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Dee Ford signed as a D-Lineman/LEO,,(so where would/could Bosa go ??)

Originally posted by NTeply49:
Originally posted by toppdogg32:
Originally posted by kem99:
Don't you want two good Edge pass rushers? One coming from both sides? The Broncos have Miller and Chubb. The Seahawks had at diffreent points a combo of Avril, Bennett and Clark. You're going to be in nickel or dime at least 2/3 of the time and from what we've heard the 49ers are going to more of a Wide 9 approach and wanting their Edge and interior linemen to get up field to get to the QB and then adjust if its a running play. That sounds like a team wanting two edge rushers and not worrying too much about who is the "Big End" and who is the LEO.

If you too caught up in assigning positions, then who do you take? Josh Allen? Nope. He would play SAM which is taken off the field most of the time for nickel/dime. On passing downs, he would go to one edge with Ford on the other, just as you would do with Bosa. Q. Williams? Well, there's a whole other issue about whether he's redundant or not with what they have. Burns? He's more of an Edge like Ford and you'd have the same problem. There really isn't a CB or Safety you'd want to take at #2. I don't think you could justify going offense with Metcalf at #2 either. Ultimately, the 49ers need to take the best player. Most believe the top 2 are Bosa and Williams. If the Cardinals pick one, the 49ers pick the other. If both are there at #2, the 49ers get their pick unless a very attractive trade down presents itself. They shouldn't over think it.


I'd love to have 2 edge rushers coming from OPPOSITE sides, problem is- Bosa and Ford both play on THE SAME SIDE.. Seattle had a bevy of players, so they could rotate many diff. combinations. They didn't sign a RDE for $87M then draft a guy and had them split snaps. They didn't resign AA to play LDE, and then draft a Bosa type player and put him on left side. I can roll with your assessment IF Bosa was a LDE, but he's not. Also, I remember Seattle SAM LBers having der helmets up our QB's arse many a time (Bruce Irvin and Barkevious Mingo of lately), and we send our Sam LB'ers on blitzes too (Watson, Marsh), so Allen could be used in same way..

So you feel Allen and Ford is less redundant than Bosa and Ford? Does anyone actually question Bosas run defense or ability to hold the pointof attack? Maybe I missed something. Been a couple months since I really watched anything from him

what I keep telling everyone is this is NOT my opinion, I got this off the Webzone earlier. So everyones questions or points go to the writer of the article. I'm just delivering the mail..
Originally posted by Ice49er:
Wouldn't drafting Bosa require Armstead to play NT?

4-3
Thomas Armstead Buckner Bosa
Ford Warner Alexander

3-4
Armstead Buckner Thomas
Ford Warner Alexander Bosa


seems like it, It seems as though everytime we try and incl. Bosa, in the discussion there's all kinds of acrobatics we have to do. Resigning AA to $9mil., and Signing Dee Ford is what kinda caused a domino effect on D-Line to shun acquiring Bosa. You add any other player (Allen, Williams, etc. ) and then the D-Line lineup kinda flows w/o a ripple. I see why everyone wants Bosa, and I too wanted him BEFORE we made the above moves. But I'm not for scrambling the whole D-Line around to force a fit. If Bosa was a LDE, bravo-take him in a heartbeat!, but to add him and have to sit $$$$$$ on the bench and play some guys part-time (incl. Bosa) to "make things work", I just don't see it happenoing.
Originally posted by Oakland-Niner:
You don't draft a guy 2nd over all to play heavy rotation or out of position. Otherwise you end up with Solomon Thomas 2.0.


AAAAAA FUKIN MEENNNN!!!!!!!!,
Finally some logic!!
Originally posted by Ice49er:
Trade down.
Plenty of Pass Rusher and WRs to draft in the 1st round.
I'm praying Bosa goes to Arizona and 49ers can sell the 2nd pick to the highest bidder


I think that's what the 49ers are planning. To me their moves in FA telegraph their intentions.
Originally posted by toppdogg32:
what I keep telling everyone is this is NOT my opinion, I got this off the Webzone earlier. So everyones questions or points go to the writer of the article. I'm just delivering the mail..

