WR class 2020

Originally posted by NCommand:

I was thinking about this. Even with Goodwin's speed, like when Ginn was here, how often do coaches really go for a 9 or deep post route? Kyle and Garoppolo live in the intermediate zones and that's where Lamb would thrive and make his living.

Exactly, Lamb and Jefferson truly do make the most sense based off of our scheme and QB

EDIT: but Aiuyuk, Raegor, Hamler, Bowden & Duvernay would be fun chess pieces

Originally posted by krizay:

Originally posted by NCommand:

I was thinking about this. Even with Goodwin's speed, like when Ginn was here, how often do coaches really go for a 9 or deep post route? Kyle and Garoppolo live in the intermediate zones and that's where Lamb would thrive and make his living.

Exactly, Lamb and Jefferson truly do make the most sense based off of our scheme and QB

EDIT: but Aiuyuk, Raegor, Hamler, Bowden & Duvernay would be fun chess pieces

Yeah, really. I'm very curious how this is all going to shake out.

I think it is a longshot, but Kyler Murray has been clamoring for the Cardinals to take his college teammate Ceedee Lamb at 8. I think it is more likely the go OT, which Murray would likely appreciate later, but if they take Lamb, does Christian Kirk become available for trade? Lamb, Hopkins, Fitz is plenty of talent, and they did spend a 2nd last year on Isabelle who looked promising from the slot. They drafted 3 WRs in total last year, so they have so young guys for depth.

Where does Kirk rank in this WR class? He has looked pretty promising to me. While built differently, he has a pretty similar usage rate to Deebo. Great in the open field, can run plays out of the backfield, good on bubble screens, and has 4.4 speed. Good return guy as well. He was a mid second round pick and has seemed to live up to that billing so far. He is not a true #1 WR, but I could see him replicating some of Sanders role. If he can be had, while keeping the two 1st round picks, I would be all for it, and that may allow us to take other positions in the first.

Originally posted by scooterhd:

I think it is a longshot, but Kyler Murray has been clamoring for the Cardinals to take his college teammate Ceedee Lamb at 8. I think it is more likely the go OT, which Murray would likely appreciate later, but if they take Lamb, does Christian Kirk become available for trade? Lamb, Hopkins, Fitz is plenty of talent, and they did spend a 2nd last year on Isabelle who looked promising from the slot. They drafted 3 WRs in total last year, so they have so young guys for depth.

Where does Kirk rank in this WR class? He has looked pretty promising to me. While built differently, he has a pretty similar usage rate to Deebo. Great in the open field, can run plays out of the backfield, good on bubble screens, and has 4.4 speed. Good return guy as well. He was a mid second round pick and has seemed to live up to that billing so far. He is not a true #1 WR, but I could see him replicating some of Sanders role. If he can be had, while keeping the two 1st round picks, I would be all for it, and that may allow us to take other positions in the first.

Why would AZ trade with SF?

Originally posted by scooterhd:
I think it is a longshot, but Kyler Murray has been clamoring for the Cardinals to take his college teammate Ceedee Lamb at 8. I think it is more likely the go OT, which Murray would likely appreciate later, but if they take Lamb, does Christian Kirk become available for trade? Lamb, Hopkins, Fitz is plenty of talent, and they did spend a 2nd last year on Isabelle who looked promising from the slot. They drafted 3 WRs in total last year, so they have so young guys for depth.

Where does Kirk rank in this WR class? He has looked pretty promising to me. While built differently, he has a pretty similar usage rate to Deebo. Great in the open field, can run plays out of the backfield, good on bubble screens, and has 4.4 speed. Good return guy as well. He was a mid second round pick and has seemed to live up to that billing so far. He is not a true #1 WR, but I could see him replicating some of Sanders role. If he can be had, while keeping the two 1st round picks, I would be all for it, and that may allow us to take other positions in the first.

Fitz is in his last year and AZ ran more over 700 plays with 3 and 4 WR sets. I believe I read that they ran more 4 WR sets in one week than the rest of the NFL combined. I could be mistaken there though.

So it's not out of the realm of possibility that they go WR at 8.

New Head Coach Kliff Kingsbury and Arizona have brought a variant of the Hal Mumme Air Raid to the NFL, and while the Cardinals didn't earn a Week 1 win — they tied the Detroit Lions in their home opener — the system lived up to its billing. Known for its spread concepts and heavy use of the forward pass, the Air Raid relies on a smart, accurate passer to distribute the ball to a bevy of playmakers sent into routes that attack all areas of the field. And spread they did. With first overall pick Kyler Murray running the offense, the Cardinals trotted out more four wide receiver sets (45) on Sunday than the rest of the NFL combined (36).

