasn't a fan of Greg Roman yesterday, ironically, this was actually a good play-call.

Since the fullback typically dictates the direction of a run, most linebackers shed the FB, rendering him open if the play-action is deceptive enough.

Yeah, that was a few weeks ago, Carolina jumped all over the attempted screen pass to Miller. It just continues a pattern of this team beating a dead horse.

Oh, you're referring to the screen pass -- in that case, I agree. But I was referring to our first-series on the opening drive, where we faked it to Gore and Bruce Miller peeled off his lead-block for a big gain.

That's pretty much the ONLY time we need to see Miller as the primary target haha

but then we tried it when we were backed up against the goal line...and the Panthers were all over it.

Originally posted by Marvin49:

Originally posted by sdcindy:
My problem with Kap is that he seems to be regressing (and showing the career stats don't show that). In fact, he barely looks like the same guy as last year. He just appears to be indecisive. And we can't just blame the WR's. Wilson and Luck seem to be able to throw to no-name receivers when their top receivers are out with injuries (along with Brady, Brees, etc). The difference is that they throw their receivers open, something Kap doesn't seem to do. They also seem to be more comfortable going to their 2nd, 3rd, even 4th choice than Kap does. In fact I am now questioning whether Kap is the right quarterback to lead the 49ers. Sigh.

Relax.

Kap is was RAW as hell coming out of college. He was considered a project. He wasn't supposed to be ready to play yet.

Kaps number have dived for several reasons and his targets are a HUGE reason why. Not the only one, but a very big one. Kap will be fine. Every single game he plays he's learning. Every mistake teaches a lesson. Most QBs don't hit the scene the way Kap did last year. He is capable of being that guy. Its in there. He just needs to figure out what to do when he's not getting a lot of help. Go look at Tom Brady's number this year.

People like to dismiss it, but don't think the receivers aren't a he part of the problem.

You can't "throw open" every receiver. You especially can't expect that from a guy this early in his career. All the great QBs in the NFL had really bad games early on.

Whats up Marv, I have to say I agree with you to a certain degree, especially the bolded. after you said Relax. Now with that one sentence right there. So Raw, considered a project and not ready to play yet. This all goes against the QB decision last season. I know for a fact that Harbs didnt make the switch for a better QB, just to see him go thru growing pains, and have our record affected by it. If that is the case, then that means we considered this a try out year. I cant see us after we were led to 6-2, and then he took the reigns, helped us get to the playoffs, and nearly helped us fight back to win the SB, and now he needs time to get everything together.

He will have his growing pains, but J. Smith, F. Gore, and a few other vets are getting old. As Justin Smith said last year, that window of being a contender or making a name for yourself is closing as the years and seasons go by. I mean who would of thought that Seattle would be leading the division.

Overall, I'm with most that come on, dont throw the towel away on Kaep just yet, i mean he still hasnt even had a full season. But I also dont think, the switch at QB was made to go through a finding your way in the NFL type of mentality. Harbs and Co believed that Kaep would continue the progress he had after the GB game, not what we have now. But it was telling when Harbs said out of his mouth, "We will dial back the playbook for Kaep", and he said that after our second loss.

So coming out and saying it's not the playcalling it's the execution. Players saying it's the execution, fans seeing at times its the execution, then shortening the playbook. He probably is still doing his learning curve thing. I just hope it all gets fixed soon, because to be that team, that we are capable of being, we need a QB that just knows how to get it done. Don't mean he's gonna kill every game, just know that the QB will also be one of the highlights for the O, and not just the running game.

Originally posted by Eastcoastniner:
the receivers are clearly a huge part of the problem along with kaep, oline, injuries, roman, the list goes on. and even when crabtree comes back we have no where near the best WR core in the NFL....

True.

Good write up. We all know the offense is terrible. I think the QB will/should shoulder a lot of that responsibility. Every team doesn't have a Gore or Vernon or Boldin ...those are star players, all on one team. Add the OLine and defense in general, we should be a top notch team week in and week out.
The QB has to make plays regardless of the situation....even a few good throws/wise decisions in a loss will bring in some confidence. Maybe the 49ers got lucky last year that we went to the SB with a rookie QB, and these are just painful learning lessons.
End of the day, we still have a shot at the playoffs, so that is always good. If we go 5-2 in the remaining games, I hope we at least get to a 6th seed.

I didn't say he blames others. He says comments like (from yesterday): Said quarterback Colin Kaepernick: "They're a good defense. But today was more our lack of execution than what they were doing." With some quarterbacks, I hear things like I didn't execute, I didn't play well, I missed a couple of throws. That's all I am saying.

