Mason Rudolph and Baker Mayfield--The OK Kids

Originally posted by Temecula49ersfan:
and they are both air raid qbs.

I don't consider Ok State to be an air raid. More like Air Coryell or something. Its all about the deep passes.

Air Raid is actually West Coast without the run game, built on short/intermediate passes.

Originally posted by NinerSickness:

Originally posted by SunDevilNiner79:

Originally posted by NinerSickness:
Baker Mayfield has one of the best releases I've seen in a while. Accurate too. A lot to like. Might drop in the draft because of his size.

See a lot of Russell Wilson in him.

whatttttt?

You don't think so?



It's high (relative to his height), quick & smooth. Dude can sling it. It's not one of his question marks.

that's a lot upper torso torquing going on in that throw that delays the actual delivery. And I've seen on a lot of throws a real odd wind up from where he starts to initiate the throwing motion. And he pulls the ball to a real odd position behind his shoulder, it isn't in the higher "loaded" position but instead he uses kind of a sidearm throwing motion with his release.

If I could draw it, it would be easier to do.



1:45 shows his throwing motion in slow motion, if you pause it at 1:49 look the throwing motion. He pulls the ball back and off to the side, then initiates his throwing motion

Or look at the 0:12 second mark. Look how long it takes him to throw the ball when he starts his body language of intending to pass the ball, he pushes the ball forward, then does the odd almost-side arm pull back.

If you look at a player like Drew Brees, their release is fantastic because there isn't wasted body motion. The arm fires back into the loaded position where they hold the ball behind their ear and they can fire it. Its about simplifying the motion to make it as efficient, quick, and consistent as possible.

At the NFL level, if your body language for throwing a pass takes a half second longer then needed, thats the difference between it being batted down or picked off.

Originally posted by Phoenix49ers:

Originally posted by NinerSickness:
That's probably accurate. But WAAAAAAY less potato.

I like him a heck of more than friggn' CJ Beathard; that's for sure.

Yeah but dude got run down from behind by a cop while evading arrest.

Oh.

Originally posted by NinerSickness:
What do you like about him? I don't think he's gonna be any good.

His accuracy. Decision making. His ball placement.

Okla st. runs a pistol offense and do their fair share of play actions and boots. which does translate to Shanny. But more importantly, unlike most college QB's (especially air raid QB's) he's not just completing balls to completely wide open receivers. He's throwing them open with his ball placement.

Originally posted by WRATHman44:
Depends how much Shanny wants to go deep. Rudolph was a very good deep passer who struggled with ball placement in is short and intermediate passing. If he cleans that up, hes still a long shot to be selected, because he could go in the first and Shanny appeared to suggest that he wouldn't take a QB that early if they couldn't play for a while. Rudolph would likely need a couple years to learn the offense, the footwork, and the rhythm. If he falls in the draft and Shanahan falls in love w/his deep ball potential (and believes he can clean up the short/intermediate accuracy), he could surprise and take Rudolph.

Me and you are apparently looking at 2 different Mason Rudolph's

Originally posted by krizay:

Me and you are apparently looking at 2 different Mason Rudolph's

You must be watching with your eyes closed then. His short and intermediate passing isn't great by any stretch of the imagination, even his own coach admitted that those were the areas he needed to work on the most.

Now, Rudolph's practice focus has shifted more toward efficiency with short completions in a crowded pocket.

"That is the progression he needs to take," Gundy said. "The throws in between the numbers from 7-to-14 yards is where he really needs to work. I think he's going to make a small adjustment in his footwork that he feels like has been a flaw. He's going to make an adjustment this spring and see how it feels."

I think when it's all said and done Rudolph will go middle of the first round. Mayfield's off the field stuff and his size will drop him down.

I like the potential of Rudolph, but as a 3rd rounder or later, which at this point, I doubt highly

Originally posted by SunDevilNiner79:

Originally posted by NinerSickness:

Originally posted by SunDevilNiner79:

Originally posted by NinerSickness:
Baker Mayfield has one of the best releases I've seen in a while. Accurate too. A lot to like. Might drop in the draft because of his size.

See a lot of Russell Wilson in him.

whatttttt?

You don't think so?



It's high (relative to his height), quick & smooth. Dude can sling it. It's not one of his question marks.

that's a lot upper torso torquing going on in that throw that delays the actual delivery. And I've seen on a lot of throws a real odd wind up from where he starts to initiate the throwing motion. And he pulls the ball to a real odd position behind his shoulder, it isn't in the higher "loaded" position but instead he uses kind of a sidearm throwing motion with his release.

If I could draw it, it would be easier to do.



1:45 shows his throwing motion in slow motion, if you pause it at 1:49 look the throwing motion. He pulls the ball back and off to the side, then initiates his throwing motion

Or look at the 0:12 second mark. Look how long it takes him to throw the ball when he starts his body language of intending to pass the ball, he pushes the ball forward, then does the odd almost-side arm pull back.

If you look at a player like Drew Brees, their release is fantastic because there isn't wasted body motion. The arm fires back into the loaded position where they hold the ball behind their ear and they can fire it. Its about simplifying the motion to make it as efficient, quick, and consistent as possible.

At the NFL level, if your body language for throwing a pass takes a half second longer then needed, thats the difference between it being batted down or picked off.

I'm not seeing what you're seeing in most of his throws. As Jim Harbaugh says, throwing motions can all look different, and it's still fine as long as the ball is above the shoulder. Take a look at this play; it's pretty bad**s. His first read is left, and then he goes to his 2nd as he's being flushed out of the pocket & then slings a strike on the run with VERY little movement of his body (Even w/ a dude in his face):



I love that arm / release. It's not the best I've ever seen, but I'll take it any day of the week. He has other question marks, but I don't think his pure ability to throw is one of them. Look at how quickly he plants his feet & releases after backpedaling.

Mayfield: 31 yards off his back foot & momentum going backwards w/ a quick delivery (and a hand in his face):

Ignoring Darnold... Mason Rudolph is probably my favorite QB going into the season. He's a gamer and I think he'll just keep moving up draft boards throughout the season. I expect that he'll solidify himself as a 1st rounder before the draft.

Originally posted by strickac:

Ignoring Darnold... Mason Rudolph is probably my favorite QB going into the season. He's a gamer and I think he'll just keep moving up draft boards throughout the season. I expect that he'll solidify himself as a 1st rounder before the draft.

CBS has him at #4 overall and the second QB behind Darnold right now... Rudolph is already considered a 1st rounder, but I think Allen will pass him during the year as well as Rosen (if Rosen stays healthy and his shoulder checks out).

Don't see the fascination with Mayfield. Not a fan at all.

Originally posted by gold49digger:
Don't see the fascination with Mayfield. Not a fan at all.

I don't see anyone here with a fascination w/ Mayfield. He throws a nice ball, but there are tons of other question marks.

I'll take the OK ST connection of Rudolph to Washington, both should have a huge year together..