Originally posted by NYniner85:
Why would AZ trade with SF?

I dont think they will. It's just a scenario and we have seen crazier things happen. The Ravens and Steelers made a trade this offseason.

If they take Lamb, they would have alot of depth at WR, and could be inclined to move someone for more picks or players. Maybe Breida?

Originally posted by Costanza:
Kyle's buddy Chris Simms really hyping CeeDee Lamb and Justin Jefferson.

No bearing or even a read as to what Kyle will do. But both are quality receivers.

If it were the right player, I'd draft a tackle at 13 and have him ride the bench for a year. Being able to win the spot at RG, for me, would be a bonus, not the goal. If he isn't starting at RG, that means more likely than not that Brunskill is the RG of the future....that's a win.

With all that being said, I also wouldn't be sad at all if we somehow pulled off Lamb at 13 and Jefferson late first, whether at 31 (unlikely) or with some manuvering. Lamb, Jefferson and Deebo is a balanced WR group I cam get behind.

Interesting that Crocker doesn't have Ruggs top 5. Like I understand the speed dimension that adds to our team, but when you look at his film, he really isnt that guy that's beating people over the top. And jimmy isn't necessarily the QB that can throw over the top. He's more like Deebo, except he's not as good at it as him. Then you throw in his size the a lack of production. I mean if you're the best receiver on your team, then you get the ball the most, that's the bottom line. I'm started to lean away from Ruggs now to someone bigger.

Originally posted by T-9ers:
Interesting that Crocker doesn't have Ruggs top 5. Like I understand the speed dimension that adds to our team, but when you look at his film, he really isnt that guy that's beating people over the top. And jimmy isn't necessarily the QB that can throw over the top. He's more like Deebo, except he's not as good at it as him. Then you throw in his size the a lack of production. I mean if you're the best receiver on your team, then you get the ball the most, that's the bottom line. I'm started to lean away from Ruggs now to someone bigger.

Jeudy got the ball on a lot of plays where Ruggs is wide open going deep. Jeudy is arguably the best Alabama WR right now, but he has a high floor and low ceiling. Ruggs may be a better NFL prospect because he has far more athleticism and better hands.

Also, guys like Ruggs and Tyreek Hill can contribute without putting up monster stats by forcing defenses to account for them at all times opening up plays for other receivers and TEs (plus the running game). Even if Tyreek Hill doesn't gain 100 yards/game, he still has a huge impact in that offense.

Simms doesn't have Jeudy top 5. Both of them are top 5 WR prospects, but people have different opinions on where they rank.

Originally posted by eastcoast49ersfan:

Jeudy got the ball on a lot of plays where Ruggs is wide open going deep. Jeudy is arguably the best Alabama WR right now, but he has a high floor and low ceiling. Ruggs may be a better NFL prospect because he has far more athleticism and better hands.

Also, guys like Ruggs and Tyreek Hill can contribute without putting up monster stats by forcing defenses to account for them at all times opening up plays for other receivers and TEs (plus the running game). Even if Tyreek Hill doesn't gain 100 yards/game, he still has a huge impact in that offense.

Simms doesn't have Jeudy top 5. Both of them are top 5 WR prospects, but people have different opinions on where they rank.

Probably wouldn't go Jeudy either, I like Jefferson, Lamb, Shenault, bigger tough guys. Plus what the hell did we draft Hurd for then at the top of the 3rd last year, he's been cleared, the guy has has superb athleticism, he's ready. The more I think about it, not sold we're going receiver at all at 13.

Originally posted by T-9ers:
Interesting that Crocker doesn't have Ruggs top 5. Like I understand the speed dimension that adds to our team, but when you look at his film, he really isnt that guy that's beating people over the top. And jimmy isn't necessarily the QB that can throw over the top. He's more like Deebo, except he's not as good at it as him. Then you throw in his size the a lack of production. I mean if you're the best receiver on your team, then you get the ball the most, that's the bottom line. I'm started to lean away from Ruggs now to someone bigger.

Come on now.

The day Ruggs is drafted he will be one of the fastest players in the NFL. At the college level he can go over the top at WILL. He did not however run a ton of go routs in college, because that is not the only thing he is good at. I don't recall were i read it at, but think only 18% of the patterns he ran were go routs.

