Can we give some props to Trent Baalke?

How do you let the bengals sign Lawson away for a measly 3 mil 1 year contract??

I would have locked manny up for 3 or 4 years in the 12-16 mil range, him along with smith would have been a talented duo at OLB.

Originally posted by GMniner805:
How do you let the bengals sign Lawson away for a measly 3 mil 1 year contract??

I would have locked manny up for 3 or 4 years in the 12-16 mil range, him along with smith would have been a talented duo at OLB.

Well, that chance went by the boards last October when the team decided not to even make an offer. Since then Lawson has just been waiting to leave town. He had no interest in staying around with this FO.

Originally posted by GMniner805:
How do you let the bengals sign Lawson away for a measly 3 mil 1 year contract??

I would have locked manny up for 3 or 4 years in the 12-16 mil range, him along with smith would have been a talented duo at OLB.

Good thing you're not the GM. I've never understood the fascination with Lawson, especially considering how much money the organization paid to him in his front-loaded contract. He's making less money now than he did his first year in the league, and that's when he was considerably overvalued.

That being said, I doubt he would've gone for your deal anyway. He doesn't want to split time, he probably wants to start, and he's probably tired of the organization.

Originally posted by 12b6demurrer:

Originally posted by GMniner805:
How do you let the bengals sign Lawson away for a measly 3 mil 1 year contract??

I would have locked manny up for 3 or 4 years in the 12-16 mil range, him along with smith would have been a talented duo at OLB.

Good thing you're not the GM. I've never understood the fascination with Lawson, especially considering how much money the organization paid to him in his front-loaded contract. He's making less money now than he did his first year in the league, and that's when he was considerably overvalued.

That being said, I doubt he would've gone for your deal anyway. He doesn't want to split time, he probably wants to start, and he's probably tired of the organization.

Anyone who actually knows the game of football & has watched the games on sunday understands Lawson was one of the 49ers most talented/valuable defenders.

When you cannot re-sign Franklin after he comes for a visit, you are garbage...what did the guy come here for? To be jerked around by the FO? Awful...

Originally posted by GMniner805:

Originally posted by 12b6demurrer:

Originally posted by GMniner805:
How do you let the bengals sign Lawson away for a measly 3 mil 1 year contract??

I would have locked manny up for 3 or 4 years in the 12-16 mil range, him along with smith would have been a talented duo at OLB.

Good thing you're not the GM. I've never understood the fascination with Lawson, especially considering how much money the organization paid to him in his front-loaded contract. He's making less money now than he did his first year in the league, and that's when he was considerably overvalued.

That being said, I doubt he would've gone for your deal anyway. He doesn't want to split time, he probably wants to start, and he's probably tired of the organization.

Anyone who actually knows the game of football & has watched the games on sunday understands Lawson was one of the 49ers most talented/valuable defenders.

Oh okay, I'll respond by using similar hyperbole. Anyone who actually knows the game of football and has watched the games on Sunday understands Lawson was ultimately an ineffective pass rusher who was unable to shed blocks despite his increased size, covered less effectively than the posters on this forum would have you believe, and didn't even garner a mid-tier 6th year linebacker's salary from a team with a huge need at SAM linebacker.

Oh wait, that's not hyperbole. That's the truth. If he was so great in coverage, why were we constantly burnt on the screen and the flat? A lot of that had to do with the scheme, but Manny Lawson's position is supposed to cover these plays. He, along with Haralson, never squared up or set the edge as effectively as Webzoners (who are completely football illiterate based off of what I've read here in the last few days) would think. Lawson had especially slow reaction time and didn't keep his man in front of him. Not a great recipe considering he's slow as hell.

Originally posted by Bobbi9698:
When you cannot re-sign Franklin after he comes for a visit, you are garbage...what did the guy come here for? To be jerked around by the FO? Awful...

its called a negotiation

Originally posted by 190836:

Originally posted by b9er37:

Originally posted by aclarke49:

Originally posted by Lifer:

Originally posted by 5280High:

Originally posted by Lifer:

Originally posted by b9er37:
There has obviously been a lot of arguments about why Baalke has not been able to deliver top free agents, and I have been one who is certainly disappointed. Now that I have had some time to think things through I believe the CBA thing really did screw up this season for us. Why waste money on pricey free agents when Jim needs time to find out what he has to work with. I think we just roll out with a young team this year and see who can play. I hate to throw in the towel but next year we'll have a much better shot at scoring free agents and winning some games. Just my perspective...

