Week 11: Thoughts after Re-watching the game...

Originally posted by nvchamp9ers:
Pass to Braylon was actually a PERFECT pass. I know i sound crazy but what we saw therr was a timing route much like a flat fade where the Qb throws the ball to the back pylon pretty much no matter what coverage is. Braylon got excited broke the route of early turned around and well we all saw what happened.

Exactly. If it was supposed to be a fade route then the ball needs to be high to avoid an interception. I heard Maiocco say the same thing and I couldn't disagree more (if that was the route).

Originally posted by Oldschool9erfan:


Dashon Goldson - LOCK THIS GUY UP!!!!! He adds the HAMMER in the secondary for us. I would hate to lose him next year. I hope that our success is going to change his mind. On the downside, he is a bit of a hothead......you know that in the playofffs another team might have a 4th string WR try to pull some Bushleague move and Goldson might do something like take a swing.

this

Originally posted by Marvin49:
Actually went to this one. ;-) Have a friend with Season Tix.

1) Edwards: He just isn't right out there. I think his knee is still bothering him and I think he hurt his shoulder a few weeks ago because he's had problems getting his arms up and he is holding his arm awkwardly. I think he wants to contribute because this is a contract year so he's playing hurt, but thats just an opinion with nothing to support it.

2) Kyle Williams: I think he needs to get his shot. Now. So quick. So fast. Great hands. Good route runner. Put him in there more. I also heard on the radio on the way home that he spent ALOT of time with Alex in the offseason catching passes. That breeds familiarity.

3) Alex: The first two lead me to Alex. I think we are at the point now where we can say Alex struggled without thinking the sky is falling or that he is a bust that flat out sucks. The fact that we look at a game where he threw for 260 yards, 2 TDs and an INT and think it was an off day really speaks to how well he's played this year. I do see a problem tho. I don't know if its him, the receivers, or a combination of the two, but he has been scattershot in the red-zone. Braylon should have caught the ball, but it was still not a very good throw. Crabtree (more on him later) was WIDE OPEN in the endzone. They have 6 games to figure this out, but if they don't figure it out in these last few months, January could be a depressing time around here.

4) Crabtree: FINALLY. I've been seeing it all year, but it just hadn't come together. This is the guy I think he can be. 120 yards and could have had 20+ more and a TD if Alex gets the ball there. I think its pretty clear that Crabtree is your #1 guy, Williams may get his shot at #2, Morgan probably gets #2 back next year.....and Braylon.....well Braylon has some work to do.

5) Gameplan: Steve Young said something on the radio a few weeks ago. He said the Niners were at a place now where they have breathing room so they should take the opportunity to put the ball up in the air to see what they can do and prepare for January. I didn't really take it seriously at the time, but ya know what? It really looks like that may very well be what they are doing. They essentially have 6 games here to "practice" and prepare for a January run. Thats good too because that game could EASILY have been a 40-0 blowout. The 23-7 final score really doesn't tell the whole story.

6) Willis: I don't even know what to say. Best player at his position in the NFL. Hands down. He had a pick, a forced fumble, tipped a pass that was intended for Fitz......but the play that impressed me the most was catching a WR from behind to knock the ball away in the 4th quarter. ILBs shouldn't be able to run that fast. It defies the laws of nature.

7) Goldson: He is playing his way into a big contract. Call him the anti-Braylon.

8) Akers: Rough day at the office. He'll bounce back.

9) Bowman: PLEASE get this guy to the Pro Bowl. I love that ILBs are making plays on Flanker Screen plays. No team in the NFL can boast ILBs with that kind of speed. NOBODY.

10) Winning the games they are supposed to win: It ain't always gonna be pretty. Someone once said that great teams aren't always great. They are just great when they need to be. Thats kinda what keeps occuring to me when they are beating the Cards, Washington, the Browns, etc. They pretty much dominate the game and get the work done before kinda letting up late. They are never in danger of losing, but also don't go out of their way to score 40 pts.

Here's hoping they start putting it all together in the pass game in order to compete in January. I'm not talking about becomeing a passing team, I'm just talking about becoming something the NFL has precious few of....a truly BALANCED team.

Willis is hands down the best non-QB in the NFL. In fact, you can make the argument that the only guy you can make an argument that you'd rather have on your team is Rodgers.

Originally posted by PhillyNiner:

Originally posted by oldninerdude:
Same was true with the pass to Crabtree in the endzone, wasn't it? Smith threw it to the back pylon, but Crabtree didn't run his route to the pylon, he broke towards the post when he was in the endzone.

