Joe Haden is Horribly Overrated

Seriously, what's with all the damn 'Joe Haden at #13' love throughout every mock draft on the web lately? I've seen endless tape on this guy (bowls/highlights/regular games) and I find his draft stock to be very misleading (within terms of delusional college-super-stardom over the realistic payoff in the NFL).

1. Haden was working with THE BEST D-LINE IN THE NATION (at Florida), so Joe barely had to worry about relying upon 'raw' instinctual coverage situations, and looked REALLY good because he had guys like Ahmad Black and Major Wright behind him, allowing Haden to harp upon (spread-out) positional advantages.

2. Guys built like Haden can only (really) find NFL success within stoic Tampa-2 based defenses (which we're not), where Joe would rarely play man coverage (based on how undersized Joe is realistically going to be compared to #1 WRs in the NFL).

Yes, Joe has NFL-ready potential (and playing in the SEC helps a lot), but no speed or fluidity (and I'm not even counting the misleading 40-time bs, this dude just has a low-motor). -Now I'm not bringing hate on this guy, but I'm just saying he isn't worth more than a mid-20 pick, taking him at the #13 spot sounds a little 'over the top'.

um pretty sure our scouts did their homework. they will know if or not to pick him up.

I've heard a few sources now say that no CB in this draft is a top 20 pick, and I believe it. I see Haden, McCourty and Wilson as solid choices in the 20s and beyond, but they do not represent a 13th pick to me.

Originally posted by SFCH3DDERZ:
um pretty sure our scouts did their homework. they will know if or not to pick him up.

yup

I like Wilson from Boise St. if we trade down, I just see him becoming a better corner in this league than Haden. I wouldn't mind either of them

Originally posted by SnakePlissken:
Seriously, what's with all the damn 'Joe Haden at #13' love throughout every mock draft on the web lately? I've seen endless tape on this guy (bowls/highlights/regular games) and I find his draft stock to be very misleading (within terms of delusional college-super-stardom over the realistic payoff in the NFL).

1. Haden was working with THE BEST D-LINE IN THE NATION (at Florida), so Joe barely had to worry about relying upon 'raw' instinctual coverage situations, and looked REALLY good because he had guys like Ahmad Black and Major Wright behind him, allowing Haden to harp upon (spread-out) positional advantages.

2. Guys built like Haden can only (really) find NFL success within stoic Tampa-2 based defenses (which we're not), where Joe would rarely play man coverage (based on how undersized Joe is realistically going to be compared to #1 WRs in the NFL).

Yes, Joe has NFL-ready potential (and playing in the SEC helps a lot), but no speed or fluidity (and I'm not even counting the misleading 40-time bs, this dude just has a low-motor). -Now I'm not bringing hate on this guy, but I'm just saying he isn't worth more than a mid-20 pick, taking him at the #13 spot sounds a little 'over the top'.

Haden will be working with one of the best DL in the NFL if he's drafted by the 9ers! Haden is the top CB in this draft and is a flat out stud, the great thing about getting him would be that he could play nickle behind Clements/Spencer this year if needed.

Anyone would be crazy to be unhappy with the top CB in the nation coming to their team in the mid 1st round.

Originally posted by OregonDuckNiner:
I like Wilson from Boise St. if we trade down, I just see him becoming a better corner in this league than Haden. I wouldn't mind either of them

Wilson has a reputation as being soft in run support and not a very good tackler. If that is the case, then I can't see us drafting him.

Originally posted by SnakePlissken:
Seriously, what's with all the damn 'Joe Haden at #13' love throughout every mock draft on the web lately? I've seen endless tape on this guy (bowls/highlights/regular games) and I find his draft stock to be very misleading (within terms of delusional college-super-stardom over the realistic payoff in the NFL).

1. Haden was working with THE BEST D-LINE IN THE NATION (at Florida), so Joe barely had to worry about relying upon 'raw' instinctual coverage situations, and looked REALLY good because he had guys like Ahmad Black and Major Wright behind him, allowing Haden to harp upon (spread-out) positional advantages.

