Alex Smith & Crabtree Chemistry

Originally posted by OnTheClock:

Originally posted by SmokeCrabtrees:

Originally posted by OnTheClock:

Originally posted by Ceadderman:

Originally posted by SybErkRimInAL:
I have no doubt smith can make throws on a practice field, with no real pass rush. It's the way he panics when the pocket breaks down that makes him suck. Also, his slow ass release.

He panics? Really? Syber I can show you several games where he didn't panic. He kept drives alive with his feet. And shoot man, if he did panic as you suggest he did, then can you REALLY blame him? Especially after fat @$$ Rocky Bernard came in free an unblocked and did an impression of Jimmy SuperFly Snuka? Not a very good impression but it still put Alex out.

You'd panic too when a 325 lb. guy plants you in the turf. And comparing the two Alex MAY have a slow release (I do believe that he worked on this, but...) , it still will get there faster than ANY lame duck pass that Hill throws. Shoot I think Smith would have time to go to the sideline get a Starbuck's Venti Caramel Mochiato, and throw the ball. Just beating Hill's wounded duck pass.

~Ceadder

Yeah, I don't know. I always thought Smith actually did pretty well under pressure. Through 06 and the start of 07, he had Glass Jennings and Kwame Harris at OT for him with Patrick Estes and Snyder as backups. Larry Allen also was out for six games in 06, which if you don't remember, is why we HAD to use Estes at LT when Jennings got hurt. Another note: In the games Alex started playing hurt in 2007, Jennings had just been lost for the season in the prior game. Yikes. Torn shoulder + No OL as well.

Then looking at his weapons again: Gilmore, Bryant, Taylor Jacobs, Brandon Williams, and Battle -- Wow. It's amazing he was able to do ANYTHING. Then consider 07, he didn't even have Bryant anymore, nor did he have him late in 06 after he got suspended.

Our defense? Sammy Davis? Brandon Moore? Melvin Oliver? Roman? B.J Tucker? Chad Williams? T.J. Slaughter? Holy crap. How did we even win 7 games?! It's remarkable.

This really deserves it's own post, but it'd simply be locked and it wouldn't matter because it has already been discussed -- and ignored.

Anyone that tries to claim the team Hill is currently playing on is comparable in ANY way, shape, or form to Alex's teams.. They're completely wrong. Alex wouldn't be defended if there was no valid reasoning. Simple reasoning such as stated above is an enormous part of why there is such strong belief that Alex could succeed after managing to accomplish seemingly a spectacular feat, considering what he had to work with when one truly looks at it all, from offense to defense to coaching.

Fans are just unreal to themselves if they can't see Shaun Hill has LIMITED POTENTIAL...PERIOD. Alex on the other hand can atleast prove us something,he can go in with the weapons we have which he's never had anywhere near what he worked with in the past. He's more mobile so hell have a better chance to avoid sacks. He's wiser,stronger&has a stronger arm. He needs to get a nod with a winning record like this so we can see if he can lead us to the playoffs,the worst that can come out of it is WE KNOW FOR A FACT he couldn't complete the task&have all talks end.

Seeing if Alex can do it once and for all is really all people are asking for. If he can't now, then that's it. It's done. No excuses. Develop Davis, stick it out with Hill, and/or draft another QB. For now, Hill needs to be given the opportunity to rebound. Only if he cannot does Alex see the field. I like Alex, but this is how it needs to be.

As stated, we cannot know for a fact that Alex couldn't do it right now. We just can't. With only one complete season as a starter under his belt, which happened to be with such dramatic improvement while still with an abominably bad supporting cast (read above) all around, it cannot be helped to consider he realistically would have a chance at success if given the opportunity.

Just as Alex would have no excuses with this team. Hill gets NO excuses either. OL, "lack of weapons," poor defensive support. No. No excuses. Not with this team we've got. You go out there and get it done. If you can't, get your tail on the freaking bench.

Back to the topic -- I don't know if Crabtree cares who's throwing it to him, but he sure seems to be a little more.. "close" .. I suppose.. with Alex as far as talking (chatting on the sidelines) and developing a rapport through practice, etc.

I'm sure the coaches see every f**king day whether or not he can do it. Obviously he's not better than Hill! Get over it, in fact, trade Smith for Brady Quinn.