Smith's reaction was the same it was on a similar play last week--he really wanted that play over again.

As to Braylon, I don't think his knee is right.

They really were not the same thing. On Edwards pass the ball was deliberatly thrown a little high and a little away to be conservative versus the pick. A guy with the height and athleticism of Edwards should catch that ball every single time...no excuses. The Crabtree pass, Smith while throwing it to what was technically the right spot, threw the ball a little to flat, which made it impossible for Crabtree to get there in time to make the grab. There just wasnt enough touch on it, unless you somebody absurdly fast like Hester, your never going to get there.

I see what you're saying.

The pass to Braylon was on the short side of the field, the one to Crabtree was further away, a longer throw and needed a bit more air so Crabtree could run under it.

But I still think Crabtree turned the wrong way to look for the ball, then, because the pass was a little flat, he couldn't turn back and recover in time. IMHO.

Originally posted by Marvin49:

Originally posted by qnnhan7:
You forgot to give Cully and Brown some love. They did a good job out there yesterday.

Smith had some very suspect throws, but that one to Edwards into the end zone was very good. Don't take that one away from Smith.

NOt really. Edwards was WIDE OPEN. All Smith had to do was put it on him. There was no need to put the ball 3 feet over his head.

Yes, Braylon should have caught it, but it could have been an easy pitch and catch. They are both respobsible for that one.

Good points on the review. Disagree about Braylon. If a pass hits a receiver's hands, it should be caught. No questions. Smith rarely places a ball right where it's supposed to be. But he still manages to get it there. It should have been caught.

Originally posted by oldninerdude:

Originally posted by qnnhan7:

Originally posted by nvchamp9ers:
Pass to Braylon was actually a PERFECT pass. I know i sound crazy but what we saw therr was a timing route much like a flat fade where the Qb throws the ball to the back pylon pretty much no matter what coverage is. Braylon got excited broke the route of early turned around and well we all saw what happened.

Yeah, with you on that.

Same was true with the pass to Crabtree in the endzone, wasn't it? Smith threw it to the back pylon, but Crabtree didn't run his route to the pylon, he broke towards the post when he was in the endzone.

Smith's reaction was the same it was on a similar play last week--he really wanted that play over again.

As to Braylon, I don't think his knee is right.

Nah, the one to Crabtree -- Smith just plain overthrown. Hurts me just thinking about that cause that could have been an easy TD too.

Originally posted by Marvin49:

Originally posted by nvchamp9ers:

Originally posted by Marvin49:

Originally posted by nvchamp9ers:
Pass to Braylon was actually a PERFECT pass. I know i sound crazy but what we saw therr was a timing route much like a flat fade where the Qb throws the ball to the back pylon pretty much no matter what coverage is. Braylon got excited broke the route of early turned around and well we all saw what happened.

Thats possible, but re-watching it showed that there was no defender between them. There was no need to throw it high.

If i am a Qb i am not expecting my WR to break his route off, i expect him to run his route, thats where Alex threw it.

Are we talking about the same play? I'm talking about the pass that hit his hands, not the one where it was overthrown.

The pass in the end zone that hit him in the hands would have been an easier catch if he didn't cut the route off. Instead of running a fade he ran a fade stop, dunno if it was impromptu or a miscommunication between the two on the route.

Marvin, can I please have my eyes and brain back now?

Just what I saw/thought too!

Excellent as always.

I'll add to the Edwards thing: I don't see him on the team next year if Morgan comes back 100% healthy. He's pushing himself too much and it isn't working out well.

1. I agree with your Braylon assesment. I think he is playing hurt, the preseason he showed alot more explosiveness and effort,
2. I agree with your Crabtree take. I have said it since day 1 he is our #1.. The thing with Crabs is he is the type of guy that needs to find a rythem, he needs 10 targets a game and he will do damage (texas tech)
3. Steve Young was correct. I knew it was coming.. our first 8 games or so I believed we averaged about 25 pass attempts a game, while the other high octane offenses were putting it up 35+.. we know what we have in the run game, we know what we have out of Ginn and the return game, we know what we have with the defense. Alex actually had his lowest rated game of the season against the Cards yesterday, he did miss some throws, it was running, and there were a few drops. Lets continue to get Alex ready for the playoffs and stay more balanced instead of run heavy to close out the season..
4. also.. yes i like Kyle Williams, still think he is a #3 and good one at it, but yes lets see him on the field more!!