Okay but you keep posting the same article in every thread like its supposed to mean something. It is some other random person's opinion. It still doesn't make much sense. "49ers won't draft Bosa because Armstead and Thomas." To me that notion is absolutely ridiculous. Armstead is on a one year deal and if you're letting Thomas affect what you do with the second pick in the draft, you are screwing up. The 49ers current talent level on defense pretty much demands a BPA approach. They don't need a bunch of quantity as much as they need some serious quality. That is what players like Bosa, QW and even Allen give you.
Lol, I think what people need to realize is that the COACHES, (NOT; zoners, armchair GM's, bloggers, fanboys, draft crushnicks, etc.) are the ones deciding and announcing where players are gonna line up. There are some great scenario's and alignment ideas being named on here- but none are coming from the 49ers staff, nor reported from the 49ers Organization. A guy like Grant Cohen, who isn't liked by many on this board- is closer to the organization and people in it than probably 99% of the Zoners on this board! Let that sink in! So, if him, or ANOTHER reporter closer to the action, or a member of the coaching staff says: "We're gonna line this player up here", "We signed this guy to do this for us, play this position", "We're bringing in THIS guy for a workout"- I'm gonna be more inclined to believe what THEY say or report, over the forementioned folks in parenthesis above. I'm read the mail, and deliver the mail BUT I didn't write it ! So unless you' re last name is Shanny, Saleh, Kourick, or Lynch- or someone quoting and writing for them- Its just opinion, idea, or ego,,, not gospel.
Originally posted by toppdogg32:
Lol, I think what people need to realize is that the COACHES, (NOT; zoners, armchair GM's, bloggers, fanboys, draft crushnicks, etc.) are the ones deciding and announcing where players are gonna line up. There are some great scenario's and alignment ideas being named on here- but none are coming from the 49ers staff, nor reported from the 49ers Organization. A guy like Grant Cohen, who isn't liked by many on this board- is closer to the organization and people in it than probably 99% of the Zoners on this board! Let that sink in! So, if him, or ANOTHER reporter closer to the action, or a member of the coaching staff says: "We're gonna line this player up here", "We signed this guy to do this for us, play this position", "We're bringing in THIS guy for a workout"- I'm gonna be more inclined to believe what THEY say or report, over the forementioned folks in parenthesis above. I'm read the mail, and deliver the mail BUT I didn't write it ! So unless you' re last name is Shanny, Saleh, Kourick, or Lynch- or someone quoting and writing for them- Its just opinion, idea, or ego,,, not gospel.

And some opinion just doesn't make a whole lot of sense. Anyway you slice it, Bosa is a great fit for this roster. The idea that having too many pass rushers would somehow present a problem is nonsense. They have Armstead, who is best suited as a two down player, under contract for a year. He could simply walk after next season. Thomas hasn't proven to be able to do a whole lot and would still get snaps at Leo on run downs and be able to rotate inside. There is plenty of room for Bosa on this roster with the ability to move him around and have him play both Leo and big end.
We're starving for pass rushers. Signing one guy doesn't cover our need. Bosa could be an elite edge rusher for years to come. It's incredibly short sighted to pass on that just because we traded for Dee Ford.
People are WAY overanalyzing this holy crap. The Sam in this defense IS a DE as they have edge and rush responsibilities. Ford absolutely has the ability to play there in base and/or short yardage. That puts Bosa at Leo, opposite of Ford.

In nickel/sub, Ford goes to Leo to pin his ears back, DJ comes out, Solly/Armstead slide inside, and Bosa goes to big end. It's not that difficult.

There is simply no way on God's green Earth that anyone on this coaching staff thinks that Thomas or Armstead are the answer at big end on passing downs. No f*cking way. If they do they should be shot with a rusty pellet gun.
Originally posted by toppdogg32:
How could general manager John Lynch and head coach Kyle Shanahan pass on the complete package of a prospect in Bosa? Well, they might even have a reasonable reason once you dive into the finer details.
The acquisition of Dee Ford would undoubtedly be a very big part of why. It's not just that the 49ers added one of the best edge rushers in the league. It's how they plan to utilize him. Ford played as a linebacker for the Kansas City Chiefs. He was the wide-9 rusher, which made him a linebacker in the 3-4 defensive system the Chiefs employed.
The 49ers don't run a 3-4 scheme but rather a 4-3. Upon the completion of the trade, many wondered if the 49ers would play Ford in the SAM linebacker position in their defense. This will not be the case. When asked if Ford will be a defensive end, Lynch was succinct in his answer.
"We do," Lynch said at the press conference introducing Ford and Kwon Alexander last week. "That's what we see him as ... he fits the LEO mold perfectly."
This decision has a domino affect on the rest of the defensive line. With the LEO position taken, the 49ers must decide who will serve as the team's other defensive end as well as find a linebacker for the SAM position. If the 49ers draft Bosa, he would fill the "big end" spot as the team's other starting defensive end.
That would create a potential playing time problem for the 49ers incumbent defensive ends. There are four starting defensive line positions. DeForest Buckner will be taking one of the defensive tackle spots and Ford will be taking the LEO defensive end position. Two spots left with Arik Armstead, Solomon Thomas and potentially Bosa still unaccounted for. Someone would be the odd man out.

*******Looks like I'm not the ONLY one with this question/concern. They more than summarized my contention, and Walters Football credibility has inadvertently been vindicated.

an article by some rando with 100 followers on twitter? Maybe this Levin Black dude know something, but trying to sniff out any sort of take to try and prove your point...come on dude, be better.

Walter football has been wrong on so many occasions and IMO I don't find him reputable at all.

Ever think that Lynch say's Ford is a LEO in sub BECAUSE that's what we will be in like 70% of the time? Bosa can play both LEO or BE in base and we damn well know he will be rushing the passer in sub across of Ford. They got rid of Marsh and have zero outside of Ford on what is basically a one yr deal if he doesn't play well.