I think Alex entered the draft so young is because he graduated that year. Do players ever stay on as grad students?

Originally posted by teeohh:
I think Alex entered the draft so young is because he graduated that year. Do players ever stay on as grad students?

Weinke must have been on at Florida as a grad student, he didn't get drafted until he was 26

Originally posted by fan49:

Originally posted by maximill15:

Originally posted by rapid4:
Damon Bruce commented that if he were Shawn Hill, and he needed to get the offense going, he would damn well have stayed in town to throw to Crabtree.

so shaun hill is supposed to sacrifice his only 3 day's off because of crabtree?? Please, getting a couple days to see family and clear your head, is prob more important that helping crabs, who wont do much this season anyway...

no cuz he is leading a terrible offense

But the rest of the terrible offense was not around to practice. Do you really need two quarterbacks to hang out & teach one new guy some of the playbook for a few days?

Originally posted by djfullshred:

Originally posted by fan49:

Originally posted by maximill15:

Originally posted by rapid4:
Damon Bruce commented that if he were Shawn Hill, and he needed to get the offense going, he would damn well have stayed in town to throw to Crabtree.

so shaun hill is supposed to sacrifice his only 3 day's off because of crabtree?? Please, getting a couple days to see family and clear your head, is prob more important that helping crabs, who wont do much this season anyway...

no cuz he is leading a terrible offense

But the rest of the terrible offense was not around to practice. Do you really need two quarterbacks to hang out & teach one new guy some of the playbook for a few days?

No DJ....I guess some fell Shaun SHOULD HAVE stayed & worked will Crabz. However, maybe that what Shaun & the O needs - To get away for a bit.

Pa-leeze...Alex throws to Crabtree one day and now they have chemistry? The assistant trainer threw to him one day, too...so does that mean he and Crabtree have chemistry? Yikes...

Originally posted by MSteitz468:

Originally posted by teeohh:
I think Alex entered the draft so young is because he graduated that year. Do players ever stay on as grad students?

Weinke must have been on at Florida as a grad student, he didn't get drafted until he was 26

weinke went on to play baseball for a few yrs which is why he was older then everyone when he was at fsu and got drafted

This thread is going everywhere.

I think it comes down to this. Smith has better mechanics and mroe arm strength than Hill, and the coaches know that. But Hill has that moxy and leadership ability that doesn't show up on paper. He doesn't lose games. I think it's that simple.

If Alex and Crabs have "chemistry," it's not surprsing. I mean, theyr'e both professionals. But in a game, its completely different. With everyone else on a BYE, I doubt Smith was throwing to Crabs with D-Linemen in his face and a secondary covering Crabs

if there is any person that has chemistry with crabs it's nate davis, and that not even on the field chemistry! Seeing how hill has already been sacked 16 times, its only a matter of time before he gets hurt, then Smith will get his shot and when he fails, all these smith apologist will once again say that he has no oline or some other bs excuse! I think sing is going to stay will hill, because of one reason over others and that is ball security!

Originally posted by maximill15:
if there is any person that has chemistry with crabs it's nate davis, and that not even on the field chemistry! Seeing how hill has already been sacked 16 times, its only a matter of time before he gets hurt, then Smith will get his shot and when he fails, all these smith apologist will once again say that he has no oline or some other bs excuse! I think sing is going to stay will hill, because of one reason over others and that is ball security!

Actually if Smith doesn't play as well as I expect him to when he's in there with this team, then I hope he gets traded for a better NFL player. This is the best 49er team we've had in any of the time Alex has played with us, so I'm predicting him to do very well. Anyways, Hill has been playing like pure s**t, so there's no way Alex plays worse.

Originally posted by Method:

Originally posted by maximill15:
if there is any person that has chemistry with crabs it's nate davis, and that not even on the field chemistry! Seeing how hill has already been sacked 16 times, its only a matter of time before he gets hurt, then Smith will get his shot and when he fails, all these smith apologist will once again say that he has no oline or some other bs excuse! I think sing is going to stay will hill, because of one reason over others and that is ball security!

Actually if Smith doesn't play as well as I expect him to when he's in there with this team, then I hope he gets traded for a better NFL player. This is the best 49er team we've had in any of the time Alex has played with us, so I'm predicting him to do very well. Anyways, Hill has been playing like pure s**t, so there's no way Alex plays worse.