Originally posted by sdcindy:
My problem with Kap is that he seems to be regressing (and showing the career stats don't show that). In fact, he barely looks like the same guy as last year. He just appears to be indecisive. And we can't just blame the WR's. Wilson and Luck seem to be able to throw to no-name receivers when their top receivers are out with injuries (along with Brady, Brees, etc). The difference is that they throw their receivers open, something Kap doesn't seem to do. They also seem to be more comfortable going to their 2nd, 3rd, even 4th choice than Kap does. In fact I am now questioning whether Kap is the right quarterback to lead the 49ers. Sigh.

I'm having the same issue. For a while I was putting this on WR, Roman and the Oline. While they are all issues, Kap may be the biggest long term issue, one that could change the future hopes of this team more than anything else. It's all on Harbaugh now. If he truly is a QB genius, it's time for him to prove it.

Originally posted by sdcindy:
Right. When has Kap said, this loss is on me guys? Being a leader means you have to accept responsibility, even when it is not all your fault.

Wrong. 53 man roster. Being a leader does not mean that at all. Leaders lead. Being a boss means that you take responsibility. The coaches should say that the loss is on them and often, they do.

Originally posted by Jersey9er:

Originally posted by Marvin49:

Originally posted by sdcindy:
My problem with Kap is that he seems to be regressing (and showing the career stats don't show that). In fact, he barely looks like the same guy as last year. He just appears to be indecisive. And we can't just blame the WR's. Wilson and Luck seem to be able to throw to no-name receivers when their top receivers are out with injuries (along with Brady, Brees, etc). The difference is that they throw their receivers open, something Kap doesn't seem to do. They also seem to be more comfortable going to their 2nd, 3rd, even 4th choice than Kap does. In fact I am now questioning whether Kap is the right quarterback to lead the 49ers. Sigh.

Relax.

Kap is was RAW as hell coming out of college. He was considered a project. He wasn't supposed to be ready to play yet.

Kaps number have dived for several reasons and his targets are a HUGE reason why. Not the only one, but a very big one. Kap will be fine. Every single game he plays he's learning. Every mistake teaches a lesson. Most QBs don't hit the scene the way Kap did last year. He is capable of being that guy. Its in there. He just needs to figure out what to do when he's not getting a lot of help. Go look at Tom Brady's number this year.

People like to dismiss it, but don't think the receivers aren't a he part of the problem.

You can't "throw open" every receiver. You especially can't expect that from a guy this early in his career. All the great QBs in the NFL had really bad games early on.

Whats up Marv, I have to say I agree with you to a certain degree, especially the bolded. after you said Relax. Now with that one sentence right there. So Raw, considered a project and not ready to play yet. This all goes against the QB decision last season. I know for a fact that Harbs didnt make the switch for a better QB, just to see him go thru growing pains, and have our record affected by it. If that is the case, then that means we considered this a try out year. I cant see us after we were led to 6-2, and then he took the reigns, helped us get to the playoffs, and nearly helped us fight back to win the SB, and now he needs time to get everything together.

He will have his growing pains, but J. Smith, F. Gore, and a few other vets are getting old. As Justin Smith said last year, that window of being a contender or making a name for yourself is closing as the years and seasons go by. I mean who would of thought that Seattle would be leading the division.

Overall, I'm with most that come on, dont throw the towel away on Kaep just yet, i mean he still hasnt even had a full season. But I also dont think, the switch at QB was made to go through a finding your way in the NFL type of mentality. Harbs and Co believed that Kaep would continue the progress he had after the GB game, not what we have now. But it was telling when Harbs said out of his mouth, "We will dial back the playbook for Kaep", and he said that after our second loss.

So coming out and saying it's not the playcalling it's the execution. Players saying it's the execution, fans seeing at times its the execution, then shortening the playbook. He probably is still doing his learning curve thing. I just hope it all gets fixed soon, because to be that team, that we are capable of being, we need a QB that just knows how to get it done. Don't mean he's gonna kill every game, just know that the QB will also be one of the highlights for the O, and not just the running game.

oh man...PLEASE...lets not go down this road.

We aren't going back. He's gone. Enough.

Kap gave them the bets chance to win last year. They almost pulled it off. Its over.

The only references I ever want to hear about "he who shall not be named" is the compensation....IE Tank Carradine, and 2nd and 3rd round this upcoming draft (the 3rd because they obtained it trading down the Chiefs pick this year).

Originally posted by Marvin49:
?

We are watching different games man. LOL.