2. Guys built like Haden can only (really) find NFL success within stoic Tampa-2 based defenses (which we're not), where Joe would rarely play man coverage (based on how undersized Joe is realistically going to be compared to #1 WRs in the NFL).

Yes, Joe has NFL-ready potential (and playing in the SEC helps a lot), but no speed or fluidity (and I'm not even counting the misleading 40-time bs, this dude just has a low-motor). -Now I'm not bringing hate on this guy, but I'm just saying he isn't worth more than a mid-20 pick, taking him at the #13 spot sounds a little 'over the top'.

1- Florida's DL was def. a top 5 unit but debateable as to whether they were actually the best or not. The same argument that you are making about the talent around him can be used against other top prospects but Haden play on the field speaks for itself. When you watch him play he actually shows why he is the consensus #1 CB in this class.

2- 5"10 6/8th's and 193 pounds is not really undersized. While he could stand to fill out his frame a little better, I have no doubts that will come in his first few years as a pro. He is only 21.

There are a lot of CB's who are under 6 feet tall and 200 pounds who have found success at the NFL level playing either man or zone coverage (Asante Samuel, Darell Revis, Leon Hall, Jonathan Joseph, Cortland Finnegan to name a few).

I honestly don't know what you were watching if you think he doesn't play fast, or fluid for that matter. He also showed good man coverage skills, good ball skills and the willingness to hit.Every analyst in the country pretty much has him as being one of the top 15 prospects in the country and that hasn't really changed, especially after proving at his pro day on a wet track that he is faster than the combine indicated.

Originally posted by SFCH3DDERZ:
um pretty sure our scouts did their homework. they will know if or not to pick him up.

so as long as the scouts do their homework they are guaranteed not to draft busts? Dammit why didnt our scouts do their homework on Reggie McGrew, Mike Rumph, Rashaun Woods, Kentwan Balmer

Originally posted by OregonDuckNiner:
I like Wilson from Boise St. if we trade down, I just see him becoming a better corner in this league than Haden. I wouldn't mind either of them

I've seen him play a couple times at Oregon, and that is not what I saw at all, he was a very physical corner and didn't give our WR any room to catch the ball. It was a tough game to watch for our passing game

If it re airs, try and watch the Sports Science segment on espn about Joe Haden. watch that and then tell me if he's over rated.

Originally posted by zero:
If it re airs, try and watch the Sports Science segment on espn about Joe Haden. watch that and then tell me if he's over rated.

what did they show him on sports science for? i cant find it online

No he isn't. Dude shut down LaFell and Gilyard this year. Plus he ran a much better 40 at his pro day after recovering from his back injury. He's not undersized either, he's nearly 5'11'' and there are plenty of CBs in the NFL 5'11''. Nate Clements was considered big and physical and he's only 5'10''. Shawntae Spencer is 6'0''. Asante Samuel is like 5'10''. Size certainly helps but he's not undersized like a Tarel Brown or Dre Bly(5'9'') and he's not slow.

Originally posted by Niners23:
I've heard a few sources now say that no CB in this draft is a top 20 pick, and I believe it. I see Haden, McCourty and Wilson as solid choices in the 20s and beyond, but they do not represent a 13th pick to me.

I agree with this, the best corners in this class(Haden, McCourty, Wilson) are all closely rated in the last third of the first in my opinion. I hope the 49ers don't take Haden and would prefer Kyle Wilson to him at any pick.

Originally posted by WillistheWall:
No he isn't. Dude shut down LaFell and Gilyard this year. Plus he ran a much better 40 at his pro day after recovering from his back injury. He's not undersized either, he's nearly 5'11'' and there are plenty of CBs in the NFL 5'11''. Nate Clements was considered big and physical and he's only 5'10''. Shawntae Spencer is 6'0''. Asante Samuel is like 5'10''. Size certainly helps but he's not undersized like a Tarel Brown or Dre Bly(5'9'') and he's not slow.

Clements is 6'0"
Clements at NFL.com