It certainly makes sense but, of course, they could never come out and say it. The term “rebuilding” is to the NFL what “Voldemort” is to the world of Harry Potter. So Baalke and York talk about patience and sticking to the plan. Trouble is, the plan for 2011 is tear down the roster, get some high priced guys off the books, and audition a bunch of young guys. Makes it tough on your marketing department when your plan is to basically tank the season.

49er slogans:

2009: “I want winners!”
2010: “Don’t tell me, show me!”
2011: “We’ll get ‘em next year!”

I don't know what your definition of tear down the roster... but this is not a tear down. You wanna see a tear down go look at what McDaniels did to Denver.

It looks like we could actually be bringing Franklin and Goldson back, who knows what Manny is up to, its possible all three come back. Won't matter cause fans will always find something to complain about.

If you lose 5 out of 6 starters on defense (which could very well happen), that's a tear down. If your defensive coordinator says that only two positions are set and everything else is up for grabs, that's a tear down. If you're 24th in the league in pass defense and you let your starting CB walk with no one to replace him, that's a tear down. When said starting CB is quoted by his new coach as saying that he left because he didn't want to be part of rebuilding, that's a tear down. They're not trying to add a couple pieces on defense, they're starting over. That's a tear down.

Agreed. I don't see how he can keep his job. If the Yorks have any respect for themselves then they would get rid of him now.

They gotta give trent and jim a chance. Some of the guys we lost just didn't want to be here so they can f off. If our other free agents don't want to come in here at a reasonable price then so can they. I would like to see trent burn up some of that 30 million, but I don't want to see any nate clements type mistakes. Just hang in there niner fans...At this point what do we really have to lose?

With all due respect, fans like you said the same thing about how we have to give the GM and the coach time and a chance. The result was Erickson, Nolan and Sing. A decade of losing.

With all due respect, we haven't even played a preseason game yet.

Originally posted by b9er37:

Originally posted by 190836:

Originally posted by b9er37:

Originally posted by aclarke49:

Originally posted by Lifer:

Originally posted by 5280High:

Originally posted by Lifer:

Originally posted by b9er37:
There has obviously been a lot of arguments about why Baalke has not been able to deliver top free agents, and I have been one who is certainly disappointed. Now that I have had some time to think things through I believe the CBA thing really did screw up this season for us. Why waste money on pricey free agents when Jim needs time to find out what he has to work with. I think we just roll out with a young team this year and see who can play. I hate to throw in the towel but next year we'll have a much better shot at scoring free agents and winning some games. Just my perspective...

It certainly makes sense but, of course, they could never come out and say it. The term “rebuilding” is to the NFL what “Voldemort” is to the world of Harry Potter. So Baalke and York talk about patience and sticking to the plan. Trouble is, the plan for 2011 is tear down the roster, get some high priced guys off the books, and audition a bunch of young guys. Makes it tough on your marketing department when your plan is to basically tank the season.

49er slogans:

2009: “I want winners!”
2010: “Don’t tell me, show me!”
2011: “We’ll get ‘em next year!”

I don't know what your definition of tear down the roster... but this is not a tear down. You wanna see a tear down go look at what McDaniels did to Denver.

It looks like we could actually be bringing Franklin and Goldson back, who knows what Manny is up to, its possible all three come back. Won't matter cause fans will always find something to complain about.

If you lose 5 out of 6 starters on defense (which could very well happen), that's a tear down. If your defensive coordinator says that only two positions are set and everything else is up for grabs, that's a tear down. If you're 24th in the league in pass defense and you let your starting CB walk with no one to replace him, that's a tear down. When said starting CB is quoted by his new coach as saying that he left because he didn't want to be part of rebuilding, that's a tear down. They're not trying to add a couple pieces on defense, they're starting over. That's a tear down.

Agreed. I don't see how he can keep his job. If the Yorks have any respect for themselves then they would get rid of him now.

They gotta give trent and jim a chance. Some of the guys we lost just didn't want to be here so they can f off. If our other free agents don't want to come in here at a reasonable price then so can they. I would like to see trent burn up some of that 30 million, but I don't want to see any nate clements type mistakes. Just hang in there niner fans...At this point what do we really have to lose?