I'm baffled on how this entire offensive slump is ALL HILL's fault! I mean he's not calling these terrible/ uncreative run/pass plays! He's not letting d linemen through a revolving door, yeah he throws a ugly ball, but Hill will play significantly better if this run game can continue to improve and the oline pulls their head out of their ass!

Originally posted by maximill15:
I'm baffled on how this entire offensive slump is ALL HILL's fault! I mean he's not calling these terrible/ uncreative run/pass plays! He's not letting d linemen through a revolving door, yeah he throws a ugly ball, but Hill will play significantly better if this run game can continue to improve and the oline pulls their head out of their ass!

It's "ALL HILL'S fault" because it's always been "ALL SMITH'S fault.". I think Houston will score 27 points. Do you think we can get higher then that with Hill as our QB?

Sadly, I don't.

Originally posted by Method:

Originally posted by maximill15:
I'm baffled on how this entire offensive slump is ALL HILL's fault! I mean he's not calling these terrible/ uncreative run/pass plays! He's not letting d linemen through a revolving door, yeah he throws a ugly ball, but Hill will play significantly better if this run game can continue to improve and the oline pulls their head out of their ass!

It's "ALL HILL'S fault" because it's always been "ALL SMITH'S fault.". I think Houston will score 27 points. Do you think we can get higher then that with Hill as our QB?

Sadly, I don't.

I wouldn't put all the blame on smith! He had the worst situation imaginable, but if people were wrong to put the blame entirely on smith it's ok to do it to Hill? No, let try and remain constructive here ( no pun intended to u specifically) but I think Hill still gives us the best shot to win! He makes the plays when we have had to, but we all knew coming into this season, it rested on the D and the run game. D has showed up in the first 4 games, the running game only showed up in the seattle game! Granted gore was out, hopefully him coming back will make Hill's life easier and we can put this qb talk to rest. Theres a reason he won the starting job!

Originally posted by MSteitz468:

Originally posted by OnTheClock:

Originally posted by SmokeCrabtrees:

Originally posted by OnTheClock:

Originally posted by Ceadderman:

Originally posted by SybErkRimInAL:
I have no doubt smith can make throws on a practice field, with no real pass rush. It's the way he panics when the pocket breaks down that makes him suck. Also, his slow ass release.

He panics? Really? Syber I can show you several games where he didn't panic. He kept drives alive with his feet. And shoot man, if he did panic as you suggest he did, then can you REALLY blame him? Especially after fat @$$ Rocky Bernard came in free an unblocked and did an impression of Jimmy SuperFly Snuka? Not a very good impression but it still put Alex out.

You'd panic too when a 325 lb. guy plants you in the turf. And comparing the two Alex MAY have a slow release (I do believe that he worked on this, but...) , it still will get there faster than ANY lame duck pass that Hill throws. Shoot I think Smith would have time to go to the sideline get a Starbuck's Venti Caramel Mochiato, and throw the ball. Just beating Hill's wounded duck pass.

~Ceadder

Yeah, I don't know. I always thought Smith actually did pretty well under pressure. Through 06 and the start of 07, he had Glass Jennings and Kwame Harris at OT for him with Patrick Estes and Snyder as backups. Larry Allen also was out for six games in 06, which if you don't remember, is why we HAD to use Estes at LT when Jennings got hurt. Another note: In the games Alex started playing hurt in 2007, Jennings had just been lost for the season in the prior game. Yikes. Torn shoulder + No OL as well.

Then looking at his weapons again: Gilmore, Bryant, Taylor Jacobs, Brandon Williams, and Battle -- Wow. It's amazing he was able to do ANYTHING. Then consider 07, he didn't even have Bryant anymore, nor did he have him late in 06 after he got suspended.

Our defense? Sammy Davis? Brandon Moore? Melvin Oliver? Roman? B.J Tucker? Chad Williams? T.J. Slaughter? Holy crap. How did we even win 7 games?! It's remarkable.

This really deserves it's own post, but it'd simply be locked and it wouldn't matter because it has already been discussed -- and ignored.