Vernon is great.
Boldin is good when someone else can create space.

...and I'm out.

Where the hell is the rest of this great WR corps!?! Manningham might add something, but he's still working back. Crab may never be 100% this year and hasn't been on the field.

When Vernon is out, teams bracket Boldin. He can't beat double coverage. Nobody else is getting open. Nobody.

I haven't watch the coach's film on the 2nd half..but I defy you to find a passing play in the 1st half of the game where there wasn't an option for Kaep to go to. Just one..go ahead.

Originally posted by Afrikan:

Originally posted by Imfasterthanur:

Originally posted by Phoenix49ers:

Originally posted by Imfasterthanur:
Haha. While I wasn't a fan of Greg Roman yesterday, ironically, this was actually a good play-call.

Since the fullback typically dictates the direction of a run, most linebackers shed the FB, rendering him open if the play-action is deceptive enough.

Yeah, that was a few weeks ago, Carolina jumped all over the attempted screen pass to Miller. It just continues a pattern of this team beating a dead horse.

Oh, you're referring to the screen pass -- in that case, I agree. But I was referring to our first-series on the opening drive, where we faked it to Gore and Bruce Miller peeled off his lead-block for a big gain.

That's pretty much the ONLY time we need to see Miller as the primary target haha

but then we tried it when we were backed up against the goal line...and the Panthers were all over it.

Of course he was covered, with Vernon Davis out with a concussion at that point -- replaced by a rookie -- along with the worse receiving corps in the league, who is left to cover? Kyle Williams? a double-teamed Anquan Boldin? A rusty Mario Manningham?

No good defense will bite on a play-action when they already know we abandoned the run (i.e., Frank Gore with 4 carries in the second-half).

Originally posted by sdcindy:
I didn't say he blames others. He says comments like (from yesterday): Said quarterback Colin Kaepernick: "They're a good defense. But today was more our lack of execution than what they were doing." With some quarterbacks, I hear things like I didn't execute, I didn't play well, I missed a couple of throws. That's all I am saying.

...and that's total BS.

You are just nitpicking now. There is enough here to criticize without making sh*t up. The guy takes this personally and doesn't EVER throw anyone under the bus. Saying "we" instead of "I" is accurate. Its not an attempt to not take responsibility.

Sheesh.

The Panthers did a great job confusing Kap before the snap by making last second adjustments. How many audibles did Kap call at the line of scrimmage? How often did those audibled plays succeed? I remember a lot of audibles and many of them did not work well. As with all our losses, we passed way too much in the 2nd half. It was like we were down 10 points, not one. The playcalling woes in this game can be given to both Kap and Roman.

Execution was also obviously an issue as well. I remember early in the game we had a 3rd and one play where we ran the ball up the gut. I didn't have any issue with the called play but we were stuffed for a 2 yard loss on a dive play up the middle! Unfortunately that kind of set the tone on offense for the day.

Originally posted by Jakemall:

Originally posted by Marvin49:
?

We are watching different games man. LOL.

Vernon is great.
Boldin is good when someone else can create space.

...and I'm out.

Where the hell is the rest of this great WR corps!?! Manningham might add something, but he's still working back. Crab may never be 100% this year and hasn't been on the field.

When Vernon is out, teams bracket Boldin. He can't beat double coverage. Nobody else is getting open. Nobody.

I haven't watch the coach's film on the 2nd half..but I defy you to find a passing play in the 1st half of the game where there wasn't an option for Kaep to go to. Just one..go ahead.

Just because a guy appears open doesn't mean the QB is going to get to that progression. If the guy is a third option but the QB is under pressure, he's not going to get that far.

The QB doesn't see the entire field at once. Watching film doesn't help you if you don't know the design of the play.

Thers is no way tho that you are going to convince me that we are fielding one of the best WR corps in the NFL. That's lunacy.

Originally posted by Marvin49:

Originally posted by sdcindy:
I didn't say he blames others. He says comments like (from yesterday): Said quarterback Colin Kaepernick: "They're a good defense. But today was more our lack of execution than what they were doing." With some quarterbacks, I hear things like I didn't execute, I didn't play well, I missed a couple of throws. That's all I am saying.

...and that's total BS.

You are just nitpicking now. There is enough here to criticize without making sh*t up. The guy takes this personally and doesn't EVER throw anyone under the bus. Saying "we" instead of "I" is accurate. Its not an attempt to not take responsibility.

Sheesh.

Just my opinion (probably because of my background in management). Understand that you and others have a different opinion. That's cool. I just want Kap to get better.