2012 49ers WR Corps

Originally posted by susweel:
Moss has been even more disappointing than I had envisioned.

Gametime partially due to lack of time one the field I agree, but he is proving to be a great mentor to alot of our younger receivers. IMO still worth the small amount of money he got for this season.

Moss has to be frustrated. If he isn't, I am surprised.

Originally posted by Baldie:
Moss has to be frustrated. If he isn't, I am surprised.

He must have known his position, and agreed to it before the season started, because I agree, with as little gametime as he has seen he would usually be throwing his manfits by now.

As the season goes, he'll probably see his touches. At some point the niners will need to air it out.

Originally posted by Baldie:
As the season goes, he'll probably see his touches. At some point the niners will need to air it out.

So true. Even though this team won't be like the Saints, they should be able to air it out more. The offensive line, and receivers have improved. Alex Smith doesn't have the deep ball accuracy, but he should be able to hit the immediate passes.

Originally posted by Bootlegger:

Originally posted by oldman9er:

Originally posted by Oakland-Niner:

Originally posted by English:
Too many drops.

And how come Davis can pull them in but not the receivers?

Why can Alex hit Davis in the hands on deep routes, but not his Wrs....

Its one of the world's great mysteries.

the WRs have to actually stick their hands out for the ball.. It's not gonna always magically appear in their hands at their sides.

Yeah, if only our WRs were 7ft tall with lanky arms we'd have 0 drops this season.

That's not the problem, our WR's aren't 7 ft tall and they're not "Mr. Fantastic", that would be a fantasy. The problem is that once Crabtree beats the DB by two steps, he needs to catch up to the overthrown ball. In other words, it's not good enough to be faster than the DB, he has to also be faster than himself once he see's that the ball is overthrown. If he was faster than himself, he could have caught up to that ball.
The same thing can be said for Manningham.
Seriously, what good is speed, if you can't even outrun yourself?

Originally posted by dave1003:

Originally posted by SofaKing:

C'mon man. Crabtree is a legit starting WR. Whether he is a true #1 or not is still debatable, but he had good production this year considering we threw the ball so little. He will benefit greatly by having more talent around him. Moss and Manningham > Williams and Swain.

The guy will never be a 1. Best case scenario he becomes a 2. I would take manningham over him right now. Better route runner, better hands, faster. He was the giants 3 last year and look what he did in the playoffs.

Manningham had a two time Super Bowl champ at qb.

Originally posted by LoneWolf:
Gametime partially due to lack of time one the field I agree, but he is proving to be a great mentor to alot of our younger receivers. IMO still worth the small amount of money he got for this season.

This IMHO We brought him in for this reason more so then his any potential remaining skill. Crabtree has been a good to great WR ever since we drafted him but Moss' presence has pushed him and really motivated him to become a truly great WR. His presence is even helping Kyle Williams learn to be a better WR and they have almost nothing in common in terms of football skills outside of similar speed.

Originally posted by BrianGO:
That's not the problem, our WR's aren't 7 ft tall and they're not "Mr. Fantastic", that would be a fantasy. The problem is that once Crabtree beats the DB by two steps, he needs to catch up to the overthrown ball. In other words, it's not good enough to be faster than the DB, he has to also be faster than himself once he see's that the ball is overthrown. If he was faster than himself, he could have caught up to that ball.
The same thing can be said for Manningham.
Seriously, what good is speed, if you can't even outrun yourself?

Dude be realistic, everyone on the zone has agreed that Alex overthrew Crabtree.

Originally posted by Oakland-Niner:

Originally posted by English:
Too many drops.

And how come Davis can pull them in but not the receivers?

Why can Alex hit Davis in the hands on deep routes, but not his Wrs....

Its one of the world's great mysteries.

Alex hits Davis due to the nature of the plays.

Davis runs seem routes and wheel routes where he rarely gets touched or slows down. He can do this because a DB isn't going to try to jam him, they are too small. The linebacker can't run with him. So he is usually not only clean, but he hardly has to alter (make a move) the routes at all to get open. Its like throwing a ball in practice with no defenders.

The problem receivers have, is that they have to constantly fight off the DB, or make a move on them, in order to break free and clean from them. Their routes get "mucked up" a lot more than a TE or RB's routes typically do. Smith hits the WR's well on seem routes and crossing routes, probably because the WR has an easier time running a clean route. Its a lot more difficult to determine where to throw a ball when the WR is just breaking free from a jam, or is in the process of being jammed.