What your basically saying is yeah i know that team has Jerry Rice and Terrell Owens.....but man I really want me some of that Carl Pickens or Frank Sanders (they both out performed Rice and Owens given a small enough sample size)

Will all due respect to Deebo, Ruggs is a significantly better prospect. If you threw away the extra speed Ruggs possesses, he would still have better vision, significantly better hands, and be the better rout runner.

Size is a fair assessment tho, I can understand why you would want some one larger. This team a big talent add for the redzone offense.

What about Ruggs tape says he isnt tough? What about Ruggs tape says his "lack of production" equates to him not getting open? What about Ruggs tape says his smaller stature equates not being able to climb the ladder and make a grab? What about Ruggs tape says that just because he wasn't asked to run endless 9 routes means he doesn't have the athleticism or ball tracking ability to do so?

Originally posted by Dshearn:

Come on now.

The day Ruggs is drafted he will be one of the fastest players in the NFL. At the college level he can go over the top at WILL. He did not however run a ton of go routs in college, because that is not the only thing he is good at. I don't recall were i read it at, but think only 18% of the patterns he ran were go routs.

What your basically saying is yeah i know that team has Jerry Rice and Terrell Owens.....but man I really want me some of that Carl Pickens or Frank Sanders (they both out performed Rice and Owens given a small enough sample size)

Will all due respect to Deebo, Ruggs is a significantly better prospect. If you threw away the extra speed Ruggs possesses, he would still have better vision, significantly better hands, and be the better rout runner.

Size is a fair assessment tho, I can understand why you would want some one larger. This team a big talent add for the redzone offense.

No, that's not what I'm saying. You expect pick 13 to be a #1. So you're projecting Ruggs to be Tyreek Hill like and this #1 we want even though he hasn't shown to be a #1(arguably the 3rd option on Bama), and we don't have a QB that can throw the ball 70yds in the air. We have a QB that primarily works the center of the field from about 5-20 yards out.

I get the scheme fit, the threat he will add, so that's how you justify the pick and I'm not going to be disappointed if Ruggs is the pick because I think that will be dope but maybe Ruggs just ain't a #1. And is Ruggs really a better prospect than Deebo, because I guarantee if they did last years draft again, deebo would be drafted top 10 probably . Bottom line is nobody knows until these guys play.

Originally posted by T-9ers:
Interesting that Crocker doesn't have Ruggs top 5. Like I understand the speed dimension that adds to our team, but when you look at his film, he really isnt that guy that's beating people over the top. And jimmy isn't necessarily the QB that can throw over the top. He's more like Deebo, except he's not as good at it as him. Then you throw in his size the a lack of production. I mean if you're the best receiver on your team, then you get the ball the most, that's the bottom line. I'm started to lean away from Ruggs now to someone bigger.

If you read his notes on Ruggs he's concerned Ruggs doesn't always play up to his speed or he does't always get guys to respect it. He used his LSU film to make his judgement and Crock is awesome and I respect his opinion but disagree with his concerns in this case.

Ruggs even on that film showed enough to make me confident in this offense, with these players and Kyle scheming up plays he'd be a terrific weapon.

And your point has sound logic to it but it's not always the case in college. The whole "if you're the best you get more opportunities" was kind of used to knock Nick Bosa during his evaluation but fact is NCAA, especially the big schools have to feed certain guys due to recruiting conversations.

Not to mention you have plenty of guys who were backups in college that ended up better than their counterparts in the NFL. Alvin Kamara was a backup. Terrell Davis was a backup. Frank Gore was a backup at one point forcing Willis McGahee to go into the NFL.

Not to mention sometimes there are just teams with stacked roster. It would be one thing if Ruggs didn't produce when he saw the ball but that wasn't the case. Part of the draw with Ruggs is his ability to open things up for other guys on the team - much like he helped with Smith and Jeudy(granted they're studs on their own) but there were also plenty of plays where Ruggs was wide open and didn't see the ball.

And the whole "Jimmy can't throw over the top" thing is silly...especially when the biggest knock from him in the SB is that he overthrew Sanders. Ruggs catches up to that ball.

I also posted up the stats Tyreek Hill had with Alex Smith...you're telling me Jimmy can't use Ruggs similar to how Alex used Hill? You don't need to have a cannon arm to throw it deep. And we're not suddenly going to turn to an offense that throws it deep every other pass attempt. The threat of it with Ruggs' speed is enough to prevent a defense from just playing short/intermediate stuff - something KC did against us with unfortunately great success in the SB.

Not to mention with Ruggs simple quick throws, misdirection based stuff could quickly lead to big time plays/scores.