Anyone that tries to claim the team Hill is currently playing on is comparable in ANY way, shape, or form to Alex's teams.. They're completely wrong. Alex wouldn't be defended if there was no valid reasoning. Simple reasoning such as stated above is an enormous part of why there is such strong belief that Alex could succeed after managing to accomplish seemingly a spectacular feat, considering what he had to work with when one truly looks at it all, from offense to defense to coaching.

Fans are just unreal to themselves if they can't see Shaun Hill has LIMITED POTENTIAL...PERIOD. Alex on the other hand can atleast prove us something,he can go in with the weapons we have which he's never had anywhere near what he worked with in the past. He's more mobile so hell have a better chance to avoid sacks. He's wiser,stronger&has a stronger arm. He needs to get a nod with a winning record like this so we can see if he can lead us to the playoffs,the worst that can come out of it is WE KNOW FOR A FACT he couldn't complete the task&have all talks end.

Seeing if Alex can do it once and for all is really all people are asking for. If he can't now, then that's it. It's done. No excuses. Develop Davis, stick it out with Hill, and/or draft another QB. For now, Hill needs to be given the opportunity to rebound. Only if he cannot does Alex see the field. I like Alex, but this is how it needs to be.

As stated, we cannot know for a fact that Alex couldn't do it right now. We just can't. With only one complete season as a starter under his belt, which happened to be with such dramatic improvement while still with an abominably bad supporting cast (read above) all around, it cannot be helped to consider he realistically would have a chance at success if given the opportunity.

Just as Alex would have no excuses with this team. Hill gets NO excuses either. OL, "lack of weapons," poor defensive support. No. No excuses. Not with this team we've got. You go out there and get it done. If you can't, get your tail on the freaking bench.

Back to the topic -- I don't know if Crabtree cares who's throwing it to him, but he sure seems to be a little more.. "close" .. I suppose.. with Alex as far as talking (chatting on the sidelines) and developing a rapport through practice, etc.

I'm sure the coaches see every f**king day whether or not he can do it. Obviously he's not better than Hill! Get over it, in fact, trade Smith for Brady Quinn.

Well golly! I was unaware Alex plays regular season games against opponents every single day. I was unaware that Alex and Hill match up and play against each other in practice every day and at the end of practice a winner is announced!

Originally posted by Bali-Niner:
This is funny I had to post. AS of an article I read today, One of the trainers who used to be a QB is now throwing to CTree till Hill gets back. Of course he's back now. So right, there was such fabulous chemistry they took Smith off the job and gave it to a trainer who used to be a QB to throw to him.

Imagine if you are Smith and even, tossing the ball to the new guy is taken away because, They don't the WR to get bad habits from catching Smith's balls!!!!!!!!! That's wot I think.. sad, but so true.

I am not definitely saying Hill is the man of the hour, but Smith's talent level is so low, it makes Hill the starter by default. Just ger Davis in I say. If Sanchez, Stafford, Ryan ( the qb who kicked our ass) and Flacco can do it, then Davis can too. Open your eyes, not everyone comes to the NFL from a trick offense without presence.. oh what's the use, it's all been said before..

Bust, he is, bust he is.

Ok then if you don't believe me, there was a great interview MM did with the guy who studies all the NFL game film and then comments for the NFL, this was a few days ago, and to my mind this is THE most scathing review of A Smith's abilities I have EVER read. To wit:

MM:
I know you haven't seen him play in two years, but is there where Alex Smith, because of his arm strength and the better physical tools, might be the better option at quarterback?

Cosell:
"Well, I don't think Alex Smith has particularly good physical tools. Certainly, we know Shaun Hill has an average to below-average NFL arm. You're right, we haven't seen Alex Smith throw in two years, but the last time we did see him throw and even when he came out (of college), I'd say Alex Smith's arm strength was slightly better than average - nothing more. I'm always leery - I know he's a smart kid - but I don't know how much he's learned. I'm not there. When you play in the Urban Meyer offense, and I can tell you for a fact, that when Alex Smith went through his board work for teams coming out of the draft that he had zero clue about NFL route combination's, which is not surprising. Because in Urban Meyer's offense, nobody does. I'm not a big Alex Smith guy. I think he has limited skills and I think he's got limited understanding."

You guys should really.......... GET OVER HIM!!!
I digress..

GO NINERS BEAT THE TAXASSES!!

So now that Sanchez has thrown more pick in one game than Smith ever has, is he a bust?