One thing that bugs me is that we rarely see Smith hit post corner routes to WR's, he either doesn't attempt them, or misses them, or he throws it on a dime to VD. That is what Moss ran when he was overthrown in Minnesota.

We should keep in mind that all of those overthrows were REALLY CLOSE to being hit on a dime. I think as long as Smith's confidence isn't shaken, we should see him begin to hit a couple of these plays in the near future.
Smith's confidence is everything. Harbaugh knows this; which is why he is constantly praising him and hugging him etc.

Originally posted by LoneWolf:

Originally posted by BrianGO:
That's not the problem, our WR's aren't 7 ft tall and they're not "Mr. Fantastic", that would be a fantasy. The problem is that once Crabtree beats the DB by two steps, he needs to catch up to the overthrown ball. In other words, it's not good enough to be faster than the DB, he has to also be faster than himself once he see's that the ball is overthrown. If he was faster than himself, he could have caught up to that ball.
The same thing can be said for Manningham.
Seriously, what good is speed, if you can't even outrun yourself?

Dude be realistic, everyone on the zone has agreed that Alex overthrew Crabtree.

Just went back and watched it. That is definitely a classic overthrow, at minimum it was thrown to a landmark just as Manningham's attempted 1 handed catch was. It even did what most Zoners bash Alex for and travel outside of the receiver's straight line route, just not to the extreme that we've seen.

I'd give AS the benefit of the doubt and say it was landmark throw because it seems like almost all of the deep shots we take are of that variety. AS looked rushed and thrown on too much of a rope rather then dropping it in his path.

Originally posted by LoneWolf:

Originally posted by BrianGO:
That's not the problem, our WR's aren't 7 ft tall and they're not "Mr. Fantastic", that would be a fantasy. The problem is that once Crabtree beats the DB by two steps, he needs to catch up to the overthrown ball. In other words, it's not good enough to be faster than the DB, he has to also be faster than himself once he see's that the ball is overthrown. If he was faster than himself, he could have caught up to that ball.
The same thing can be said for Manningham.
Seriously, what good is speed, if you can't even outrun yourself?

Dude be realistic, everyone on the zone has agreed that Alex overthrew Crabtree.

Not from some of the stuff I was reading. Some were implying that it was Crabtree's fault. Or that he isn't fast enough etc. I was just trying to point out how absurd it is to assert that a player isn't fast enough when the ball is thrown over him.

Originally posted by sfout:

Originally posted by LoneWolf:

Originally posted by BrianGO:
That's not the problem, our WR's aren't 7 ft tall and they're not "Mr. Fantastic", that would be a fantasy. The problem is that once Crabtree beats the DB by two steps, he needs to catch up to the overthrown ball. In other words, it's not good enough to be faster than the DB, he has to also be faster than himself once he see's that the ball is overthrown. If he was faster than himself, he could have caught up to that ball.
The same thing can be said for Manningham.
Seriously, what good is speed, if you can't even outrun yourself?

Dude be realistic, everyone on the zone has agreed that Alex overthrew Crabtree.

Just went back and watched it. That is definitely a classic overthrow, at minimum it was thrown to a landmark just as Manningham's attempted 1 handed catch was. It even did what most Zoners bash Alex for and travel outside of the receiver's straight line route, just not to the extreme that we've seen.

I'd give AS the benefit of the doubt and say it was landmark throw because it seems like almost all of the deep shots we take are of that variety. AS looked rushed and thrown on too much of a rope rather then dropping it in his path.

We can blame whatever we want, but that is a separate topic. I only wanted to make the point that this particular play was most definitely not Crabtree's fault, or his "lack of" ability.

Originally posted by BrianGO:
Not from some of the stuff I was reading. Some were implying that it was Crabtree's fault. Or that he isn't fast enough etc. I was just trying to point out how absurd it is to assert that a player isn't fast enough when the ball is thrown over him.

I haven't read that, Ive only seen the blame on the manningham throws and those were more towards the defense jamming manningham and slowing him down, that particular pass seemed more calculated to trust the receiver would get to the ball, similar to the INT on the pass to Crabtree in Minn seemed more like terrible communicaton + putting the ball were he thought the receiver would be. The overthrown crabtree pass was 100% overthrown on Alex, judging by the distance it looked as if he thought he was passing to Vernon.

Originally posted by susweel:
Moss has been even more disappointing than I had envisioned.

well if alex hadn't overthrown him twice in the vikings game his numbers would be better

he looks fine to me though