With all due respect, fans like you said the same thing about how we have to give the GM and the coach time and a chance. The result was Erickson, Nolan and Sing. A decade of losing.

With all due respect, we haven't even played a preseason game yet.

The 9er fan cycle:

August
This team is blowing it in the draft and FA. We’re gonna suck this year!
A: We haven’t even played a preseason game yet.

October
This team is getting out-played and out-coached. We’re gonna suck this year!
A: The season’s barely started.

December
We sucked this year!
A: It wasn’t that bad. We’ll fix the problems in the off-season.

August
This team is blowing it in the draft and FA. We’re gonna suck this year!
A: We haven’t even played a preseason game yet.

Repeat ad infinitum.

Originally posted by 12b6demurrer:

Originally posted by GMniner805:

Originally posted by 12b6demurrer:

Originally posted by GMniner805:
How do you let the bengals sign Lawson away for a measly 3 mil 1 year contract??

I would have locked manny up for 3 or 4 years in the 12-16 mil range, him along with smith would have been a talented duo at OLB.

Good thing you're not the GM. I've never understood the fascination with Lawson, especially considering how much money the organization paid to him in his front-loaded contract. He's making less money now than he did his first year in the league, and that's when he was considerably overvalued.

That being said, I doubt he would've gone for your deal anyway. He doesn't want to split time, he probably wants to start, and he's probably tired of the organization.

Anyone who actually knows the game of football & has watched the games on sunday understands Lawson was one of the 49ers most talented/valuable defenders.

Oh okay, I'll respond by using similar hyperbole. Anyone who actually knows the game of football and has watched the games on Sunday understands Lawson was ultimately an ineffective pass rusher who was unable to shed blocks despite his increased size, covered less effectively than the posters on this forum would have you believe, and didn't even garner a mid-tier 6th year linebacker's salary from a team with a huge need at SAM linebacker.

Oh wait, that's not hyperbole. That's the truth. If he was so great in coverage, why were we constantly burnt on the screen and the flat? A lot of that had to do with the scheme, but Manny Lawson's position is supposed to cover these plays. He, along with Haralson, never squared up or set the edge as effectively as Webzoners (who are completely football illiterate based off of what I've read here in the last few days) would think. Lawson had especially slow reaction time and didn't keep his man in front of him. Not a great recipe considering he's slow as hell.

Manny was often in coverage & still managed 14.5 sacks over the last two years, yet he's an ineffective passer rusher??

& then you blame him for the 49ers DL not being able to read a screen..

Manny Lawson slow as he'll?? The man ran a 4.43 40 yard dash & you call webzoners football illiterate?? Man get out of here with that nonsense.

Frankly your mistaken, I doubt you have played or coached(which i have btw) the game outside of Madden.

[ Edited by GMniner805 on Aug 2, 2011 at 11:26:03 ]

Originally posted by Lifer:

Originally posted by b9er37:

Originally posted by 190836:

Originally posted by b9er37:

Originally posted by aclarke49:

Originally posted by Lifer:

Originally posted by 5280High:

Originally posted by Lifer:

Originally posted by b9er37:
There has obviously been a lot of arguments about why Baalke has not been able to deliver top free agents, and I have been one who is certainly disappointed. Now that I have had some time to think things through I believe the CBA thing really did screw up this season for us. Why waste money on pricey free agents when Jim needs time to find out what he has to work with. I think we just roll out with a young team this year and see who can play. I hate to throw in the towel but next year we'll have a much better shot at scoring free agents and winning some games. Just my perspective...

It certainly makes sense but, of course, they could never come out and say it. The term “rebuilding” is to the NFL what “Voldemort” is to the world of Harry Potter. So Baalke and York talk about patience and sticking to the plan. Trouble is, the plan for 2011 is tear down the roster, get some high priced guys off the books, and audition a bunch of young guys. Makes it tough on your marketing department when your plan is to basically tank the season.

49er slogans:

2009: “I want winners!”
2010: “Don’t tell me, show me!”
2011: “We’ll get ‘em next year!”

I don't know what your definition of tear down the roster... but this is not a tear down. You wanna see a tear down go look at what McDaniels did to Denver.

It looks like we could actually be bringing Franklin and Goldson back, who knows what Manny is up to, its possible all three come back. Won't matter cause fans will always find something to complain about.