Originally posted by oldninerdude:

Originally posted by PhillyNiner:

Originally posted by oldninerdude:

Same was true with the pass to Crabtree in the endzone, wasn't it? Smith threw it to the back pylon, but Crabtree didn't run his route to the pylon, he broke towards the post when he was in the endzone.

Smith's reaction was the same it was on a similar play last week--he really wanted that play over again.

As to Braylon, I don't think his knee is right.

They really were not the same thing. On Edwards pass the ball was deliberatly thrown a little high and a little away to be conservative versus the pick. A guy with the height and athleticism of Edwards should catch that ball every single time...no excuses. The Crabtree pass, Smith while throwing it to what was technically the right spot, threw the ball a little to flat, which made it impossible for Crabtree to get there in time to make the grab. There just wasnt enough touch on it, unless you somebody absurdly fast like Hester, your never going to get there.

I see what you're saying.

The pass to Braylon was on the short side of the field, the one to Crabtree was further away, a longer throw and needed a bit more air so Crabtree could run under it.

But I still think Crabtree turned the wrong way to look for the ball, then, because the pass was a little flat, he couldn't turn back and recover in time. IMHO.

Believe it or not that route was a thing of beauty from Crabtree, when coaching my Db's i refer to it as a "dip" route. The Wr (in this case Crabtree) runs the stem and cut of his route like a dig against a zone, but instead of settling out of his break he dips his outside shoulder and breaks it to a corner route once you (the db) are already commited to the crossing dig. Crabtree's route fooled both the corner and the safety at first, and thats all that is needed bc once you are fooled and take a "false step" you are pretty much burned. Alex plain just didnt hit his wr, he needed a half second of air more under that ball, just missed him. I should add when the route is run like it was, it is nearly impossible to defend if the throw is on target.

If Smith would have waited for Crabtree to take a couple more steps before throwing that ball.... Would have been an easy TD. I think Smith was too eager to get it there cause he saw a sure TD. Arrggghhh... so close

Nice post.

Alex definitely needs to work on the touch and accuracy of some of his throws, but it seems like our receivers and tight ends drop a lot of catchable balls.

Originally posted by nvchamp9ers:

Originally posted by oldninerdude:

Originally posted by PhillyNiner:

Originally posted by oldninerdude:
Same was true with the pass to Crabtree in the endzone, wasn't it? Smith threw it to the back pylon, but Crabtree didn't run his route to the pylon, he broke towards the post when he was in the endzone.

Smith's reaction was the same it was on a similar play last week--he really wanted that play over again.

As to Braylon, I don't think his knee is right.

They really were not the same thing. On Edwards pass the ball was deliberatly thrown a little high and a little away to be conservative versus the pick. A guy with the height and athleticism of Edwards should catch that ball every single time...no excuses. The Crabtree pass, Smith while throwing it to what was technically the right spot, threw the ball a little to flat, which made it impossible for Crabtree to get there in time to make the grab. There just wasnt enough touch on it, unless you somebody absurdly fast like Hester, your never going to get there.

I see what you're saying.

The pass to Braylon was on the short side of the field, the one to Crabtree was further away, a longer throw and needed a bit more air so Crabtree could run under it.

But I still think Crabtree turned the wrong way to look for the ball, then, because the pass was a little flat, he couldn't turn back and recover in time. IMHO.

Believe it or not that route was a thing of beauty from Crabtree, when coaching my Db's i refer to it as a "dip" route. The Wr (in this case Crabtree) runs the stem and cut of his route like a dig against a zone, but instead of settling out of his break he dips his outside shoulder and breaks it to a corner route once you (the db) are already commited to the crossing dig. Crabtree's route fooled both the corner and the safety at first, and thats all that is needed bc once you are fooled and take a "false step" you are pretty much burned. Alex plain just didnt hit his wr, he needed a half second of air more under that ball, just missed him. I should add when the route is run like it was, it is nearly impossible to defend if the throw is on target.

Good knowledge, as always. Thanks.

I dunno if I'm correctly understanding you, but sounds like you're saying that the two (Smith and Crabtree) were on different pages on a play that shoulda been an easy TD--which is why Smith looked like he'd give alot for another shot at it.

Originally posted by oldninerdude:
Same was true with the pass to Crabtree in the endzone, wasn't it? Smith threw it to the back pylon, but Crabtree didn't run his route to the pylon, he broke towards the post when he was in the endzone.

Smith's reaction was the same it was on a similar play last week--he really wanted that play over again.

As to Braylon, I don't think his knee is right.

Even if crab broke to the pylon as you are suggesting, it was too far ahead when I watched it.