-AA is on his last yr of his deal and we all know he's better as an interior rusher. Kyle said he had AA playing NT towards the end of the yr as well.
-Thomas can play either BE/LEO in base (which kyle said) BUT will be a DT in sub. Please remember SUB is what matters here.
-Ford like you're articled stated played a SAM role at KC and in BASE there's zero reason to believe he won't still do that. He's not a BASE LEO and Kyle also stated he likes to see Thomas there.
Bosa will play either LEO/BE and will rush the passer. Even if he's a nickel edge rusher yr 1 it's still all about long-term value. Similar to what we did with Aldon Smith.

Originally posted by toppdogg32:
Lol, I think what people need to realize is that the COACHES, (NOT; zoners, armchair GM's, bloggers, fanboys, draft crushnicks, etc.) are the ones deciding and announcing where players are gonna line up. There are some great scenario's and alignment ideas being named on here- but none are coming from the 49ers staff, nor reported from the 49ers Organization. A guy like Grant Cohen, who isn't liked by many on this board- is closer to the organization and people in it than probably 99% of the Zoners on this board! Let that sink in! So, if him, or ANOTHER reporter closer to the action, or a member of the coaching staff says: "We're gonna line this player up here", "We signed this guy to do this for us, play this position", "We're bringing in THIS guy for a workout"- I'm gonna be more inclined to believe what THEY say or report, over the forementioned folks in parenthesis above. I'm read the mail, and deliver the mail BUT I didn't write it ! So unless you' re last name is Shanny, Saleh, Kourick, or Lynch- or someone quoting and writing for them- Its just opinion, idea, or ego,,, not gospel.

Grant is close to the organization? Dude get's laughed at by our coaching staff and players when he's trying to ask nonsense questions to sir up s**t. He goes to some of the OTAs and such but to think he's close to anyone in that FO is laughable. You got other beat writers who are actually informed and have a relationship with the team in both Matt's saying if Bosa is there he's probably gonna be the pick.

You do realize in that same presser Kyle stated he sees Thomas playing outside on BASE and playing the same role as last yr. Where did he play last yr? LEO in BASE. Ford is 245Lbs he's not a BASE LEO. he was poor at run defending at KC where he basically played the SAM role. NOW you're gonna line him up vs tackles? Please tell me how that makes sense.

His job is to get after the QB and that might require him to sit his ass down on 1st and possibly 2nd downs if you plan on making him a 3-down LEO. BUT if you have a SAM backer he can set the edge vs TEs and can cover a RB out in space if need be. SF didn't even ask our SAM to cover much anyway. Either way he would be rushing the passer plenty.
Originally posted by Furlow:
People are WAY overanalyzing this holy crap. The Sam in this defense IS a DE as they have edge and rush responsibilities. Ford absolutely has the ability to play there in base and/or short yardage. That puts Bosa at Leo, opposite of Ford.

In nickel/sub, Ford goes to Leo to pin his ears back, DJ comes out, Solly/Armstead slide inside, and Bosa goes to big end. It's not that difficult.

There is simply no way on God's green Earth that anyone on this coaching staff thinks that Thomas or Armstead are the answer at big end on passing downs. No f*cking way. If they do they should be shot with a rusty pellet gun.

it's not rocket science....end of the day sub is what matters not who lines up wherever in BASE (which we play out of for like 10-12 snaps a game)
Originally posted by toppdogg32:
seems like it, It seems as though everytime we try and incl. Bosa, in the discussion there's all kinds of acrobatics we have to do. Resigning AA to $9mil., and Signing Dee Ford is what kinda caused a domino effect on D-Line to shun acquiring Bosa. You add any other player (Allen, Williams, etc. ) and then the D-Line lineup kinda flows w/o a ripple. I see why everyone wants Bosa, and I too wanted him BEFORE we made the above moves. But I'm not for scrambling the whole D-Line around to force a fit. If Bosa was a LDE, bravo-take him in a heartbeat!, but to add him and have to sit $$$$$$ on the bench and play some guys part-time (incl. Bosa) to "make things work", I just don't see it happenoing.

acrobatics to what? it's very simple actually.....

BASE (which we play in for like 10-12 snaps a game according to out film gurus in NT)

LEO-Bosa/Thomas
NT-Jones/AA
DT-Buck/AA
BE-Thomas/Bosa/AA
SAM-Ford/Nzeocha

SUB

EDGE-Ford/Bosa
DT-Buck/AA
DT-Thomas/AA/Streets
EDGE-Bosa/Ford/Blair

There's your DL and you actually have a rotation, good young starters, and depth.

How is that hard to get
As a rookie I wouldn't even mind if they had Ford at leo 100% of the time, Bosa at nickel edge rusher. Aldon had 20 sacks doing that and nickel is 70% of the game.
[ Edited by tjd808185 on Mar 19, 2019 at 6:00 AM ]
Originally posted by tjd808185:
As a rookie I wouldn't even mind if they had Ford at leo 100% of the time, Bosa at nickel edge rusher. Aldon had 20 sacks doing that and nickel is 70% of the game.

I agree as far as him being a nickel edge rusher....I feel like just about any DE we draft would have that roll yr one anyway. I don't see why Ford is a 3-down LEO though. He's was a liability in the run D in KC and I don't see how it gets better putting a 245lb guy on the line.
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