If you lose 5 out of 6 starters on defense (which could very well happen), that's a tear down. If your defensive coordinator says that only two positions are set and everything else is up for grabs, that's a tear down. If you're 24th in the league in pass defense and you let your starting CB walk with no one to replace him, that's a tear down. When said starting CB is quoted by his new coach as saying that he left because he didn't want to be part of rebuilding, that's a tear down. They're not trying to add a couple pieces on defense, they're starting over. That's a tear down.

Agreed. I don't see how he can keep his job. If the Yorks have any respect for themselves then they would get rid of him now.

They gotta give trent and jim a chance. Some of the guys we lost just didn't want to be here so they can f off. If our other free agents don't want to come in here at a reasonable price then so can they. I would like to see trent burn up some of that 30 million, but I don't want to see any nate clements type mistakes. Just hang in there niner fans...At this point what do we really have to lose?

With all due respect, fans like you said the same thing about how we have to give the GM and the coach time and a chance. The result was Erickson, Nolan and Sing. A decade of losing.

With all due respect, we haven't even played a preseason game yet.

The 9er fan cycle:

August
This team is blowing it in the draft and FA. We’re gonna suck this year!
A: We haven’t even played a preseason game yet.

October
This team is getting out-played and out-coached. We’re gonna suck this year!
A: The season’s barely started.

December
We sucked this year!
A: It wasn’t that bad. We’ll fix the problems in the off-season.

August
This team is blowing it in the draft and FA. We’re gonna suck this year!
A: We haven’t even played a preseason game yet.

Repeat ad infinitum.

Alright, get a new team then... I prolly thought nolan was gonna be a good coach, and I even thought sing was gonna be aight. But I really do believe Jim is the dude to at least bring the niners back to respectability. Look at how close we were to the playoffs last year, and dudes were making ridiculous mistakes on the field. Anything can happen, just because you don't have every high priced free agent on your team doesn't mean you can't win. Look at Tampa,and KC, maybe they didn't do anything in the playoffs, but the young dudes created a buzz for their fans. something to build on.

My personal opinion is that we have to wait until the season is underway before we can rate his actual performance. However, FA to this point has been an unmitigated PR disaster, and has drained a significant portion of the positive feeling that the hiring of Harbaugh generated.

It is entirely possible that the players currently on the team perform well above expectations, and that we end up praising Baalke's job for not overspending on FAs. Admittedly, the probability of that is highly debatable, and it is just as possible that we end up getting steamrolled in every game because we don't have the players. Time will tell.

There are still players available at positions of need. Signing some of those would help take the edge off a rough "start" to the offseason for the fans.

Originally posted by Lifer:

Originally posted by b9er37:

Originally posted by 190836:

Originally posted by b9er37:

Originally posted by aclarke49:

Originally posted by Lifer:

Originally posted by 5280High:

Originally posted by Lifer:

Originally posted by b9er37:
There has obviously been a lot of arguments about why Baalke has not been able to deliver top free agents, and I have been one who is certainly disappointed. Now that I have had some time to think things through I believe the CBA thing really did screw up this season for us. Why waste money on pricey free agents when Jim needs time to find out what he has to work with. I think we just roll out with a young team this year and see who can play. I hate to throw in the towel but next year we'll have a much better shot at scoring free agents and winning some games. Just my perspective...

It certainly makes sense but, of course, they could never come out and say it. The term “rebuilding” is to the NFL what “Voldemort” is to the world of Harry Potter. So Baalke and York talk about patience and sticking to the plan. Trouble is, the plan for 2011 is tear down the roster, get some high priced guys off the books, and audition a bunch of young guys. Makes it tough on your marketing department when your plan is to basically tank the season.

49er slogans:

2009: “I want winners!”
2010: “Don’t tell me, show me!”
2011: “We’ll get ‘em next year!”

I don't know what your definition of tear down the roster... but this is not a tear down. You wanna see a tear down go look at what McDaniels did to Denver.

It looks like we could actually be bringing Franklin and Goldson back, who knows what Manny is up to, its possible all three come back. Won't matter cause fans will always find something to complain about.

If you lose 5 out of 6 starters on defense (which could very well happen), that's a tear down. If your defensive coordinator says that only two positions are set and everything else is up for grabs, that's a tear down. If you're 24th in the league in pass defense and you let your starting CB walk with no one to replace him, that's a tear down. When said starting CB is quoted by his new coach as saying that he left because he didn't want to be part of rebuilding, that's a tear down. They're not trying to add a couple pieces on defense, they're starting over. That's a tear down.

Agreed. I don't see how he can keep his job. If the Yorks have any respect for themselves then they would get rid of him now.

They gotta give trent and jim a chance. Some of the guys we lost just didn't want to be here so they can f off. If our other free agents don't want to come in here at a reasonable price then so can they. I would like to see trent burn up some of that 30 million, but I don't want to see any nate clements type mistakes. Just hang in there niner fans...At this point what do we really have to lose?

With all due respect, fans like you said the same thing about how we have to give the GM and the coach time and a chance. The result was Erickson, Nolan and Sing. A decade of losing.

With all due respect, we haven't even played a preseason game yet.

The 9er fan cycle:

August
This team is blowing it in the draft and FA. We’re gonna suck this year!
A: We haven’t even played a preseason game yet.

October
This team is getting out-played and out-coached. We’re gonna suck this year!
A: The season’s barely started.

December
We sucked this year!
A: It wasn’t that bad. We’ll fix the problems in the off-season.

August
This team is blowing it in the draft and FA. We’re gonna suck this year!
A: We haven’t even played a preseason game yet.

Repeat ad infinitum.

lol... so true

Originally posted by GMniner805:

Manny was often in coverage & still managed 14.5 sacks over the last two years, yet he's an ineffective passer rusher??

& then you blame him for the 49ers DL not being able to read a screen..

Manny Lawson slow as he'll?? The man ran a 4.43 40 yard dash & you call webzoners football illiterate?? Man get out of here with that nonsense.

Frankly your mistaken, I doubt you have played or coached(which i have btw) the game outside of Madden.

14.5 sacks in 3 years is hardly good for a pass-rusher. Manny was good at "setting the edge" and coverage, that was about it. His measly $3 million for 1-year (relative, of course) dollar contract and lack of suitors show how much he was over hyped on the zone..

Originally posted by GMniner805:

Originally posted by 12b6demurrer:

Originally posted by GMniner805:

Originally posted by 12b6demurrer:

Originally posted by GMniner805:
How do you let the bengals sign Lawson away for a measly 3 mil 1 year contract??

I would have locked manny up for 3 or 4 years in the 12-16 mil range, him along with smith would have been a talented duo at OLB.

Good thing you're not the GM. I've never understood the fascination with Lawson, especially considering how much money the organization paid to him in his front-loaded contract. He's making less money now than he did his first year in the league, and that's when he was considerably overvalued.

That being said, I doubt he would've gone for your deal anyway. He doesn't want to split time, he probably wants to start, and he's probably tired of the organization.

Anyone who actually knows the game of football & has watched the games on sunday understands Lawson was one of the 49ers most talented/valuable defenders.

Oh okay, I'll respond by using similar hyperbole. Anyone who actually knows the game of football and has watched the games on Sunday understands Lawson was ultimately an ineffective pass rusher who was unable to shed blocks despite his increased size, covered less effectively than the posters on this forum would have you believe, and didn't even garner a mid-tier 6th year linebacker's salary from a team with a huge need at SAM linebacker.

Oh wait, that's not hyperbole. That's the truth. If he was so great in coverage, why were we constantly burnt on the screen and the flat? A lot of that had to do with the scheme, but Manny Lawson's position is supposed to cover these plays. He, along with Haralson, never squared up or set the edge as effectively as Webzoners (who are completely football illiterate based off of what I've read here in the last few days) would think. Lawson had especially slow reaction time and didn't keep his man in front of him. Not a great recipe considering he's slow as hell.

Manny was often in coverage & still managed 14.5 sacks over the last two years, yet he's an ineffective passer rusher??

& then you blame him for the 49ers DL not being able to read a screen..

Manny Lawson slow as he'll?? The man ran a 4.43 40 yard dash & you call webzoners football illiterate?? Man get out of here with that nonsense.

Frankly your mistaken, I doubt you have played or coached(which i have btw) the game outside of Madden.

G GS Comb Total Ast Sck
16 16 59 48 11 2.5
16 16 68 51 17 6.5
14 10 45 33 12 3.0
where are you getting 14.5 sacks in 2 years from